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LGP 46 - Macanudo Flint Knoll No. 2
16 Plays5 days ago
This week, we will be trying out Flint Knoll Release No 2 from Macanudo!
This collaboration with Flint Knoll Wines released at the 2024 PCA, and the third and final release shipped in late 2024.
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Transcript
Introduction to 'Let's Get Pairing'
00:00:00
Speaker
Hey everybody, welcome back to Let's Get Pairing. I'm your host Tripp, as always, here in the way I don't do that part yet. Man, I got mixed up. everybody, welcome back. Alright, well, we're smoking the Flint Knoll number two this week.
00:00:16
Speaker
We'll talk about what number two means, because it doesn't mean the size like most number twos in the cigar world. um And we're to be pairing it with some appropriate pairings for the most part. So grab yourself a drink, grab yourself a cigar.
00:00:28
Speaker
Let's get pairing.
Recap of Previous Episode and Flint Knoll
00:00:51
Speaker
right, and we're back. Hey, everybody. Welcome back. This is Let's Get Pairing episode 46. Last week, Dennis was out, so we had Bear fill in, but this week, Dennis is back when we were smoking the Flint Knoll from Macanudo.
00:01:07
Speaker
We'll talk about what the cigar is, what it means, but first, i'm your host, Tripp, here from the Casa de Monte Cristo Studios in Florida, and with me, as always, is Dennis. Dennis, how doing this evening? Hey, man. I'm good, man. I'm i'm happy to be back.
00:01:20
Speaker
It's been a story. It's been a trip. No pun intended. And we'll talk about that a little bit, I think. All right. Sounds good. um Have you lit your cigar yet?
00:01:31
Speaker
I can get into it while you do so. Yeah, I'm
Exploring the Macanudo Estate Reserve
00:01:34
Speaker
lighting up right now. All right. All right, so this is the Macanudo Estate Reserve Flint Knoll No. 2 Toro that we are smoking.
00:01:43
Speaker
um So that's a long name, but it is a Macanudo cigar produced by General Cigar, as most Macanudos are, um in collaboration with Flint Knoll, which is a winery out of Napa Valley known for their Cabernet Sauvignon.
00:02:00
Speaker
And so this is a five country blend in the, when it comes to the tobacco, the most, uh, not, not necessarily the most interesting, but kind of the selling point is, ah the Connecticut broadleaf aged in French oak arrow, uh, French oak barrels, uh, that previously held Clinton all Cabernet, uh, as the binder.
00:02:26
Speaker
This has a barrel-aged binder aged in wine barrels, which is, ah you know, that makes the the collaboration seem appropriate. um So as far as the cigar, this number two because it was the second release.
00:02:40
Speaker
These were very limited. um The first release, Bear gave number one and cigar of the year to the Churchill. ah The second year, interestingly, I believe the first year, if I remember correctly, they had a Toro, a Churchill, and a Robusto.
00:02:54
Speaker
This is from the second release. um which had only a Toro and a Churchill. And then the third release only had a Churchill, which is interesting. um I haven't smoked one of the second release in a while. I remember i pretty much right after I got the second release, I found a couple of the first release, um so I was able to
Tasting Notes of Flint Knoll No. 2
00:03:17
Speaker
compare them.
00:03:17
Speaker
And I liked the first release a little bit more. I thought it punched had a little more punch to it. As I'm getting into this one, I think the extra age has helped it. What are you thinking of this thing so far? Agreed.
00:03:29
Speaker
i you know I just love the cigar, and I think very much the same feeling. There's a little bit more nuance to it, certainly from the extra age. um But again, fairly mild off the light.
00:03:42
Speaker
A lot of hay, kind of that vanilla hay sort of very light aspect to the cigar, which is kind of cool. um And again, it's just something that I don't often smoke, this kind of I'll say, type of cigar, if you will.
00:03:56
Speaker
You and I both and tend to go for more powerhouse cigars, which is, I think, a nice reprieve for both of us to transition to something a little bit different. Yeah, generally I prefer a powerhouse, but this kind of cigar I really love where it's ah it's definitely on the lighter side, but it's got a ton of complexity.
00:04:13
Speaker
There's so much going on in this cigar. There's a little bit of sweetness, a little bit of sour, but little bit of nuts, little bit of earth, little bit of, like you said,
Flavor Complexity and Pairing Discussion
00:04:21
Speaker
vanilla. There's a little bit of kind of a chocolatey coffee component.
00:04:25
Speaker
There's a little bit of that. I taste just a hint of like that barrel char kind of influence. Oh, yes. All right, so let's talk about the blend.
00:04:37
Speaker
The wrapper is Ecuadorian Connecticut Shade, which I think we could probably guess just by looking at it. As I mentioned before, the binder is Connecticut Broadleaf, which has been aged in French oak barrels that previously held a Cabernet Savion from Flint Knoll.
00:04:54
Speaker
Filler, we have an interesting mix of Brazilian Modafina, Nicaraguan from Jalapa, dominican olor and dominican peloto cabano that's six tobaccos five countries made in the uh dominican republic by general we are smoking the six by 54 toro and the uh price point on this was a at the time when this cigar first came out twenty dollars seemed like a lot for a cigar
00:05:24
Speaker
I was only like two and a half years ago,
Beer Pairing with Revolution Brewing
00:05:27
Speaker
maybe three years ago. Times have changed. Times have definitely changed since then. $20 seems almost reasonable these days. and sorry Hey, Sam and Will.
00:05:37
Speaker
Thanks for joining us, guys. um Yeah, i'm I'm into this cigar so far. I'm very curious how it's going to pair because we've pasted our pairings, but we I haven't done a side-by-side yet to see what the actual pairing experience is like.
