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Episode 1 - Bethesda Xbox exclusives and rioting at Riot
11 Plays4 years ago
The boys discuss Bethesda exclusives, PS5 sales, GTA5 spaghetti code, how Star Citizen is a scam, how loop hero isn't one, and how we're never going to get any of that sweet sweet league of legends money
Not bad for our first episode.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Controversial Opinions
00:00:39
Speaker
too loud. There you go. Now I fixed it. It's episode one. This is where we make mistakes. We learn things.
00:00:48
Speaker
We're allowed to make a lot of mistakes here. Maybe have some hot button opinions. Mistakes and those opinions coming back. Legend of Zelda is overrated. All that stuff. Well, first of all, we're streaming on Twitch. First of all, we're streaming on Twitch and taking advantage of none of the features of Twitch, which is showing any sort of video or anything. Well, there's a chat box. There is a chat box for all our viewer. I'm sure.
00:01:17
Speaker
Uh, so primarily I think this is supposed to be an audio only experience, but I also think that streaming on Twitch is the only way that we're going to get to commit ourselves to releasing this to the public. So that's why we're doing it. Yeah, that's true. It's true. So just wait for that live feedback in that chat box.
00:01:34
Speaker
That's right. Or just tell us that we're wrong and everything that we think is incorrect, which is probably true. Um, maybe it's worthwhile also just to say right at the top.
Gaming News Focus
00:01:44
Speaker
So this is a gaming new show. I say in quotation marks. Um, really it's just an excuse for Charles, Andy, and I to.
00:01:51
Speaker
make each other laugh talking about the news stories that may or may not happen in the week. We may talk about the big story, we may talk about stories that no one really gives a crap about but us, but mostly we just try to make it entertaining and maybe slightly informative. Well hopefully hopefully I'll learn something. Hopefully you'll get your door dash which is apparently I just listen I didn't get another ghost notification so I don't know if I'm getting my noodles.
Microsoft's Bethesda Acquisition
00:02:17
Speaker
This is the hard hitting investigative journalism that we're going to bring. And you know what that means though? I'm drinking on an empty stomach. I'm going to really feel this mosaic IPA. We're going to need a graphic for the Andy drink count. Well, this is the second.
00:02:38
Speaker
Well, Andy, I'm, I'm really worried about the fact that you haven't had food because our first article may shock you. But I have a drink in hand. Phil Spencer says they spent billions of dollars on Bethesda, not to put their exclusives on Sony. Wait, why? Wait, hold on. Grass grows, birds fly, sunshine.
00:03:03
Speaker
And Microsoft bought exclusives for a reason. Yeah, pretty much. But they said it's not for exclusives? No, they did. They 100% did. So as you may recall, Microsoft paid $7.5 billion for Bethesda. And everyone's like, so what's that mean? Are we not going to get Elder Scrolls? Are we not going to get Fallout 5? Are we not going to get Starfield? And the answer is yes. You're not going to get those things unless you play it on Game Pass.
00:03:33
Speaker
Mm-hmm just to read Spencer's statement So obviously I can't sit here and say every Bethesda game is exclusive because we know that's not true There's contractual obligations. Those are things like fallout 76 deaf loop and What's the other game they're releasing for Sony? Is it returnal? No, I don't either way. There's one more Oh, no deaf loop Tokyo
00:03:55
Speaker
Def Loop Tokyo, yeah. Ghostwire Tokyo. Ghostwire Tokyo, thank you, excuse me. Ghost, Def Loop and Ghostwire Tokyo, yeah. So they're already committed to those, but you're gonna boot them up on PS4 and see Microsoft Game Studio, which is hilarious. But anyway. They're gonna integrate, I'm learning so much right now. See, I thought it was just them building up the Game Pass.
00:04:16
Speaker
Well, yes. He continues. We have games that exist on other platforms, and we're going to support those games on the platforms they're on. But if you're an Xbox customer, the thing I want you to know is this is about delivering great exclusive games for you that ship on platforms where Game Pass exists.
00:04:37
Speaker
That's our goal. That's why we're doing this. That's the root of our partnership that we're building. So unless your PS five has game pass, you ain't getting next gen Bethesda exclusives.
Valuation Discussions: Gaming vs. Traditional Media
00:04:48
Speaker
They're going to be on Xbox and PC only. I mean, that's fair. They spent like 7.5 billion dollars. They did. They really bought out. We don't have exclusives. We'll have all okay. First, I want to figure something out.
00:05:06
Speaker
Uh-huh. Mm-hmm. How do you value something at $7.5 billion? Well, there's people for that. Yeah, they're called actuariels. I mean, is it that good?
00:05:21
Speaker
Well, you figure it right that you take a look at their revenue over the past 10 years and you say, OK, you sold this many of this game and this many of that game and we can project that you'll probably sell this many of that game in the future. And somewhere around there, they figure out a price. And the other important part here, too, by the way, is they bought Zenny Max, which owns Bethesda and the other 13 other game studios. So it's not just Bethesda.
00:05:48
Speaker
yeah it is 14 game studios and their revenues oh my gosh it's just so much money it's just how does this exist how do people have this much money
00:06:01
Speaker
How is Microsoft? How are we okay? Is this a commentary on wealth? All the major tech companies we have reliably, Microsoft is in that discussion.
00:06:22
Speaker
Well, Andy, I was watching a report or I was on the TikToks. Someone posted a report from 1999 about people going, how can Amazon stock me this much? Are you telling me Amazon is going to put Sears Roebuck out of business? Oh, no. Oh, no. Well, I guess that's Bethesda. Well, not really. He's on email.
