Transcript
Speaker: This is HSBC Global Viewpoint, your window into the thinking, trends and issues shaping global banking and markets.
Speaker: Join us as we hear from industry leaders and HSBC experts on the latest insights and opportunities for your business.
Speaker: A heads up to our listeners that this episode has been recorded remotely, therefore the sound quality may vary.
Speaker: Thank you for listening.
Speaker: So we have Nick Gandolfo from Sustainalytics, a global leader in ESG and corporate governance research and ratings.
Speaker: Nick is a director of sustainable finance solutions, heading the business in APAC and is based in Singapore.
Speaker: He's over 15 years experience in the region across countries as diverse as Australia, Hong Kong, China, Indonesia, Cambodia and Singapore and worked in the private and seven government sectors in both developed and emerging markets.
Speaker: Next, Bupesh Gupta.
Speaker: Bupesh is president and CEO of COFAS in the APAC region, a position he's held since 2016.
Speaker: And he brings an extensive experience across a wide range of financial products across large ticket leverage and project finance, trade and consumer finance.
Speaker: He's had a number of senior roles in GE Capital and is a board director for JV's Hyundai Capital in Korea and Cosmos Bank in Taiwan.
Speaker: Ashok Jain.
Speaker: Ashok is Head of Corporate Finance at Indorama Ventures, one of the world's leading petrochemicals producers, and is based in Bangkok in their head office.
Speaker: Ashok has been with Indorama for over 15 years, covering corporate strategy, investor relations and ECM roles, and has been in his current role for the past four years, where responsibilities cover banking and finance, taxation and M&A.
Speaker: And lastly, Michael Nielsen.
Speaker: Michael is the regional head of supply chain for Vestas Asia and responsible for ensuring the fulfillment to global locations of finished goods and components.
Speaker: He's based in Singapore and has over 15 years experience in the region, including stints in both India and China.
Speaker: Please feel free to submit questions via the Q&A functionality whilst we hold the panel discussion and we'll be holding a Q&A session at the end where I'll be able to put your questions to the panel.
Speaker: So, with a less predictable geopolitical environment, macroeconomic challenges, increased regulatory pressures, currency volatilities and most recently COVID, building and managing resilient supply chains, including their financing, has never been more the subject of scrutiny, focus and change as it has been over the past couple of years.
Speaker: be it working capital optimization, changing structures, risk management, ESG or innovation, and therefore increasingly the focus of corporate C-suites and boards.
Speaker: But it does present great opportunities for those that are able to manage this well.
Speaker: So my first question to the panel is, over the past year, the preservation of cash has become a priority for all corporates, with working capital efficiencies playing a critical role.
Speaker: What trends around this theme have you seen emerging?
Speaker: And how do you see this evolving in the future?
Speaker: Ashok, perhaps I could start with you.
Speaker: Yeah, thanks, Stephen.
Speaker: Good afternoon to everyone.
Speaker: So we have gone through a situation over the past 12 months, which was more health driven rather than any structural reasons, which we went through in the 97 ASEAN crisis or in the 2008 global crisis.
Speaker: During the past 12 months, whenever there are times, whenever times are uncertain, there is a push to keep liquidity.
Speaker: And obviously because of the nature of working capital, that is the first thing that the corporates would look at.
Speaker: So what we have seen is within the supply chain, there was an impact from destocking.
Speaker: So everyone was moving from produce to stock to produce to order.
Speaker: So
Speaker: That destocking resulted in release of cash from working capital.
Speaker: The other aspect during such times is credit risk management.
Speaker: There is a large portfolio of receivables and you never know between which of your exposures there could be risk emanating.
Speaker: And at the same time, where you are well covered
Speaker: the counterparties may reduce the, may decide to decrease those limits for you.
Speaker: So that is another aspect you need to very regularly monitor.
Speaker: What has been useful is that because of the governments, there was a lot of liquidity in the market and the yields came down.
Speaker: So there was an opportunity to lock in
Speaker: funding for long term and short term at low cost of financing.
Speaker: So primarily what we see as a trend is that with how supply chains are moving, whether we need to look at our cash cycles more closely and whether we need to change to the new normal our cash cycles rather than what we were doing in the past.
