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The Art of Making Cool with Stuff The Loyal Subjects' Jonathan Cathey
156 Plays3 days ago
This week we're joined by returning guest and CEO of The Loyal Subjects, Jonathan Cathey — right on the heels of #SDCC to get an update on what TLS is up to, what's coming, and what's driving change throughout the entire company.
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Intro and other voices by Joe Azzari
https://www.instagram.com/voicesbyjoe/
Theme Music is "Game Boy Horror" by the Zombie Dandies
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Transcript
Podcast Introduction and Theme
00:00:03
Speaker
Are you ready, kids? Get your parents' permission, check your mailbox, and grab your shopping cart. It's time for the Adventures in Collecting podcast. I'm Eric.
Comic-Con Coverage and Community Involvement
00:00:15
Speaker
And I'm Dave. Welcome to Adventures in Collecting, where we talk toy news, culture, and hauls, along with our journeys as collectors.
00:00:28
Speaker
Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Adventures in Collecting. Hi, everyone. Dave, it's ah we are in the post post San Diego Comic Con era of our lives.
00:00:41
Speaker
Yeah. We weren't there. we were not there. A lot of people asked because we We were posting a lot, but by the magic of coverage. um Yeah. So, I mean, it's I right. We have the experience of New York Comic Con. We know how exhausting that can be.
00:01:00
Speaker
but yeah it's funny how exhausting just covering something remotely could be because you have to work like harder to to like gather because you're not like they're there. there um But this is a great opportunity to shout out all of our amazing friends and peers and members of the toy community that were there. And without them, we would not have been able to provide the amount of coverage that we did. So just a ah quick round robin shouts to MCU collector, shouts to In Pursuit of Toys, Toyshiz, of course, who is celebrating his 10th anniversary as well, which is crazy.
00:01:34
Speaker
um i unparalleled universe crimson dawn collectibles uh god i'm sure i'm forgetting fraternia was he i know john wasn't there but he was somehow getting pictures toy arc toy migos j shot um did i see um toy farce was there Toy farce was there from, you know, across the ocean.
00:01:58
Speaker
ah Yeah, no, but but seriously, feel like we have no excuse now. Yeah, he he sent me a picture with with Justin and I was very jealous. I was very jealous that he was hanging out with Justin and we were not.
00:02:11
Speaker
But um yeah, i again, just quick shouts to all of those amazing members of the community that, um, you know, without their their posts and their hard boots on the groundwork, you know, we we would have not been able to bring you photos and coverage I think My Damn Toys. and it We got a lot of... Oh, yeah. from them Jeez, yeah, My Damn Toys.
00:02:32
Speaker
it was Yeah, and Ringside. Yeah, the the list goes on and on. um So ah thank you to everybody for for you know ah sticking around with our coverage. Of course, you know talking about Comic-Con, we will be there in person at New York for New York Comic-Con, which is shaping up to be a very exciting event with a lot of the things that were teased and or announced at San Diego Comic-Con. So um definitely stay tuned for that coverage come this fall.
00:03:01
Speaker
It's nice that New York Comic-Con has become a part two and not a like, hey, here's this thing that happens in October. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's it is. It is nice. It's a nice feeling. It's still, you know, clearly not the same. But um yeah, I.
August Giveaway Announcement
00:03:18
Speaker
Before we bring on our guest, because like I said, this is a a post San Diego Comic-Con wrap up, a little bit of housekeeping. I don't have a picture to show this week, but um our giveaway, because of when we're recording this, but if you go to our Instagram right now, um while you're listening to this, our our August giveaway will be live. right.
00:03:42
Speaker
Yeah, it will be live. We're recording this a little a little bit more in advance than usual. um I'm going to be traveling for for for work. So we were we're running this a few days earlier than we normally do. But I can rest assured I can tell you what the giveaway is going to be.
00:04:01
Speaker
um You will have to use your imagination. But ah the giveaway is this month we are collaborating with our friend and um and pillar of the wrestling figure community, Dave.
00:04:14
Speaker
um Alex West collects to give away a set of demolition coliseum. collection figures ringside exclusives.
00:04:25
Speaker
So um it's kind of interesting. This is the second time this year we've given away a set of demolition um in a different format both times. So we're following up exclusives.
00:04:36
Speaker
Well, no, no ah Last time it it was ah it was Big Rubber Guys. Oh, that's right. Giveaway a set of Big Rubber Guys demolition. I thought we did the unsanctioned for some reason. No, no, no, no, no. no we we We did the Big Rubber Guys. Now we're doing the Colosseum collection. So we did LOD. That's where I'm.
00:04:56
Speaker
Yep. So you can ah you can visit our Instagram at AIC underscore podcast. You will look for the pinned post. You will see a pinned post that says everything that you need to know to enter in for that giveaway. It is running the entire month, so the entire month of August.
00:05:11
Speaker
Make sure you follow the rules closely. like Like we usually say, you must follow all of the rules in order for your entry to camera. So, um yeah, that'll be up the whole month.
00:05:23
Speaker
Shouts to again to Alex West for for joining us. um You know, great great guy. ah love Love chatting with him, and you know we're happy to do this this giveaway with him this month.
00:05:34
Speaker
and um And then somehow, Dave, that's our last giveaway of, like, the summer. And then we we're, like, we're in, like, fall territory, which is just bonkers. Absolutely. I mean, i it's really warm, so I'm...
00:05:49
Speaker
My air conditioner doesn't work, so I'm um um not upset. you're You're rooting for fall. All right. Well, um I think it's time to to talk
Jonathan Catey's Return: Toy Line Evolution
00:05:58
Speaker
about our guests. So i've I've said it multiple times already, but this is post-Comic-Con.
00:06:02
Speaker
um Today's guest is a returning guest to the pod. A guest that we've had on several times, but um it's been a minute. It's been a minute since we've chatted. And a lot has a lot has changed since the last time we we chatted with this week's guest. So um our our guest today is the one, the only, Jonathan Catey.
00:06:23
Speaker
ah he is that He is, of course, at the Loyal Subjects. The Loyal Subjects has evolved from a boutique collectibles line that featured things like action vinyls and best action into a more complex toy, balancing brand new licenses with beloved classics that many collectors never expected to see on shelves again.
