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Season Five, Don't Hike Alone, Part Two: The Trails to Follow
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In today’s episode, we are continuing a deep dive into and about a notorious serial killer with a stutter from the late 1970s.
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Transcript
Content Warning
00:00:00
Speaker
This podcast may contain disturbing content for some listeners. It's intended for mature audiences. Listener discretion is advised.
Early Life and Escalation of Crimes
00:00:39
Speaker
So where we left off in the last episode was David Carpenter had committed this bizarre series of crimes. He slips by being on California's sex offender registry because of this being let out of a federal prison into a federal halfway house situation. you know It wasn't like he didn't get sentence for anything by California, he just doesn't get on the sex offender list. And he's going to be moving back in in September of 1979 with his elderly parents, who by all all accounts were pretty instrumental in abusing him. But he discovered that in order to stay out of prison, he wasn't going to take the normal path of not committing crimes because he can't control himself. So
00:01:30
Speaker
What he does instead is he escalates to starting to kill the witnesses of his crimes, the victims. Now, if you go find a short form article about him, at this point, you're going to discover a bunch of names because there are a bunch of names related to this case. But by all accounts, it's believed that his Sierra Club involvement led him into local parks and specifically to Mount Tam. This is actually a big part of Robert Grace Smith's book. He talks about the sleeping lady. He talks about, it's it's a little bit of a hard read because it kind of bounces all over the place. It's a good read, but it it definitely is a little strange. Mount Tam is a place called Mount Tamapayas.
00:02:26
Speaker
people say Mount Tam because it's hard to pronounce that. isn't It's a park in Marin County, California. This is going to be the start of David Carpenter continuing to commit these type crimes, but not go to prison for him.
Mount Tam Murders and Investigation
00:02:41
Speaker
Right before he moves in with his parents on August 19th of 1979, he's 49 years old, a woman named Etta Kane is found murdered. She is found shot and naked except for a sock in Mount Tam State Park. You can find more information about Etta Kane's murder online. She is not an official conviction for David Carpenter. The way this goes down, and this one can be credited to Katherine Ramsland. People share this online. it's ah it's a
00:03:20
Speaker
a post about as kind of specifically her murder. Etta Kane went out on August 19th. She was hiking at the foot of Mount Tam or the Sleeping Lady Park. This area overlooked San Francisco's Golden Gate Bridge. She was 44 years old. She was a married bank executive and she was athletic. On this day, she didn't have anybody to go out with her. So she went out alone and to get a hike in, but she didn't return home. So her husband got worried, he called the police, and believing that she was in trouble, the police sent out a search team. ah They were mainly worried at that point that she had fallen or otherwise become ah incapacitated in the course of her walk or hike.
00:04:10
Speaker
They found her car in the parking lot, and it was fine. There was nothing wrong with it. But they failed to locate her that night. But the next day, they found her nude body. She'd been attacked from behind, and she had a bullet wound in the back of her skull from what is described as a .44 caliber weapon. I have also heard someone say it was .40, a .40 caliber. But I, Catherine Ramblin, seems to be a better source on this. She says that from the autopsy report that she reviewed, there was a .44 caliber gunshot wound to the back of Eddy's head. The police believed that from her position that she'd been forced to basically get down on her knees and potentially beg for her life. The killer had taken $10 from her wallet
00:05:04
Speaker
and had taken a couple of credit cards and her glasses, but had left her jewelry behind. This is thought to be the first killing of on Mount Tam, and it's it's the first killing of what San Francisco police and Marin County police are going to call a trail side killer.
00:05:26
Speaker
Witnesses had described a couple of people on the trail that day. The composites that we have over the course of this case don't always point right to David Carpenter. And in this case, there are a couple of descriptions that are given. One is of a blonde man who was acting strangely, and the other is of a man who was wearing a dark blue jacket and apparently he was sweating because this is August. People had estimated that he was about 35 years old and he'd been hiding his face. So there's no sexual assault in this particular attack. There's a pretty good section of this in Mindhunter, which is a John Douglas book, and there's a section on this in The Sleeping Lady.
00:06:15
Speaker
Etta Kane's murder is at the time an isolated unsolved homicide. There's a little bit of speculation that it could be someone close to her. I don't think that ever really goes anywhere over the course of what I've read, but it's sort of a sign of things to come because just a few months later, if everything we have here is correct. David Carpenter gets a job working for a key chain distributor. It was geared towards the tourism industry. And i he was a salesperson. Basically, it was all the places around, I would assume, like San Francisco.