Speaker: Yeah, Stephen, that's all.
Speaker: Thanks, Ashok.
Speaker: Bupesh, perhaps I could pass the question over to you as well, please.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: Sorry about that.
Speaker: We've been doing this for so long, still make the same mistakes.
Speaker: I was just saying that kind of a sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-sh-
Speaker: Ashok put his thumb on the right thing, which is, you know, you've got to fundamentally protect cash, right?
Speaker: So banks provide cash, but it's really bridging, right?
Speaker: It's people like Ashok and their constituents and stakeholders who actually generate cash.
Speaker: People like us, COFOS, if you don't know, we issue policies that protect about $700 billion of receivables across the world at any point of time, right?
Speaker: So our job is to protect cash.
Speaker: We've seen a couple of trends here, right?
Speaker: And one of them surprising.
Speaker: When we started the year, kind of the end of the first quarter, beginning of the second quarter, when we thought, you know, COVID is going to be worse than we initially assumed, you know, kind of greater China and the region, it's going to affect the world.
Speaker: There was a scramble, as Ashok put it, you know, to make sure we had the right limits.
Speaker: We had, you know, not been overexposed to things.
Speaker: And, you know, we did what we had to.
Speaker: The surprising thing for me during the year has been not only us, but kind of all my fellow companies who are part of the burn union have actually paid out 16% less this year, or rather in 2020 compared to 2019.
Speaker: One was what Ashok mentioned, the fact that there was much more liquidity from government, but there was also direct support protection for debtors against creditors, et cetera.
Speaker: But that has been the biggest trend we've seen actually in this year has been the willingness to accommodate.
Speaker: Buyers, sellers have been accommodating each other more than we have ever seen.
Speaker: We've had overdues where people have said, look, can you just give us an extension of dates so we can work this out amicably?
Speaker: Because obviously when we pay claims, then we've got to go out and recover.
Speaker: That has helped.
Speaker: The issue is if this keeps going and we still aren't seeing the exact end of the tunnel, I think we know it's there with the vaccinations going on.
Speaker: We don't know when either of these things start to stumble.
Speaker: If you have in the chain of accommodation and one or two people stopping to do that, you're going to have issues.
Speaker: Comes back to our job.
Speaker: We've got about a thousand people who are monitoring on a daily basis.
Speaker: Thousands and thousands of buyers across 200 countries.
Speaker: You've got to keep your eye on that ball.
Speaker: You've got to continue to manage the risk, whether it's, you know, we are seeing some movements to documenting credit where there used to be open accounts.
Speaker: But on the whole, so far, I would say things are sticking together.
Speaker: And I hope that for the next six months, we're going to get through this and we'll be all fine.
Speaker: I think, but those are the trends that I'm seeing here is, you know, more accommodation than I've ever seen in my life.
Speaker: I went to the GFC and took billions of dollars of losses.
Speaker: This is not like that.
Speaker: It's actually going to come out and I kind of, our slogan is, you know, beat COVID together.
Speaker: And I think that's what we've got to do.
Speaker: Great, no thanks very much, Pupesh.
Speaker: So perhaps now moving on to another question and moving on from working capital efficiencies, there's now a really clear focus on sustainability priorities.
Speaker: and no longer seen I think as as optional considerations for corporate boards.
Speaker: What are the trends you're seeing and what are the steps being taken by corporates to help them achieve their sustainability goals?
Speaker: Perhaps I could start with Nick on this particular subject.
Speaker: Yeah, thanks, thanks Stephen.
Speaker: And again, good afternoon to everybody.
Speaker: So I think you're absolutely right.
Speaker: In addition to the different constraints on liquidity and the difficult COVID environment revolve, and the stresses that that's put on value chains and supply chains,
Speaker: it's enhanced, focused, accelerated, emphasized the E environment, S social and the governance perspective.
Speaker: So the context is really intensified.
Speaker: And I guess some of the trends that we see, some of them are regulatory imposed, such as Modern Slavery Act, in particularly the UK and Australia, which demands some corporates to really get into more of the details in their supply chains and have an active program on how to deal with some of those issues.