00:06:51
Speaker
But really, $7.5 billion. I just can't get over this. When do you make that money back? How much did Star Wars sell for? $10 billion? $4 billion. No, $4 billion. It was $4 billion. Bethesda's twice as valuable as Star Wars? Andy. Andy, it's gambling. Andy, what do you want? This is two Star Wars. Yeah, but if you think about it this way, Star Wars is one IP. They bought like $25 billion.
00:07:20
Speaker
Okay, Skyrim's on everything, but it's not Star Wars. Well, I mean, right, but no one's saying that one Bethesda or Zenny Max property equals one Star Wars, but you have Doom, you have Elder Scrolls, you have Fallout, you have... There's others that are escaping me at this exact moment. Also, they did announce they're gonna be making an Indiana Jones game soon, which is cool.
00:07:46
Speaker
Cool. Oh, wait, did they buy Star Wars or Lucas arts? I mean, they bought they bought Lucas films, right? Bethesda is overrated. OK, I would I would. Well, it's a good thing they bought 13 other studios besides Bethesda. Yeah, that's true. Like, again, right. You have to understand that these studios will also create new IPs, which will in turn create more revenue if if they are done well.
00:08:17
Speaker
Well, I'm just saying like that's it when it comes to how much something is it's worth as much as everyone if they all agree on.
00:08:28
Speaker
That's true. It's all made up.
Console Wars and Exclusivity Challenges
00:08:30
Speaker
All it is is an agreement. Yeah. I mean, if you want to if you if you want to think about it, they also bought Disney also bought Marvel for four billion dollars. So Disney. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. So. So in Star Wars combined. Yeah. Equals one's any. I don't believe that. Whatever. You hear that, nerds? Yeah. Yeah.
00:08:59
Speaker
You know what this means? Video games is even more art, okay? This video games have reached art when you're more valuable than Star Wars and Marvel. Well, technically it's a little bit less. Andy, you should clean your shoulders and take that chip off them. I just can't get over it. I mean, the return on those IPs has been enormous. I don't think Microsoft making that much money.
00:09:24
Speaker
But you know what, God bless. If they can make that much money, all right, just pass them as long as they're getting taxed on time. I mean, they've essentially made Netflix for gaming, which, if you think about it right, is the most disgusting thing that Sony ever let them do.
00:09:41
Speaker
That's true. Funny enough, to make this a small discussion about Sony, Sony is getting a little too comfortable being ahead in the console wars. It's always fun when they keep every new iteration of consoles, but Microsoft did need something to feel like they're catching up, and this is definitely that. Hopefully that keeps PlayStation more
00:10:09
Speaker
competitive and then more willing to do other things.
00:10:12
Speaker
because I would like them to, I would like to see something push harder in new services. Well, how much money does Sony have? That's a great question, Andy. That's a great setup for our next. The PS5 is the fastest selling console in US history. So it's a great thing you're not going to be able to play Elder Scrolls 6, Fallout 5 or Starfield on it.
00:10:44
Speaker
PS5 was the fastest selling console in US history by dollar sales. And the second best Harvard platform in February, only coming behind the switch, which I can only assume is because of the fact that you still can't find a PS5 anywhere. Yeah, that's wild. Imagine if they had the manufacturing capacity to actually meet demand. And here's the thing. Here's the thing.
00:11:10
Speaker
What's the thing? Continue. It's not that good. Like fastest selling. Well, no, maybe it does have the best exclusive lineup. I don't understand how do you sell this much? Is it like scarcity encourages it encourages the sales?
00:11:32
Speaker
Well, I think you also have the most popular video game console since the PS2 for Sony, and then you have a better one. It's like, Hey, this increases load times and everything. Yeah. Again, Andy, like.
00:11:49
Speaker
The PlayStation, gaming has gotten popular over the years, right? There's a bigger user base year over year as more people are accepting of gaming and everything else going on. So we get the biggest audience and then with COVID, everyone is stuck at home and suddenly you want to have something to entertain you with. It makes sense. And as well as the idea that
00:12:15
Speaker
It was one of the more popular gaming consoles and brands. And suddenly you make a new one. I mean, it's very natural to go, oh, there's a new version that's better. I'll buy that.
00:12:25
Speaker
I
GTA Online Optimization Mystery
00:12:26
Speaker
just I just think it's wild. But you know what? Who am I to begrudge success, right? You're definitely not because I got you a PS5. OK, that's fair. And you know what? Had a strong lineup. Everybody poo pooed on the design. OK. Sold enough. All right. I'm still not a fan of that design. I don't see rectangles selling this much.
00:12:51
Speaker
All right. Oh, the series. I think the series is doing very well. The X I'm not sure about. But, you know, I think people like the X and, frankly speaking, with all this Game Pass stuff, it's only going to get better. Yeah, that's true. That's where your Skyrim is. Yeah.
00:13:10
Speaker
But you know, I... great. I think it's great. I'm just amazed. I don't know why everything is so surprising to me today. Maybe I just want to enjoy the world. Alright. Turned up to 11. I need food.
00:13:26
Speaker
Well, I guess the question is, Charles, beer is just destroying me. Oh, God. It's that mosaic IPA. All right. This is a pint can. So I got to I got to pour the rest in this plant. Today's episode not brought to you by mosaic IPA. No, I mean, but I think this goes back to what Charles was saying earlier, is you wanted to see Sony try. Yeah, I don't think they have to. Oh, no, they don't.