00:07:04
Speaker
they would have their own key chain to me. Oh, yeah. like it's so so like the little They have a generic one or they have one with their logo, right? like Yeah. like it bridge ones right And so these are like trinket souvenir type things. And it wasn't completely medial, but I mean, yeah, it's it's selling keychains. I know that he had some, I believe the Sleeping Lady book sort of talks about him having some potential ideas that might have propelled his career a little bit, ah some ideas for keychains he wanted to sell. But yeah, for the most part, it's that type of stuff. Because you know, ah san San Francisco, the Bay Area, the Golden Gate Bridge, all that stuff is right there, and it's a huge tourist attraction. that's in
00:07:52
Speaker
ah February of 1980, he starts working for this keychain distributor. And then on Saturday, March 8th of 1980, there's another murder. This murder is another violent incident. It's different than the murder of Etta Kane. Barbara Schwartz is 23 years old. She was hiking with her dog on the 8th. By all accounts that I've found, she's a baker who's doing very well at her job um and this is her way to to get away and to enjoy herself. What's interesting about her case is there's a really close eyewitness. Another female hiker was able to see what was happening to Barbara through the woods and she sees a thin athletic man who seems to be about 25 years old by her guesstimate approaching Barbara
00:08:48
Speaker
and Barbara's dog, Barky. She describes him as having dark hair and a hawk-like nose and wearing hiking boots. As she's watching, the man suddenly begins to stab Barbara with a knife. So for nearly a minute, she watches these two people that she doesn't know, one of which is Barbara, and this man she later describes, struggle and him continue to stab her. Barbara falls to the ground and the man runs away. The witness goes for help. So this crime scene doesn't sit for very long and it has a witness. Police are able to put several things together here. And the first thing that happens is they find a set of glasses that have a really strange prescription. The witness's description in hindsight is one of those things I was talking about with the different composites.
00:09:45
Speaker
It's a weird one and she describes the guys having long black hair, but you said something and I wanted to clarify this before I get into the rest of this crime. Did you say that this was because they did a regression with her hypnosis? One of the sources that I have absorbed to cover this case indicated that her composite, now I don't know about the description, okay? I don't know if she gave, I mean, it seems like she would have given the description immediately, right? But the composite that came from her account and another person's account from Barbara's murder,
00:10:23
Speaker
It was done after she was subjected to hypnosis. I think it's this one. I've seen them. This is the one with the guy that looks like, I don't know, he looks like a villain out of a Harry Potter book or maybe Patrick Bateman. He doesn't look anything like David Carpenter for sure. No, he does not. And I was thinking maybe he had on a hat at the bargain or something. that could That could have been that. because of the long black hair thing. The other thing was like hypnosis, it's a weird tool to stimulate, especially for a composite, right? Although I could imagine a the witness wanting to be as helpful as possible and willing to do that and not realizing how,
00:11:14
Speaker
if indeed she was incorrect in remembering how much that would skew everything, right? Yeah. On the other hand, um up until I found out she had given the details that made the composite drawing under hypnosis, I was thinking that it was absurd that they had disregarded her ah composite because it didn't fit the person that they had found eventually, right? Because you can't I don't see how it could be both ways, right? Now, the hypnosis part about it, I mean, I don't have definitive information on that. I just know that that made a little bit of sense to me, but essentially,
00:12:00
Speaker
you know We've talked about eyewitness testimony, how unreliable it is. And the other part of that was this the case had gone very cold and they were not getting any new leads. At the point in time, they came up with this the very first composite, right? Yes. And so that would influence the situation as well. I just, I have trouble when the composite in no way could have ever been mistaken for David Carpenter, right? like yeah Not at all. Like, not age. He has hair. Right. Just completely not him, right? And so because of that,
00:12:41
Speaker
when they said oh yeah the the witness was just mistaken so that composite was just wrong. I feel like that's a really weird thing to say because I mean it is um don't get me wrong it is possible the composite is wrong it's just like why were you going off that to begin with, right? It just, it it it just perked my ears up a little bit as far as like, wait, what's happening here? And then when I heard that it was the result of desperation, right, is essentially what I heard being said amongst all the sources that were talking about it, they had gotten to a point where they had the very first murder
00:13:22
Speaker
happening in that county on Mount Tam, right? That was Etta. And then they've got the second murder with this eyewitness, right? And they had looked into the cases and like, this was a big deal, right? um Now they were killed in different ways, but once the, um you know, you've mentioned the glasses that were a unique prescription. and They had sent that out hoping for a lead. It didn't generate anything, right? They had done all the stuff that they knew to do trying to generate leads and then they were out of leads and then for whatever reason they came up with this composite who That's who they were looking for until they weren't Yeah, it's it's actually very confusing to look at it. And that's not any this is not a situation where it's the fault or the ineptitude of the investigators It's a confusing situation I feel like you can't have it both ways. Like it's really hard for me to, without something else being put out there, which it's entirely possible that witness was just wrong, right? Yeah. But he, she shouldn't have been just wrong because it didn't fit the suspect they found. Right. And so, okay. She's looking at this situation. The witness in this case has just seen something traumatic.
