Transcript
Speaker: Hey everybody, this week I have Jason Carlo, a nano YouTuber.
Speaker: So he said something that set me down, you know how I get, I go down these crazy tangents about accent.
Speaker: And I'm teasing my friend's mom, and I just wanna make sure everybody knows that I'm just an accent and dialect nerd.
Speaker: I have a certificate to teach and to educate people about accents and to help people with vocal issues, you know, like if a teacher's losing their voice, that kind of stuff.
Speaker: So when I hear an accent or when I hear somebody talk about an accent, I get like, I just get like nerd love for it.
Speaker: And that's all I want to do is talk about accents.
Speaker: So when I joke around about my friend's mom's Filipino accent, it's because it intrigues me to no end.
Speaker: And I love her so much.
Speaker: So it intrigues me because she speaks like four languages and she picked up a foreign country's dialect that wasn't native to her own country and then moved here and then never lost that.
Speaker: And so for whatever reason, she just kept that one accent.
Speaker: And that fascinates me.
Speaker: And I love talking about that kind of stuff.
Speaker: So I don't want anybody to think that I'm like...
Speaker: being mean to my friend's mom or making fun of accents or that I am belittling accents because anybody who comes here who has an accent is already 90% ahead of pretty much every single American who barely speaks English well, let alone a foreign language.
Speaker: And now I'm going to get made, you know, I'm going to get shit on for making fun of Americans.
Speaker: So that's it.
Speaker: I don't want people to think that I have an issue with accents.
Speaker: I spend way too much time talking about them, loving them, listening to them, doing fake ones of my own to try to perfect them for auditions.
Speaker: And that's it.
Speaker: Thanks for listening.
Speaker: Enjoy this episode with Jason Carlo.
Speaker: And thank you for all the support you've given to the show for the last couple of years.
Speaker: Just, it's so appreciative.
Speaker: And I love making the show for all of you.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Talk to you soon.
Speaker: Enjoy the show.
Speaker: Bye.
Speaker: Hey, everybody.
Speaker: Welcome back to Keyword Crypto.
Speaker: This is Michael and I have Jason Carlo, special guest.
Speaker: Jason, what is up, my friend?
Speaker: What's going on, Keyword Crypto?
Speaker: How's it going, everyone?
Speaker: So you pinged me about coming on the show.
Speaker: And I was like, yeah, of course, dude.
Speaker: Because I think it's always interesting to have a fellow...
Speaker: social media person come on.
Speaker: You create YouTube videos and I was intrigued to talk to you about your experience.
Speaker: Why exactly did you want to come on?
Speaker: Well, yeah, so basically I wanted to spread the word about Nano.
Speaker: Not like you don't like in this podcast at all.
Speaker: I'm a avid follower and listener too.
Speaker: And it's just because Nano, I feel like, doesn't get the recognition that it deserves.
Speaker: As much as there's a lot of content and community members out there, I feel like Nano is kind of like the underdog of crypto, especially nowadays, right?
Speaker: There's a lot of shit coins around.
Speaker: And it's hard to kind of navigate your way through all the thousands of cryptocurrencies out there.
Speaker: And I wanted to create content around that and, you know, come on here.
Speaker: So why don't you give us like a quick rundown of who you are and what you do?
Speaker: Yeah, sure.
Speaker: So I was born in the Philippines and I moved to the US around 2012, almost 10 years ago.
Speaker: And I did the whole school thing.
Speaker: And I was working at a startup, a direct-to-consumer startup.
Speaker: And after that COVID hit and it was a bag startup.
Speaker: So unfortunately it didn't quite work out because of COVID.
Speaker: Not a lot of people were traveling and wanting bags, right?
Speaker: And ended back up in LA and kind of booted up the camera and thought that creating content around Nano was a great angle to take, I feel like.
Speaker: So, yeah.
Speaker: Wait a minute.
Speaker: So you've only been in this country for 10 years because I would never have guessed that.
Speaker: I'll take that as a compliment, Michael.
Speaker: From your accent.
Speaker: My best friends have Filipino, have Chinese, and his parents have been here for like 35 years, and they still drapetipab on the preway.
Speaker: Brian!
Speaker: Brian, make sure you drive 55 on the freeway.
Speaker: Drive 55 under 55.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I joke around with his mom because she's actually Chinese and she moved to the Philippines in her 20s.
Speaker: And so I was like... And her... She has more of a Filipino accent than her husband, his dad, who...
Speaker: Grew up in the Philippines, and I was just like, why is your accent so Filipino?
Speaker: Honestly, when he said he was half Filipino, half Chinese, I thought his mom was the Filipino one, and his dad was Chinese, because that's how thick her Filipino accent is.
Speaker: But you've been here for 10 years, and I would have thought you were born here, because your accent is so clean.
Speaker: Yeah, for sure.
Speaker: Well, like, you know, the Philippines has a lot of Chinese residents, at least rather Chinese descent.
Speaker: And with the accent, when I moved here, I already understood that there will be, unfortunately, a stigma around accents and what kind of opportunities you'll be given and what kind of opportunities will be presented to you because it's not the sexiest accent, you know.
Speaker: It's not the sexiest accent, so it's hard.
Speaker: It's hard.
Speaker: So I kind of put it on me to kind of make it a thing to not remove it fully because trust me, if there's a deal or anything like that with a fellow Filipino, I'll whip out the Filipino accent.
Speaker: So there's that.
Speaker: So do you speak natively Tagalog?
Speaker: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker: I'm bilingual.
Speaker: So if anybody doesn't know anything about the Philippines, how many languages are there in the Philippines?
Speaker: There are a lot, like more than a dozen, because there's like 7,000 islands in there and like a lot of dialects.
Speaker: Right?
Speaker: It's ridiculous.
Speaker: But the main kind of mainland language is Tagalog.
Speaker: So that's like the city kind of language, I guess.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: When I heard that, I was just like,
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: I was shocked that a place so small can have that many different languages because I had a couple of Filipino friends, cousins of his, and they were like, oh yeah, we can't understand our other cousins because we don't speak the same language.
Speaker: And I was like, how big is the Philippines?
Speaker: Isn't it like the size of Virginia?
Speaker: It's basically like California, I think.
Speaker: The whole California is like the Philippines.
Speaker: But I guess with the US, there's a lot of different accents in different regions of the US.
Speaker: So I think instead of accents, it's like languages over there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I guess with so many different islands, I mean, if people weren't island hopping too much 100 years ago, I could see languages just kind of naturally diverting and...
Speaker: I find all that stuff fascinating.
Speaker: No, I get you for sure.
Speaker: I mean, a lot of island hopping had happened however many years ago.
Speaker: And there's a lot of Spanish influences in the Philippines.
Speaker: Last names, food, even just words even.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, welcome.
Speaker: And you picked the right coast because I know you think that the accent could potentially hurt you, but I feel like on the West Coast, everyone's so used to it at this point.
Speaker: Everybody my age, I'm in my 40s, and I don't know a single person that didn't have some kind of...
Speaker: relationship with a first or second generation Filipino.
Speaker: I mean, it's just so common.
Speaker: That's what I'm thankful for, for like my parents, because California, if I had moved somewhere else, California is so accepting and so diverse.
Speaker: And, you know, I get my fair share of like Jollibee and Filipino food.
Speaker: And I'm thankful for that.
Speaker: And, you know, because it'd be a lot harder to assimilate in different regions of the country, in my opinion.
Speaker: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker: Definitely.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: So back to cryptocurrency.
Speaker: Nice little diversion away from cryptocurrency for a second.
Speaker: Why Nano?
Speaker: And before you start going to everybody, yes, I shill Nano sometimes on the show.
Speaker: I do bring in some Nano people.
Speaker: Just bear with me.
Speaker: Why Nano for you?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, well, you know, I don't know if your viewers know, but Nano is the best currency out there.
Speaker: But anyway, I'm just kidding.
Speaker: Maybe not.
Speaker: But the reason why I chose Nano is because as a lot of cryptocurrency enthusiasts around the globe have used Bitcoin or even Ethereum, right?
Speaker: It gives a lot of anxiety when you do transactions.
Speaker: It takes way too long.
Speaker: You don't know if you...
Speaker: put the wrong address.
Speaker: You don't know if you did it correctly.
Speaker: You don't know if you, you know, you're going to have the confirmation confirmed in like the next hour or so.
Speaker: And that's, it's so unnecessary in my opinion, if there's a solution for transactions like that.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So that's why I think like I really enjoyed nano and really, you know, dedicated my content and my talent to it.
Speaker: You know, that's funny that you said that because I completely forget the anxiety I used to feel when I would send Bitcoin to different exchanges or to different wallets.
Speaker: And it would take anywhere from 10 minutes to three hours.
Speaker: And just literally having no clue how long it was going to take.
Speaker: And just being like, oh, dear God, I hope I didn't send it to the wrong address.
Speaker: Yeah, it's so frustrating because actually the reason why the first time I got into like cryptocurrencies, I guess, was back in 2012, 2013.
Speaker: When I first moved here, I was trading digital items for basically money, right?
Speaker: And some people would offer Bitcoin.
Speaker: And that was my first, I guess, interaction with cryptocurrencies.
Speaker: And Bitcoin was worth around $150 to $250-ish back then.