00:06:45
Speaker
ah We are excited to catch up with Jonathan here after San Diego Comic-Con and hear what's next. Jonathan. Welcome to the show, buddy.
00:06:55
Speaker
What up? Dude, thanks for having me, man. like like the intro. Yeah, know I like the intro. You know, the the whole thing about the company, like the whole mission the company is just do cool stuff.
00:07:10
Speaker
I mean, that's it. I mean, it's it goes as far as that. Like, hey, let's make cool things. And then hopefully it's cool. We think it's cool. Hopefully you guys think it's cool. And we have a shared experience. And then In the end, maybe we'll get a sale. And that's pretty cool.
00:07:25
Speaker
but yeah It's so funny, man, because it goes back to that, like, you know, some of those first conversations we ever had with you at like, yeah, it was like New York Toy Fair, like 2020 or something like that. 2021, somewhere around there.
00:07:38
Speaker
and And, you know, I can remember now i was telling of you yeah twenty i could remember walking into the booth and seeing the best action Cowboy Bebop figures yeah for the first time and having those conversations with you about, you know, how you were choosing licenses for that line and like what best action was going to be. and,
00:07:58
Speaker
and Truth be, the philosophy has always been exactly what you said. like We're just here to make cool stuff. Just make cool stuff, man. Actually, it's funny. That Spike Spiegel, the one you held up, that's the Afro Spike Spiegel.
00:08:12
Speaker
and we got tons We got tons of shit from Crunchyroll or... Is it crunchy roll? Who is handling the licensing for that? I forget. happy and gallas We got so much shit for it. And the reason he has a fro is because he had all these little spikes on his head.
00:08:31
Speaker
And we're selling the Walmart and part of the compliance Walmart is you have to pass rate plus and those spikes went past in compliance because they were looked at sharp edges.
00:08:42
Speaker
And like they could not get over that fact. So we basically ended up having to retool that hair, give it the spikes again. So there's two versions. You got the fro version and then the spiky hair version.
00:08:53
Speaker
And so that's the reason behind that. But to be in Walmart, you know, you can't have sharp sharp parts. Interesting. Well, now I got to hunt down the variant because I got the... There i got here is it a variant, man. Yeah, yeah. There is one with that spiky hair.
00:09:10
Speaker
Note to self, need to hunt that down. um So we we know we mentioned that that San Diego Comic-Con is a big kind of pivot point of the year. ah you know Now that the dust has kind of settled, everyone's kind of traveled back home.
00:09:23
Speaker
um what what What was your your San Diego Comic-Con experience like this year? Oh, it was great, man. You know, Comic-Con's comiccon's cool. It's like ah kind of like how Coachella used to be for like all the guys that played in l LA for years. We used to call it like Rock and Roll Summer Camp.
00:09:41
Speaker
Comic-Con is kind of like, you know, pop culturalist summer camp, you know? ah Tons of friends, people that, you know, I've known for 30 plus years easily.
00:09:54
Speaker
So that that part's super, super cool. The other part that's cool is just working with the teams and watching the teams gel, work together, collaborate. And the best part is just the fans, just the interaction with all the people, with everyone, you know?
00:10:10
Speaker
um That's my favorite part, just conversations with people i haven't met, conversations with customers and fans I've done for years. And then just seeing how people react to products, you know, it's like we had some really good stuff this year. most Most everything sold out. We had a power old like a full suite of power old items that had never been shown before. And they doesn't exist and never existed. And that went bonkers. People went just back for that. um I'm sensing.
00:10:41
Speaker
a lot of good momentum for Power World. I think it's going to go bonkers. There's a lot of collectability in it as well. like There's a lot of small items that are chase items that have tons of rare in there. so i think that's that's kind of a fun little aspect to that game, to the collecting the pals kind of thing.
00:10:59
Speaker
um Dude, Popples. Popples was a ah weird one for us. It rocketed. That was a really good one for us. Yeah, all the lines did pretty well, man. um That's always cool because you show up, you know, prayer hands go, please, hope everybody digs this stuff, you know? And then once they once you get like sort of that instant feedback, they're like, yeah, we dig it. We love it. it was It's like, yes!
00:11:25
Speaker
um but yeah it's it's about the fans man we're all all of us companies toy game companies artists distributors you know you're out there to entertain to to be a part of the circus you know where the uh maybe the low subjects are the the russian bear on the ball You know, everybody has their circus moment for the fans that are watching, you know?
00:11:48
Speaker
So we're part of that and we're stoked to be that. We're stoked to be part of their entertainment and in their passion. I know this year talking to some fans, they were just like, oh my God, the vibe's so good. this is I heard several times, you know, they always say the happiest place on earth is Disneyland. They're like, no, it's Comic-Con.
00:12:09
Speaker
So it's there was a lot of stoke, bro. A lot of stoke. Well, speaking of Stoke, I love that you you brought up Palworld so early. So we had the opportunity, i geez, what was it, like last month? I think it was it was beginning a July or or yeah late June.
00:12:27
Speaker
Right, sweet, sweet. um We had the opportunity to see to get our hands on those Palworld blind boxes, and we actually opened one there with Ben. you four of those?
00:12:39
Speaker
I couldn't, so, cool so, full disclosure, like, full, full transparency. I, very green when it comes to what PAL world is. Like, that's one of those things where, like, I had to, like, kind of look it up on the spot, and, like, then I was like, oh, wait, I do know what this is. Never mind. I'm, like, I'm good. Like, brought myself up to speed.
00:12:58
Speaker
I cannot believe the amount of, well, I shouldn't say that. That's not the way to put it. I was pleasantly surprised. with the amount of engagement that we got on that video opening up the power of blind box, there is so much excitement in the comments yeah about all the different, all all the different options, the chase variants that people had so many questions that a very much so appears to be a fan base. That's like hungry for some attention. And the game just hit like 1.0. So it's like fresh back in people's minds too.
00:13:32
Speaker
You got it, man. Yeah, it's it's definitely having its moment right now. And we're kind of feeling the momentum. Yeah, it just boils down to out the cool stuff. Like the characters are cool. you know they They look good. They're colorful. They're designed well.