00:14:47
Speaker
They do have other descriptions that day. And those other descriptions are of a guy that's wearing glasses who looks like he's in his 40s wearing a raincoat. And they point out the fact that like it's not raining. Now, it's not that they completely dismiss either one of them, but they do focus in because this woman had seen it happen. And they sort of missed the forest for the trees. The, go ahead. I wish they had declared that before he didn't match the suspect. Yeah, yeah, this turns out to be a major issue down the road. Well, and and he's not convicted of these murders, right? No, he's not convicted of either of these two murders. Which is kind of why I just sort of let it go. But at the same time, um he is, it they are,
00:15:38
Speaker
He's not convicted, but by, if you ask anybody, he is responsible for these murders. Yeah. And, uh, the glasses, well, we'll get back to them in a second. Um, so the autopsy report shows that Barbara Schwartz had about 12 separate wounds in her chest and that they, the pathologists believe they were looking for an eight to 12 inch sharp knife. Near the crime scene, a few days after this attack, some kids come across a filet knife. They call it a boning knife in one of the documentaries, and somebody else mentioned it as a boning knife. It looked like a fish filet knife to me, like a long kitchen tool. It's covered in blood. The kids tell the police.
00:16:27
Speaker
And a local reporter is there filming B-roll and decides to film the discovery of this knife and then reaches down and picks up the knife. So any fingerprints that might've been on it in the blood are wrecked, even though these kids knew not to mess with the crime scene, the reporter apparently did not. So this knife turns out to be kind of a bad lead. It's available everywhere. um There's no way to track it. And now they can't use it for fingerprints. The one thing about the glasses that turns out to be interesting is that the they're bifocals that are prison issued. So that gives investigators a lead to check on recently released convicts. They focus in on people who would be on the sex offender registry. They specifically focus on people who resemble that sketch that you had a problem with.
00:17:21
Speaker
Well, and so this brings up another point, because this is some really good like evidentiary material here, right? Yeah. I mean, this is a huge thing that got them absolutely nowhere. Yeah, it didn't. it just it The pieces did not fall in the right order. Doesn't that? To me, it's so strange, because even on like some of the sources you've given, like they talk about how this is like this monumental piece of evidence for this crime scene, right? And I'm like, is it really, though? Because you got nowhere with that. Yeah. Well, but we have this situation where the police actually questioned David
Patterns and Evidence Challenges
00:18:00
Speaker
Carpenter that night. Did you pick up on that through all of this? The night of Barbara's ah bar's murder? Yeah. Well, they questioned him at a medical center because he says that he's thwarted a robbery at a convenience store, which has landed him in the emergency room
00:18:18
Speaker
first stitches Yeah. So his switching from a 44 Magnum handgun, which is what it was alleged that he used on at a can to a knife came with a problem and he injured himself. Right. Which like, I presume that that is, that these are facts. I haven't seen the police report, right? I haven't seen the report, but it is, uh, it is brought up in all of the sources at this point. So I will go with this. If somebody got this one wrong, I'll, I'll just eat it. I bought it that they talked to him. Right. And so another thing that stood out to me was I do, I know that gunshot wounds have to be reported. Um, anytime somebody shot by a gun, even if you say that you shot yourself,
00:19:06
Speaker
it's reported. I've never heard that about knife wounds. So that's, that's a part that get wrong. That's not what the doctor seems to have been under any obligation to report there. It was because it was connected with a crime. Correct. It was, it was the crime and so it didn't happen. Right. But the police, I mean, they show as much interest in it as, you know, they show up and make the report and that's it. Yeah, it's not in the same jurisdiction. The Marin County reports are not in place. They've only put out an all points bulletin. And to be honest, it would have had the other guy's description on it. So it doesn't matter. I mean, I don't think they had that description at that point, but her first description is still tied to that in a way they might not have ever picked up on it to begin with. So I don't think this is like incompetence here.
00:19:56
Speaker
But here's the thing, though. He's not convicted for Barbara's murder, okay? If he did, in fact, go to a hospital or a medical center that same day and he was treated for a knife wound and gave a BS story, okay? It is circumstantial, but it's some pretty damning circumstantial evidence. Yeah, it is. And so because he's not convicted, I think that, you know, we've got to look at that. I mean, really the one day that he thwarted a robbery that someone had, people don't do robberies with knives to normally, right? Anyway, it doesn't really matter. But I'm just saying like, to me, that is very telling. It is telling. I i have seen a number of robberies that are that have knives attached to them. It usually doesn't and end up involved. You know, it's weird. It's one of those things where
00:20:54
Speaker
It usually doesn't involve stab wounds until it does. And a situation like this could potentially cause that. But the cops, you know, aren't really going to put this back to Barbara. But, you know, David Carpenter is like stuttering to get the guy to stop. OK, that's just me. But I follow you. I don't find it believable. I don't find his account of it believable, but he did go like 30 minutes away from, you know, where but but Barbara had been killed, right? You're just saying that David Carpenter stopping any kind of anything is probably unlikely, right? and Not just probably. It didn't happen. Well, I, okay. I would say on the other side of this, clearly he has shot someone at this point, we think.