00:13:55
Speaker
they're gonna get even lazier you know what though they've got enough good studios they're gonna make you know what was interesting tell me uh-huh yeah
00:14:05
Speaker
Ghost of Sushima is the most completed open world game ever on the Sony console. Yeah. That's one of my very platinums. Yeah. Right. And Spider-Man is above that for whatever other category of game. I have no idea. So Sony's got it locked down. I wonder how much they paid for those studios. Did they pay $7.5 billion? Did they pay more than Star Wars? I don't know.
00:14:34
Speaker
Well, they don't own Insomniac yet, although I... Oh, I thought they actually bought them. Whoops. Oh no, they bought them, because didn't they get that Jet Grind Radio ripoff one?
00:14:50
Speaker
That's Sunset Overdrive and it's a fantastic game. Alright, should be fair, never played it, couldn't even tell you what it is. I just thought jet grind when I saw it and then I moved on. I'm sorry that you're uncultured and didn't get to play the one good Xbox One exclusive.
00:15:10
Speaker
Wasn't it the only Xbox one exclusive? No, no. There was Rise, Son of Rome, Killer Instinct. Oh, oh, that's true. Halo. Really selling me here. Crackdown three. No one likes that one. No, no, no. That's why they bought Star Wars and Marvel. OK, that's Disney. Single good. That's Disney, not Microsoft. They spent Star Wars Marvel money.
00:15:39
Speaker
There you go. They spent Star Wars Marvel money to get Skyrim, because they have the money, because everything's made up. Everything's made up. I know. The pharmaceutical companies there, they paid them a lot of money to get the microchips and the vaccines for Bill Gates. That's true. That's true. And you know what? You sell that data, you've got $7.5 billion. That's exactly it.
00:16:05
Speaker
that's that's how we got here well you know what disclaimer because the internet is batshit crazy we don't believe bill gaze controls the vaccines get a vaccine for the love of god for the love of god i qualify for one soon
00:16:20
Speaker
Although can you even trust me? Andy, can you trust me? I'm already vaccinated. Oh, that's true. Listen, listen, you're controlled. Okay. That's right. You know, at least your immunity is more than zero. I just turned around. There's an Xbox series X sitting behind me. Oh no.
00:16:40
Speaker
Listen, with advertisements tuned, just for you. And I support it. I guess keeping in that saying of, we can't believe how much money things are making. Let's go. Let's keep rolling. GTA 5. Oh my god. Are they worth $7.5 billion? No, but they had enough money to pay a modder $10,000 for figuring out why it takes an hour and a half to load a map in GTA Online.
00:17:09
Speaker
So if you hadn't heard about this a modder figured out just due to some bad coding more or less that GTA Online's loading times were decreased by 70% Oh Wow, no, okay. So to be fair number one, it's not easy to make a game that big I think we all know number two, you know captain hindsight is pretty powerful But number three this game has made so much money
00:17:39
Speaker
I'm curious why they didn't go back to optimize it. Well, if you don't have to optimize it, why would you right? I was gonna say so this game came out eight years ago on another console and they couldn't be asked to figure this out in that amount of time But someone finally did and you know, it's one thing if it was like a 20% load difference. This is two-thirds difference
00:18:08
Speaker
That's pretty wild. Yeah, that's pretty wild. Yeah, they're going to be working this update into the actual official patch. So and I believe they're paying the moderate $10,000 for finding or something like that, which is ridiculous.
00:18:24
Speaker
I mean, it's not, well, okay. So the, the thing about it too is, um, I mean, $10,000 isn't so ridiculous. So here's the thing. It's very common in, uh, programming companies to have basically what we call a bug bounty. Uh, okay. And by common, I mean, uh, I've heard Google, Google used to have one. They may have stopped doing it for bug bounties, but they used to pay money if you found and fixed bugs.
00:18:53
Speaker
I knew Rockstar did have one for them. I think Microsoft had one as well. But basically, find a bug, report it, find a security flaw, report it, and you get money for it. It's a nice way for Whitehats to look at in hardened software. But in this case, 70%, that's worth more than 10 grand, I feel like.
00:19:20
Speaker
Yeah, considering the fact this will probably make people play more, buy more short cards. It's. Ridiculous. What is it? A dedicated viewer, Regga Thor in chat says it was basically struggling to parse a 10 megabyte 10 megabit JSON file, which. Wait, are you serious? Yeah. That was 70 percent of the vote time. Yep. Oh, my God.
00:19:48
Speaker
Now, to be fair, I've written inefficient stuff. I did it today as a matter of fact, he says. I've even written in my comments, apologies for how bad it was. But you know what though, who am I to judge? Who am I to judge? From the article, I believe it was.
00:20:06
Speaker
It was all under one thread on a CPU. So if you're not properly threading, yeah, that's going to happen. Who has more than one thread? Who has a multi-threaded CPU? They don't exist. They don't exist? Absolutely. Everybody runs a Core 2 Duo, OK? It's just my Intel Celeron has really been running that marathon. Well, he deserves more than $10,000. They got the money.
00:20:34
Speaker
Yeah. Well, they did it. They awarded him the 10 grand through the bug bounty system, which normally is reserved. I think it was the max, right? Yes. It's normally reserved for security vulnerabilities. And technically this isn't one, but they were like, we'll give it to you.
00:20:54
Speaker
Yeah, it's looking at PC Gamer here doing their own independent testing. It says it would take them about three minutes and 15 seconds to get from game launch to the apartment in game. People they post the patches now live of as today and people are getting two minutes or just over a minute. So that's a reduction of a minute to two and a half minutes, which is wild. Yeah.