00:05:53
Speaker
But I like the cigar so far. Like I said, kind of milder, but not quite mild, almost like mild to medium, medium minus. You want to call it that? Yeah, that's a good point. I think you prefer to call it that.
00:06:08
Speaker
There's a bit of hazelnut, too, that comes through, which is kind of nice and cool. And that sourness that you mentioned, again, I think it's sourness is not a bad thing, necessarily.
00:06:18
Speaker
lot of times you go, oh, it sucks. so it sucks It's more like when you have when you have just a little squeeze of lime on your tacos. Yeah. Right? Like, you just, that little acidity that brightens it up. um But i'm I'm really digging the kind of tons going on in this cigar.
00:06:35
Speaker
um And just nothing is overpowering. It's just a little bit of everything. I think it's time to get pairing. So let's get pairing.
00:06:44
Speaker
I did it naturally at that time.
Wine Pairing with Manos Wine
00:06:46
Speaker
Right? transition. i know I'm digging it, man. I think I've almost got this Natural.
00:06:52
Speaker
ah Sam says he's pairing a Romeo Julieta Medallias de Oro with a bourbon Negroni. Oh, yeah. i My man. Nice, man. That's awesome. Good choice. I'm going introduce my first pairing here.
00:07:06
Speaker
um as As we mentioned, we're we're featuring some appropriate pairings, but I wanted to go with one beer just to kind of put something outside of what this cigar is kind of designed for, at least what what comes to mind with this cigar.
00:07:21
Speaker
So from revolution brewing founded in a Chicago by guy named Josh death. Look at that. Oh man, this is Baphomet.
00:07:32
Speaker
i I dig it. ah It says, it says Baphomet in big letters there. I had to try this one just based on the package and because I love a Bach. So, Founded in Chicago by Josh Death. In 1995, Josh started working at Golden Prairie Brewing, ah which is no longer operating, but I think they still exist as a company.
00:07:53
Speaker
Um... Like the brewery is no longer operating. to he He just kind of wanted to learn the beer business. A few years later, after spending a few more years at that brewery, he started working at Goose Island.
00:08:07
Speaker
um And he kind of started learning from head brewer Jim Cyback, I think is how you would say his name. um And started thinking like, man, it sure would be cool to have a beer company. um So he spent...
00:08:19
Speaker
ah about 10 years trying to start a beer company and, uh, and just never quite worked out. He started, kind of started a couple attempts to open a brewery, but none of them ever really got off the ground to the point where they were actually making any beer.
00:08:34
Speaker
Um, he opened a tap room that was fairly successful in, um, in Chicago called handlebar in 2003. And then in 2010, he was finally able to open his own brewery.
00:08:47
Speaker
in Logan Square and neighborhood of Chicago. And it was after he he was just kind of in the neighborhood and saw a building for sale that was like, man, that building would be perfect for a brewery.
00:09:00
Speaker
ah So he started looking into it and it ended up working out. He enlisted George Syback, former head brewer of Goose Island, as his head brewer when he started the new company.
Revolution Brewing in Pop Culture
00:09:11
Speaker
Later on, they opened a production brewery about a mile away from their small taproom brew house in 2012. And then they ended up actually purchasing the building of that. They started the brewery in in 2022.
00:09:26
Speaker
Currently, Revolution is the largest independently owned brewer in Illinois. They're not massive. That's a big deal. But they're big enough to be the biggest in Illinois, which is pretty cool.
00:09:37
Speaker
Yeah. it As kind of a tie-in with our one for the road segment, I thought it was interesting because I've seen this film, but I never knew this. ah There's a movie called Drinking Buddies directed by Joe joe Swanberg.
00:09:51
Speaker
um Oh, yeah, man. I know this movie. you You know this movie? Okay. So so Joe Swanberg is kind of a ah an indie director, and he's he's very all over the place. He's done some horror. He's done some kind of indie drama stuff. This is kind of an indie drama comedy.
00:10:09
Speaker
starring Olivia Wilde, Jake Johnson, and Anna Kendrick. And I'm trying to remember his name. The guy from the Office Space was in it. can't remember his name. Yes.
00:10:21
Speaker
I know you're talking, Mike. I can never remember his name. But there's a whole part where some of the characters work at the brewery, and it was Revolution. They filmed that in Revolution Brewing, and it was set there as well, which is pretty cool.
00:10:35
Speaker
So this is Baphomet Bach, um It is a Bach made using traditional German ingredients. And it is all of the malts and the hops are imported from Germany.
00:10:50
Speaker
And it is lagered with German Hallertauer and Select Hops. This is a seasonal beer from Revolution that is only available January and December and is only distributed within the Chicago area.
00:11:02
Speaker
So I know I've been, you know, riding that Pavor train, but they they were able to get this, which is pretty cool for something that doesn't make it out of the Chicago area.
00:11:14
Speaker
It comes in at a very appropriate, i don't know you'll be able to read it there, 6.66 ABV. Oh, wow. Okay. That's pretty reasonable for a Bok, honestly. I think, well, in today's world, it's reasonable for a Bok.
00:11:26
Speaker
Classically, Boks have been between four and six, but yeah, yeah man. It's also a very dark Bok. like It's a little, it's almost an Imperial Bok. Looking through it, it's kind of a dark amber.
00:11:39
Speaker
You can't really see it on camera. it just looks mostly like a stout. um But it is a very dark amber kind of hue.
Cabernet Sauvignon's Impact on the Cigar
00:11:46
Speaker
um Comes in at 30 IBUs. And you can see it's got some nice little bubbles there.