00:13:46
Speaker
um And they're fun. And I think that's just in general, if you just kind of walk around, you know just things that you dig, you're sort of like a common denominator is Cool shit. That's it right? yeah i mean that boils down to it. So like, if if it's cool, it's cool. you know If it's not, you'll know.
00:14:11
Speaker
yep And it's one of those properties, too, that I think has a little something for everybody. you know like yeah Depending on what you know your design aesthetic, whether there's a particular animal or creature that you you know that you have an affinity for, it's one of those properties that kind of gives you a little bit of everything.
00:14:27
Speaker
um So, yeah, I mean, again, super cool. I think the fans are going to be really stoked once they start getting this that stuff in hand.
Balancing Nostalgia with Innovation in Toy Design
00:14:35
Speaker
and Yeah, man. I'm stoked. I'm stoked. Yeah, we lean heavily on one of our designers, Cecil. he's He's like, you know, glued to power world He's totally addicted to it, man.
00:14:45
Speaker
And I get it. It's, you know, it's a design your own world, collect pals, you know, there's cool giant creatures with machine guns. It's awesome.
00:14:57
Speaker
it's it's just It's just wacky and cool, you know? Cool, weird.
00:15:05
Speaker
Yeah, it's a lot of fun. But the company itself has evolved, like we said in the intro, from Action Vinyls and Best Action to tackling things like Angry Birds, Pal World, Bringing Back Mask, My Pet Monster, you mentioned Popples, Gem. Was that shift always part of the vision? Rainbow Bright is another one.
00:15:25
Speaker
um was Was that shift always part of the vision or did the market naturally bring you there? Just make things that are cool. i mean, honestly, i i I hate to break it down to a science. I hear all the canned stuff from other companies. You know, I like you guys are on LinkedIn and I hear, yeah know, everything sounds like something from Office Space half the time. And it's, yeah you know, I swear to God, it's just like barf. But when it boils down to it, the ultimate, you put as whatever strategy into things, but the ultimate democracy is just the end user. And they decide,
00:15:59
Speaker
you know, was the ah was the ticket cost where or the entry fee worth the experience, you know? And so if we focus there, you know, A, we got we got a theme park that we got to bring people through the doors, but is the experience going to be that we're at the cost of entry? entry And that that's always been the focus, man. So it's not a particular format or it's not a segment of the market. it's you know It's not that overly strategized. It's like, let's make cool things for people that want to have a cool experience. And hopefully there's enough of them. And if we do enough of it and we got enough of it going on, then we can scale.
00:16:38
Speaker
And that's, yeah you know, I do. You can hear you could hear it positioned in 20 different ways from all sorts of marketing needs. It's all bullshit. But that's everything everybody's doing. Here's this is what I'm into. This is what I get.
00:16:53
Speaker
You know, let's build from Let's try to bring in as many people into this tent and experience as possible. And if we do it right, we get rewarded. You know, and if we do it wrong, people will let us know.
00:17:06
Speaker
Well, I think that's, that's, you know, the key right there, the difference between doing it right and doing it wrong. So like, what are some of the things that you guys consider in terms of like making sure you're treating, especially some of these, these legacy properties that you're working with, you know things like mask and gem and rainbow bright, like that kind of stuff, like, you know, cool factor aside, cause that, you know, that's baked in, right? Like those, those nostalgic brands, like they pull on the heartstrings of certain you know people of people of a certain age.
00:17:34
Speaker
but also have that like really cool aesthetic that, you know young people could gravitate towards. But like, how do you, how do you kind of figure out like, okay, what's something that we can do that's going to, you you know, kind of spark that, that, that joy for, for both of those, those people, both of those types of people.
00:17:54
Speaker
Just try not to F it up, man. You know, it's like these guys, you know, some of these things have been around 40 years. I mean, a lot of stuff we do is like with toys, you know, there there weren't a lot of features on toys, you know, like construction is really basic. I think, you know, to what we've done, our construction is a lot better because just toys are just made better these days. You know, sometimes we plus things up.
00:18:17
Speaker
like with masks, like with blast effects and some cool like nuances like that. But we try to keep it pretty close to that Kenner kind of style, you know? i I believe we did a better job. You know, I know the Internet's full of opinions, but I am the opinion that we actually fucking crushed it. um And I think that's like ninety nine point nine percent the opinions that had the experience with that.
00:18:42
Speaker
But the idea is just don't fuck it up, man. You know, just just be true to the 40 years of storytelling and history. You know, you don't need to deviate.
00:18:53
Speaker
You know, like Gemma's a little bit different because, you know, it had a really twiggy, weird Barbie body, like like a Barbie light body originally. we wanted to make it feel more like it was like a woman in space, like, you know, ones that walk around on planet Earth.
00:19:08
Speaker
versus you know stick figure sort of like polypropylene bodies used used to do back in the day. um Because it wasn't really about that. It was just like, hey, I got but i got a budget for five parts. What do I do? And my sculptor, we got to knock this out in one week and throw it to a factory. you know That's kind of how the business was back in the day. But you know we get to get a little bit more nuanced, a little bit more on sort of the anatomy side of things, make it look like it's like a person.
00:19:37
Speaker
versus you know a twig a twig with with a ball on the top. so But I think that's just bringing it into just more the realm of relatability and where we are in the times versus what people had to work with back then and what toy toy making was back then. It was definitely largely a commodity driven sort of idea. where you know now collectors little bit more nuanced. you know they're not you know They're sort of like groomed on detail and having some of those Easter eggs and things that look a little bit more sharply nuanced. So me me being an artist and a painter and and pretty good at anatomy, you know I want to make sure that we got we got our... you know
00:20:21
Speaker
The boobs are in the right place. The clavicle's in the right place. The waist is in the right place. it's you know There is a forearm. There is a bicep. you know It's like, hey, it's a human being. What do you know?
00:20:34
Speaker
um But you know there's there's that aspect. But for the most part, just kind of step out of the way a little bit and just you know these great brands that have just been telling these great stories or these really fun stories. Some of the stories are really silly, but they're fun, right? And they they've they're beats in people's lives.