00:21:42
Speaker
We know he's assaulted multiple people, including with a hammer. And we also know that he shot at a cop who shot it back. Right. But those were all like power moves for him. We're talking about a situation where he's saying, he are are you saying you believe that he took a knife from somebody that was trying to rob a convenience store? I think he stabbed himself in the hand while he was stabbing Barbara Schwartz. Right, and so if there's legitimately paperwork to back that up. You think that's enough for the conviction, or at least to move forward. I think that that that's some pretty strong evidence. And because of the difference in the the way that Etta and Barbara were killed, going into what he actually gets convicted for, I feel like this is relevant evidence here. Oh, 100%. Yeah, if those records exist, they would be strong.
00:22:34
Speaker
I will say this is one of the weirdest things I've read. It's tied to that. The cops don't check the convenience stores in the area to see if anything like this had happened. I don't blame them. The description that finally comes out with the composite really doesn't match them. So that's not going to help. But the next day he goes to an optometrist to get his glasses. One of these things that I listened to is either on a podcast I listened to about him, Once upon a crime had an episode on him or two, the very scary people had him. They said that he was kind of irate about these glasses and that he really needed them to see. Weirdly, the doctor he went to see that he berated about this whole thing was Barbara Schwartz's eye doctor.
00:23:20
Speaker
Right, and so if David Carpenter legitimately had that prescription refilled, then, you know, very close to when this happened, because he had lost his glasses and he couldn't see without them, and they were the same prescription of the glasses that were found, right? Yeah. um Again, very strong evidence. Yeah, it is strong evidence. And it is circumstantial. But to me, like this is getting to where you need to be, right? Yeah, I mean, he so these are like, for people who don't know what I mean next, birth control glasses is what he's wearing. um That is when you go into the military or you go into prison, you get a very generic frame that all look basically the same. They're large, black, heavy frames. And ah sometimes they're half frames, sometimes they're full frames.
00:24:11
Speaker
especially if you have like a, this is ah probably not that way anymore, but it was that way. You get these, you know, especially when you have these big thick lenses, it's the only type frame that can hold these big bifocal lenses. It probably was not issued that often, but I seriously doubt they kept a good record of it. Well, and that was something that surprised me actually was that they had no way to see like who in the prison system had been issued that prescription. Yeah. And I was like, well, that could be telling like something you should probably look into. Yeah, it it really should be. But, you know, it in theory, whomever it was, right, they were spotted in the midst of killing this woman and they lost their glasses and didn't feel like they could take the time to find them. Right. Yeah.
00:25:03
Speaker
Yeah, so next up, what happens is he lays low for a number of months. he He's had like space between his crimes when he's out of prison long enough to do crime. This experience with losing his classes and stabbing Barbara Schwartz, where he also, because this is an important thing, it's a terrible thing to say, but he didn't rape Etta and he didn't rape Barbara. So whatever is going on with him where he is a rapist, because that is the main thing that David Carpenter is. He's a rapist. It's getting worse. I think it's more specifically getting him to be a murderer, because he's decided he doesn't want to go back to prison, but he needs to continue his raping. Yeah, he has to figure out his raping.
00:26:03
Speaker
And we're coming up on crimes that he is going to be caught and convicted for. The next thing that happens, depending on where you read, could be out of order. So we have on his profile that on October the 11th of 1980, a guy named Rick Stowers and a woman named Cindy Moreland, they disappear.