00:11:51
Speaker
You got those little foamy bubbles, which we loved. ah All right. Well, take a couple sips of this and see how it pairs with a cigar that's meant to be paired with wine. Tell us what you're pairing first.
00:12:03
Speaker
Yeah, man, I've got ah i got a banger for the first one. Hell yeah. As I take a sip to to think about where the cigar is at with this wine. Let me show this bottle. It's it's pretty cool. it's I don't know it's going to come off great on camera, but nice, beautiful gold bottle.
00:12:22
Speaker
Really cool. It came in a lovely case, which is, let me let me show you the case. Here we go. Super cool case, Ouija is, and again, i as soon as I saw this, I was like, man, I need to get this.
00:12:37
Speaker
And then i I looked at the kind of the case in the container and thought, well, this is kind of cool. There's a Ouija board inside of this. And let me show you that Ouija board too.
00:12:48
Speaker
We're having a very occult-themed episode tonight on Access. It's super occult, unintentional, um but this is like this really nice leather Ouija board, printed leather. Oh, that's cool.
00:13:00
Speaker
I thought it was really snazzy and fun. There's a fun planchette that comes with it. Of course, any Ouija board needs a planchette. And so this is actually the first collaboration ever that With the the Parker Brothers, who now today in today's world own Ouija, the game, which, yes, it is a game. Originally, was meant to be a game and not a kind of an occult thing.
00:13:25
Speaker
And it was a collaboration with the monomos they Manos Wine. and I almost said brothers, but it's Manos Wine. And Models Wine was founded in 1982. sort nineteen They they pretty much took over the industry of wine, but only from the kind of the perspective of focus on the perspective of licensed wines.
00:13:47
Speaker
So they specialize in, hey, you want to do a licensed wine for whatever the brand is. They're huge with the Major League Baseball crew, and they've made a lot of custom wines for them, among others, like Major League Soccer, a couple of universities.
00:14:02
Speaker
I bet they're buying that Netflix wine that I see at the store. It might be. i was curious about that, too. and um It could possibly be that. But they have really, i think, owned the market since 1982 for these sort of specialized, licensed wines.
00:14:18
Speaker
Again, originated—it's a family name. They came out, and they they kind of wanted to do something that was, again— Eche Amano is yeah made by hand. They wanted this handmade thing.
00:14:30
Speaker
They're based out of Kansas City, Missouri, which I thought was really cool because you don't really hear about a lot of wineries out there. No. if you're If you're a huge fan of wine,
The History and Impact of Prisoner Wine
00:14:39
Speaker
you're really not thinking about necessarily Kansas City.
00:14:42
Speaker
But, again, they really nailed the market on what they were doing. And this particular wine is is really cool, again, because of that college collaboration. The Ouija set, it it's it's just been, I think...
00:14:55
Speaker
quintessential but for so many years before we even realized it. By the time that we got it, by the time that we were kids and we thought about Ouija boards, they've been around for such a long time. And the kind of the the title or the ownership of it has exchanged so many hands.
00:15:12
Speaker
This particular one is a California Cabernet Sauvignon. And i thought, you know, what better way to honor Flint Knoll than to kind of start off with the Cab Saved you know urban terminology, I would call Cab Sav.
00:15:28
Speaker
Oh, yeah. All the cool kids are doing and And I love Cabernet Sauvignon specifically because of that jammy quality to it. I wanted to to kind of embrace the the jamminess plus the tannic quality, which generally when I drink wine, I'm leaning toward Chamborson's, I'm leaning toward Cab Franc's.
00:15:48
Speaker
Something that's a little kind of meatier on the... on the tannic side of the house, especially for the first third of a cigar.
00:15:59
Speaker
Generally, I smoke fast. So for me, that first third is almost always going to be really intense. And I think these are the kind of wines that that I find really work well with my palate. Nice.
00:16:11
Speaker
um I'm finding a surprising amount of spice coming out of this cigar. Like halfway through the first third, like a lot of spice on the retrohale, more than I remember and more than I was expecting.
00:16:24
Speaker
There's a really nice white white pepper spice. Yeah, it's kind of that white pepper. At least that's what I'm getting.
00:16:31
Speaker
it's sort of got less flavor than black pepper, but more heat. That's how think of pepper. nail down. White pepper is such a thing to nail down. It's like more fragment more fragrant, but also more spicy, but less intense taste.
00:16:46
Speaker
it's like That's the way I describe white pepper. if If you're, I think the difference for me at least is if you're, the difference is smelling a black pepper versus tasting a black pepper.
00:16:58
Speaker
That's the white pepper difference. It's so much more subtle, to your point, more fragrant. it's it's It's like the essence of rather than the intensity of, which is really nice.
00:17:12
Speaker
Yeah. All right. So this Bach. delicious um it's got it's a it's definitely more bitter than you expect from a bock um like if let me take another sticker hold on
00:17:29
Speaker
this has enough enough hops that if you gave me a glass and said this is a black IPL a black india pale lager I'd be like Okay, I get that.
00:17:44
Speaker
Yeah. Like, it's just enough hoppiness that you could call it an IPA. I mean, it's not an ale, but you know what I mean. It's at that level of, like, an IPA or an IPL. But it's ah rounded out with that ah that roasty sweetness that you get from from a Bach that's just like...
00:18:02
Speaker
um it's like It's like you mixed a just a normal lager, a pilsner or something like that with a quarter.
00:18:14
Speaker
And so you're cutting that roastiness and adding a little bit more sweetness. with that Yeah. It's fantastic. And you can, you're starting to, well, you still can on camera. In real life, I can see the color now that there's, I'm down to this much in the glass.