00:20:51
Speaker
um And that's important. and That's important to that person. You can remind them of ah a birthday gift, a Christmas gift, a moment of their grandparents, moment with their parents, you know straight A's on a report card, whatever. And that was part of their experience of receiving toys growing up.
00:21:07
Speaker
So we want to kind of try to see if we could re-bottle that you know to get some of that excitement back. you know um and make it that much fun and sort of, you know, slightly like a little emotional tweet, you know, just a little tinge of emotion going back into your time machine to your way back machine.
00:21:27
Speaker
But yeah, we we mostly try to step out of the way and not be in the way and just maybe kind of dial things up here there that hopefully don't take away and make it more enhanced.
00:21:40
Speaker
Now, are you trying to when when you when you say you're tap, you're trying to tap into those moments. Are you drawing anything from like from your because I know how much of you goes into these, you know, the years of talking to you, how much you of of yourself that you're putting into these products? Like, are there things that you target specifically knowing that like, OK, this meant a lot to me or like somebody I was close to? or Like, are you are you drawing from from that area at all?
00:22:09
Speaker
Well, yeah, I mean, I have a motion response to all this stuff. You know, I was born 74, so I was kind of that golden wave of like, you know, Star Wars, Indiana Jones, E.T., you know, that whole era of sort of movie making and imagination and how some of that kind of, you know, more than trickled down, but sort of exploded the consumer products and helped propel some of these large companies like Mattel and house grown to sort of like the, the stratosphere.
00:22:37
Speaker
Um, so those were all really cool beats for me, you know, like I, I do remember like what it was like to get Voltron on Christmas. I do remember what it was like a year that my parents got, ah got me a bunch of GI jobs for Christmas. You know, those, those are good memories, man.
00:22:55
Speaker
Um, I wasn't the kid with the most toys, you know, i was primarily like a, you know, surfer, basketball player, baseball player. But I loved it. loved it.
00:23:05
Speaker
I loved all of it. I love my Han Solo. My dad gave it to my sister because she liked him more than I did, I guess. At least she told my dad that. I mean, Han Solo is yours. but ah But yeah, man, you know, those are cool moments. Those are cool moments in my life.
00:23:21
Speaker
And I do remember them. And I do remember those those great stories, how they impacted my imagination. And yeah, Yeah, I do try to put some of those emotional storytelling elements back in to what we do, things that impacted me. It's the old like T.S. Eliot thing, you know you you know, you write what you know.
00:23:42
Speaker
yeah you know I'm not trying to write something I don't know. It usually comes from a place I do know. And now, a word from our sponsors.
00:23:55
Speaker
This segment is brought to you by our friends at Chubsy Wubsy Toys. A traditional mom and pop toy store in Little Falls, New Jersey, Chubsy Wubsy Toys brings you the best new toys from the brands you love without the hassle of pounding the pavement searching for them at larger retail stores.
00:24:12
Speaker
Visit them in person at their brand new home at 101 Newark Pompton Turnpike Suite 1 in Little Falls, New Jersey, or online at chubzywubzy.com.
00:24:24
Speaker
That's
00:24:30
Speaker
And tell them Adventures in Collecting sent you.
00:24:36
Speaker
And now, back to the show. Yeah, and that that authenticity is something that has always kind of resonated, i think, with the loyal subjects. you know going Going through all of the different phases, you know like you know whether it's the you know action vinyl or best action turtles and like you know all of the different character choices that you guys have made over the years. like It's always been uniquely the loyal subjects, and I think... yeah no your kind of authentic touch has always been there. It's always been present. Yeah. And I think that's true with every company, you know, like, like, you know, I think NECA, like a Joel Weinshaker's company, and you're going to get like a very specific fingerprint or like, like Mezco, you know, you're going to get a really specific fingerprint or like super seven, it you'll you know, like Mez has ah his thing, you know, Brian Flynn's got his thing, you know,
00:25:33
Speaker
it's i think it's true across the board thrill joy you're gonna get you're gonna get a lot of mariotti out of it like you know yeah um you rocky motor you're gonna get a lot of mike decker out of it right so it's like i think that is true it's just like the or prism of how we interpret pop culture and then how we regurgitate it so it's ah it's gonna have some of our fingerprints on it and again and in life there's i mean how many careers are there you know probably a million different careers, but we all chose this, you know, so you to like it, you know? And so we obviously have a fun doing it. um
00:26:09
Speaker
But yeah, it's it's another canvas for me. You know, I'm also an oil painter and I do a lot of fine art off to one side, just my personal life. But um it's a canvas for me. And yeah, it has emotional beats.
00:26:22
Speaker
um It does have my fingerprints on it because it has to reverberate through you. Like when Jimmy Page picks up Les Paul, it's going to be, it's going to sound different than slash picking up Les Paul because their bodies are different. Their arms are different. Their brains are different. Their fingers are different, you know? So that's, that's going to happen. Even in some of these companies, the personality of the company is going to be different, the fit are different. The fingerprints are going to be a little bit different.
00:26:52
Speaker
And I think that's why it makes it exciting. I think it makes it exciting for collectors too, because You know, it could just be all the same, you know, to aliens, the same plastic shit, right? It's just weird shit that people collect that have bunch paint on it. And what does it mean?
00:27:08
Speaker
But the people here on earth, they're totems and they have value. You know, and these they either have stories from other from studios or things are just made up like the stuff that Pop Mart's doing. That's wonderful.
00:27:21
Speaker
They're just, you know, let your freak out imagination. Just let it fly. That kind is really from the designer vinyl art toy movement from 20 plus years ago, but really kind of getting its play now, you know, and I think that's cool, man. You know, that has a personality, too.
00:27:42
Speaker
Yeah, you got Target. I mean, i was just in my my local Target today, and there is a whole new section. I never thought in a million years I would ever see it in, like, a like a proper retail mass market store.
00:27:55
Speaker
They have a whole, whole like, blind box art toy section now. that like i think that's cool, man. I mean, that's where I started. i think i think I was the first artist to do a Kidrobot crossover T-shirt.