Speaker: And I didn't really pay much mind to it.
Speaker: And it would just take a while.
Speaker: It would just take a while.
Speaker: I mean, granted, it was a lot, you know, earlier in the day.
Speaker: So like the network wasn't as congested, but Bitcoin natively is just like clunky and slow.
Speaker: And the user experience is not, it's not the most fun, you know?
Speaker: You know, I made, I made the, I did a blog post comparing it to the Ford Model T where it's,
Speaker: super necessary for cryptocurrency.
Speaker: You have to have that first kind of breakthrough cryptocurrency.
Speaker: But then after a while, it's just like, set that Ford Model T to the side and go buy a Tesla or whatever.
Speaker: And because it's just completely unusable at this point for me.
Speaker: No, yeah, that's the most fun analogy with real-life use cases.
Speaker: The Ford Model T 100 years ago and 100 years after the Tesla Model S came out.
Speaker: I think the roadster, I don't know, after 100 years.
Speaker: But the Tesla came out and it's so fast.
Speaker: And it's just like the user experience is amazing.
Speaker: The drive experience is amazing.
Speaker: And it's just much more efficient as a vehicle and as a user in itself.
Speaker: And like...
Speaker: would you rather take the Ford model T for going, driving from San Diego to, I don't know, LA, right.
Speaker: And then two hour drive or take a Tesla.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I mean, granted it might be like the same kind of like duration, but at the same time, like it's much more fun.
Speaker: And also I think faster.
Speaker: I don't think you can go a lot faster than like 40 miles an hour into model T. Exactly.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think it tops out at that.
Speaker: I think it's a little too dangerous.
Speaker: Anything beyond there.
Speaker: I know it's like everything just starts falling off.
Speaker: Do you get back to the Philippines often?
Speaker: Last time I was there was 2017.
Speaker: So around four years ago, four or five years ago.
Speaker: And I love it, man.
Speaker: If I could go like every year or like every other year and it would just be so much fun.
Speaker: Like I really try my best to stick with my roots and, you know,
Speaker: The thing is also with, you know, segwaying back to cryptocurrency is because I think the Philippines can really benefit with Nano in terms of banking and fees because a dollar fee or like $2, $3 or even $15.
Speaker: Let's do that.
Speaker: Like the average today of Bitcoin.
Speaker: It just, it's a lot for a third world country like the Philippines.
Speaker: And I think that's why I gravitated towards Nano a lot.
Speaker: That's what I was getting to.
Speaker: I was wondering what the current fiat conversion was.
Speaker: What's the name of the Filipino currency?
Speaker: Pesos.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So do you know off the top of your head what the conversion rate is for US dollars to pesos?
Speaker: Yeah, around 45 pesos, which is $1.
Speaker: And to give the listeners an idea of what $45 can get you, you can basically get you a meal or, you know, a round trip from, I guess, like LA standards from downtown LA all the way to like San Diego, I think.
Speaker: Like a round trip, maybe.
Speaker: On a bus or in a car?
Speaker: On like a bus, like a Greyhound kind of vibe, you know?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I mean, that's insane.
Speaker: So to sit there and say, hey, you have to pay, you have to not have dinner tonight because you need to pay, even if it was only a dollar, even if a Bitcoin fee was only a dollar.
Speaker: Like, okay, you can't have dinner tonight because you got to transact on Bitcoin tonight instead.
Speaker: It's like,
Speaker: That's what's so frustrating about Bitcoin and Ethereum too.
Speaker: Granted, there's the Bitcoin Lightning Network, which is as much as all the maxis say, it's not fully free.
Speaker: It's not free to actually access the channels and...
Speaker: send 100 sats to someone, it's not fully free compared to Nano.
Speaker: That's frustrating because those things add up, man.
Speaker: Those things really add up and I think that it really affects third world countries and
Speaker: it's just, I don't know, coming from there and like being born there and like, you know, growing up there, it's hard to see this exuberant amount of fees just going down the drain, you know?
Speaker: And I mean, I think there's just a real disconnect.
Speaker: I feel like the majority of people in Bitcoin
Speaker: you know, are from developed nations.
Speaker: They're most likely white, they're most likely programmers or some kind of tech job where they, they were working in the industry and making decent money and they fed, you know, they, they got into crypto.
Speaker: I mean, I just don't think they have any comprehension of what it's like to live in a place where $1 can get you a whole meal.
Speaker: Yeah, no, I definitely agree with you on that.
Speaker: This might be a hot take, but they visit for a week or two weeks or maybe even a month, and they're like, oh my God, it's so life-changing and so eye-opening.
Speaker: But you don't really understand when you're born there and really in the trenches.
Speaker: You know what I'm saying?
Speaker: It's tough seeing... I don't know.
Speaker: The recent...
Speaker: The recent average or rather like the whole day fee amount, I guess, for Ethereum was like 70 million the other day.
Speaker: I was like, dude, that's like the whole GDP of some countries.
Speaker: And they brag about it and it drives me crazy.
Speaker: They're like, yeah, it just shows how much activity is on it.
Speaker: It's like, that's not a good thing, man.
Speaker: All you're doing is bragging about how 99% of the planet can't use Ethereum.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: No, I definitely agree with you on that.
Speaker: And it's just that like, you know, granted, there are a lot of people buying NFTs and, you know, just buying all these like, you know, shit coins for lack of a better word.
Speaker: And they brag about it.
Speaker: And that's, I think that's a huge problem in terms of the cryptocurrency space, because we're all about status, I think, in the cryptocurrency space.
Speaker: bragging your newly minted uh i don't know what do you call this a board ape board board ape right and all these like you know i don't know it's just all these nfts it's all for status and it's not really doing anything granted i am i do enjoy some of the artwork don't get me wrong and i do enjoy the whole idea of nfts but
Speaker: the real use case of cryptocurrency and I think the whole cryptocurrency ethos in its heart is actual peer to peer transactions.
Speaker: Well, I mean, so this is where I disagree with you is I think, I mean, honestly, and this is what I get frustrated with Nano about and the Nano community a little bit.
Speaker: I always jump in for the last couple of years and been like, look, you need some kind of banking system
Speaker: You need Nano to be able to interact with the banking system because banking has been around since the beginning of man because people have needed to borrow money and people have had extra money and they loan it and that's just the way the world works.
Speaker: I don't mind if somebody has a better alternative to banking.
Speaker: But you can't just say like, here's Nano and then not offer the alternative to banking.
Speaker: Because just saying, you know, be your own bank, hold on, like self-custody.
Speaker: What happens if you forget, you lose your keys or you lose your, you know, forget your password or this or that.
Speaker: And then all of a sudden your entire life is just wiped out in one forgotten password.
Speaker: Or one, you know, you thought the – you put it in a fireproof safe, but the building collapsed on it and cracked it and it burned everything inside.
Speaker: Like – and you had your key written down on a piece of paper.
Speaker: And it's just like there's –
Speaker: What do you mean by that?
Speaker: Like, why are you exactly disagreeing?
Speaker: Because I definitely want to understand.
Speaker: Well, I mean, so I feel like you got to have some kind of like decentralized finance and Nano needs to be able to interact with that decentralized finance.
Speaker: And that's the reason why Ethereum is just blowing the doors off of Bitcoin right now is because they have the ability to do smart contracts and be able to have decentralized finance.
Speaker: And people really, I mean, that is in essence...
Speaker: the whole purpose of cryptocurrency is decentralization.
Speaker: And how can we recreate the real world?
Speaker: See, my frustration is like when a Greenpeace person says, oh, people should stop driving so much.
Speaker: Well, expecting people who have built their entire life around having to pay rent and they have to go to their job and drive to their job, if there's no alternative for them to get to work,
Speaker: Asking them not to drive their car to work is a non-starter because they have to be able to drive to work so they can, you know, raise their family, you know, feed their family and pay their rent and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker: So it's one thing to say, hey, we built this entire, you know, subway system and there's a stop right outside your house and a stop right outside your work.
Speaker: please stop driving your car so much.
Speaker: We, we, we have this amazing new subway technology and it'll get you to work just as, just as well.
Speaker: And it's not bad for the environment because the subway runs on electric, on clean electricity.
Speaker: So like, that's great.
Speaker: But to expect people just to stop driving, it's like, what, you're going to stop feeding your family?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: So it's, so it's,
Speaker: The idea that like, okay, well, we have Nano, we have Bitcoin, but you can't do any kind of normal banking on it without it being centralized.
Speaker: Well, the whole purpose of cryptocurrency is decentralization.
Speaker: And we can't expect people not to use banks anymore because that's just what we've been doing for the last 20,000 years, 10,000 years.
Speaker: And so if you have an alternative to banks, great, show me the alternative.
Speaker: But until then, we have to be able to recreate the banking system in a more decentralized, egalitarian way that helps everybody, not just the rich bankers.
Speaker: And I think DeFi really does that because anybody can provide liquidity.
Speaker: So that could be your savings account is providing liquidity to a trading pair and getting some
Speaker: some of the fees back, you know, and that's kind of your interest.
Speaker: And so like, I just like the idea of that.
Speaker: No, yeah.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: I'm not fully against DeFi.