00:18:30
Speaker
um But this is really delicious and it's really working well with this cigar. I think it kind of helped bring that pepper note out with that, that hit of bitterness that's, Like I call it IPA, but you know, when we think of most IPAs, you're looking at like 60, 80 IBUs in that range. 60 plus generally. yeah Yeah. Like 45 is the lowest you get usually for an IPA.
00:18:50
Speaker
It's still less bitter than that. um So it's not that cloying bitterness. It's just a very intense bitterness right up front. um So it's not overpowering or clashing with the cigar at all.
Pairing Experience with Prisoner Cabernet
00:19:01
Speaker
um And I think it's really helping bring out those white pepper and those sweeter flavors in the cigar for me.
00:19:08
Speaker
And I think that's part of the, I was going to say, so let me get into the cigar in a second, but, but the, I think the magic of beers like that, when people go, oh man, I love IPAs. I love cigars. I can't smoke cigars with IPAs. It's too much.
00:19:23
Speaker
If you find a beer like this, that is much lower IBU, you have that bitter element that again, to your point, it it brings out some of the flavor, but it doesn't wash out the flavor of the cigar.
00:19:35
Speaker
Yeah, it doesn't assault your palate with bitterness. Right. But it still, you know, it still scratches that itch a little bit. Right? but Yeah, man. if If you're a hophead like me, something like this might be right up your alley because it does scratch that hoppy itch um while also having just a different, more approachable um flavor that works better with paring.
00:19:59
Speaker
right. How's that wine working? I'm excited to get to my first one, man. I so we talk about bubbles. Oftentimes on the show, we focus on beer. We talk about the quality of the bubbles, the size of the bubbles, all these things, the texture and the mouthfeel.
00:20:13
Speaker
And people get stuck on that and they kind of forget that there are other things that are not beer that have texture. So, you know, scotch is a great example. We talk about those scotches that are really viscous, that have those legs on them, that coat the palate, and and that stays there. And I think Cabernet Sauvignon a really great example because that flavor hits you initially, but it also sticks to your palate for a little bit.
00:20:36
Speaker
when you go back to the cigar, it it kind of adds to the cigar a little bit. and changes the flavor. And again, that spice, right? Spice comes out, which is great. The tannic quality is almost akin to, in a sense, akin to the IBUs.
00:20:53
Speaker
And I think, ah it for me as ah as a beer drinker, mostly beer drinker, obviously scotch as well, but really when I look at IPAs, this is a kind of wine style that I really dig, or a grape that I really dig, that scratches that itch, the way you said it.
00:21:12
Speaker
Sounds good. And how's it working with the cigar? like as I think intense's going it's It's jammy. I love the spice coming out. The sweetness is still really there.
00:21:23
Speaker
And it's very much distinctly the sweetness from the cigar rather than the sweetness from the wine. And again, the wine does have a little bit of sweetness. Typically, this is is it's a very dry style, so you're not going to get much sweetness from the wine.
00:21:36
Speaker
But when you pair with a cigar, it sticks. And that stickiness on the palate opens up the sweetness from the wine. All right. I'm excited to get into my second pairing here then and see see what I think.
00:21:50
Speaker
So... ah I'll show you what I'm drinking first and then I have a little bit of story time. This is The Prisoner Cabernet Sauvignon. Oh yeah, man. I know all well.
00:22:02
Speaker
I had heard good things and wanted to try it. ah I hadn't had any of the prisoner stuff, and I figured since it was Cabernet Sauvignon cigar, I would ah try out their Cabernet.
00:22:14
Speaker
um So, little history on the prisoner. Pretty interesting. um After he completed a study abroad program in Italy, a guy named Dave Finney started kind of experimenting with winemaking in the late ninety s um He came up with a Zinfandel-based red blend that he liked a lot, just um at home kind of experimenting, and then he decided he wanted to get serious with it. So ah he went to make his first batch 2000, and he ended up with, ah there was a difficult harvest, and he basically had a hodgepodge of grapes that were all kinds of different grapes from all different
00:22:56
Speaker
ah vineyards. um And he just decided to kind of blend them together and see what would happen. And he was surprised by it. So that kind of gave him the In the year 2000, he released 385 cases of the Prisoner Red Blend from Napa Valley.
00:23:16
Speaker
The basis of the blend was an old California vineyard technique that ah kind of fell out of style at some point in the last hundred years. where you would take different grape varieties grown all together in the same fields. You would basically just toss down a bunch of grape seed and ah you know whatever kind of whatever actually been ended up growing and producing, you would just mix that together.
Introducing OZV Zinfandel
00:23:46
Speaker
And so based on that old technique, where they would ferment all the different types of grapes together, For his red blend, he sourced a bunch of different varieties of grapes from a ton of different ah vineyards in Napa Valley. So he was actually getting some of the grapes were like the Zinfandel grapes. He was getting Zinfandel grapes from multiple wineries.
00:24:12
Speaker
ah Sorry, vineyards. I keep losing that word. That word keeps like falling down the stairs in the back of my head. And then I got to run back down and get it. um So it's basically, you know, i I couldn't find any specifics, but let's say there's five different grapes or varietals of grape, and there's maybe 15 or 20 different vineyards that grew those grapes.
00:24:35
Speaker
So you're getting a collage of flavors. um The name and eventually the labels... were inspired by an 1820 Spanish sketch by franceis Francisco Goya called The Little Prisoner.
00:24:49
Speaker
Well, it translates to The Little Prisoner. um but Finney had been gifted an etching of this sketch ah by his mother at some point, and when he was trying to come up with a name and an idea for his new wine, he looked up and saw it on the wall in his office and thought, that's perfect.