00:28:11
Speaker
I think the very first crossover t-shirt they ever did was a drawing I did for them. Wow. So that's where I start. You know, I start way back there, you know, yeah like, ah like causing who does the boo boo and Kenny Wong who does Molly, man. I met those guys years ago. I met Kenny Wong at a toy con in Hong Kong.
00:28:33
Speaker
You know, when Michael Lau was, he was kind of like the star there. Dude, that guy was rad. He had this like little booth, it was like some weird convention center in Central. And he had this like little booth and he would put like, it was like a hallway and in the middle the hallway, it was like a glass case and it had one light that came down on it.
00:28:53
Speaker
And it was like shielded. and then the next day there'd be a figure inside and that was that was the exclusive. Oh, wow. It was so cool, man. It was just like, you know, it was like a like a fun more consumer experience, right? That was like kind of so hyped and elevated.
00:29:13
Speaker
You know, I love that stuff, but I was, you know, I was working with those guys quite a bit um in that art toy scene to start with. even the little subjects we started with joe lebetter gary baseman alex party sam flores we started with all the sort of like pervasive pop surrealist artists and the sort of r20 movement that's how the company started it yeah friends with you you know those were like the first things we we did 17 years ago in this company but it is cool to see that it's having its day because
00:29:45
Speaker
Man, it's it did have a movement with Kid Robot in 2000, and then it's very kind of petered off, you know? um But there were a lot of good people doing a lot great art and illustration and coming up wacky characters and, you know, things that were, were different than Spider-Man and and Superman, but like also deserve the time of day.
00:30:07
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, for sure. So one of my favorite wacky cartoons of all time, it's even in my background right now, um is Mask. and the revival has been a big point of discussion for everybody, I think, in the collector community.
Feedback and Engineering in Mask Toy Line
00:30:23
Speaker
How have you been responding to the feedback that you've been getting for mask and, you know, kind of what's, how is that shaping kind of the future of mask?
00:30:34
Speaker
I think mask mask is crushed for us, you know, and again, i think we've done it. I think we've done an excellent job where we kind of fucked up last year is on the customer service response that's timing. But, you know, so like you put kerosene on a fire kind of thing.
00:30:50
Speaker
But um yeah, I know it is interesting through for a group people that come up with something because they think feel they own it. you know like yeah I see it through like Star Wars crowds, I see it through like you know Gibson Les Paul forums and things like that. It's like, I own it, I'm the expert on that. and it's And then there are people who just want to have a good experience with it too. So, you know, things were a little bit more precious. They want to take more ownership over it. You know, they want to be the expert on it then there's folks who just want to have the experience just for fun, you know? So, you know, that's always going to be a balance in collector world.
00:31:23
Speaker
I remember, de I remember this, this year that we launched this really cool mini series with Joe Ledbetter. It was kind of, it was called the, um, like chaos mini bunny series. And these guys, i don't know, like, I don't know where the fucking fans have learned the term QC. They don't even know what it means half the time. You know, it's like, you see, dude, it's for someone that's lived three years of his fucking life in factories and, you know, knows the processes and tooling and compliance and testing knows it backwards as far as in 2020, which ways to Sunday, been selling to Walmart for 10 years and Target for fucking 10 years.
00:31:58
Speaker
Oh my God, this stuff that I have to read sometimes. I'm just like, okay. um But this thing, this mini chaos bunny series, God damn, it was so fucking good.
00:32:10
Speaker
And I remember this one clicker, dude, there's tiny lines off and shit and fucking puts it in a fucking dog poop bag, lights it on fire, posts it on the internet.
00:32:21
Speaker
It's like, bro That shit was expensive too. Like, that's what you did. That's what you do with your time. What? just Just breathe, bro. Like, breathe. Take a deep breath. they Evaluate a little bit.
00:32:35
Speaker
And that fucking series was up for the designer tour of the year award. You know, like, bro it you know what I mean? It's whatever. You're going to have people that that hate on shit, people love shit, and that's a collective community. You go on Kidrobot forums, you go on Super7 forums, Naked forums, haters and lovers on it.
00:32:57
Speaker
It's what it is. But as far as like what we did, I think we fucking crashed it, you know. And anybody that thinks you do a better structure on goddamn company, show us.
00:33:09
Speaker
but you go I've mentioned it to you and I think I definitely mentioned it to Ben at SweetSweep. But like I like that when you open the Thunderhawk, the door doesn't fly halfway across the room.
00:33:22
Speaker
just Like mine did when I was five. you You wanted to fly away and and you want to get up and ride up PCH and Melvin the fucking thing? no I mean when I hit the button. It's worth perfect.
00:33:36
Speaker
It's perfect. It's to halfway across the room. I agree with you. That thing is perfect, dude. The engineering. Bro, we have world-class engineers. World-class, dude. Like, I mean, some of the best of the best. Our Chinese team is the best. We have some of the best factories in the world. They're all compliant, you know.
00:33:56
Speaker
audited up to up to, you know, here in you know, tested the hell and back. Like what we do is the right way of how you do these things. And we brought it to a price that wasn't like, I guarantee you, if our competitors had some of these these these projects, they you'd be buying the MDU for 500 bucks.
00:34:17
Speaker
Guarantee it. it's And thing would fall apart. fall apart. yeah We catch a lot of crap here, like, like as, like, Adventures in Collecting, like and and have over the last, we're coming up on eight years that we've been doing this, which is also a crazy thing to say, but, like,
00:34:37
Speaker
I would say, generally speaking, we're net positive. And I think a lot of that comes from the fact that like, we know what we want. we We know what's out there. you know, we've taught, we've we've had conversations with people. Like we understand a little bit, maybe a little bit more of the process than like your your average collector does.
00:34:55
Speaker
regardless of how you want to rationalize it, like, we're out here to have fun. So, like me, my touchpoint original interaction with Masked Toys was playing with Dave's that had already been, let's just say, very well loved, right? They were loved. You know, to to to the point of, like, you open a door and it flies off, like... but but Although that was kind out of the box. Bro, this stuff we made is so much better than the Kenner stuff. It's not even close. The technology is so much better. But here's the thing that i absolutely really love. yeah
00:35:26
Speaker
ah Here's the thing I love, though. when i hold So, like, we got a chance to hold, to get hands on the Thunderhawk and the Condor. The San Diego Comic-Con exclusive ones. So the the the blue and the green ones i back at Sweet Sweet.