00:21:19
Speaker
It's like that person for finding it almost people up there. It almost makes me want to play GTA again because the loading screens were honestly the worst part of that game. Oh, it was the worst part. Oh, are we more than 10 grand in marketing just with this? Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's right. Come play
Star Citizen's Ambitious Funding Model
00:21:39
Speaker
our game again. We fixed our shit. Oh, no. Well, we didn't. A fan did.
00:21:44
Speaker
And we just sneezed and handed him the tissue. That's the Bethesda model, Andy. That's fair! But it didn't work out for CD Projekt Red. Sorry, bud. Eh, they got time. You got it cleaner.
00:22:00
Speaker
What was it? We're still due the big update. I think it's the January update got delayed to I think it's this month or either early next month because of that whole ransom thing where someone stole their data. Yeah, I'm almost convinced that was like almost an inside job. Like just, guys, we need time to get this patch out. We'll just say we got ransomware.
00:22:28
Speaker
quit with the arms sympathy, although I thought some people like confirmed like how it was sold wherever it was dark web said that it was sold. They did not say.
00:22:44
Speaker
I mean, that's fair. I don't know. I've never been on the dark web. I know you're supposed to say Thor. There's more tour tour. And that's and that's that's good, Andy. That's that's real good coverage. I've never been on the dark web. Or for that, right?
00:23:03
Speaker
I'm only on the light web. You know, and that's fair. Listen, I run with no ad block. All right. I, I greet the internet open and honest. Right. I am a better person, not a sucker. All right.
00:23:19
Speaker
Well, I guess you're not a sucker because you have it unless you have but we'll find out in a second Star Citizen has made three hundred fifty million dollars Selling what is a bit ostensibly jpegs of spaceships. Oh my god. Yeah, so episode is all about inflated work It really is
00:23:46
Speaker
Yeah, I, I, being the person who makes the discussion topics, I get to create my own narrative every week. Was this subconscious or do you have an agenda here? Because you're getting me riled off.
00:24:00
Speaker
do work for a nonprofit. Oh, all right. So that's how you cover it. No. So yeah, it's Star Citizen, the lauded, hated, scandalous Kickstarter game, which I have to bet on me. I should have gotten the note up. When did it originally release? Star Citizen? Well, did you start it? Yeah. When was the original?
00:24:26
Speaker
The timelines there for the Kickstarter, when they started their funding, go down. What is that? Oh, there is Kip. Oh, I see. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I see in 2013. Uh oh. Oh, wow. And it's not even released? Oh, it's never going to release, Andy. OK. I want, OK. The first decision they can do is never release this game.
00:24:49
Speaker
first, which is really like five games. Yeah. They're going to do like a bunch of stuff. And then when you have 350 million, okay. I bet GTA five didn't even cost 350 million. What do I know? But, um, first, okay.
00:25:08
Speaker
Yeah, I'm trying to find this original date here. Where is it? I understand. But Andy, do you understand how they've made money? So it was like Kickstarter before Kickstarter, right? Yes. Well, no, no, no, it was like one of the big original Kickstarter. Oh, I didn't know it was on Kickstarter.
00:25:24
Speaker
OK, all right. No, no, it was OK. It was the top one. I'm dumb. OK, so it was. Yeah, this this was October 10th, 2012 was the original date. Wild. Yeah. So we're. I know they like I feel like they opened up a PayPal or something and then people kept giving them money. And then I guess they build exclusive ships for people with a lot of money. But how are people still invested in this game?
00:25:53
Speaker
Well, they build exclusive ships, but they also have ships you can buy. But Andy, this is a this is a real universe, right? With real danger. OK. And so it's not enough that you have to buy your ship, right? You also have to buy insurance for your ship, because what happens if it blows it up, your ship will be gone. No, I'm not. You 100 percent can buy.
00:26:19
Speaker
insurance for your ship. So I'm Bethesda and I buy a 200, no, I'm Microsoft, sorry. And I buy a $200 million ship and I go, someone else goes and blows it up. I literally lose that. Yes. I'm a state. I have a stake in your company.
00:26:37
Speaker
Yeah, here we go. Uh, you can buy the Aurora starter pack for $45 includes three months of insurance, not lifetime Andy, three months. You got to re up that insurance on a regular basis. Why is anybody else mad about this? I feel like I've never heard of this.
00:26:55
Speaker
What are you talking about? This is the joke about the Star Citizen. It's been almost 10 years, Andy. This is like the biggest example of being scammed by Kickstarter. Yeah. Andy, you can buy the Constellation Andromeda for a cool $275, and it comes with six months of insurance. That's wild. You could lose it.
00:27:21
Speaker
Yeah, it gets blown up. And to be honest with you, this isn't necessarily breaking new ground in that, you know, this is like a more modern version of Eve. Yes. Yeah, I was going to say. Like Eve people spending real money for their ships
00:27:41
Speaker
And some worth $20,000 to $30,000 in Eve ships gets destroyed. You just lose all that money. So it's not necessarily a new ground in that way. OK, that's fair. And they're going for an Eve kind of thing, right? It's like Rogue Squadron meets Eve. Yeah, wasn't it like a Rogue Squadron guy? Oh, there's so many games in this thing.
00:28:03
Speaker
I don't think this is, oh no, you said it correctly though, right? This is like the horror story of what could happen to a Kickstarter, right? This is the worst possible outcome where you start it, you get $350 million and you still can't finish it. But Andy, look at this beautiful web 2.0 experience they have where I can view my ship. Is that OpenGL or whatever it's called? Probably, yeah. Oh man.