00:26:30
Speaker
They are at Point Reyes National Seashore Park. So this is a couple. In terms of howus like how the profile spills out for David Carpenter, we actually moved to a different person. So Rick Stowers and Cindy Moreland, they disappeared. October the 15th 1990 so four days later a Peace Corps volunteer name or a former Peace Corps volunteer. I don't you say that a person who had been in the Peace Corps Disappears and this is an elder son. Is that how you say that name? Yes, so this is an elder son She was seen by people on ah October 15th at the end of this is Columbus Day weekend
00:27:28
Speaker
And this is back on Mount Tam. Yeah, she's at Mount Tam and she was sitting alone in the amphitheater there watching the sunset. A part caretaker recalls later on in multiple sources. I think he's in the Grace Smith book. He's with Catherine Ramsland and he recounted in a couple of different ways. He considers going to say something to her about not hiking after dusk and not being alone out there. But he decides that she seems peaceful and he moves on from her, doesn't say anything. According to Robert Graysmith, earlier that day, same guy that was going to warn her had seen a man by himself in the area that he thought was around 50 years old, who was just standing around. Now, John Douglas says in Mindhunter, in his little recounting of
00:28:28
Speaker
David Carpenter, that there are at least two other people that saw Anne and they said that she was in the area where Etta Kane had been killed the previous year. Anne is a new type of victim for us. After she disappears, she is found and she's been shot through the right side of her head. Her earring is missing from that side. And her body has been propped face up against a rock, like looking out. This is similar to Etta Kane's position, but it's the it's kind of like if Etta Kane had been able to roll, it would look like this. But the idea was the police believed it was possible and had been forced to kneel down before she was shot. Now she had been hit with a .38 caliber
00:29:28
Speaker
bullet as opposed to a .44 caliber bullet. And at autopsy, the pathologist discovered that even though she's fully dressed, she had been raped. So he has, by this point, at October 1980, moved back to being that rapist. She was found relatively quickly. So the couple goes missing, then she is missing and found, and then the other, the two girls go missing and they find the couple. After Anne Alderson is found, there's a kind of a lull in activity. But on November 28th, a woman named Shawna May is supposed to meet her friends at Reyes National Seashore Park. They're all going to go hiking. This park is a couple of miles north of San Francisco.
00:30:25
Speaker
When her friends go up and they can't find, they can't find Shauna, they notify the park rangers and a search is put together around the same time. So Shauna May is missing on Friday. Another young woman named Diane O'Connell, who's 23 years old, she had gone missing while she was out hiking with her friends. So it gets alarming when Diana O'Connell and Shawna May are both missing, having been supposed to meet up with their friends. And authorities get worried about that. The the authorities expand this search. What's strange is, while they're looking for Shawna May and Diana O'Connell, they come across Richard Sowers and Cynthia Moreland. Richard Sowers and Cynthia Moreland had been and engaged to be married. They had gone on a hike.
00:31:18
Speaker
in mid-October. This is now Thanksgiving. Rick had been declared AWOL from the Coast Guard and no one had really been looking for them. but So now we're in the holiday time where basically Thanksgiving's just happened and we find Richard and we find Cynthia. They had both been shot in the head. And if I recall correctly, Cynthia had been rape. They're found in shallow graves. So it confuses authorities that they went in looking for Diana and for Shauna, and they have now found Richard and Cynthia. But shortly thereafter, they find the bodies of the other two that they were looking for. Somehow, these two women who went missing separately from separate friends groups are laying side by side sort of in a trench covered up.
00:32:16
Speaker
Shawna May has been shot three times in the head, and she has been garroted with picture frame wire that you would hang picture frames with. This is on November 30th of 1980, by
Carpenter's Relationships and Arrest
00:32:30
Speaker
the way. She was determined at autopsies who had been raped. With ah Diane O'Connell, her friends did not even know that she had been missing. The idea was that Shawna May was being assaulted and Diana Connell walked up and then the killer had basically turned it into a dual assault because either she stepped either she accidentally ran into them or she tried to do something about it and
00:33:13
Speaker
they So Diana was found with her panties stuffed in her mouth. Their clothing was all piled on top of their hiking gear. And she had been strangled and raped as well. So the police go with this assumption that the killer had basically been raping one and the other one come along at the wrong time. And as a witness, had to be put away with as well. The investigation indicates that these two did not know each other, and I have not seen anything that contradicted them. Have you? They did not know one another. A hiker that had been in the area that afternoon, when interviewed by park rangers, said that they had heard four gunshots at basically the same time. So you've got, that's a lot. Like, no matter how you shake this,
00:34:08
Speaker
You have four bodies being found on the search for these two missing girls and nobody had like real, nobody had really been searching for these others. You've been missing for six weeks. That is a lot to happen all at one time. Yes. It's unbelievable. In fact, when they found the couple, it was immediately apparent that it wasn't the two girls that had just gone missing because they were so decomposed. Right. And, you know, it's sort of like, you know, you're in like some sort of we surreal twilight zone, right? Like how is it possible that, you know, there's two girls missing much less. We find two bodies that aren't related to the two girls missing while we're looking for them. Yep. It was completely insane. Yeah. So they put together more composites from this information, but this is where we get our best piece of evidence that's going to lead to a conviction in this case.
00:35:02
Speaker
The best piece of evidence here is that the ballistics start to match. So these are, I believe these are all .38 caliber bullets, and it matches all the way back through. I know it matches, so Richard, Cynthia, Diana, and Shawna match, and Alderson matches. Is that the five that match? That's cracked. So at this point in time, the park officials and local law enforcement tell people that they need to not hike and they start putting up signs about do not hike in this area because it's, I don't even know how to explain how crazy it is that all of this is going on. But if this person has truly taken all these people randomly,
00:36:00
Speaker
authorities want to limit the options. So we have about a four-week lull. And at the end of that four-week lull on December 28th of 1980, another young woman disappears. So on December 28th of 1980, Anna Kelly Minivar disappears, and she's not going to be found for ah about seven months. David is at home living with his parents and he meets a young lady in January of 1981. How would you describe this young lady? Are we talking about Gandy? I would describe her as um friendly and compliant, which probably saved her life.