00:25:06
Speaker
And it kind of... reminded him of the parallels between, the sketch and breaking the traditional winemaking rules by, doing this different blending technique.
00:25:19
Speaker
Um, after the first year or after the first release, rather the wine quickly gained popularity and acclaim due to its shift from the traditional style of Napa Valley wines, which would be, you know, this bottle contains all grapes grown on your, uh,
00:25:35
Speaker
ah in your vineyard, keep losing that word, in your vineyard and grown of the same varietal. ah That was kind of the norm in Napa Valley at the time, and he changed everything because now just about everything that comes out of Napa Valley other than a few select ah wineries are...
00:25:58
Speaker
really blends. um Even if it says Cabernet Sauvignon, there's probably something else in there a little bit just to round out the flavors the way they want. um I can't remember the word for it, but there is a first growth, is that what it is, ah where it's all the same identical, same yeah same vintage grapes.
00:26:17
Speaker
um But they really, the prisoner created the style of wine that is now available everywhere. ah In every supermarket in the world, 90% of the wine is going to be red blends. um and it's also inspired other countries. So now, you know, ah there's French red blends and Italian red blends that are more inspired by this style than the traditional blending style.
00:26:41
Speaker
All right. There's a level of sustainability, I want to also want to say. There's a level of sustainability that that ties into that, too, where you can make a red blend this season, next season, and you're really not kind of prisoner to specific...
00:26:58
Speaker
Right. Like producers. um Exactly. You're not getting your your ah raw materials from different producers. Yeah. Which and it's great because you can still produce a great product that you something that people will enjoy.
00:27:12
Speaker
And to some degree, could be a little bit more consistent than if you did a single grape, single season, if you will. Terroir issues, ah we know this from cigars, we and and again, very similarly, um grapes are very much tied into that.
00:27:30
Speaker
Some years you have a bad year. Some years you have drought. Some years you have a little bit too much water, and the grapes will grow a little bit differently, and you'll have different flavors. When you do a blend, you can kind of meld out those flavors you necessarily wouldn't want in a single grape release. You can get rid of that variance that you don't want. That's right. Where this year the the grapes are a little more sour.
00:27:50
Speaker
You can blend that out to balance it back to where you want it, which, like you were saying, goes right back to cigars. I mean, cigars do this all the time where the same tobaccos might be in the cigar, but year to year they may change producers sometimes.
00:28:03
Speaker
They may change ah consistency due to crop years. um And actually, Coop was just telling me about he went to a blending seminar about ah maintenance blending, which I would love to hear. Oh, yeah, man.
00:28:19
Speaker
In cigars, that is. um All right, back to the prisoner. By 2008, so let me just go back a little bit. In 2000, he released 385 cases.
00:28:31
Speaker
Do you want to guess how many cases he sold in 2008? Oh, man, i would I would venture to say all of them. but Yes, all 85,000. It's wild. in eight years.
00:28:45
Speaker
eighty five thousand and eight years um Obviously, with that kind of popularity, ah people were chomping at the bit, and he sold the brand for $300 million in 2008.
00:28:58
Speaker
um He has since started a new winery, Oren Swift, I believe is what it's called. It's a collaboration, isn't it? Yeah, that might be a collaboration with somebody else. um But he also does have a whiskey company, a distillery in Napa Valley, that we've had a couple of their whiskeys before, thanks to our friend Tom. um Yeah, so...
00:29:20
Speaker
you know, just making a product. You might not feel like you're changing the world at the time, but ah this this wine has has literally changed the face of the wine market, which I didn't know until I was doing my research.
00:29:34
Speaker
um All right, so I am drinking Cabernet from the prisoner the original as i mentioned before is zinfandel blend this one was first released in 2020 as a nod to the original red blend of course the cabernet is made from grapes from all over napa valley um but uses mostly cabernet savant young grapes rather than the as the base rather than zinfandel and then is also blended with merlot syrah malbec petite syrah and charbono
00:30:06
Speaker
Oh, Charbonneau is not not expected in my book, but that's cool, man. That's the only one that I don't think I've ever had a single ah single varietal wine made with. um A bottle of this is around 40-ish bucks.
00:30:21
Speaker
I think I've hit 35. 15% ABV. Yeah, I'm going to take a couple sips, see how it pairs. how many How many percent ABV? 15.
00:30:33
Speaker
fifteen Oh, 15. Okay. Sorry. I heard my my brain thought 35% AVV. Yeah, they went hard with this one. um Before you talk about your your second pairing. Yeah, man. Sam wants to know, do you exhale into your glass?
00:30:49
Speaker
Oh, good question. Actually, if I may jump on this, I used to do this all the time. um I find that I do it more with with pipe tobacco. Generally speaking, the cigars that I smoke that are generally kind of ah high power, if you will, every time I exhale into my glass and then try to enjoy it, it kind of ruins it for me.
00:31:12
Speaker
I do it too much. I think probably there's a nuance that but some people that do that can reach. For me, I've ruined it every time. but So I used to do it with cigars. I don't do with cigars anymore. I do it with pipe tobacco almost exclusively now.
00:31:27
Speaker
But, Tripp, what do you think? what do you Do you do that at all? I don't. um I have experimented with it before. yeah i find, for me, it mixes the flavors a little too much.
00:31:38
Speaker
just being in the room or being near me while I'm smoking, the and beverage is going to absorb a little bit of that smoke flavor. Yeah. um And I feel like blowing the smoke into the glass kind of overdoes it sometimes.
00:31:53
Speaker
It can, and it's really subtle. when you talk about smoke cocktails, it's really great example. Smoking cocktails is a subtle art where you can overdo it so easily. Yeah. And completely blow out the cocktail. Yeah.