Speaker: What I'm just saying is like first in the NFT realm of a cryptocurrency, some of it are kind of, you know, shit, I guess.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, and with DeFi in itself, I think the whole idea and the whole
Speaker: movement of banking people without a centralized authority is a wonderful wonderful movement and also um i guess angle for cryptocurrencies what i'm just against is that like when people just fully use ethereum with nano in itself like i guess you can be your own bank if you do
Speaker: keep your own, you know, your, your seed, you protect it as best as you can.
Speaker: And I do understand the argument with like the whole building burning down and all of that.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And I feel like there are a lot of other things that you have to worry about when the building burns down and you lose your seed.
Speaker: And that's the thing I enjoy and also appreciate about Nano is because you can technically be your own bank.
Speaker: Once Nano is fully built out in commercial grade and used by the everyday, you know, Andy, Joe, whatever it is, it's...
Speaker: Literally, you can just be your own bank because if you have your own seed, no one else has access to it and it's safe and you can just spend it and you can actually use it as a currency.
Speaker: But I mean, you come from a place where I'm sure you encountered parts of the Philippines.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Maybe you didn't.
Speaker: Maybe you were a city boy the entire time.
Speaker: But there are absolutely parts of the Philippines that don't have access to banks.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker: So what do they do?
Speaker: They just hide it under their mattress.
Speaker: How safe is that?
Speaker: That's terrible.
Speaker: And they're not making any money off their money.
Speaker: Their money isn't growing in any way.
Speaker: So that's what I get frustrated with Nano about.
Speaker: It just doesn't make sense.
Speaker: I'm just going to sit there and sit on my money.
Speaker: Well, how do I know if, how do I loan it out to people and make some interest?
Speaker: How do I, you know, it's like, so I'm just like, let's say I had like a million nano.
Speaker: How do I find people to loan it out to, to make some interest on it?
Speaker: How do I do that safely?
Speaker: There's just so many points of centralization with Nano by not having smart contracts that I get frustrated on because it's like, okay, well, if money isn't flowing and it's not circular where it's being loaned and repaid and loaned and repaid,
Speaker: then the economy just is kind of stagnant because the money's just kind of sitting in everyone's individual wallets.
Speaker: And it's very difficult for it to cycle outside of when I actually go buy something.
Speaker: See, I think I definitely get your argument.
Speaker: But the thing is, growing up from the Philippines, I don't think it's the whole loaning thing and the banking thing.
Speaker: And like, hey, how do I get interest into my money or from my money?
Speaker: And how do I...
Speaker: Make it worth it that I'm holding a million nano or whatever.
Speaker: I think the whole issue comes from education in terms of financial education, financial literacy.
Speaker: And I think it's a different conversation when it comes to that because there are...
Speaker: a huge gap in terms of financial education in the Philippines.
Speaker: And in terms of social classes, there's a huge difference with the persona of someone saying, hey, how do I spend nano to buy my family a meal or whatever in a province?
Speaker: And there's another persona where it's like, hey, how do I, you know, earn interest from my thousand nano, a million nano and hold on to it for like, I don't know, a year, 10 years, five years, whatever the case may be.
Speaker: And the whole gap between that is just education.
Speaker: And I think that's where it kind of strikes a chord in me because I
Speaker: I didn't learn all this in school.
Speaker: I didn't learn all of this.
Speaker: Like my my family never really taught me this.
Speaker: Like they had to learn it on their own, too.
Speaker: You know, see that that's how I know you're American now, because that's how most Americans are, too.
Speaker: What do you mean?
Speaker: Wait, what?
Speaker: Most Americans don't learn financial literacy in school.
Speaker: And most Americans don't have parents that know of financial literacy.
Speaker: And so the majority of Americans are growing up not knowing anything about money.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: That's why, you know, the rich people, they know about money and they teach their kids at a very, very young age how to handle money.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: And that's why it's a lot tougher because, you know,
Speaker: You know, I mean, the Philippines is not the best performing country in terms of GDP and in terms of education.
Speaker: But moving here, I felt like there's a huge opportunity in terms of like teaching a lot of people about financial education and about interest, you know, loans, APRs, all the terms that people get so, what do you call this, like intimidated about, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, yeah.
Speaker: I guess my biggest frustration with Nano is like, okay, so let's say I'm living in a small village or like, you know, a small, one of the smaller islands in the Philippines and we need to build a bridge, but we don't have enough money in the village to get all the supplies.
Speaker: It's like, so what do you do?
Speaker: You just don't have the bridge?
Speaker: Like, that's what I mean.
Speaker: Like, I feel like that's what getting loans and, and
Speaker: And even if it's just a micro loan and not from a shady banker who's a piece of shit, but like an actual credit union type thing.
Speaker: I feel like you need some kind of resource or else everything just kind of stops.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because if you can't cross that river and so you can't build the village anymore, you can't grow anymore, you're just stuck until you can figure out a way to get that money to build that bridge.
Speaker: And I feel like that's a very specific small thing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But that's kind of in the grand scheme of things.
Speaker: If you're a small business owner and you're kind of stuck at this point where you want to expand your business, like the business next door to you shut down and they offered you the space, but you don't have enough money for it.
Speaker: But you can't actually make any more money because you don't have enough space to grow more.
Speaker: And you're never going to, like at the current rate, you're never going to be able to save up enough money to buy that space.
Speaker: Like that's a perfect example of what a loan is perfect for.
Speaker: Because you have that capital up front.
Speaker: You can knock down the wall.
Speaker: You can expand your business and you can grow it and you can slowly pay it back.
Speaker: But you can't do that with just money.
Speaker: nano and a wallet right like you need smart contracts you need banking you need loans you need like need these abilities to do these things and right now the only way for people to do that with nano is through a centralized platform and that's what i kind of get frustrated with it's like are we are we decentralized or are we not decentralized like no i i i definitely get you on that uh to turn up on your point the first point in terms of like the bridge um
Speaker: It's coming from, I guess, like the background with the Philippines, it's hard because people in the provinces are honestly content with what they have.
Speaker: And, you know, they have a farm or whatever it is, like they don't want to build a bridge.
Speaker: going to the city or whatever.
Speaker: It's like, in terms of like agriculture and like scaling their business, right?
Speaker: Very SF thing to do, like SF startup.
Speaker: They don't think that way.
Speaker: They just want to make sure that their family's fed like tomorrow and, you know, next few weeks after that.
Speaker: And I get your frustration for sure.
Speaker: Since I've experienced both sides, I lived in SF for a while and I've also lived in the Philippines for a very long time.
Speaker: I do get both sides and I...
Speaker: understand because you know if people would just know and people would just understand um hey like there's other angles and other routes you can take you can take a loan out or you know whatever it is like if it's nano like you don't have to loan it out in terms of just nano you can convert a fiat and you know but that's you know obviously a little bit more technical for the fiat and just get some loan against that um that's different and i feel like going back to nano
Speaker: I feel like it's really solving the issue with people...
Speaker: living in unbanked areas and being the actual currency of the future, right?
Speaker: Digital money in the sense.
Speaker: And I feel like that also, like I said, I feel like it comes down to education and it's hard when people are just thinking about feeding their family tomorrow or, you know, the next week, they're not thinking about like massive gains and wall street bets and all the green candles.
Speaker: And so I think that's like, you know, my, I understand both sides and I get that frustration too, because like, Hey, if I could take out a loan with my nano dude, that would be perfect.
Speaker: But I think nano does one job perfectly and so excellent.
Speaker: And I think like it should keep doing that.
Speaker: And, you know, it's, it's frustrating because honestly, you know, might be a hot take too, but I would love to buy NFTs with my nano and, you know, loan it out and,
Speaker: whatever it is and all the smart contract stuff.
Speaker: But I just have to accept that it can't, unfortunately.
Speaker: I mean, I've always said, not always, but for the last couple of years, I've said, I don't think Nano is gonna be a thing that people use.
Speaker: In my mind, it's gonna be like the backbone of things, kind of like TCP IP.
Speaker: And they're not gonna know what it is.
Speaker: And it's just kind of going in the background because, you know, we had Colin on the show,
Speaker: I flat out asked him, I said, can you point to an example of a fixed supply monetary system being successful in the history of humankind?
Speaker: And he said, no.
Speaker: And he said, I know it's an experiment.
Speaker: This is absolutely an experiment.
Speaker: And so we're asking people to try something that has never, ever, ever been done before.
Speaker: And I think that's my fear.
Speaker: Versus like we're trying to do too much all at the same time.
Speaker: So we're trying to convince people that a decentralized cryptocurrency can work.
Speaker: And then we're also trying to convince them that technically a deflationary currency can work.
Speaker: Even though we know that deflationary currencies never work.
Speaker: Because technically a fixed supply is deflationary as long as humanity increases the population.
Speaker: So that's kind of, that's another one of my fears where it's just like, and I'm, and I'm bringing these things up to you because you're a, you know, a well-educated guy at this point.
Speaker: And so, um, so I wanted to get your, like, you know, what's your take on that, on those two points?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, so I definitely get you on that side with Nano just being like, you know, just working its wonderful, magical ways in the background.
Speaker: And I think that's also a great thing to have in humanity.
Speaker: But if we aim to become the deflationary currency, by we, I mean like people that use Nano and just like
Speaker: you know, people that like it and actually transact with it.