00:35:40
Speaker
And they glow in the dark, bro. They glow in the dark. have to say, though, like, when i got my hands on that Thunderhawk, I legitimately felt like I was holding...
00:35:52
Speaker
an original mask toy. Like it felt the way exact and and I could be wrong, whatever, but like it felt the way that I remember that, like the way that the wheels spin, the way that like the, the kind of the springiness of things, like it felt like ah the real deal. And I mean, it is, it is. Well, it just took me back because I remember how, how they work and they still work that way, but they work better. Yeah.
00:36:18
Speaker
now because like I said, the Thunderhawks door stays on. It's so frustrating that people are beating it up. It's frustrating. That's, dude, as always, bro, it's like the 2% loud dudes, but like the 98% just fucking love it and roll with it and they have a good time with that. We're from New Jersey. We know loud dudes. Like, Yeah, yeah do and I've owned a collectible company forever and so and a lot of my friends have too. It's like, but you just go, you just bounce on, doesn't matter, you bounce on any of my competitor friends.
00:36:53
Speaker
you know, boards and they're, you know, you got people loving and hating the shit, you know, it's just, it just what is what it is, man. um But yeah, I mean, we're, it's hard to play for the 2%. We'll try to win those guys over, but you know, it's the 98% that's the payoff, but hopefully 2% come along, you know, but if people have really strong feelings, they feel they own it, bro, I could show up with a perfectly cut diamond and I'll have 10 guys shitting on it.
00:37:22
Speaker
It's true. It's true. And five of those guys will say it was Blood Diamond. And the other two will say that it was grown in a lab. you got it, bro. Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. I mean, it's just the way it is. It's the way that social media is right now.
00:37:37
Speaker
You know, it's just, it can be loud proud and it can be beautiful and wonderful and a communion. it's It's both. It's all of it. But like, yeahp I think those are fun. don't want people that are toy enthusiasts to miss the opportunity because I doubt these things will ever come back, dude. So it's like yeah people sometimes miss that opportunity to, you know, it's like, you know, you know, don't, you know, don't knock down the statue because it shines too bright. you know, it's like you got it. You got to make sure that
00:38:11
Speaker
Hey, you got it now. It's cool. It's it's affordable. it's It's a really cool thing. By the way, it's all it's all sold out, so I don't have any skin in the game because I've sold it all. So, like, you know, yeah to me ah to me, we did our job. but um But they are very good, you know? And again, like, it these things are made by, crosses a thousand hands before it shows up someone's house.
00:38:35
Speaker
Literally a thousand hands. You that's the other thing. It's toys are all hand. Like, there is no... you know weird Japanese robots and guys in white suits in a fucking Beastie Boys video doing hyper-automation in people's imaginations. No, it's all done by hand, baby. That's exactly what I'm going to do from now on. Just throwing them out there.
00:38:56
Speaker
so Everything will be the intergalactic video. Yeah, yeah, you got it, dude. Wave 1, Wave 2, we've seen them. you know People have gotten them in hand gotten Wave 1 in hands and you know but the San Diego Comic-Con exclusives.
00:39:10
Speaker
What's made to stick, dude, stick like disgustingly sick, bro. Hurricane. Oh, my God. Things insane. I mean, it turned me into like a five year old kid, dude.
00:39:22
Speaker
Like, you know, and maybe I'm talking passion about this stuff because I do love it. And we put a lot of like care into it and This stuff is good. You know, for someone that's made, you know, I don't know, 15000 excuse, you know, and I think i'm I've done my 10,000 hours.
00:39:38
Speaker
You know? well it's good So I know this shit i know the shit is good. It's great hearing you talk about it like this. I mean, I think that's i think that speaks volumes, not only not only to you know what you're doing, but also like to the quality of it. so like you know yeah that I stand by our quality any day any day of the week. And you know people you are entitled to their opinions, but as a collectibles company and a toy company, I think our stuff's good as anybody's. It's mostly better than most people's.
00:40:10
Speaker
so So when do you think, what will people hear about the the next wave of mask? Any timeline on that? Probably pretty soon, yeah. Probably probably this like late fall.
00:40:23
Speaker
Okay. Maybe New Comic Con time, maybe? don't know, gotta talk to ben he's Ben. Ben's kind of the master of like you know of getting some of these late drop timings down. so If it's just me, ill just' see it deal i'll just three I'll show you all the poker cards, bro. That's what I'm dealing with. What do you got? ah Fair enough. Fair enough. All right. So good. and So we'll we'll we'll we'll keep we'll keep our eyes open for the fall.
00:40:53
Speaker
For sure. Yeah, we got a lot we really got a lot of good staff. I bet on us. I think Little Subjects has, even at at Comic-Con, I thought we looked like one of the most original booths there.
00:41:06
Speaker
Like just our product lineup. It was just fresh. It was original. It just felt real good, man. so another i'm not I'm not a can CEO. I'm just going to talk plain. I'm from Laguna Beach. The one thing that you will find out from like Orange County Kids and all the guys that own surf brands and skate brands and all that,
00:41:24
Speaker
I don't know what happened, but the F word replaced just about every other word in the in the English language. Once again, we're from New Jersey. Yeah, there you go man yeah go, man. It's part of ah it's part of like a greeting at this point yeah here. it's It's as common as and.
00:41:43
Speaker
yeah it's for us Yeah, for us, it's Spicoli, you know? Yeah, there's lot of Spicoli in that F word.
00:41:52
Speaker
and But yeah, know i I love Mask. I think it's some of the best toys we've ever made. I'm not saying a lot because we've made a lot of cool shit. Hell yeah. um So another one that i is an old school one that I loved and in turn my wife loves. And we saw it back at, geez, Toy Fair. I think came back like two years ago at Toy Fair. Yeah.
00:42:18
Speaker
was Jem. So is there any update on the dolls or any expansion to Jem? We did sample. We sampled one of the misfits.