00:32:06
Speaker
But it's also personal preference. You do you. Exactly. Yeah. All right. What's your second pairing? ah So i'm I'm actually struggling a little bit with my second pairing.
00:32:20
Speaker
For better or worse. um Let me show you what I got. So this is a wine by Joe. This is a Pinot Noir out of Oregon ah from the, i but is it the Willamette Valley? Willamette. Am I saying that correctly?
00:32:34
Speaker
Willamette Valley. Willamette. Thank you. It's better than ah I'll never forget John and and Rob saying Williamette Valley. Oh, God. i Hey, here we are.
00:32:46
Speaker
We're learning new things, right? So you you said it was it was the Willamette? Willamette. Willamette Valley. All right. So the Willamette Valley in Oregon, ah they're interesting because they were established in 2002 and founded by the winemaker Joe Dobbs.
00:33:03
Speaker
I'm hoping i'm I'm saying it properly, but yeah. So Joe Dobbs came out, started a small family winery. They expanded over the years to a 2000 case, two sorry, production.
00:33:15
Speaker
two hundred thousand case annual production which is massive. And they source the grapes from Willamette Valley and Rogue Valleys as well.
00:33:27
Speaker
Willamette, Rogue, yes, Willamette, Rogue. I'm struggling with the Willamette thing. It's hard. it's so It's a weird thing to say. It's a weird word. It's one of those Oregon words that like, ah there's a lot of words in the Pacific Northwest that don't make any sense.
00:33:43
Speaker
You don't know how to say them until you somebody say them. Well, you come to South Jersey. Snoqualmie. Snoqualmie is one of the ones that, like... so you see it What's that?
Zinfandel's Bold Profile and History
00:33:53
Speaker
it's ah It's a part of Washington um okay that used to be an Indian reservation, I think, but it's... I see. oh There's a lot of Native American words in the Pacific Northwest, like Snoqualmie.
00:34:06
Speaker
Interesting. And when you see them written down, you're like Snoqualmie? don't know how to say this word. Well, hey now, down in South Jersey here, we got words like water instead of water, which drives me nuts.
00:34:22
Speaker
Coming from Brooklyn, New York, I'm like, what are you talking about? i don't What is that? It's weird. there's There's one more pronunciation thing that I think you'll get a kick out of. um Yeah? in In Portland, there's a street called spelled C-O-U-C-H street.
00:34:37
Speaker
How would you pronounce that? C-O? C-O-U-C-H. c u c h
00:34:44
Speaker
ah Uh, couch. Exactly. But it's cooch. It's not cooch. It's cooch. It's cooch. Ah, there's no accent mark. So anyway, it's, it's, it's a Portland thing where like, uh, I mean, it's like that kind of everywhere, you know, where there are words that just don't make you, you wouldn't know how to say them unless you heard somebody say that's fair.
00:35:09
Speaker
That's fair. These cats, so let me let me get back to let me get back to Joe because kind of cool because in 2018, they released something called Joe to Go, which was a line of kind of small canned wines and ah bunch of different wines. They released Pinot Grays Rosés and a couple other styles.
00:35:32
Speaker
They released them in cans that you can kind of buy and and take it home you know to go, which is really cool. Uh, they've been kind of really, interestingly enough, they've been really involved in the, in the community for, for wine specifically.
00:35:49
Speaker
they've done a whole bunch with the community. They've done things for like the Oregon zoo foundation, um, the partnership with the Oregon zoo, which is really cool. They won a bunch of awards. But Pinot Noir is one of those styles that, for me, I i really love, but also i was a little bit reluctant to jump into with a cigar because Pinot Noir generally in my palate is kind of thin.
00:36:12
Speaker
And so a cigar almost always takes over a Pinot Noir. And I think maybe you have the same experience. I completely agree. um I'm not a big fan of Pinot Noirs. i like the...
00:36:25
Speaker
I like how like a Cab Sav or a Syrah, the drier, darker grapes, I guess you would call them. um They have that kind of stick to your palate kind of flavor.
00:36:36
Speaker
They have those big tannins. yeah the They're not overly sweet. There's sweetness, but they're not overly sweet, even though they're fruity. um And I just find that's more my style than Pinot Noir. Pinot Noir to me is thin and a little too sweet usually.
00:36:52
Speaker
Well, it's apropos that you say that because Pinot Noir is actually known as the heartbreak grape because it's thin-skinned and super delicate. And it's really hard to grow.
00:37:04
Speaker
never knew. It kind of almost fits the sort of fits the bill.
00:37:10
Speaker
But again, Pinot Noir is a really popular style. it's It is actually used in in champagne. So Pinot Noir is a really popular grape for champagne. And also, it really is sort of a sort of kind of like a genetic parent of many grapes.
00:37:26
Speaker
It's not really one grape. It's this mix of all sorts of different grapes. Historically, it's been kind of hard to grow as a result because of all the mutations that that it's had over the years.
00:37:38
Speaker
But it's a cool style. I think it's one of the styles that I stay away from when it comes to pairing wine with cigars as a general rule. I like the wine. It's great. I think cigars, it's a little bit tough. And and we talk about this again with IPAs, right? IPAs are really tough two to pair with cigars.
00:37:56
Speaker
And to me, the Pinot Noir is the IPA of, you know, in in that kind of realm, it's similar to IPAs. I mean, at that seems kind of appropriate that Oregon is the land of Pinot Noirs and IPAs.
00:38:13
Speaker
It's a partnership to some degree. Mm-hmm.
00:38:21
Speaker
All right. So the prisoner is working really well. I see what you mean about that Cabernet, like that, that super jammy kind quality really is working well with this cigar.