Speaker: If we just use nano as a deflationary currency on our day to day life, I think that it actually says something to what the future of currency can be, because in a sense of like, if you use one nano to buy a coffee or something, you know,
Speaker: Currently it's trading around like five to $6 each.
Speaker: You can buy like a nice, really, you know, a coffee with that.
Speaker: And if you just use that and you know, you lose your one nano, it's, it's deflationary in that sense.
Speaker: And it's like, do you lose value in that?
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: You,
Speaker: On a micro scale, I feel like you gained value because you got what you paid for and you got a coffee and you used a currency that you have to spend on that coffee, right?
Speaker: And...
Speaker: I feel like with Nano just working on the background, I think that's also a huge opportunity in terms of businesses because there's a lot of... I mean, granted, cryptocurrencies are not as regulated as it is now today in 2021.
Speaker: But I feel like in the future, there will be some sort of regulations in terms of credit cards and cryptocurrency in a sense where sometimes credit cards can be...
Speaker: cannot be used, sorry, and they cannot be used for certain transactions.
Speaker: And I feel like Nano will be able to solve that depending on where our homies at the United States government feel like.
Speaker: I mean, and also I want to warn people that every time, and when I had Sharon on a couple of weeks ago, US tax accountant, and she flat out said, probably shouldn't use your cryptocurrency.
Speaker: Just because every time you use it, it's a taxable event and you have to pay 30% on that purchase plus all the taxes that you're already paying for it, like sales tax and all that.
Speaker: And so that becomes a huge, and you have to track every single time you buy anything with cryptocurrency and you have to store that and you have to report that at the end of the year and then pay taxes on it.
Speaker: Like right now in the US, it's such a fucking mess.
Speaker: Well, also, Michael, I listened to that podcast.
Speaker: Great episode, by the way, if people haven't listened to that.
Speaker: Sharon did also say that people in the cryptocurrency tax space don't know what the fuck they're doing.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: And I think...
Speaker: It just comes down to education, I feel like.
Speaker: And it's hard because it's like the Wild West.
Speaker: All these coins, like Save the Kids, Safe Moon, whatever.
Speaker: I don't want to burst anyone's bubbles here, but there's a lot of shady currencies out there.
Speaker: And it's just not working out for a lot of people.
Speaker: And it's a wild west, like I said.
Speaker: And even Sharon, you know, I looked into her website as well, the advisory group, I believe.
Speaker: And just like not a lot of people know what they're doing, especially with taxes.
Speaker: It's hard.
Speaker: But in the case, in a perfect world,
Speaker: I can just pull up my phone and spend my Nano on a cup of coffee, dinner.
Speaker: And, you know, I also like hotels, right?
Speaker: I've done that as well.
Speaker: I spend it on a hotel and it's... Oh, that's my video.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: I've, you know, used Nano and enjoyed my stay and it felt...
Speaker: It was so smooth.
Speaker: But the thing is, my honest take as a cryptocurrency enthusiast and user is that how different is it?
Speaker: But this is me also comparing the hotel transaction because I have to wait.
Speaker: Let's say I have a trip this weekend and...
Speaker: I pay with Nano.
Speaker: It's so fast, confirmed instantly.
Speaker: But I have to wait.
Speaker: The instant gratification isn't there.
Speaker: But if I do buy coffee, if I do spend in an in-person store, pay for parking, pay a ticket, whatever it is, I feel like that's the perfect world that Nano is.
Speaker: I guess aims to be because you just use your nano and just like you can spend it and you get what you had paid for.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I just, I just try, I mean, I feel like the whole purpose of nano is to make things as simple as possible, but in the, in the U S using nano becomes like a 17 step process because you have to write down that transaction and
Speaker: You have to then put it into a file.
Speaker: Then you have to, at the end of the year, you have to go through all those and you have to report every single one and then pay taxes on all those times you did it.
Speaker: And so it's like all of a sudden, Nano doesn't, any cryptocurrency doesn't become a simple, you know, easy process to use anymore.
Speaker: And I think that's what I get frustrated with is it's like, so what I've been thinking about lately, and I want to get your take on this, is I actually want to create
Speaker: a nano clone that's a stable coin.
Speaker: So kind of like Dai with ETH and how, and originally they only used ETH to keep the peg of Dai.
Speaker: But then eventually they started allowing USDT or USDC and, and that kind of just, and then, and then that became dangerous because USDC can be frozen and then that kind of fucks up die.
Speaker: And so dies in danger now of that.
Speaker: But if there was a way to keep like, you know, USDN or something like that and,
Speaker: And it runs the same exact way as Nano, but, you know, however they used to keep the die peg with ETH by trading it back and forth and selling it and buying it, do that with Nano because then you wouldn't be paying taxes on a stable coin, technically, because it's just a stable coin.
Speaker: Like you're not making any profits on it.
Speaker: You're not making any losses on it.
Speaker: It's, you know, relatively, it's the same price every single time.
Speaker: So,
Speaker: I feel like that would create a moneymaker or a market maker effect for Nano because you have to keep trading it back and forth to keep that peg.
Speaker: And then people could use it on a daily basis without worrying about using a deflationary asset.
Speaker: Because I always say, no intelligent person would ever take their Apple stock and buy a cup of coffee with their Apple stock.
Speaker: Because 99.9% of the time, that Apple stock is going to be worth more tomorrow than it was today.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I got your point.
Speaker: And that's why deflationary currencies, that's the same thing.
Speaker: When you have a currency that's deflationary, it's worth more tomorrow than it was today.
Speaker: And so it discourages people from buying anything beyond the basic needs to survive because, hey, do I really need to buy that new refrigerator today?
Speaker: Can I wait another week and have my money just make that much more money?
Speaker: It's like people just keep putting off those purchases and then just the economy starts to slow down and stagnate a little bit.
Speaker: So-
Speaker: I mean, maybe that's better for society.
Speaker: Maybe it's better for humanity.
Speaker: But if we're trying to just slowly change and move towards cryptocurrency, I think we have to be realistic that there's a reason why the entire world uses USD is because it's relatively stable.
Speaker: It's a little inflationary, but the goal is to be inflationary at 2%.
Speaker: And that's roughly the amount, you know, that's roughly the growth of the population.
Speaker: And so if you keep the inflation set to population growth roughly, then it's always going to be a dollar is a dollar.
Speaker: I feel like the angle you're taking here is coming from a trader perspective.
Speaker: No, no, no.
Speaker: This is all about usage.
Speaker: Like, cause, cause I'm like, why aren't people using nano?
Speaker: Like, like what are the reasons?
Speaker: Their day to day.
Speaker: And like, you know, Hey, like I'm going to book a hotel in Travala or whatever.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: It's the same reason.
Speaker: Like, it's the same reason why I wouldn't, if I don't need to sell my Apple stock today, if I say, Oh, you know, I could sell all my Apple stock and go buy a new computer today.
Speaker: Or like, okay, well can I get like two or three more months out of my computer?
Speaker: Because there's a chance that Apple's going to go up in the next two to three months.
Speaker: So why wouldn't I just get that extra money?
Speaker: Why wouldn't I wait to the last possible minute for my computer to actually collapse and then sell my Apple stock?
Speaker: And so like there's a reason not to buy stuff.
Speaker: When it could be worth more tomorrow than it is today versus if you're using a stable coin, it's just, oh, I need a computer.
Speaker: I don't, I don't worry about it.
Speaker: I don't think about that.
Speaker: Like right now, nobody thinks about is my dollar going to be worth more tomorrow than it is today.
Speaker: I mean, maybe right now because of all the shipping stuff.
Speaker: and inflation because of COVID.
Speaker: But a year and a half ago, nobody thought about that.
Speaker: Nobody thought, should I not buy this today?
Speaker: Because I'm able to get it cheaper tomorrow.
Speaker: Unless something went on sale.
Speaker: But we're not thinking about that with milk, right?
Speaker: Maybe milk now because it's so expensive.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But pre-COVID, no one was thinking like, oh, I shouldn't buy this milk today because I might be able to get it cheaper tomorrow.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: No, I definitely get you on that.
Speaker: I think the whole thing with people not using their Nano in terms of
Speaker: I guess, day-to-day transactions is because of also like speculations, not just the tax concerns and not just like the regulation concerns even.
Speaker: I feel like it's also like speculation because if you ask anyone in the nanospace, everybody believes that it's undervalued.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Not just in terms of as a currency or...
Speaker: Yeah, I think just the currency, I think people believe that it's severely undervalued.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: Rather than the $5 to $6 that it's trading it right now.
Speaker: So nobody wants to use it.
Speaker: That's the same problem with Bitcoin.
Speaker: Everyone's like, hodl, hodl, hodl.
Speaker: It's just like, everyone... Sorry, go ahead.
Speaker: No, yeah, but the thing is, I think that's where the nano community kind of separates.
Speaker: There's a lot of people that actually use it.
Speaker: And there's a lot of people that just constantly accumulates and buys it.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, I guess I'm one of those people that actually use it.
Speaker: I mean, I feel like there are a lot of people that... I mean, the other day, like, I saw... What do you call this?
Speaker: Like, on the NanoCurrency subreddit, someone bought, like, some hot sauce with their Nano.
Speaker: And it's just, like, some odd things.
Speaker: And it's, like, you know, they're really pushing for the adoption of Nano being used by merchants and, you know, actual stores.