00:42:31
Speaker
Got to get strategy together for that. But yeah, I know there's like, I think they're just like hammering us on our social media channels. Like, where but you know, just giving it to me about Jem. want that more man they good if enough people want more that's the whole thing you know some of these things are are fairly niche audiences you know so it's like it it all has to make sense but we do have one in the misfits sampled up so you know don't hold out hope it ain't over
00:43:04
Speaker
Good to know. Right on. Yeah. um And i know I know this is. I don't dictate this stuff, man. You know, there's got there's got to be enough. Remember I said I built a theme park, but, you know, there's got to be enough people in that parking lot to come in.
00:43:18
Speaker
Yeah, fair enough. that's how heard that i mean Listen, listen, gem fans. you're hearing this, get out there. Be loud. um yeah Now, I know this is a dangerous. Be loud is like, don't blow me up, though. Like, you know, be lot of like, fuck, we got you, dude. We're here. We're going we're going to get it.
00:43:34
Speaker
Be loud and show up. yeah Yeah. Loud and positive. There we go. loud It's like when you see a show flyer for a show, you got to you got to show up and the band will come back. Yeah, man.
00:43:45
Speaker
Exactly. yeah I came from the band scene. I know how that is. I was that dude on Sunset Boulevard and all the clubs up and down West Hollywood and Hollywood. Come see my band. Come see my band.
00:43:58
Speaker
I was at Kinko's cutting little letters out, making the flyers. Pre-Photoshop days, guys. yeah. Way back then. You got to make the collage and tape it together and get it the right way the machine. That's what to do. Oh, it's the best. That's what I used to I used to do that for my band. I'd sit there and cut all the little letters out and little images.
00:44:18
Speaker
you know So fun story, I've i've also been in and out bands since i was 15. And there was a VFW hall, or an American Legion Lodge, actually, that was kind of like our home base. That was like our the the club that we played at most regularly here in New Jersey.
00:44:34
Speaker
And we used to set up on the bar, like during the day, in
Punk Music Influence on Toy Development
00:44:40
Speaker
between like the regular dudes that were like American Legion members, we'd have like our little like our little silk screening wooden board, set up on the bar we'd have all of our like you know magazines to cut out all the letters to do like the ransom note style flyers and stuff yeah together and all these old timers would be sitting there like pounding like butt heavies just being like what are you guys what are you kids even doing we're like we're gonna be players for a punk show that we're gonna have upstairs and they're like what the hell's a punk show and we would you know we're like know like punk music like punk punk rock music and they're like oh
00:45:16
Speaker
When's that happening? And like, you know, hold up the flyer and it's like this weekend. And then sure enough, those old dudes showed up and they were like, you kids are pretty good. Oh, that's cool, man. I love that, dude. I love that. um Man, I miss that.
00:45:32
Speaker
yeah that was so That was so fun. I mean, that was like my entire like late teens and 20s was doing that. you know ye I miss it. I do miss it. I still play. I mean, my office still has a bunch of stuff.
00:45:49
Speaker
I still play. And now my kids are old enough where like they're listen, like I've played them some of my stuff from like, you know, when I was a teenager and they're like, we want you to be in a band again. We want to see you play live. And I'm like, I wish it was that easy where it was just like, sure. Just slap it together. Bro, live got the is a different deal than playing by yourself, man. Like there is were within about 45 seconds you're gassed.
00:46:17
Speaker
Oh yeah. How's that? You know, I played here for two hours straight. Anything, yeah anything on drums. I play for two hours straight, barely bake break a sweat, just full plying too playing to play live.
00:46:31
Speaker
If I started right now, 30 seconds into it, I'd just be damn. Yep. Totally blown up. Totally blown up. It's such a different chop, man. It's, it's crazy.
00:46:44
Speaker
Yep. But i hope I'm hoping, I'm holding out hope. I got i got a group of guys that like i've been that are part of those have been part of those years. we've been We've been chatting, we've been messing around with some things. So my fingers my fingers are are very, very crossed. never never Never could play, but long time appreciator. I went to a show with the Stone Pony like two weeks ago and I was like, oh yeah, i forgot how much fun like standing out in this back crowd.
00:47:11
Speaker
just sweating profusely is. but It is, man. It's that communion. It's like the community and the communion. I actually think that toy has it. Like it's something in San Diego Comic Con kind of has that weird vibe like that.
00:47:24
Speaker
Yeah. agree It does add that where it's like community, right? You know? um But yeah, there's there's nothing like those vibrations coming through those speakers. You know, it's it like aligns your cells.
00:47:37
Speaker
m It's endorphin-inducing. It's cool. It is. And I think there's a lot of there's a lot of crossover. like There's a lot of people that are, even in like the like toy journalism community part, like between the makers and the people that are like covering and collecting, like there's a lot of crossover between- Dude, this is how I got into it. I'll tell you how I got into being a toy a company owner and creating a toy brand.
00:48:06
Speaker
I was, you know, I was on tour with bands like in vans going through just small towns, you know, in all these small towns, you'd have like little thrift shops. And this was like when Star Wars started kind of picking its head back in, I'd see like little Darth Vader's and Luke Skywalker's and they'd be restoring troopers. They'd be selling like five bucks a pot when you're broke.
00:48:28
Speaker
you know, that's all you can afford. So you buy these like little trinkets to kind of remind you as as things you had as a kid. But a lot of the other musicians I knew did the same exact thing.
00:48:40
Speaker
And then um I created this thing called Mulletheads. It's sort of like, you know, like trash, metal, crazy thing. And made a bunch of toys and in sold this show for development to MTV.
00:48:54
Speaker
And that's that's how I got into the toy game. wow Yeah, yeah. But all came from music. My whole lens came from music. The entire thing came from, and I've kind of operated, I've always operated this like it was like, almost like a punk band to a certain degree or skate brand or a surf brand, you know, very similar. You know, my personality in the industry is a lot different.
00:49:18
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Cause those were what I was exposed to. was exposed to any bands, you know, Do you, you know, do it yourself. And then I was exposed to surf brands and skate brands or core culture, you know, things like that.
00:49:34
Speaker
So, you know, you've been doing this now almost 20 years. Um, I started, I started 2001.