Speaker: The other thing that's really intensified too is this whole movement towards decarbonisation, net zero, transition.
Speaker: And what that has meant is that a lot of corporates need to focus on what we call scope three emissions.
Speaker: So where's the emissions in their value chain?
Speaker: The topic of today is the supply chain aspect of that.
Speaker: And that's really intensified.
Speaker: So some of the certifications...
Speaker: in the market about science-based targets and having a really robust plan to reduce your emissions you actually need to take these things into consideration or you can't actually get some of those uh certifications so they're they're two big ones probably the other two things that i think is happening and being exacerbated by covid and just the ongoing context and importance of sustainability is
Speaker: I'd say leadership.
Speaker: So more and more corporates wanting to show leadership through their procurement spend, through their investments, through their interactions, because a lot of corporates are obviously sourcing and working with suppliers in some difficult markets who don't maybe have the best enabling ESG opportunities.
Speaker: regulations and support.
Speaker: So I think there's a real opportunity for leadership there and we're seeing it.
Speaker: So some corporates really using that influence through that procurement spin.
Speaker: The other thing is transparency.
Speaker: And we've seen that in the green bond, label bond, social bond, sustainable finance markets of which HSBC is a huge, a huge player.
Speaker: And that's transferring to, I'd say, sustainable supply chains as well.
Speaker: So us as consumers, we demand more of companies now.
Speaker: We want to know where our products we're buying comes from.
Speaker: So there's been lots of different announcements from companies like Unilever and many others about how robust their supply chain is.
Speaker: management is, how they've integrated sustainability.
Speaker: So there's push from banks, there's push from investors, and there's really push for consumers.
Speaker: So I think all of that as sort of trends, that they're not...
Speaker: in the absence of, or just come out of nowhere.
Speaker: COVID highlights these, some of these trends have been building for some time and now it's just intensified.
Speaker: So lots of different things that we see in the market and it's a real growth area for our business and talking to clients about lots of these different aspects.
Speaker: Great.
Speaker: No, thanks, Nick.
Speaker: Michael, with Vestas being an industry leader in sustainable energy solutions and at the forefront when it comes to sustainability, it would be great to sort of get your views and hear from your thoughts around this subject.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Good afternoon to everybody.
Speaker: I think Nicholas did a very good job of explaining what are the key things that's going on at the moment across the board.
Speaker: I think maybe to mention two examples of how those things go over and beyond, because even though we are a sustainable product, it takes the whole value chain, as Nicholas mentioned, to make it work.
Speaker: And in that aspect, of course, we have our own internal goals of how we become a carbon neutral company by 2030 by doing various actions.
Speaker: But it's also how do we make sure that the value chain becomes and how do we ensure that the partners we work with get enabled to do it?
Speaker: So we do have, for example, like Vestas Ventures,
Speaker: but we actually collaborate with other people in the power industry or supporting sustainability where if the battery life needs to get longer, how do we make sure that we work, collaborate with the right people to evolve in that space of it?
Speaker: How do we work to improve the capability of turbines as well?
Speaker: And then we are still a young industry, so to say, in sustainability.
Speaker: So actually what we're also working on right now and something you'll be seeing coming over the next couple of weeks is the
Speaker: collaboration, not only with our industry peers, but also partners that is suppliers to us to see how do we work on actually making reverse logistics sustainable.
Speaker: So as we start to see more repowering happening, old turbines being taken down, being reused, how do we take this forward looking of knowing what is coming tomorrow and ensuring that that also becomes sustainable.
Speaker: So there's consortiums now being established across the value chain to make sure we become as an industry more sustainable than
Speaker: our product is today.
Speaker: So again, it takes a lot of collaboration.
Speaker: I know that Nicholas mentioned that the consumer, but it's also in the business to business that just something like safety of employees during the COVID times.
Speaker: Safety is already for employees of our utmost importance, but actually being able to translate that to customers, what we're doing, being able to collaborate with partners, telling them what we're doing.
Speaker: I think there's a lot of soft, so let's call it leadership.