Speaker: And I feel like that's the other side of the...
Speaker: the cryptocurrency, nano cryptocurrency spectrum, I guess, like people actually want to use it and people actually want to hold it.
Speaker: Whatever tribe you're in, I know people, I know those two tribes still believe that nano is severely undervalued, not just as a currency, like in terms of price, but also as, as a piece of technology.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, absolutely.
Speaker: But I mean, like there's, what my fear is that, you know, two pizza, Bitcoin guy,
Speaker: Is a cautionary tale.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh my God.
Speaker: Don't use your cryptocurrency.
Speaker: But that's kind of like hindsight though, Michael, don't you think?
Speaker: Well, but that's how we, that's how we grow as a society is we, is we write is, you know, we tell these stories, we learn about these stories and then we use them as cautionary tales.
Speaker: Hey, if you buy an asset that increases in value over time, don't use it until you absolutely have to.
Speaker: Definitely don't use it on fucking pizza.
Speaker: Because that Bitcoin you spent on that pizza is now worth like $87 million.
Speaker: So my fear is like when I had spent 37 Nano on I think a night or two nights, I think at Palm Springs with Travala.
Speaker: I was like, holy shit, this might be like $37,000 in the future.
Speaker: I get you on that 100%.
Speaker: But I feel like that's also part of the process.
Speaker: I don't mind losing out on that amount of money.
Speaker: Obviously, if that's not all of my Nano.
Speaker: But it's a good amount for a lot of people.
Speaker: And I feel like, you know, like if you just look at like, hey, like someone spent 10,000 bitcoins on a few pizzas like back in 2011.
Speaker: That's like hindsight.
Speaker: And I do get that too.
Speaker: But I think that it still does come down to the two tribes of people that follow Nano.
Speaker: Well, I know I get that fear for sure because like I feel that.
Speaker: I spend Nano here and there.
Speaker: And I was like, oh my God, I spent like, what do you call this?
Speaker: A few Nano on Nurch, like just buying Nano merchandise on like this website too.
Speaker: And it was like, oh my God, like what if this like Nano just skyrockets up to like $10, $15, right?
Speaker: Like, oh my, like that would suck, but whatever.
Speaker: Well, so, and, you know, the flip side of that argument is
Speaker: Bitcoin probably wouldn't be where it was if it wasn't for two pizza guy.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: And I'd like to think that I'd be that pizza guy, you know, but like, no, it's like, if it wasn't for Roger Ver going out there and trying to convince people to let him give them a Bitcoin, you know, he had to, he had to beg people, please let me, you'd go to, you know, you'd go to those conferences and just walk over like, please let me give you one Bitcoin.
Speaker: And I bet you all those people who said, no, screw you, blah, blah.
Speaker: I'm sure they're kicking themselves right now, now that it's $65,000.
Speaker: And so it's like, but you had to have people doing that in the beginning just to prove that it worked.
Speaker: So my point of creating a nano-based stablecoin that keeps its peg using nano is
Speaker: That allows people to save their Nano as a store of value and then in turn use a stable coin based on Nano day to day without worrying about, oh my God, is this 37 USDN going to be worth $37,000 a year from now or two years from now?
Speaker: It takes away that worry.
Speaker: But isn't that kind of like the same equivalent of just selling your Nano for fiat for USD and just spending it?
Speaker: I mean, the point of buying stocks is you buy a stock and then you...
Speaker: let it sit there and mature over time.
Speaker: I get that.
Speaker: With like the Apple stock, I feel like if you do sell the Apple stock, I don't remember how much it's trading at right now.
Speaker: But it's like, you know, if I sell my Apple stock today and I'll just buy a MacBook, right?
Speaker: That's basically where you're getting at.
Speaker: At the same time, I know it's not fully that, but it's very similar.
Speaker: Don't you think?
Speaker: Oh, it absolutely is.
Speaker: It absolutely is.
Speaker: And if the entire world was being paid with Nano, then...
Speaker: But then it gets back to the same point is there's a fixed supply of nano.
Speaker: And as the human population increases over time, it discourages using the nano because it might be worth more today than it was tomorrow.
Speaker: So why not hold it and then have, I forget the phrase.
Speaker: We had Noah Smith on here.
Speaker: It's something like good money –
Speaker: pushes out bad money and good money is money that you don't think about.
Speaker: Like you, you just use instinctually use.
Speaker: You don't worry about, about what it's going to be worth today or tomorrow.
Speaker: Cause that like, that's good money.
Speaker: Bad money is money that like you're, you're constantly worrying about the value of it and having to do math in your head is now a good time to use it is now a bad time to use it.
Speaker: Like that's bad money.
Speaker: Good money is the most seamless money you could possibly think of.
Speaker: It's just, hey, I need a cup of coffee.
Speaker: I've got the money.
Speaker: Here's the money.
Speaker: Cup of coffee.
Speaker: Great.
Speaker: Value.
Speaker: Whereas you thought about, holy shit, is this 37 Nano going to be worth $37,000 five years from now?
Speaker: That's bad money.
Speaker: Definitely bad money.
Speaker: I get you on that.
Speaker: But in terms of
Speaker: In terms of bad money and good money, I feel like that comes into a micro-argument in terms of it comes down to the individual that actually wants to spend it and actually buy it.
Speaker: I feel like
Speaker: Like I said, I feel like a lot of people don't even think about spending their Nano.
Speaker: And I feel like a lot of people do believe in a future where there's a lot of merchants that take Nano.
Speaker: And I feel like that's... I want to believe that's a future that we can live in, in terms of actually just using your Nano without it being pegged to USDN or DAI or whatever the case may be.
Speaker: And we can just spend our Nano freely.
Speaker: But then that comes into like with the argument of like, hey, like should nano become like an actual stable coin, right?
Speaker: Oh, no.
Speaker: I'm not advocating that nano becomes a stable coin.
Speaker: I'm advocating for a second coin that is pegged using nano.
Speaker: And so nano is kind of like gold reserve or whatever.
Speaker: And then it keeps –
Speaker: the stable coin that also runs like, it'd be like a clone of Nano and then, you know, people just run nodes for that as well.
Speaker: And they would do both side by side.
Speaker: No, no, no.
Speaker: I definitely get you.
Speaker: I think that,
Speaker: in terms of it being pegged to Nano, if I'm understanding properly here, I feel like that just adds... It'd be pegged to USD.
Speaker: Oh, USD is right there, sorry.
Speaker: I feel like it'd be adding layers of inconveniences and also headaches, in my opinion.
Speaker: In my honest opinion, I feel like, hey, can we just have the currency, the Nano XNO at this point, right, and spend it here and there?
Speaker: And I feel like
Speaker: that would be a wonderful future that we can live in.
Speaker: And like I said, with the whole like, you know, um, Sharon's episode here, the cryptocurrency spaces, I feel like is a, is a wild West and people are constantly trying to figure it out.
Speaker: And, you know, with the whole like tether thing going, going around and, you know, all these regulations and people getting checked in terms of the sec, um, um,
Speaker: It's all still getting figured out.
Speaker: And I feel like really early in the space.
Speaker: And, you know, I don't put it past me that that can be a possibility in terms of spending your Nano being pegged to the USD.
Speaker: Because, you know, that 37 Nano can be $37,000 in the future.
Speaker: I don't know what the case may be, but yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I only think that because I don't ever see any government in the world having nano be their currency.
Speaker: I don't see any government relinquishing control of their financial system to a completely decentralized international body.
Speaker: Right?
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: We don't even like being controlled by the UN.
Speaker: And that's just policy of how we deal with other countries.
Speaker: That's not even our financial system.
Speaker: I can't imagine the US ever saying, sure, we'll be at the behest of a few coders coding nano.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And some people and making sure people confirm the transactions by running a few nodes here and there.
Speaker: Like I just don't see any government ever, ever doing that.
Speaker: So do you think the whole El Salvador and Bitcoin as a legal tender was a mistake?
Speaker: What do you think about that?
Speaker: well I disregarding nano and its technology is wonderful technology for a second here but in terms of cryptocurrency being used as a legal tender in terms of not I know like El Salvador doesn't just take Bitcoin and you know spend it but having it as a as another piece of legal tender in that country do you think that's kind of giving control to a few coders
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And I feel like it's a way to take advantage of poor people.
Speaker: So I have a friend that I work with who's from El Salvador and he's not super educated.
Speaker: He's a busser.
Speaker: He's my age.
Speaker: He's been here for like 15 years.
Speaker: And he was like, hey, I was back there at the beginning of COVID.
Speaker: He got kicked out of the country by Trump and he finally got back in.
Speaker: And he was like, everybody there, like everybody I talked to loves it.
Speaker: You know, they love what Bukele's doing.
Speaker: Like they love these building roads and doing this and doing that.
Speaker: But when you don't have the education, the historical knowledge of what authoritarians do, where, you know, I said, well, what about when he held up the Congress at gunpoint and kicked out the entire Supreme Court and filled it with all his friends?
Speaker: He's like, oh, yeah, you know, that's bad.
Speaker: But, you know, he's building all these roads for us.
Speaker: So they don't have the historical context to understand, like, that's the power play.