00:38:34
Speaker
It's brought out kind of a, fruity note that I can't put my finger on with cigar. Reminds me almost of strawberry or cherry, maybe. um But it it's brought out some interesting flavors in the cigar and just kind of going back and forth between the two.
00:38:53
Speaker
um It's making for a really good pairing. The ah cigar is creamy and spicy and a little bit leathery, little bit earthy.
00:39:04
Speaker
And then i go back to the wine and it's kind of that dark stone fruit, tannic, bitter, a little bit, tender. Just a pairing that's going really, really well. So i'm curious to see how my last pairing works.
00:39:18
Speaker
Any notes I think it's wonderful style. Yeah, I think so too. Yeah. Man, you know, for me, I was really enjoying the cigar and I think the yeah kind of the Pinot Noir fell out.
00:39:28
Speaker
It's just, it's so thin. It's thin on the mouthfeel. I think really almost going back to beer beer culture, it would sit much better with some bubbles. Yeah.
00:39:40
Speaker
Yeah. Which is, again, not weird right for Pinot Noir. Common grape for for champagnes. So, yeah. If it had bubbles, club soda, right?
00:39:53
Speaker
If I adulterated this with k club soda, maybe it could be a little bit better with the cigar. All right. Rob Goodhart says Captain Vino by Natalie Vineyards or Natali Vineyards maybe paired great with strong cigars like the Feral Flying Pig, for example.
00:40:08
Speaker
It's a port style made from Cab Sav and Syrah grapes aged in stainless and whiskey barrels. That sounds right up my alley because I like Cab Sav and Syrah are two of my favorite wine grapes that I know of. I haven't.
00:40:23
Speaker
I mean, I've talked about this over and over again, but I haven't done a ton of exploring. I found some wines I didn't like, like Pinot Noir and almost every white wine I've ever tasted. um And then I found some I liked like, like Cab Sav, Syrah, Pizza Raw.
00:40:42
Speaker
There's one more that them I'm trying to remember. Tempranillo. Tempranillo. Oh, Tempranillo is fantastic. Fantastic with cigars, but in my opinion. Dennis says that vineyard is in my hometown. We'll have to take the bikes down.
00:40:54
Speaker
Must be Natale Vineyards. It's local. Oh, man. All right. We can check it out. all right. I'm curious.
Reflecting on Wine Pairings
00:41:02
Speaker
Well, I am drinking something that is also barrel-aged, but not like that.
00:41:10
Speaker
I almost got that today. I've had this forever.
00:41:17
Speaker
I bought this.
00:41:19
Speaker
I don't know exactly when, but somewhere back in the sharing our pairings days. and whatever happened with that cigar, we I never ended up using it. Maybe I used a different pairing.
00:41:31
Speaker
And then I just stuck this in my wine rack and forgot about it. So this is a 2016 vintage. ah um So it's probably, I probably bought it in 2017 or 18. So it's been around for a little while.
00:41:43
Speaker
um If you know anything about wine of this caliber, that may or may not do anything to help it um This is about a $15-ish bottle of wine. So Apothic.
00:41:56
Speaker
um They're quite popular. I think they their lunch has kind of been eaten by like the 19 crimes of it all. um I see 19 crimes a lot more than I see Apothic anymore.
00:42:08
Speaker
um But Apothic was founded in Modesto, California by E.J. Gallo Winery, which is one of the world's largest wine producers. um It was initially kind of a way for them to launch a bold and accessible red blend called Apothic.
00:42:22
Speaker
um But it was so popular, they quickly branched out and started producing, um you know, they they changed Apothic from being a single wine. almost knocked over a wine glass there.
00:42:34
Speaker
being a single wine, I gestured with my hands too much. From being a single wine to a whole brand. So they and released a white and a rosé. I remember the rosé being actually pretty good.
00:42:45
Speaker
um It wasn't bad, actually. I thought it was nice, yeah. And they've done a whole bunch of like limited editions and collaborations. ah They got cool packaging. The wine is pretty pretty cheap, and it's usually fine.
00:43:00
Speaker
um Apothic is named for the medieval word apotheca, which which refers to a place where herbs were stored and wine was actually blended there. um Since they're owned by one of the biggest companies in the world, or biggest wine companies in the world, um there's not a whole lot to say about the history of apothec other than that.
00:43:20
Speaker
So, This is Apothic Inferno. um It is a blend of mostly Zinfandel and Merlot, which is aged in whiskey barrels for 60 days before bottling. um And the ABV is 15.9%. I'm very curious to see how this is.
00:43:38
Speaker
i don't have huge expectations because, like I said, Apothic is um it's kind of a half-decent grocery store wine, in my opinion.
00:43:50
Speaker
I'm not a huge wine connoisseur, but i know i know that much. But I'm going to find out how it tastes while you talk about your final pairing in the evening and see if it's actually worth about $15. So I'm getting down on a Zinfandel as well.
00:44:09
Speaker
Man, we are about the streams crossed tonight, huh?
00:44:14
Speaker
They are crossed, for sure. um and So this Zinfandel is infinel is iss kind of interesting. And in to me, it's weird. Weird, not in a bad way. Weird in a curious way, because I want to learn more. And um i've I've spent some time trying to figure out kind of what their story is.
00:44:30
Speaker
Let me show you the bottle. and
00:44:34
Speaker
So I have a OZV Zinfandel Lodi, California, or Lodi, California, and depending on kind of how you want to say it. But it's short for Old Zin Vines.
00:44:48
Speaker
And this is a label that's produced by old Ridge Winery. They've been around for a really, really long time. And officially today, they're still considered the oldest operating winery in Lodi, California.