Speaker: I'll call it, there's a lot of soft things in the SDGs as well that we need to be aware of that we're working on as well to enabling everybody in the value chain.
Speaker: So I think there's a lot of good things happening across industries in consortiums as well as within companies.
Speaker: Great.
Speaker: Thanks very much, Michael.
Speaker: Perhaps I'll pass over to Ashok.
Speaker: Welcome any sort of thoughts and views from you, particularly for petrochemicals industry perspective.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So I think Nicholas and Michael have covered it well.
Speaker: Since we are part of an oil group chemical industry, so there are a lot of expectations on the ESG front.
Speaker: from our industry and there are expectations of structural changes in the longterm within the industry.
Speaker: So we need to prepare for that, which we are doing.
Speaker: At the same time, I think what we have seen is that ESG has gained more relevance over the past 12 months.
Speaker: As we have seen, the skies have become more blue
Speaker: I used to never see a blue sky in Bangkok in the day, but I do see it over the last 12 months.
Speaker: So that is a change.
Speaker: Of course, that is because people go out less, they travel less.
Speaker: So I think within the industry, everybody is trying to come out with their own ESG strategy, primarily, which is centered around reducing the carbon footprint.
Speaker: whether that carbon footprint is in manufacturing or is in supply chain and distribution.
Speaker: And secondly, I think everybody is setting up their targets.
Speaker: Everybody is preparing for 2040, 2050, how to become, how to get to zero GHG.
Speaker: And at the same time, since we know that electric vehicles
Speaker: are coming and up to 2040-50 is a long period within which probably if the electric vehicle industry picks up, there could be an infrastructure which can be set up for that.
Speaker: So that, so there is a lot of preparation within the industry going on, as I mentioned in the beginning, that it has potential to structurally change the oil to chemical industry over a period of 20 to 30 years with what is happening around us.
Speaker: Great.
Speaker: No, no.
Speaker: Really appreciated those thoughts, views, Ashok.
Speaker: Bupesh, I'm really interested in how you see this from a COFAS's perspective.
Speaker: Look, I think there are two aspects of that.
Speaker: I think we're
Speaker: we're pretty well subscribed to the fact that we want to be, you know, an organization with a strong ESG culture, right?
Speaker: And we're doing lots of things.
Speaker: We just signed up to an LGBT charter to ensure, you know, inclusiveness, not across, you know, sexes, but also across, you know, things like that.
Speaker: But I think from looking out at my clients, I see a change, right?
Speaker: And the change is kind of, you know, I think it's not the beginning, but it's kind of somewhere closer to the first quartile of a change from what we used to see 20, 25 years ago, which was a tick the box mentality.
Speaker: I need to tick enough boxes so I can stay out of trouble from the regulators to a mentality which is more looking now like a virtuous evolution of corporate culture.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: More and more organizations are really believing in this.
Speaker: I think there are two reasons for that.
Speaker: One is I think the millennials demand that of us.
Speaker: If you're going to employ millennials, you're going to have to think and act differently.
Speaker: There's no winking going on.
Speaker: They're part of the organization.
Speaker: They want to be part of organizations that have a strong ESG culture.
Speaker: I think there's another one which comes out from them.
Speaker: We are actually seeing a number of our clients that come to us and say, we'd like to understand your ESG culture to decide whether we want you to be an insurer.
Speaker: This is not a trend that I'd seen five years ago, right?
Speaker: People say, okay, you're a financial institution.
Speaker: You do what you need to, you know, I'll carry on my business.
Speaker: So when people start demanding that their partners have a similar ethos and culture as them, you start seeing the start of an evolution or could become a revolution.
Speaker: So I think from my point of view, we see much more of that.
Speaker: We try and be fully compliant.
Speaker: We try and be socially active.
Speaker: Our motto is for trade.
Speaker: We believe trade brings peace, prosperity, and stability across the world.
Speaker: So we do our own bit.
Speaker: We're a small organization, but it's good to see others following that.
Speaker: Yeah, great.
Speaker: Thanks, Bupesh.