Speaker: is he, you know, the, the authoritarian leader does a couple of bad things and then they start doing really, really, I mean, you, you know, you have, you have first, first hand experience with, with the Philippines.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I mean, the territory is a fucking monster.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I 100% agree with that.
Speaker: I mean, it's fucking crazy what he's doing.
Speaker: Just executing them on the streets.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I feel like the political side is definitely a different conversation.
Speaker: But in terms of El Salvador and Bitcoin as legal tender, I...
Speaker: Definitely agree with you on that in terms of it being a power play.
Speaker: But in terms of adoption, that's where I think I'll disagree with you on that.
Speaker: Because I think a lot of people are happy that...
Speaker: Bitcoin is being used as an actual currency in El Salvador.
Speaker: But I do know that people tend to hold on to it in terms like your argument that like, hey, like this might be worth a lot more.
Speaker: It's more like 10, 20%, whatever it is tomorrow.
Speaker: But in terms of the future that we're building today,
Speaker: The cryptocurrency in itself, I think, has a lot of meaning and movement behind it in the right hands and in the right, I guess, central authority government.
Speaker: I feel like it can really change a lot of people's lives in terms of day to day usage, because.
Speaker: Bitcoin being used as legal tender in El Salvador in whatever Bickele decides to do outside of cryptocurrency, I feel like
Speaker: still changes the outlook on a lot of people's day-to-day not just spending not just holding hodling i guess um but in terms of actually believing in a quote-unquote decentralized finance despite it being governed by the
Speaker: El Salvador's government.
Speaker: I don't know if I'm making sense here, but- No, but I think here's my fear is it all looks rosy until he starts murdering people in the street and then everyone starts associating Bitcoin with a murderous dictator.
Speaker: But wasn't that the case too in terms of the early days of Bitcoin Silk Road?
Speaker: Everybody was like, oh my god, Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies used by criminals, money laundering, all that.
Speaker: And now we hear that with NFTs.
Speaker: But Bitcoin is being used all over the world, unfortunately.
Speaker: But in terms of it having this sort of background...
Speaker: I feel like- I mean, people are buying it as a speculative asset.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: There's only a million active wallets a day on Bitcoin.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I mean, yeah, think about that.
Speaker: A million, and I say this all the time, there's a million active wallets daily for Bitcoin and there's 10 million people living in Sweden.
Speaker: And those 1 million wallets are using as much energy as the entire 10 million people of Sweden.
Speaker: So it's 10 times less productive.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: No, I get you on that.
Speaker: But then – Yeah, go ahead.
Speaker: So it's like the idea that people are using it is a misnomer and people may be buying it and just sitting on it just because they want to get rich.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And it's like a spec it's, it's like gold mining or something like that or whatever.
Speaker: It's just, but it's just like at the end of the day, what is it?
Speaker: If people are just using as a speculative asset, then they're not actually using it.
Speaker: Then how is it actually helping humanity?
Speaker: But then that, that's when I think the argument in terms of education comes into play because in term, in terms of market cap and supply, uh,
Speaker: I think people just want to hold Bitcoin because they think it's going to rise in price in the future.
Speaker: And I have no doubts about that.
Speaker: But in terms of people saying like, hey, I'm going to hold, I don't know, 0.00001 Bitcoin and I'm going to be a millionaire in 10 years.
Speaker: That's very unlikely.
Speaker: And people just understanding tokenomics and just understanding the actual supply of Bitcoin and what it is, they can't just say that like,
Speaker: hey, I got into Bitcoin 2017 or 2021 and I'll be rich in a few years.
Speaker: That's highly, highly unlikely because...
Speaker: I mean, if you look at the charts, man, like Ethereum is kind of, you know, taking over Bitcoin in terms of market dominance.
Speaker: And Bitcoin is just, you know.
Speaker: I'm not talking about Bitcoin.
Speaker: I'm talking about any cryptocurrency.
Speaker: Everybody thinks they're going to get rich.
Speaker: Anybody who's not in the cryptocurrency space and who doesn't buy.
Speaker: Like, why does anybody buy cryptocurrency for the first time?
Speaker: 99% of the time, I'm going to make up a percentage and I'm going to throw it out there.
Speaker: I'm going to say 99% of the time somebody buys cryptocurrency for the first time because they think they're going to get rich.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So it's like they're not using it because why would they use it?
Speaker: It's like a lottery ticket.
Speaker: You don't go buy a cup of coffee with your lottery ticket if you think your lottery ticket is going to be the winning numbers.
Speaker: Right?
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But then that's the thing too, like in terms of education, like people don't know what actual cryptocurrencies do, like establish cryptocurrencies at least because it's hard to actually understand.
Speaker: Like a lot of people in the cryptocurrency space think they know what they're saying.
Speaker: That's including me too.
Speaker: Most of the time, most of the time I am just trying to figure out as much as everybody else on the platform and just like,
Speaker: everybody else in the space because there's so much, so much things to learn and it's just the wild west right now.
Speaker: And nobody knows what the future holds and we're just all speculating in the end of the day.
Speaker: So this is my pitch for a nano based stable coin is if I give you a stable coin and say, this is worth a dollar, it was worth a dollar yesterday.
Speaker: It's worth a dollar today.
Speaker: And it's going to be worth a dollar tomorrow.
Speaker: And it's never going to be worth more than a dollar.
Speaker: I guarantee you, you're going to use it to buy a cup of coffee.
Speaker: But if I give you- I do that every day with Fiat.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But if I say, hey, here's a Nano.
Speaker: There's a pretty good chance at $6 a day.
Speaker: There's a pretty good chance like five or six years from now, it'd be worth $1,000.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I have a feeling that you're just probably going to set that aside and keep using your stable currency.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Even though it's relatively stable currency.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: My setback on that is like, why would I just, can I just spend my fiat then?
Speaker: My US dollars that are rotting every single day, inflationary wise.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's the whole point of inflationary currencies.
Speaker: It encourages people to use it as opposed to hold it.
Speaker: And governments want people to spend their money because it makes the economy...
Speaker: more stable.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So like when the stock market falls, there's this, there's this, uh, thing that they, that they, um, I'm blanking on the, it's, it's like a, a, a, a poll consumer confidence.
Speaker: Where's the consumer confidence.
Speaker: And when consumer confidence is low, they don't spend as much money and companies start to lay off people.
Speaker: Businesses shut down because there's just not enough money flowing around and businesses can't sustain each other.
Speaker: And if businesses can't sustain themselves, then they can't pay the people.
Speaker: And it's a cyclical, they call it a death spiral because more people lose work, so they don't have money, so they're not buying anything and more shops have to shut down because there are not enough people buying anything.
Speaker: And it's like, it's a fucking death spiral.
Speaker: So that's my fear of if Nano were to become a currency like that,
Speaker: People not spending it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Versus if you have a stable coin and it's running the same exact way as Nano where you and me can send it back and forth a billion times and it's still one USDN or one stable coin based on the Nano network.
Speaker: And it keeps that peg by you and me trading Nano back and forth on the exchanges to make sure it's always, that USDN is always worth $1.
Speaker: However ETH did it with DAI.
Speaker: You know, MakerDAO, I forget, I would probably just try to recreate that.
Speaker: But I feel like there needs to be a way to encourage people to not think they have a lottery ticket.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And
Speaker: I think it's also kind of just teaching people that not everything is a Dogecoin pump or like a Shiba Inu pump too.
Speaker: And when people actually understand that- You believe Nano is and I believe Nano is.
Speaker: So like how we're the ones who are trying to convince people to use Nano, but you and I both think it's going to be worth more.
Speaker: Right, definitely.
Speaker: I do believe it's going to be worth more in the future.
Speaker: I'm not throwing out any actual price out there, but I do think that it's severely undervalued as well.
Speaker: But I do also believe that spending Nano is beneficial in terms of the network.
Speaker: Just think about it in terms of the people that are...
Speaker: integrating nano into the businesses like hey like actually like people are actually using nano like let's use this and ultimately that raises speculation and also demand sorry supply oh sorry not demand to for nano is because people think that like it's actually getting used and that's why people are always pushing like hey when's the next partnership coming in hey when's like the next adoption coming in because
Speaker: Honestly, people want to push for all these big merchants and big automotive factories to take nano.
Speaker: But nobody wants to use the nano.
Speaker: Nobody wants to use it.
Speaker: But you get to that place by actually using your nano.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: I feel like it's a chicken and egg problem, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like what comes first, like the actual valued market cap or is it actually the adoption of like actually people using it?
Speaker: And I think my two cents...
Speaker: in this to the nano community.
Speaker: It's just like, spend your nano.
Speaker: If you're too scared of losing out on it, spend your nano, replace it, and you'll sleep freely.
Speaker: And if you're like, oh, I could have doubled it, right?
Speaker: I spent one nano and then I bought two nano or whatever, but I still lost one nano.
Speaker: It doesn't matter in the next few years if nano is going to be worth whatever much, right?
Speaker: You...
Speaker: I want people to believe that you are helping the adoption and actually usability of Nano in the long run because a lot of short-term games are being played in the cryptocurrency space right now, and not a lot of people are seeing the long run, in my opinion.
Speaker: Yeah, and I'm obliged to say...
Speaker: if you're an American, maybe don't do that just because of the tax implications.
Speaker: It's going to, it's going to bite you in the ass.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You got to talk to Sharon about that.