00:37:00
Speaker
Yeah. um I believe there's a strong chance that Candy might have ended up being a victim of David Carpenter, except he decided to make her a girlfriend and move her in with his parents. So on January 21st, 1981, Candy Dawn Townshend, Candace Townshend, also known as Candy, moves in with David Carpenter and his elderly abusive parents shortly after this in February of anyone David Carpenter has to get another job and he ends up working at econo quick. Okay, so we have Anna Kelly men of ours she disappears right after Christmas and Then we've got candy moving in we've got a
00:37:52
Speaker
David Carpenter starting to work at the Econo Quick Print. And then on March 29th of 1981, when David Carpenter is 50 years old, we have what I consider to be his undoing to some degree. I think the best summary of this is from the great outdoors. David Carpenter with this new job that he has kind of limited to weekends and to holidays. Now this is brought up as a much bigger deal in some of the media that you'll hear about them than it actually is. This is convenience paid. But on March 29th of 1981, David Carpenter goes to Henry Cowell Redwood State Park. There's a couple hiking there named Ellen Hanson and Steven Hartle. This is in the Santa Cruz Mountains. They are on spring break from UC Davis.
00:38:47
Speaker
And as they're hiking up in the trail, they get past the observation tower when they run into you David Carpenter. David Carpenter flat out says to them that he's going to rape Ellen. And Stephen says, no, you're not. And tries to figure out like what to do there and intervenes. And David Carpenter just opens fire.
00:39:18
Speaker
He ends up killing Ellen Hanson, but Stephen Hartle, despite being shot, is able to survive. Not only does he survive, he gives a clear description of Ellen's murder. He picks David Carpenter out of a police lineup, and multiple witnesses are able to point out different things about David Carpenter and David Carpenter's car. One of the cars he had at the time was a red Fiat. All these people are going to come back up and be very important a little later. In April of 1981, so this happens into March, April of 1981, Candy Townsend, she moves out. Specifically, she moves out on April the 30th. On
00:40:10
Speaker
May the 2nd, Carpenter makes his next series of terrible mistakes. One of his coworkers at the Akano Quick Print that he'd been working at since February has trouble with her car. And he says to her that he can help her find a car. Now, the office has already pegged this 50-year-old guy as a creep. Heather Skaggs is 20 years old, She doesn't pay attention to what the people in the office are saying, but she has a good relationship with her boyfriend and he does want to she does wanna take advantage of Carpenter's offer to help her find a car. He says one of his friends has a car and they can go down to Santa Cruz and purchase this car. She writes down all the dated Carpenter's information, including a phone number and his address, but agrees to go with him.
00:41:09
Speaker
to check out this vehicle. And Carpenter even ah offers to loan her money to buy the car. And Heather Skaggs disappears. It turns out that there are a number of things other than just the information that was left behind that are going to tie dated Carpenter to the disappearance of Heather Skaggs. Now the story that is told is basically that he says ah along the way, they have to stop and look for this flower. And when he did that, he took her into Big Basin State Park and he sexually assaults her.
00:42:03
Speaker
he then shot her in the face with a .38 caliber handgun. This .38 caliber handgun is also gonna be linked to Ellen Hanson. And it's gonna be important a little later on. When they confront David Carpenter about his connection to Heather Skaggs, they being the police, and the fact that his information was left behind with her boyfriend, and that they knew each other, One of the officers observes that there are green Kleenex in his red Fiat. And that was something that the police had been told by Heather's mother that she frequently had green Kleenex as with like tissues with her. There's a lot that kind of unfolds in the different media you can consume on this case kind of around Heather Skaggs disappearance ultimately between
00:43:00
Speaker
killing Ellen Hanson and her boyfriend surviving and the disappearance of Heather Skaggs being tied back to him, the cops are able to put together a pretty good case that David Carpenter is linked to all of this. At first, they don't have the handgun, but that's going to come up here in a minute.
00:43:25
Speaker
They go ahead and decide they have enough to put him away and arrest David Carpenter on May 15th, 1981, when Heather Skaggs is still a missing person. Her body ends up being found in a little shallow trench with brush covering and big bags on Redwood State Park on May 24th of 1981. When they talk to him, and arrest him. They're not sure how much of this he's gonna be responsible for, but Stephen Hartle, according to this profile, pretty much immediately fingers David Carpenter. And then on June the 16th, Anna Kelly Minavar's remains are found in Castle Rock State Park. By July 31st of 1981, the total charges against David Carpenter are revealed
00:44:24
Speaker
to be five counts of murder, rape, and attempted rape, all in Santa Cruz County. So when he's actually like going on trial for this, weirdly, he is going on trial for the the murder separately. What they're hitting him with with these five counts is Richard Stowers, Cynthia Moreland, Shawna May, Diane O'Connell, and then Ann Eldersun.