00:49:44
Speaker
Straight to the Mall like 2,000. So yeah, 26 years. 26 years. So almost And like you said, you've made you've thousands of licenses, thousands of products over the years. i Are there any kind of like dream licenses or you know like brands or you know with your music background, like is there is there any dream license out there that you that you can talk about that you would love to work with?
00:50:10
Speaker
You know, I like all the pop culture stories. i like all the sort of legacy brands. Like, you know, it's funny when you say that, you know, like people sometimes describe the little subjects, what we do is nostalgia. But if you walk into Walmart, Target, it's all nostalgia. I mean, what's on the shelf?
00:50:25
Speaker
Jurassic Park, Pokemon, Masters of the Universe, Star Wars. I mean, tell me something that's not on that shelf that isn't less than 30 years old. Like there's hardly anything on that shelf that isn't 30 years old or longer, right?
00:50:41
Speaker
That is, the whole thing is nostalgia. um But yeah, you know, part of the part of me just wants to get back to, you know, creating our own stories.
00:50:52
Speaker
You know, that's how i started. I started just making stuff up and, you know, drawing it and, writing stories about it. And I got one thing launching a Walmart 912 pretty big. That's something I made up and design. I personally designed for the company. Oh, awesome.
00:51:07
Speaker
Yeah. very cool It's called Skittons. It's actually the the name my ah wife ah calls her cat. Her cat's name's Cocoa, but she calls her Skitton.
00:51:18
Speaker
That's like her pet name. And so I kind of created a a collectible line, you know, in I don't know, maybe it's a love letter to my wife, but she inspired it. That's awesome. um But that's going to be on in Walmart, I think 2000 stores, something like that on 912. Right right on on. That has a lot of my own personal in touch on it.
00:51:48
Speaker
Very cool. um So toy industry has changed dramatically over the last few years. Loyal Subjects has changed right along with it. And we talked a lot about that. But when you look ahead, like next three years, next five years, what do you want the collector community to think of when they hear the Loyal Subjects?
00:52:08
Speaker
ah Yeah, just quality products, doing cool things, turning people on, you know, making things available, you know, making them consumable, you know, not hard in the pocketbook.
00:52:20
Speaker
a Again, the price, the the ticket entry fee is is less than the experience you get out of it. I mean, that's those are just the North Stars. Just keep going, keep going, keep going, keep going. you know I think we got like the blocks to scale this company and kind of really build it out pretty substantial.
00:52:39
Speaker
We have some good partnerships, got some great licenses. We're doing some great things internally and just stuff we're we're creating on our own and bringing the market. out um But hopefully it's a story that resonates and it's a story that people can connect with. You know, it's the great democracy is consumerism.
00:52:59
Speaker
So, you know, consumers will let you know what they think with their dollars and hopefully they choose us. And we understand that it's A privilege. It's not an expectation that people work hard for the money and they work hard for the entertainment. It's never lost on us What a privilege it is to actually be chosen and how rare and special that is.
00:53:19
Speaker
And we're we're eternally grateful for that. And i think the toy industry is are looking really good. i think there's a lot of good people doing a lot of good stuff.
00:53:30
Speaker
I do. And competition is fierce. I think we're as good as any. um And I'm excited what's going to happen next three years.
Company Vision and Conclusion
00:53:39
Speaker
I think it's going to be a really exciting time.
00:53:43
Speaker
Awesome. Well, Jonathan, thank you so much for taking the time, man, to chat with us. Yes, thank Before we let you go, remind our viewers, our listeners, where can they stay up to date on all things The Loyal Subjects?
00:53:57
Speaker
Well, mainly our social media. So I think Facebook is Loyal Subjects Co., backslash facebook.com uh instagram it's the loyal subjects um you know social media is kind of king i'm i'm working tick tock bro you know i'm such a gen xer i gotta i gotta get my act together we're still working trying to figure tick tock out too so we're we're with you or how about this guys like you you guys do you guys do as much as we do half time about what we're doing um
00:54:29
Speaker
You know, and and your buddies, all the other buddies in the ecosystem. I actually had a good client sit next to Jordan on a panel over, you know, oh yeah. yeah gracious Jordan.
00:54:39
Speaker
And he's such a good guy. Love that dude. He is. Oh, what a sweetheart. Yeah. One of one of our, yeah. yeah we we are very We are very fortunate to be one of our friends. a friend Yeah, yeah. I agree.
00:54:55
Speaker
He's a solid guy. Yeah, yeah. yeah So I would say, you know, maybe let me revert him back to you guys. Pay attention to you guys. You know, you guys will have scoop.
00:55:08
Speaker
We will continue doing everything that we can to you know to get to get all the news out there about everything that The Loyal Subjects is doing, but we will also make sure that in our show notes, we do put links to to all the social media accounts. That way people can can do the whole like and follow and and all that good stuff.
00:55:26
Speaker
um Jonathan, thank you so much, man, for chatting with us. We cannot wait to see what you do next. ah Dave, I think it's time to get us out of here. hi broce I appreciate you guys. I do.
00:55:39
Speaker
You guys are solid dudes. Thank you. Have a great night, everyone.
00:55:44
Speaker
Thank you, dear listener, for hanging out with us today. Subscribe, rate, and review us wherever you listen, and then tell your friends to do it. Thanks also to Joe Azari, the golden voice behind our intro. Our music is Game Boy Horror by the Zombie Dandies. Find more about them both in our show notes.
00:56:01
Speaker
Follow us on social media at AIC underscore podcast on Instagram and Twitter. Stop by and say hi. Show us your toy hauls and share your toy stories. Maybe we'll talk about it in a future episode.
00:56:16
Speaker
Don't try this at home. Voidware prohibited in some assembly required. Each sold separately. Not a flying toy. Consult a physician if your toy run exceeds more than four hours.
00:56:24
Speaker
This has been a non-productive media presentation. Executive producer, Frank Hablaui. This program and many others like it on the Non-Productive Network is distributed under a Creative Commons Attribution Non-Commercial No Derivatives License. Please share it, but ask before trying to change it or sell it. For more information, visit non-productive.com.