Speaker: But if you're not an American, I absolutely say, yeah, just do it.
Speaker: And then go out and buy more nano.
Speaker: If you, if you like nano and just go out and buy more,
Speaker: and try to get adoption through usage.
Speaker: But it is, you know, it is this real kind of catch 22 chicken and the egg thing.
Speaker: It's just like, that's why I think it's so, I think that's why America solved the problem, solved that problem by getting rid of the gold standard.
Speaker: But the danger is if you don't have a stable government in place, then inflation becomes a real issue.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And outside of the early 80s, late 70s, which was kind of when we officially got off the gold standard, that was the first time there was really that kind of inflation.
Speaker: Since then, inflation really hasn't been an issue up until now.
Speaker: And it's only now because it was a worldwide shutdown of every single nation's economy.
Speaker: And that hasn't happened for 100 years.
Speaker: So I think once that clears up.
Speaker: They can't forget about the 40% of the whole US dollar supply was printed in the last two years.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean- Yeah, that one too.
Speaker: Well, I mean, because of a global shutdown, not because you had people who were being irresponsible and just willy-nilly printing money for no reason.
Speaker: They were injecting money into the economy to keep the economy afloat because people couldn't work.
Speaker: I think if everyone was working, they wouldn't have injected all that money into the economy.
Speaker: The only danger is when you have Republicans in office who give tax breaks to billionaires who don't need it and then they devalue the currency that way.
Speaker: And it doesn't help any of the poor people.
Speaker: It only helps the rich people.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And then I think with the whole consumer confidence index, I felt like it was just at an all-time low when people were just scared of spending their fiat currency because, you know, obviously, like, COVID was scary, man.
Speaker: March of 2020, dude, like, everything was out of stock.
Speaker: And it was just like, you just don't know what's going to happen.
Speaker: And I feel like that's a...
Speaker: In terms of actual day-to-day life, that was a very, very tragic time in history where people were just scared to spend because they don't know.
Speaker: They don't have a job.
Speaker: They don't know what's going to happen tomorrow.
Speaker: They could spend this money.
Speaker: But what were they doing?
Speaker: They were going out and spending as much as they could on durable goods like toilet paper, like canned goods, because they weren't sure if the food supply was going to dry up.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So they were spending their money, but they weren't spending it on like, oh, let's go buy a new TV.
Speaker: Till the government printed a lot of money.
Speaker: Till the government printed the money.
Speaker: And they're like, oh, okay, cool.
Speaker: Now we can keep the economy going and blah, blah.
Speaker: And all that ended up doing was just like helping the billionaires anyway.
Speaker: But then I feel like that goes back to your argument a few minutes ago where it's like,
Speaker: Doesn't that – I wouldn't say authoritarian, but in terms of the US being inherently a capitalistic country, I feel like that just really benefits everyone up top.
Speaker: Oh, it absolutely did.
Speaker: I mean, they made – people like Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos made record profits over the last two years.
Speaker: But the average American average –
Speaker: had more wealth at the end than they did before.
Speaker: Because a lot of them were just saving that money because they weren't making people pay rent.
Speaker: They weren't making people do this.
Speaker: They were helping with rent.
Speaker: They were giving them money.
Speaker: So the average person has less debt now than they did before COVID started.
Speaker: Either a lot less debt or either a lot more debt.
Speaker: That's the only thing.
Speaker: No, no.
Speaker: The average person in this country, so over 50%, over 50% of the people have less debt now.
Speaker: Right, right.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: I meant like some people have more debt still.
Speaker: Yeah, but that's not the norm.
Speaker: I'm saying, but like that's a pretty crazy stat that the majority of people now have less debt.
Speaker: That's wild.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And, you know, in terms of like YouTube, I think the financial education YouTubers or YouTubes have seen record high viewers in terms of people learning about financial education and just like financial independence.
Speaker: Yeah, let's get it back to your channel.
Speaker: Let's promote your channel.
Speaker: What is the name of your channel anyway?
Speaker: We didn't even say that.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: Well, it's basically just Jason Carlo.
Speaker: You can find me there.
Speaker: Jason Carlo.
Speaker: I think if you put it on YouTube, Jason Carlo Nano, you'll see me on there.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But yeah, no, it's just like a lot of more people were scared to spend their money.
Speaker: And like people were just hungry and thirsty for financial education after COVID hit.
Speaker: Because, dude, it was like so scary.
Speaker: You don't know what's going to happen.
Speaker: Like you don't have that much money compared to like all these billionaires, millionaires.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And you just and I feel like that's why I said like I feel like that goes back to people being scared to spend their currency because they don't know what's going to happen in the future.
Speaker: In this case, like with Nano, we don't know if Nano is going to be worth more in the future.
Speaker: We we believe it will be worth more in the future.
Speaker: But
Speaker: In terms of COVID, I feel like people are just scared.
Speaker: They didn't know what was going to happen in the future to them or to their family, right?
Speaker: I also think it's – I think you're talking from a personal perspective.
Speaker: Definitely.
Speaker: And maybe you're coming into contact with a lot more immigrant families, first-generation families.
Speaker: And maybe you're talking to those people because all, all the, so I work in a department at a hotel where I'm the only American born person.
Speaker: Every single person is an immigrant that I work with.
Speaker: So there's 12 of us and 11 of them are immigrants.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: from Central Latin America, Central America and Mexico.
Speaker: But it's a union.
Speaker: It's a union hotel.
Speaker: So none of them were worried because we all just collected unemployment.
Speaker: And the hotel was like, all right, here's your paperwork.
Speaker: It's filed for unemployment and you have nothing to worry about.
Speaker: And so immigrants in that situation that are familiar with that
Speaker: Being in a union, they know they have security.
Speaker: And that's why those jobs are like our gold for them.
Speaker: But I could see like immigrants, you know, because I also worked at bars for 20 years that weren't unions.
Speaker: And if it shut down, that's it.
Speaker: You just don't have any money.
Speaker: You're fucked.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: And I feel like that's a huge benefit in terms of working for a union is because you know you're backed.
Speaker: You're backed up, dude.
Speaker: You don't have anything to worry about if your current employer kind of fucks with you.
Speaker: You're backed up as a big boy.
Speaker: You're good.
Speaker: But there's a lot of...
Speaker: A lot of jobs out there that are not backed by the union, unfortunately.
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, New York had record numbers of people going to food kitchens and just not knowing how they were going to eat every day.
Speaker: That's crazy.
Speaker: So it's like I definitely understand what you mean.
Speaker: We had record numbers of people who had food insecurity, but we also had record numbers of people who just had more money than they normally had.
Speaker: And they were just like, oh, I've got all this extra money.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: No, I definitely want to disclose that.
Speaker: I am talking from, speaking from a background of an immigrant family and also coming from a third world country without like, I don't even think like unions exist in the Philippines.
Speaker: Not as far as I know, like at least to the scale of it is in the U S I worked for UPS back then too.
Speaker: I know I was a supervisor for, for a hot minute there.
Speaker: And yeah,
Speaker: the unions for like the drivers and people that load, um, the trucks, they honestly just didn't really give a shit because like, they know they're back.
Speaker: We can't really tell them anything.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I respect that and I get that, but there, there's that kind of like, you know, what tribe you're going to be in kind of thing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's hard, but in terms of a individual person basis, like you're good.
Speaker: If you're working for a union, like you're, you're, you're backed up, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, it's definitely been a good job to have over the last five, six years.
Speaker: Definitely.
Speaker: So how can people, well, you already said, just search Jason Carlo Nano on YouTube.
Speaker: What about Twitter?
Speaker: How can people find you on Twitter?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, so my socials, Twitter, Instagram, and even YouTube, just slash Jason ESG.
Speaker: That's Instagram.com, Twitter.com, YouTube.com slash Jason ESG.
Speaker: And you can find me there.
Speaker: Say hi.
Speaker: Unlike your favorite YouTuber, I'll actually respond.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Nice.
Speaker: So is there anything else you want to, that, is there anything else you wanted to talk about that, uh, that you didn't because I railroaded you and I talked about what I wanted to talk about instead, which I always end up doing in the show.
Speaker: And I feel like an asshole afterwards.
Speaker: No, no, no.
Speaker: I mean, I learned a lot and, you know, it's fun.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I think the only thing I want to talk about is just spend your nano, guys.
Speaker: Spend your nano.
Speaker: Don't be scared.
Speaker: Don't be scared to spend your nano.
Speaker: If you're too scared to spend your nano, spend and replace.
Speaker: That's the thing.
Speaker: Spend 10 nano, buy 10 nano, and...
Speaker: That's the only workaround that we have at the moment, you know, until Michael develops this whole USDN thing going on right here.
Speaker: But spend your Nano.
Speaker: It goes a lot further than you think because it really shows everyone in terms of the business side that people are actually interested in Nano.
Speaker: And yeah, I think that's it.
Speaker: I mean, if you haven't told any of your friends about Nano,
Speaker: Tell them to download Natrium and show them.
Speaker: It's actually like that's the best way to have people adopt Nano, I think, in terms of like the friends level.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's pretty amazing.
Speaker: I mean, even back in 2017 when I first was using the developer wallet that was still kind of buggy, it was still a thousand times better than anything I was using.
Speaker: The old wallet was so ugly.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And you had to like... The old wallet was so ugly.