00:28:33
Speaker
Well, let's go free view. Here's $10,000. Let's take an X-ray look so we can see the interior design of my fake ship. Oh, thank God. Earn my money. Earn my money. Yeah, I mean, they have like a marketing person who makes these look like actual car marketing ads.
00:28:51
Speaker
Yeah, legit. To be fair, it looks pretty slick. Yeah, they're presenting it. Listen, I'm going to play whatever in 2082 when Star Citizen comes out, I will play it and I will fly the most busted ass ship that I can play because I will not fly something that will can blow up in 10 seconds. That's as close. How much is the base game? Let's let's I just want to see if you can buy the game.
00:29:20
Speaker
Or is it free to play and then you have to buy ships on top of it?
00:29:24
Speaker
You know, it's been a minute since I've really understood the model for stuff. OK. Hmm. I think it might be MMO where they it's free to play and you have to buy in time or something. Because that's very Eve like to rate isn't Eve essentially free to play, but you have to buy time. Yeah. Yeah. And to fair again, Charles, you brought up there's a precedent for this. This already exists in the or at least a model adjacent to it. But I find it egregious.
00:29:54
Speaker
That Star Station is doing it. Are you not gonna play it, Andy? I refuse! Listen, as a person, as a person with a moral compass to not use ad block, okay, my moral compass says boycott. I don't know why. What if it's exclusive to PlayStation 7 and you get free ships with your PlayStation Plus account? You know what? I'll probably still be playing something else. I got enough of a backlog. It's fine.
00:30:21
Speaker
But you know what people and, and, but here's the thing. I don't want to be grudge the people who invested 300, whatever it was a billion dollars into this game. That is so sad. That is so sad, right? To have so much investment in it and just see it. And well, who am I to say though? I haven't played it. I don't know how fun it is.
00:30:44
Speaker
Maybe people got their money's worth, maybe they got their $275 worth. What's up? Upper right, press the play now button. Oh, sure. What type of thing it is. So it takes you to the starter pack. So you get this. Yeah, but so there must be
00:31:05
Speaker
I feel like I heard it somewhere, too. There is like a beta thing. Yeah, some people are. Yeah. And it's it's like you can fly your ship around. Oh, wait, is the game released? No, no, no, no, no, no. But there's like a small version of the game where you can like fly your ship around. And like, I think you can go inside your ship and things like that. But it's not done yet.
Loop Hero's Surprising Success
00:31:30
Speaker
Like if I let's see.
00:31:33
Speaker
Yeah. So you can go inside these things. You can walk around. There's inside your ship, but it's not, there's nothing to do. I think, as I understand it, it's just kind of like a bunch of experiences that you can have. Oh, to be fair, it looks nice. I mean, yeah. Yeah. The reason, the reason why it got kick started was because it sold what
00:31:57
Speaker
you know, it's Sold the Right Dream, which is a great MMO, sci-fi, exploration game. Basically, Eve, but, you know, actual graphics. Like, because Eve, in theory, and all the stories about it, is really cool and, like, enticing. But it's not, it doesn't look fun. And it can, it's very boring with all that.
00:32:20
Speaker
But if you actually have this type of interface and you see those graphics and you're doing stuff, there's no reason why it couldn't be good. EVE is a fucking old ugly looking game and somehow the company is successful. And people who want
00:32:39
Speaker
who want that dream for a better sci-fi experience. This is what Star Citizen sold exactly what people wanted. But by the way, Andy, just current alpha release is what they're in. This is alpha. Oh my God. This is semantics right now. Just think about how amazing it's going to be if this is alpha, Andy.
00:32:59
Speaker
Aren't they embarrassed? No. Why? They made $350 million. I would be embarrassed, be laughing on the way to the bank, but I lack more. I think what this means is that we have to come up with a game we'll never finish or make hundreds of millions of dollars off of. Andy, I think what you're missing is we've started step one of that process, which is start a Twitch channel, gain followers.
00:33:30
Speaker
It's all just a big scam and only the five people. I don't know. There's no donation link. I don't see the hundreds of millions more in there. It takes time, Andy. You can't do it immediately. Well, we've got a- We're approaching this thing like parents hearing about Twitch and streaming is like, hey, did you hear about this Twitch where people become millionaires? You should start a thing. Yeah.
00:33:57
Speaker
Well, if we use, you know, Star Citizen as our North Star, we've got eight years to make $350 million. Nine years. Nine years. And that's enough for me to pay off my student loans. So I'm fine. Or Andy. Unless someone samples them first. Or Andy. We could make a game and sell 500,000 copies like suckers.
00:34:23
Speaker
That could pay off my loans too. Yeah. What is that? Actually, I want to think about it. So Loop Hero, right, has sold five hundred thousand copies. So let's see. That's five hundred thousand times. I think it's nineteen ninety nine. It's twenty ninety nine. Either way. Did they self publish to? That's a great question. Let's see. Did they owe the money? Oh, Devolver, Devolver publishes them. So. OK. But man, Devolver really knows what they're doing.
00:34:53
Speaker
The developer knows what they're doing. But yeah, so that's that's just south of let's see. Oh, here's the price right here. Oh, it's 15, 14.99. There you go. OK. So that's probably just somewhere south about seven, eight million dollars. That's a good amount of money. Yeah. For a game that looks like shit, but play is great. Are you very clear about that? Doesn't look like shit necessarily. It does. It looks like it was made in 1982. It looks like Oregon Trail. Yeah.