Speaker: I think this whole piece around the millennials and what they demand and having to, you know, we're all looking to attract the best talent.
Speaker: And as you say, I think there is very much a real movement where people, as you say, generally care about this and less the tick the box exercise.
Speaker: So perhaps we can just move on to, I think, the final sort of question we have for the panel before we move into sort of Q&A.
Speaker: And this really is looking at the digitization of supply chains.
Speaker: And I guess what you see is the key shifts that innovation is driving.
Speaker: And how, it's always a difficult question, how do we see this defining the future?
Speaker: So perhaps if I could throw this one over to Ashok to have a sort of stab at, thank you.
Speaker: Okay, so I think how I see it is it's how we are looking at it is now more as in
Speaker: end to end solution with a more visible supply chain.
Speaker: When I say visible, earlier it was more information driven, now it is more visibility driven.
Speaker: And the objective remains the same to have a better customer experience and optimization opportunities.
Speaker: How the consumers have shifted over the last many years is that there was a time when they had more
Speaker: options means more products on the shelves from which to pick from then they had more options in terms of retail formats so instead of home stores it went into different types of segments of retails and now what we see is that now it has become digital so there is an option of e-commerce as well where again there are multiplicity of platforms
Speaker: from which they could pick the products.
Speaker: So taking a cue from there, if there is a consumer and that consumer needs to be satisfied as we are going forward, I think what would be required is that besides the ERP platform, probably a lot of networking on cloud computing between the entire value chain.
Speaker: so that you could see those shifts and you could move the product.
Speaker: This may be more relevant for particularly for somebody who is in a consumer good industry rather than in an industrial good industry.
Speaker: At the same time, there is a lot of, to have so much of flexibility, obviously your logistics need to be tracked closely.
Speaker: You need to have
Speaker: means there are supporting industries which are also evolving, which is in terms of tracking of the logistic systems, having 3D printing RFID, because there is a need for labeling, digital labeling on every product so that they could be captured on the systems.
Speaker: So I think where we are heading towards is
Speaker: probably the shift of consumer will drive more and more towards the innovation within towards digitization.
Speaker: And I'll just share with you an example in Bangkok that during the lockdowns, the home delivery of food business has gathered steam.
Speaker: And there are so many organizations which are providing that.
Speaker: And every
Speaker: Means even coffee shops need to link to these networks now so that people, if they want to buy a product, they could get to this.
Speaker: So I think the digitalization is affecting the entire supply chain.
Speaker: And I think the COVID-19 has pushed a lot of the smaller retail formats up to the larger manufacturing organizations and the retail formats to move into this.
Speaker: So I think that's, I will end with that.
Speaker: Great insights, Ashok.
Speaker: Michael, perhaps I can pass over to you.
Speaker: Welcome your thoughts around the digitization.
Speaker: We see it in three factors and then I would like to add an example of what Ashok meant because there's an expansion of the home delivery as well.
Speaker: But the first one is your predictive maintenance.
Speaker: So I think it's a lot of session and feedback loop you'll get from the demand of what is being used at your customer's location.
Speaker: That is enabling you to have a more efficient supply chain and you could do maybe predictive of when you want to do maintenance and make sure you have the right stock at the right place.
Speaker: So that feedback loop in terms of digitalization is now out most important.
Speaker: And you're seeing that in the most equipment that's coming out.
Speaker: The other one is also digitalization also is the key for us to have decision making.
Speaker: So during the COVID crisis, I think a lot of companies who had the visibility to where you had your finished goods, where you had your suppliers, where you were to deliver.
Speaker: So taking the demand chain versus the supply chain and actually have the ability to reroute it where possible during those periods to actually fulfilling your customers demand.
Speaker: That is the second part where it becomes critical.
Speaker: And then a third part where I think now we're in a finance forum where digitalization is becoming important is
Speaker: Hedging, exchange rates, to sourcing, final consumption, how to utilize the free trade agreement.
Speaker: There's a lot of things that ties into the supply chain that is potentially not anchored into when we take supply chain decisions because we keep talking physical factories, components,
Speaker: But sometimes there's more money in the sourcing and deliveries if you're actually understanding the global networks of the free trade agreements and the collaboration across countries.