Speaker: You had to like manually accept transactions.
Speaker: And I was just like, where's my money?
Speaker: Like, oh, you have to like, you have to, you know, you have to press this button and it goes, it tells it to accept it.
Speaker: And it's like, but even that was still a thousand times better than all the Bitcoin, Ethereum and IOTA wallets.
Speaker: Right, and you don't have to have a necessary anxiety if you send nano or even receive it.
Speaker: It means you don't have to worry about it.
Speaker: I mean, now, we got the new all this nature, you just instantly receive it, you see it, and instant gratification.
Speaker: And who doesn't like that?
Speaker: It's funny that even if it's like a second and a half slow for some reason, because this is the app,
Speaker: like hung for a second, I have like a little bit of anxiety.
Speaker: It's like, Oh my God, did something happen?
Speaker: Like where's my nano?
Speaker: The fact that it takes like two seconds.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, but that's how amazing nano is.
Speaker: It's like, if it's not there within two seconds, I start to have anxiety.
Speaker: Like that's how fast it is and consistent it is.
Speaker: I definitely get you that I worry about that, especially like back then too.
Speaker: I think a few months back with the whole like spam attack too.
Speaker: I tried sending nano to my other wallets and all that's kind of moving funds around.
Speaker: And I was like, Oh my God, where's my nano?
Speaker: I had to like wait, wait a lot longer than I typically do.
Speaker: But those things are solvable.
Speaker: It's a matter of time till it gets like actually like fully solved.
Speaker: So do you know anything about 20 version 23?
Speaker: So the thing is with version 23, I think there's something about like pruning ledgers and all that.
Speaker: I don't want to get into it too much, but it's a lot more technical and a lot more boring in my opinion.
Speaker: I think the whole thing that I actually wanted to talk about too, like the, the new news that the foundation released where nano is totally forgot to talk about that X no now.
Speaker: And they have a very, very cool currency symbol now.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that got to be like so excited.
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: Like, what do you think about that new news?
Speaker: I'm on the fence because I feel like they had already done one rebranding and then a second rebranding.
Speaker: I get the idea of why they're doing the X. That makes total sense because all currencies have to start with an X. And like, that's why BTC is traded as XBT.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so that totally makes sense to me.
Speaker: But then when they said you can't use the Nano logo anymore because that's for the Nano Foundation, I was like, what?
Speaker: Wait, who said that?
Speaker: Nano Foundation.
Speaker: George.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: She said, you know, we expect people to not use this anymore.
Speaker: This is for the Nano Foundation and our partners that we work with.
Speaker: You should just use Nano.
Speaker: You should just say Nano.
Speaker: And I was like, what?
Speaker: So there's no... I think in her mind, that X with the two lines through it should be the new logo.
Speaker: I think... Just like the B with the two lines through it is the Bitcoin logo.
Speaker: No, you're right.
Speaker: I get where you're coming from.
Speaker: And I think I've seen that on the Discord too.
Speaker: But I think people misconstrue that as like, oh, the Nano Foundation is going to sue everyone that doesn't use X instead of the cool N logo, right?
Speaker: I think... I just think that using both is still fine in terms of people...
Speaker: I mean, obviously I can't speak for the foundation, but when you're showing people what nano is and like, you know, like using the N or like the X, right?
Speaker: It's still...
Speaker: shows the same currency or like it still stands for the same currency.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Like I feel like that's all like details that people like to kind of, you know, like twist and pull whatever it is into their own belief.
Speaker: But I like, I still have on my thumbnails.
Speaker: I still have the old logos.
Speaker: I mean, I might change some like for the Travala video for, yeah, I don't think I'm actually spending it.
Speaker: But I think like if, you know, third party companies start,
Speaker: start using nano or promoting nano, unless it's a nano foundation partner, but then I'm like the whole, like nano foundation is going to dissolve it at a certain point.
Speaker: So we're not like people aren't supposed to use the seven dots anymore after the, after nano foundation dissolves.
Speaker: It's like just the lack of clarity and the lack of foresight to talk about, to have this like perfectly in writing beforehand, um,
Speaker: got me a little annoyed.
Speaker: So I was just like, come on.
Speaker: Like you should know exactly.
Speaker: They should have said, this is the new Nano logo.
Speaker: This, the seven dots is the Nano foundation logo.
Speaker: Two different things.
Speaker: From now on, the X with the two slashes is the new Nano logo from now on.
Speaker: Moving forward, full stop.
Speaker: Okay, great.
Speaker: Everybody uses that now.
Speaker: Because now it's like some people are still using seven dots.
Speaker: Some people are using the X. There's not consistency.
Speaker: And I don't like confusion in spaces like this, especially in decentralized spaces.
Speaker: It's just like, I just feel like
Speaker: it confuses new people.
Speaker: And I don't, it's like, it's already, this space is already as confusing as it is.
Speaker: And I feel like you instinctually have the desire to educate people.
Speaker: I instinctually have the desire to educate people.
Speaker: That's why we both have our perspective on,
Speaker: podcasts and YouTube channels.
Speaker: And when there's even something like that, I mean, even with the Niano thing, even saying Niano is just pennies to Niano, we had to, it took me a day and a half, two days, three days, four days, I think actually of, of testing out language that made people completely understand.
Speaker: No, Niano is not a new currency.
Speaker: It's just like Satoshi's.
Speaker: It's just like pen.
Speaker: It's just like sense.
Speaker: It's just like, but like I had to, I had to keep like beta testing language and
Speaker: to finally find something that I could say consistently every single time and people weren't confused anymore.
Speaker: And I feel like Nano didn't really do that.
Speaker: Like Nano Foundation didn't really do that with the logo.
Speaker: And I felt like they should have done that with the logo ahead of time and made sure that everyone was aware.
Speaker: And everybody in the community was on the same page.
Speaker: So I think like the people in the community just want direction from them.
Speaker: And they have a tendency of not giving any direction.
Speaker: And I feel like that's kind of dangerous.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I get you that in terms of the education perspective because people might be confused.
Speaker: But I think that with US dollars and the S with the line through it and USD or whatever people use for dollars and USD, X no in this case, right?
Speaker: And dollars equals to nano.
Speaker: I feel like that comes with time.
Speaker: It's just like the initial confusion too, where people were like, oh my God, all these old memes are going to be so outdated now.
Speaker: All these pictures are going to be outdated now.
Speaker: I feel like people are worried about the wrong things.
Speaker: I'm definitely looking at it more long-term in terms of like, this is great because it's actually seen as an actual currency.
Speaker: And you obviously know how I feel about it being used as a currency.
Speaker: So...
Speaker: um i'm excited about this and i i get why you're a little bit annoyed i i've seen um people on the discord too i've been annoyed like hey like what the hell's going on you know all this stuff but um i think time will time will tell and i'm sure there will be news around the new x no change with uh george and colin coming out but
Speaker: We'll see.
Speaker: We've got to give it some time.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: The whole like nano thing too.
Speaker: I think that was, I would honestly, I was a bit confused, but I did understand when I read into it, but I, I can understand where, where people, um, you know, don't do the same type of research that I do.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: And, and I mean,
Speaker: I'm going to conspiracy theory here.
Speaker: Tinfoil hat.
Speaker: I don't even know if Colin's still around.
Speaker: I think he's just an animatronic robot at this point because I haven't seen him in real life, you know, doing interviews or anything like that.
Speaker: Have you in the last six months to a year?
Speaker: Last six months.
Speaker: Didn't he do the one with Chicken Genius Singapore?
Speaker: Like the past six months?
Speaker: Oh, maybe he did.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: He did.
Speaker: He did.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I think he's still a fully functioning human being around.
Speaker: You know, I think he's coding around V23, V24, maybe.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: But I know.
Speaker: I think he's still around.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Thanks for playing with me on that one.
Speaker: I think he's still good.
Speaker: Just blink.
Speaker: Blink if you're held awesome.
Speaker: Blink if you're not a bot.
Speaker: If you're not a Twitter bot.
Speaker: Blink if Satoshi didn't hold you captive.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Well, I appreciate you coming on and chatting and letting me fucking talk your ear off about stable coins and shit.
Speaker: No, I mean, I appreciate you having me here, man.
Speaker: It's definitely a fun one, for sure.
Speaker: And I will have all of Jason's links in the show notes.
Speaker: Check out his YouTube channel.
Speaker: He has great podcasts.
Speaker: relatively short videos that are chock full of knowledge.
Speaker: So if you don't have a ton of time, you know, there's not one of those videos where you have to sit there for like 50 minutes and listen to a lecture.
Speaker: It's always fun to just like, you know, five, 10 minutes, get so much information or just like cool narratives of like you taking that trip and using Nano along the way and just your experience.
Speaker: Like that was a cool, that was a really fun video to watch.
Speaker: So definitely check out his videos.
Speaker: Thanks, Michael.
Speaker: I appreciate the plug, man.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Come say hi.
Speaker: Like I said, I'll actually respond to you guys.
Speaker: Tweet at me, whatever the case may be.
Speaker: Say hi.
Speaker: And I'm always happy to chat.
Speaker: Sweet.
Speaker: All right, everybody.
Speaker: Thanks for listening.
Speaker: Talk to you on the next one.
Speaker: Peace.