00:44:58
Speaker
Although she's, no, Ann is Marin County. Huh, how did they do that then? Well, Ann was the only one um that he is charged with on Mount Tam. Oh, so she is the only in Mount Tam. Okay, so Ann is the only Marin County charged there. And then they do Santa Cruz separately. Yeah. So they end up hitting him with Ellen Hanson, um, and the attempted charges, uh, against, I guess that's going to be attempted murder with Steven Hartle. So they hit him for Richard Stout. At first they hit him for Richard Stout, Cynthia Moreland, Shawna May and Diane O'Connell. And then Ellen Hanson and Heather Skaggs.
00:45:49
Speaker
They and end up bringing charges for Ann Alderson as well. So it is separate then? Yeah, they they do all of this kind of separately. And I think the best way to approach this next part is to go over like how crazy ah the trial portion of this is. I'm trying not to drag him out into too many episodes, but I have several more things to talk about with him. I think where we'll pick up is like with his trial. I think the best way to end this is to point out that all of this happens in 1981. David Carpenter is not going to go on trial until 1984 when they
00:46:34
Speaker
peel all of this apart and take a look at whether or not he's actually the trailside killer. He maintains his innocence throughout all of this. Have you heard him talk, by the way? Have you heard some of the stutter? Yes, I have. And he is a very, very interesting murderer.
00:47:01
Speaker
He's very pathetic. That's what I was going to say. Like, I cannot imagine a more... Like, you talk about loser murders. This guy's a loser. Yeah, he is sort of the king of the losers in all of this. it's it's He is one of the most pathetic excuses of a human being that I've ever seen. Yeah. So, he's...
Conclusion and Next Episode Preview
00:47:30
Speaker
Next week, we're going to talk about the trial and what happened there. And we're going to talk about some murders that he suspected of. And we're going to close out his profile. And then we'll have so we'll have that episode. And there's going to be another episode beyond that where we're going to talk about why he still has sort of an asterisk next to the total number of murders he is thought to have committed.
00:47:57
Speaker
Thank you so much for listening today. We'll see you next time.
00:48:28
Speaker
All right, so I'm gonna tell you guys a a few things about some of the folks who are helping sponsor our show.
Sponsor Messages
00:48:35
Speaker
Now, Labradi Creations sponsors our show, and you can always use the the crime excess code there. um You can also just message them at Labradi Creations, and they will generally do something for the people who come from true crime excess. They were our very first sponsor. They've done a lot for the show, and that code is crime excess at labradicreations.com.
00:49:01
Speaker
The first new advertisers that we have, and i've I've selected all of these guys, I've selected all of these advertisers. So the very first one is Cure. Now, I'm gonna tell you guys about this, about Cure as being one of our sponsors.
00:49:18
Speaker
If you're an athlete, you know that proper hydration is key to peak performance, but plain water can be boring and sports drinks can be filled with artificial ingredients and added sugars. That's why we love cure. It's a clean and effective way to stay hydrated and perform at your best. I use it late in the day when I switch out of caffeine mode. Specifically, when I hit the pool or I go play tennis with my wife, I use cure to help me stay hydrated. It helps me recover after a long day. Now, you guys may not know this, but I built it. Right now, I've been building several structures on our property out here. Among those is a new podcast studio space for myself. I do a lot of that work at night and into the wee hours, and I always have some cure with me to go into my aluminum water bottle. Hydration is not just about filling up my aluminum bottle with water.
00:50:13
Speaker
Cure hydration is an oral rehydration solution that contains the perfect balance of electrolytes and glucose to help your body absorb water and rehydrate quickly. Whether I'm building things or or're putting the podcast together or chasing these dogs that you sometimes hear in my studio up and down the trails to get them worn out. Cure hydration is the way that I choose to go. Cure hydration is an oral rehydration solution or an ORS that contains the perfect balance of electrolytes and glucose to help your body absorb water and to rehydrate quickly.
00:50:48
Speaker
The formula is made with all natural ingredients like coconut water, powder, and pink Himalayan salt. It's free from artificial flavors, from sweeteners, and preservatives. Pure hydration is vegan, gluten-free, and non-GMO, making it a great option for anyone with dietary restrictions or preferences. The packets are convenient and easy to use. ah You just mix them with your water and you drink. They're perfect for on the go. They're perfect for travel. and Anytime you need a quick and effective hydration boost, ready to combat dehydration, then you try cure today and feel the difference for yourself. You can use code TRUECRIMEXS for 20% off your order. That's T-R-U-E-C-R-I-M-E-X-S. I have a link that I'm putting in the most recent episode show notes and TRUECRIMEXS will get you 20% off.