00:35:22
Speaker
I need I need this bigger. My eyes. Hold on. Oh, my eyes can't process this. OK. I don't know how to stretch this, unfortunately. So you'll have to look at it. But no, it's if you haven't played Blue Pirro, it's I don't really know how to describe it with any other game. You know, to be fair, I've had it described by multiple people who I think they described it well, but it still makes no sense to me.
00:35:50
Speaker
Well, so so what it is is the tile placement game where you have no control over movement or combat. You're placed on a loop. So just kind of it's procedurally generated. So it kind of makes this loop path. Right. That could be different things. And then you get tiles to place, which alter the the encounters you have in that loop.
00:36:14
Speaker
and sometimes they can be buffs and sometimes they can be they can spawn more enemies but ultimately what you end up doing is you gain gear from fighting those enemies you get better gear you gain resources which you can use to go back and increase your base which gives you more abilities when you go back into the loop and it's just this kind of it's very low stress
00:36:38
Speaker
Almost mindless, but just the right amount of interest where you want to keep playing it game So it's just that nice balance of hey I can play this game for five minutes or I can play it for four hours and it doesn't really make a difference Wait, can you pause it there and make it bigger? Let's take a look at this map. Oh, I mean I can there it is There we go. Okay. So so if you see and this is great. This is great audio, right but So
00:37:06
Speaker
Yeah, so there's this loop, which is this gray area. So there's kind of the circular loop and your character, who's this little white guy right here, walks forward in it. And all you can do is say pause or go forward. You have no control over speed and you have no control over the battle when you're in it. He just attacks however fast he attacks based on your attack speed. And then while you fight monsters, you get gear, which goes here. You place your gear and you get different levels of gear that upgrades over time. It's a fun little game.
00:37:34
Speaker
That's cool. 15 bucks. Great. And I'm hearing great things about it. I love it. I love it. I was I mean, I think it took me a minute because I didn't really I just heard I always treat chasing the trends. Just heard people like this game. And I felt that dragon greed kick in and I went, all right, maybe I'll like this game. And it took me a minute because I was like when I started playing it, I'm like, holy shit, this game looks like crap.
00:38:01
Speaker
But once I got into it, I really understand what they were going for. You know what? And kudos to the players, too, all right, to see the diamond and the rough. And maybe that's not the right way to characterize it. But I can tell you, this screenshot doesn't pull $15 out of my wallet. Oh, absolutely not. That's the thing. It looks like a mud. Like, have you ever played any mud, Andy? Mud? Yeah. It's like door fortress. You know, door fortress? Oh, I'm aware of it. I've never played it.
00:38:32
Speaker
It just didn't seem interesting to me. I just know it has really good water physics for a game that's ASCII art. But you know what? I'm happy for
Riot Games Controversies
00:38:41
Speaker
it. I'm happy for it. I'm happy for them. You know who else you should be happy for, Andy? I want to know because I've got love in my heart right now. The CEO of Riot Games has been cleared of all right wrongdoing by Riot Games. Oh, no. Oh, no. Oh, no. What? What?
00:39:02
Speaker
OK, so here quick before we scroll down. Uh huh. What I know. I love this picture of them, too, by the way. For those of you listening only to audio, imagine the smuggest punchable face you can imagine. That's the picture we're looking at right now. And that's not an exaggeration. Literally, this is like a stock image of smug. This this is tagged smug. And all I know is that Riot Games hates women.
00:39:29
Speaker
And you might want to throw allegedly as we're talking now in a public place. Well, apparently I'm wrong, right? Because this guy didn't do anything. There goes that League of Legends sponsorship, Charles. Exactly. I heard it's a very toxic workplace, right?
00:39:52
Speaker
wasn't enough to stop him from making a lot of money, but there was corruption from the top down. When you set a precedent, it trickles down, right? Not to excuse the behavior elsewhere, but you are not setting a good example by letting this guy go.
00:40:08
Speaker
OK, but I don't know what they excused him of. So let's let's figure out what he did and why it was OK. Well, let me let me ask you, you don't do you don't walk up to your subordinates and just rip ass on him. That wasn't very specifically, but it was there are there were employees that have done that.
00:40:32
Speaker
So let's see here, yes, Niccolo Laurent. So Laurent has been the center of a fresh new sexual harassment controversy within Riot since early January, when former employee and Riot executive assistant Sharon O'Donnell filed a lawsuit alleging that Laurent had created a hostile work environment, made sexual advances against O'Donnell, and conditioned her appointment on reciprocating those advancements. You know, like you do when you can get any woman you want. Oh, God.
00:41:02
Speaker
Well, now she made these claims. Now, why were they refuted? Well, so here's the thing, right? There was an internal investigation and they have been clear today, according to internal emails obtained by the Washington Post. So, right. This is not an official release. This is a reporter breaking a story. But that being said, allegedly, this guy is a real piece of shit. And I mean, look at his face. Seriously, Google his face and look it up and then just be disgusted.
00:41:31
Speaker
It's so bad. He approved that picture. He stood in front of something, a professional took it, and he said, yes, this is my image. Hand it to everyone. This is in the press kit. I want this to be what I look like. He's not even showing teeth. It's disgusting. So what was the excuse?
00:41:54
Speaker
I uh let's let's go to the washington post article uh let's see here he did or treated with another picture of him looking like the most piece of shit guy i've ever seen
00:42:09
Speaker
Oh man, that, that, that 10 cent sponsorship going right down the drain. Uh, let's see here. So according to Niccolo, it's important that you hear from this, from me directly, the allegations of harassment, discrimination and retaliation involving me are not true. Nothing of that nature or even remotely close to it ever happened.