Speaker: So it's very important that those get integrated from a digitalization part of it.
Speaker: And then Ashok mentioned an example, and we've seen the same thing for where I sit about the food industry and deliveries.
Speaker: But that also creates an enormous supply because people only eat breakfast, lunch and dinner.
Speaker: So people who actually in the supply chain is now identifying those people that works in the scooter.
Speaker: What are they doing from 10 to 12 from people are not consuming?
Speaker: How can I utilize these to do fulfillment of other things?
Speaker: So whatever comes out new also create opportunities for others.
Speaker: So these cross industries collaboration is also going to help us reduce the CO2 emissions and contortions to align.
Speaker: So just an example how we can collaborate as well with others.
Speaker: I know it's tough to put a turbine on a motorcycle in Bangkok, but for others who are delivering smaller items, there are opportunities for collaboration.
Speaker: So that's why we're seeing it today.
Speaker: That's really insightful, Michael, thanks.
Speaker: Nick, I'll pass that one to you.
Speaker: Yeah, I think I'd agree with a lot of things that the other panelists have mentioned and connected to the themes of digitization and visibility.
Speaker: I think there's two things that we really see and that we're building our business for and actually speaking to a lot of customers about.
Speaker: It's about risk and then impact.
Speaker: So on the risk side, a lot of it is about data.
Speaker: How do you assess suppliers?
Speaker: How do you do it efficiently?
Speaker: If there's no data that exists, have you got a digital platform to enhance that, to enable it?
Speaker: So I think from a risk perspective, I think digitization is very important.
Speaker: The other side too,
Speaker: around sort of visibility cuts two ways.
Speaker: I think from an impact point of view and also risk as well.
Speaker: So we work with a lot of clients who want to get into the lower tiers of their tier two, tier three, tier four and beyond in some complicated supply chains.
Speaker: How do you do that?
Speaker: I think that's pretty difficult without some systems, some digitizations and some of these other trends, I think are going to enhance that.
Speaker: So what's the core need as far as ESG or sustainability goes is visibility for risk and then visibility for impact.
Speaker: And the flip side of that is we're speaking to a lot of customers about how you quantify that.
Speaker: how you measure it, how you quantify it, and certainly digitization under that banner of visibility is going to help multiple issues that we see in these supply chains because they're complicated.
Speaker: The world's only getting a more complicated place.
Speaker: So yeah, probably end on that, just those things in a very dynamic environment.
Speaker: Great, thanks Nick.
Speaker: Just before we go to Bupesh, just to remind the audience, if you've got any questions for the gentleman, please do drop them on the Q&A functionality you've got on the webinar.
Speaker: But perhaps I'll just finish with you Bupesh on this particular subject, I guess how you see this from a COFAS perspective.
Speaker: Thanks, Stephen.
Speaker: Look, I think digitization is something that happened a few years ago, right?
Speaker: If it had not, I don't think we guys would have survived the last 12 months.
Speaker: We were all able to, you know, especially people like us, you know, across the region and eventually across the world, we had 80, 85% of our people working from home.
Speaker: Without a change in response time, we were able to deal with, you know, customer credit approval requests.
Speaker: We were able to pay claims.
Speaker: We were able to do everything we know I'm going to do.
Speaker: There were some teething issues in terms of internet connection or power outages, especially with our center in India, but honestly, I don't think anyone felt it.
Speaker: So I think it comes back, the trends that I'd probably say I would like to see more happening are kind of related to what Nicholas said, data definitely.
Speaker: But for me and for my clients, it's becoming the ability to analyze, interpret, and predict on the basis of non-conventional data.
Speaker: So can I take
Speaker: all the customs records in a country and can I take all the energy consumption records in a country and can I correlate them to my buyers and say, if these guys are consuming energy and they're buying the product,
Speaker: They must be doing okay, especially if the product's not piled up in a warehouse.
Speaker: I think there's some AI, machine learning, whatever, that needs to take us to that level where you would really get efficient in being able to provide the cover and for you, even provide the financing based on that perspective.
Speaker: And I can see some of that starting to happen.