00:51:43
Speaker
Our second sponsor for the show today is Laird. Now, Laird has a list of things that they want me to tell you about. They have better ingredients with amazing taste and functional benefits. They have a superfood creamer crafted from the highest quality, all natural, real food ingredients. All Laird products are sustainably sourced and thoroughly tested to ensure that you're incorporating the cleanest, finest fuel into your routine. They have all natural whole food ingredients, and they contain naturally occurring MCTs made from coconut oil. There's no artificial flavors, there's no colors or additives, and there's no sugar from highly refined corn syrup. They want me to talk about my love of coffee, but the truth is, I don't do much with coffee. But let me tell you someone who does. My wife has to have a cup of coffee every day.
00:52:33
Speaker
Now, I've fallen off recently, but one of the big things that I've done since the beginning of our relationship is she used to go and get a Starbucks every morning. I have substituted that out by always trying to make her coffee. It's not going to be every single day of time from when I met her, but for the most part, almost every day, I make her coffee. I put her creamers together and I make sure that she has a good way to start her day. So with Laird, he started experimenting with his morning ritual almost two decades ago. He found that when he started adding fats to his morning cup, like coconut oil, he had amazing energy throughout the rest of his day. He gradually perfected this recipe for an epic cup of fuel. And he began sharing it with his friends in the surf community. I'm an ocean guy, so I saw this item and I was like, okay, we're gonna try this one out.
00:53:30
Speaker
Are you ready to feel more energized? more focused and supported. Go to layeredsuperfood.com and add nourishing plant-based foods to fuel you from sunrise to sunset. And you can use our promo code at checkout to save 15% off your purchase today. Our offer code for this for Laird is going to be truecrimexs. Pretty much everywhere except for Labardic Creations, if you use truecrimexs, that will get you
00:54:02
Speaker
At Laird, they'll get you 15% off. At some of the other places, they'll get you 20%. And the last sponsor I want to tell you about is Zencaster. We're part of Zencaster's creative network. We've been using Zencaster since about midway into our first season. Meg and I experimented with a lot of different ways to put the podcast together. And the truth is Zencaster, an integral ingredient to us being able to bring you this show. It's so easy. It's now super easy. You can record a podcast with Zincaster. You can log in using your browser and you start recording a high quality podcast right away. You can record studio quality sound and up to 4k video with your guests.
00:54:48
Speaker
You get to feel a sense of zen knowing that Zencaster's multi-layered backups ensure you will always have your recordings in the highest quality, even if the connection is unstable. You sound your best. I mean, if you've ever worried about what you sound like, Zencaster's post-production process makes you sound buttery smooth. It automatically removes those ums and ahs in your recordings. It removes those awkward pauses and conversation too. You can set the right podcast loudness and levels while reducing background noise with a click of a button. That's how you don't hear my dogs every ah second of every episode.
00:55:26
Speaker
ZenCaster is all in one. If you've thought about podcasting before and realized that you need a lot of different tools and services, those days are now over. With ZenCaster's all in one podcasting platform. You can create your podcast all in one place and you can distribute to Spotify, Apple and other major major destinations. Just go to zencaster.com slash pricing and use my code true crime excess. And you're going to get 30% off your first month of any ZNCaster paid plan. You can also check out the other plans they have available. I want you to have the same easy experiences that I do for all my podcasting and content needs.
00:56:06
Speaker
So zincaster.com slash pricing. The offer code is truecrimexs. And it's time for you to share your story today.
00:56:23
Speaker
ah We are also adding New Era as a sponsor for the show. New Era Cap is a headwear and apparel brand founded in 1920 in Buffalo, New York. Now, I actually have some experience with New Era caps. My dad and I have been through multiple iterations of baseball caps through the years. We collect different styles, different eras, and then my teenager has started his own cap collection and has several new eras as the centerpieces. Our favorite teams may not be the same, but our outfits are all topped with the same new era ball caps. We love the quality and the ability to wear what the players are wearing, not to mention new era is the leading headwear manufacturer with quality licensed products. You can support your favorite college or pro team in style from
00:57:11
Speaker
The official headwear provider for the MLB, NFL, and NBA, you can get a stylus accessory for your everyday ensemble and support True Crime XS. Just shop the official headwear and get 15% off when you go to NewEraCap.com. That's N-E-W-E-R-A-C-A-P dot.com slash True Crime XS. You can also use the code TRUECRIMEXS at checkout. That's it. That's all you have to do. And that's 15% off your order using the promo code TRUECRIMEXS.