00:42:29
Speaker
Let's see the company's decision and Lawrence email, uh, came the same day, right. Follow the appeal to speed up court proceedings in an effort to ultimately move the case to arbitration. What that generally means in stories that I've seen is that the plaintiff's lawyer has more or less signaled that they are willing to take a settlement to get this out of done with, uh, but who knows. So it's not that he was cleared.
00:42:56
Speaker
It's well, no, no, no, the the according to the Washington Post. Let's see. The allegations of misconduct for service in January 7th, which is the news shared internally for employees was followed shortly by an email to. So, yeah, it basically says that the internal investigation done by riot through a third party company says that they found no wrongdoing.
00:43:20
Speaker
What their judgment of wrongdoing is is entirely between riot games and the third party. I mean, that's that's a good call out. I mean, we weren't there. We don't know anything. I don't know. I don't know. But more than often, not people get away with it. And the other people aren't making it up. And the fact that it came to a settlement, I feel like is an admission of guilt. Well, we don't know about the settlement. They're just moving to arbitration.
00:43:47
Speaker
Oh, whoops, sorry. In my head, I categorize it as she got money.
00:43:52
Speaker
I think it's just one of those things where Riot Games has been the center of several harassment and sexually charged issues. So it's one of those things where, yeah, you have to be careful, and you have to look at both sides of every argument. But you also have to look at how much credit they're giving you. The guy who trips once a week isn't going to get the benefit of the doubt when he says, oh, he pushed me over.
00:44:21
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I think that's very much the thing. This isn't isolated, right? Yeah, this is a pattern. And I don't know about this specific instance, but I don't know. Here's the here's the statement from the committee explains the rest of everybody in the work of the third party's law firms investigation to criteria in mind. First,
00:44:42
Speaker
So really actually reading between the lines on this but first consider whether there was evidence of misconduct Second it aimed to assess whether any element interaction between Laurent and O'Donnell could have been interpreted as harassing discriminatory or retaliatory We concluded that there was no evidence that Lawrence harass discriminate or Italians gets the plaintiff reads the statement We have therefore reached the conclusion that no action should be taken against Lauren and
00:45:05
Speaker
What you need to read there is that the committee explains it reaches first by reviewing the work of the third party law firm's investigation. So you don't know what the law firm found, just that the committee found that it was enough, not enough for them to say that it happened. Usually that means that the law firm found enough that they are not legally liable.
00:45:28
Speaker
Is basically. Sure. Sure. And the difference between it happening and legally liable or two different things. That's very fair. Yeah, I don't, especially after seeing that picture, I just don't think that I don't know. I don't believe that he's guilt free, but I don't want to start a witch. Andy, throw some alleged leads in there. I don't have lawyer. Allegedly. Allegedly. And that's fair.
00:45:56
Speaker
No, no, listen, whatever the law decides is fine. I just know. Right. Right. Games is just not a great place to work. Allegedly. Allegedly. Charles, I hope something's improved. Any bridges you want to burn while we're here? Oh, I mean, I would like to call out all the riot games based content creators who never speak about all the problems with riot, the company itself.
00:46:27
Speaker
I've always found that the funniest thing about it, where you hear all this stuff and then, you know, all the people, all the content creators, they rely on it, just kind of wave it off just a little bit. You know, I was like, well, shouldn't they say something? Wouldn't they have something to say about it? That's like the Blizzard Hong Kong thing. Yeah. Well, I mean, look, I mean, the Blizzard Hong Kong thing, I saw more people willing to fucking
00:46:53
Speaker
a blackball blizzard for that than I've ever seen anybody try to rise up against riot. I think like it's fair to say League of Legends is more popular than any Blizzard game at the moment. Yeah. Yeah, it's true. I mean, like Jesus and that's sad. They make that either way. Yeah. Yeah. It's like I will say the stuff that comes out from riot, those are
00:47:24
Speaker
very good experiences i can't fucking believe how how like uh purposely heading the sands content creators are about about those issues though i mean can you threaten your livelihood or would that be a threat to your livelihood all right let's say it is a threat to their livelihood but it's still interesting right this is one of those moral quandaries i understand that you know people will put their this is their lives on the line but
00:47:53
Speaker
I've seen the Blizzard thing, people like, they quit their jobs from Blizzard. It did. Overstuffed Blizzard is dumb. Like, whatever. Hard times, but boy, sometimes really stand up a little bit harder.
Game Genre Deep Dive: Yakuza and RPG Mechanics
00:48:12
Speaker
Well, we all have to face our own challenges in our own way and dealing with the depressing reality of corporate, corporate America and the capitalism state that we live in. What are you guys planning to distract yourself from it?
00:48:26
Speaker
Listen, I found a game, okay, that has absolutely charmed me and I'm absolutely obsessed with. Yakuza like a dragon. It's a great game. I need every game to be focused around people in their forties and fifties. I only want to know about those stories. It's like persona for adults. Yeah, that's actually a great way to put it. Instead of hanging out in your uncle's cafe,
00:48:56
Speaker
You hang out in a bar and drink real alcohol. It's wonderful. It's wonderful. And I don't know if it's because of the novelty of enjoying content that stars adults and maybe more geared towards adults. Not that younger people can't enjoy it, but who boy am I loving it? I cannot say enough good things about it. I just gotten to introduce to the expanded job system. I'm in love.
00:49:25
Speaker
I'm in love. It has been joy to be able to play that game. I love it. I beat it. That was the game I bought to play on the Series X when they came out in November. Oh, sure, yeah. And it was a great time. I think I told you guys it was probably the best turn-based RPG I played since Persona 5.