Speaker: It's right now a little bit, you know, not as organized as I would like to see.
Speaker: I think the other thing that we'd probably like to see more of is the application of blockchain for the purpose of, you know, supply chain flows.
Speaker: We see a lot of fraud there.
Speaker: We see copies of bills of lending.
Speaker: It just means we're going to have to step away from the edge of the cliff and be more cautious, which means, you know, people who could be insured or people who could get financing suffer.
Speaker: So I think those two evolutions are starting to happen and I see a trend when they will accelerate.
Speaker: Great.
Speaker: Thanks.
Speaker: I really appreciate it, Pupesh.
Speaker: So look, gentlemen, thank you for your insights here.
Speaker: We now sort of would move into the Q&A session and
Speaker: Looking at questions submitted so far, I think it's a reflection on how you've answered these questions that I think, you know, some great insights that you've given the audience into the topics we've discussed today.
Speaker: As things currently stand, we don't have any questions from the audience.
Speaker: So perhaps what we can do is perhaps look to start to wrap up the breakout session today.
Speaker: I think there is in terms of what I would like to say is firstly a huge thank you to each of you for your time this afternoon and the insights you've provided.
Speaker: Clearly, you know, it's an unprecedented time for change.
Speaker: And I think we've seen the ability to drive through change in supply chains at speeds unimaginable only 12 months ago.
Speaker: But I think businesses can clearly look beyond the myriad of challenges.
Speaker: We'll really be in a strong position in whatever the new normal that emerges post-pandemic.
Speaker: So I think the next step is really to I think there are some some logistics that I need to remind you the audience of.
Speaker: Actually, actually, before we do that, we have actually one.
Speaker: One question I can probably ask the audience, sorry, the panel before we disappear, we have a couple of late questions come in.
Speaker: So, and this is a bit of a tricky one to answer, but I'll open it up to anyone who wants to have a stab at this.
Speaker: What are the roles being played by various governments in supporting SMEs, vaccine diplomacy,
Speaker: and support from the public sector.
Speaker: Has anyone brave enough to have a go at this before we wrap up?
Speaker: I think... Sorry.
Speaker: Go ahead, Nicholas.
Speaker: I was just going to say a very brief comment.
Speaker: I think SMEs are a very important piece of the puzzle as you dig into supply chains more, more of the impact, sometimes more of the risk, but maybe more of the opportunities to work with these type of companies there.
Speaker: So I think it is a huge opportunity to engage right along that value chain and even with SMEs.
Speaker: So Singapore, the MAS has some programs that the banks can tap into to support different types of sustainability, you know, financing for SMEs.
Speaker: And hopefully we see that extend to
Speaker: you know, being more specifically connected to trade and supply chain as well for the SME.
Speaker: So a really important part.
Speaker: And some governments are being a bit more progressive on that.
Speaker: Sorry, Michael, I cut you off there.
Speaker: No, I think I was about to say similar about how Singapore is supporting it, but I think what we're also seeing in a sustainability effort from countries is that they're also driving to have more local content, creating the impact to support the SMEs to actually deliver the final products that are to be erected or produced in certain countries.
Speaker: So I think also the governments are right now collaborating and trying to understand with the inability for people to
Speaker: physically move across borders and even though we are able to work from home how can we go and support actually the smes and also corporates to to develop it in the countries with the talent available so i see that there's a lot of support for the countries to support this meet not just in singapore but also india australia thailand so i think there's a there's a lot of good efforts putting in by all the countries to make sure we get through this well as humanity
Speaker: Yeah, thanks, thanks, thanks, Michael.
Speaker: Thanks, thanks, Nick.
Speaker: A huge thank you to my to my panel today.
Speaker: And thank you also to you, the audience, for joining today's discussion.
Speaker: I hope you found it as insightful and interesting as I did.
Speaker: So thank you, everybody.
Speaker: Thank you for listening today.
Speaker: This has been HSBC Global Viewpoint Banking and Markets.
Speaker: For more information about anything you heard in this podcast or to learn about HSBC's global services and offerings, please visit gbm.hsbc.com.