00:49:46
Speaker
I would say that absolutely. Yeah. Um, there are issues with it, but I think a lot of them can be forgiven because this is, uh, basically the, the team's first attempt at making a turn based RPG when the.
00:50:01
Speaker
seven or eight Yakuza games. There are six numbered games, but there's also spinoffs, too. We're basically beat them ups, right? And to change your style completely to a turn based, you know, element based, you know, rock, paper, system, rock, paper, scissors system. It does kind of it takes a learning curve and they nailed it really well. Andy, did you do the management simulator yet?
00:50:26
Speaker
I just got to it. OK, I'm going to tell you right now, spend a lot of time doing that and money will never be a problem again. Well, that's my only issue with the job system. And it's a problem with any game, right, is that you switch jobs.
00:50:41
Speaker
But that comes with new gear requirement, right? And it's fun to try out all the different stuff, but then I need to buy new weapons. And right now, I am literally, well, no, you're not, I'm not homeless at this point. But it's, you know, it's hard to buy weapons. So that's my one big bummer. But I'm excited to get invested in the management.
00:51:06
Speaker
Yeah, I love the game. The original characters are back, but they're not. They're not. What would you say? They're not important to the story. You don't have to play the previous ones. It's great. I love it. But yeah, that's what I'm playing. It just makes me wish I could have more games with adults or at least I know the characters are so likable. Right. And the game gives you so much time to spend time with them.
00:51:33
Speaker
that it's just been really enjoyable. I think that's where it's just. I would also say, too, that the characters are enjoyable. The story is excellent. And I think that does come across in a lot of Yakuza games, too.
Personal Gaming and Hobbies
00:51:47
Speaker
There is a really good, very interesting story in there. And you spend a lot of time watching cutscenes in these games. And that's important. Yeah. Listen, I'm a fan of cutscenes. I have no problem with it. So I'm I'm just hanging out with it. Right. Yeah.
00:52:02
Speaker
I love it. I love it. Just came out with a PS5 version. Yep. Charles, what about you? What have you been playing? Fire Emblem Three Houses. That's it. I got back and picked up my old playthrough of my second go around, this time working with the Blue Lion House. I've reached the midway point of the game, and I already don't like my choices. Just because I'm all about the Black Eagles, Edelgard did nothing wrong.
00:52:33
Speaker
100%. But I'm playing the completely opposite route that goes against her, and I just go, no one else thinks this is a little bit crazy good right now. Dimitri's looking like he's kind of crazy right now, wanting to kill everybody, but he's standing up against avocarts, so it's OK. Yeah, but he gets that sweet eye patch. Yeah, and that's actually the funniest part to me. It's just like there's actually a scene where one of the characters, like, yeah,
00:53:02
Speaker
With the Dimitri not even there, the other characters go, finally, everyone sees how crazy Dimitri actually is. No one going to talk about that? No one talks about it. Yeah, everything's OK. Yeah. Are they completely separate stories? Yeah. It's different routes. OK. So you side with different groups and stuff like that. So different things happen.
00:53:31
Speaker
But it's honestly still very fun. I'm just flying through the game right now because I don't care for this route in particular. The third route, which is Golden Deer, I believe, should be interesting because I heard that's more the clown route. I'm interested to see what that means. So we'll see. I've been playing Loop Hero, as we discussed earlier. And Charles, you and I played Monster Hunter Iceborn yesterday. Yeah, we did.
00:54:01
Speaker
Oh boy, we have to get used to the awful multiplayer settings for that. You want to play with your friend? All right. Only if you do my 12 tasks first. And then you need to purposely leave the battle and then start it up again at the battle so that you could have other people join.
00:54:25
Speaker
Well, that's made no sense. And then and it was just as bad as you'd imagine. And then my other my other game that I've been playing is called The Game of Life is that I'm growing. My plants are now are growing well. I have 25 different peppers going in my in my growth and currently tomatoes will probably start this weekend.
00:54:48
Speaker
Are they, like, using natural sunlight? Or are you using... Absolutely not, Andy. Science reigns in this house. I have Samsung Quantum LEDs bolting down this GMO fertilizer to make mutant plants that God never envisioned.
00:55:06
Speaker
You know what? And they are stronger and better for it. Okay. I'm actually making, I'm growing some Panamanian hot peppers, which is just something fun to say. Nice to record it. That's cool. How do you not make it an awful nightlight though?
00:55:23
Speaker
Every time I've seen people's setups for growing plants, it has the most miserable light. I was like, how can you have that in your home? Well, the other thing, too, is I have a tent, so the tent blocks out all the light, too. So even if it was upstairs, it really wouldn't be a problem. You're a professional. Listen, it's my hobby, right? Much like gaming and now podcasting. I dedicate everything to it.
00:55:51
Speaker
including
Conclusion and Humorous Wrap-Up
00:55:52
Speaker
a tent. And I think that's beautiful. You know what else is beautiful? This has been the first episode of add to party, a friendship simulator masquerading as a gaming new show. And it's been wonderful. And I never got my food. Door dash took my money. Allegedly.
00:56:12
Speaker
but never gave me my food. I want to let you know, I click on the support button in the app. It's disabled. They don't even want to tell me where my food is. This is James Hartwell. And Charles. And Andy K.
00:56:32
Speaker
This has been add to party and we streaming every week Tuesdays at 9 PM Eastern. We'll be back next week for episode two, unless Andy dies of starvation. I better not. I have food, but I don't want to make it. All right. I am $20 poor.