00:45:01
Speaker
Wow. Which is really cool. They started in 1934, which is wild, as a cooperative. So they were cooperative with local growers.
00:45:13
Speaker
In 2002, they were picked up by another company, Maggio and Reynolds. They picked them up. They started producing more wine. ah it but it's been around for a really long time. and We see this with bourbon too, right? Where you'll have a distillery that's been around for a long time, kind of dies out, and then somebody comes in and buys the the name or the brand and re-releases it.
00:45:39
Speaker
I'm actually losing my voice thanks to the Zinfandel, I guess. um Maybe that's a thing because i you heard me before like starting to cough. I haven't coughed in days or weeks maybe. Oh, jeez.
00:45:51
Speaker
If you're a cigar smoker and you haven't coughed in days, you got a problem. You got to see your proctologist. It's a problem. Or you haven't smoking enough. Oh, you haven't smoking enough. Anyway, these cats are really cool because they source their grapes from vines that are really old between 50 and 100 years.
00:46:07
Speaker
wow which is specific to them, this is their thing. This is what they love to do. It's really fascinating. And again, also really hard, right? Because you talk about terroir, you talk about when we look at cigar tobacco, crop to crop, it's so hard to maintain consistency because you're you're kind of at the mercy of the elements.
00:46:30
Speaker
Well, and um in in contrast with grapes of this style, cigar is a, or tobacco is a disposable crop. Like you grow it once and then it's all done.
00:46:42
Speaker
Like none of it grows ever again. Yes, sir. and And we also, we actually, come we see this happen in the cigar industry where between between cigar ah tobacco seasons, they'll grow something like coffee.
00:46:59
Speaker
Yeah. coffee and they'll grow coffee and the beans, whatever it is, and then it'll go back down into the soil to enrich the soil for the next tobacco crop. um This particular Zinfandel is aged for 11 months.
00:47:11
Speaker
Kind of cool because it's aged in French oak and American oak. So mostly French oak, about 80% French oak. And then a little bit of American oak, which is really nice.
00:47:23
Speaker
But Zinfandel is a really interesting style in general. People, when they hear Zinfandel, I think they go, ah it's not my thing. I don't want to get into it. how What's your thought on Zinfandel? um I know exactly you mean. Zinfandel, the name alone strikes you as... Toity-toity, I guess.
00:47:42
Speaker
A little bit. Just something a little delicate and frail and not that interesting.
00:47:54
Speaker
Like very, it strikes you as something that's going to be very low key, very low flavor, low intensity, very, very like crazy approachable. um But it's kind of the opposite of that.
00:48:06
Speaker
Like it's very approachable, but at the same time, Dinphinelle is like a flavor bomb.
00:48:14
Speaker
Yeah, Zinfandel really interesting because it has a great history. the There was kind of a boom that happened in the 1970s that kind of we saw a resurgence of specifically red Zinfandel coming back and people getting back into it. But it's been around for really long time.
00:48:30
Speaker
And it it kind of came in ah through Italy and as a primitivo. in the 18th century, which is awesome, people were digging on this this this grape for so long, doing things with this grape, and it wasn't really appreciated until much later.
00:48:46
Speaker
Huh. I never knew that. And I think it came to the Americas like early probably. Okay. yeah andra with Austrians that came in and brought in their nurseries and transferred that to California, which was the gold rush.
00:49:04
Speaker
was like 18... Well, let me check my notes. I'll tell you. 1849 to eighteen fifty s it it it was the gold rush in California with these particular grapes.
00:49:16
Speaker
Oh, very cool. Yeah, man, some cool history to it But I think really Zinfandel at its core, Red Zinfandel specifically, i think has a good opportunity to pair well with cigars.
00:49:31
Speaker
Again, it has that jammy quality. has that stone fruit. It has that something, that essence, sorry that sticks to your palate, which is what you really want when you're having a cigar. Because again, the cigar is going to stick to your palate first above anything else before you take the first sip of something. It's going to take over.
00:49:48
Speaker
Yeah, of course. um For me, this Apothic, what is it called? Apothic Inferno? Yeah. um It's better than I thought it was going by lot. I stand corrected.
00:50:02
Speaker
um
00:50:04
Speaker
it's It's almost exactly what you're talking about, like with the flavor notes. Like it's very fruity, a little more acidic than the Cabernet,
00:50:15
Speaker
um A little bit sweeter, but still not overly sweet. I know both of these are classified... Like, both Cabernet and Infidel are classified as dry, which means that ah per liter, there's less than 10 grams of residual sugar.
00:50:31
Speaker
um
00:50:35
Speaker
um put that my notes. I don't just know that off top my head. I just got to clarify. um i'm not I'm not a wine guy of that caliber. um There's a little bit of, like... ah earthiness, tobacco and know kind of flavor going on um that I'm really digging.
00:50:53
Speaker
And it's working really well with this cigar. I think the Cabernet works a little bit better just because it's a little bit cleaner. Those earthy flavors that are in the Apothic kind of sit on my palate a little bit more.
00:51:05
Speaker
but I see why there's a price difference here, but I think this Apothic Inferno is better than 15 bucks would expect. But maybe that's because I've had it sitting around for like seven years. Well, I would say also, a kind of a fun fact, is Red Zinfandel is considered the most popular style of wine to pair with barbecue.
00:51:27
Speaker
Hmm. I never knew that. wild It's wild, but when you have a Zinfandel, a red one, you kind of get that... You can see it. it It makes sense. Yeah, I think so.
00:51:40
Speaker
That acid, I think, really would go well with something like a smoked meat. um the jaminess. It's not, like i said, it's it's a little sweeter than the Cabernet i had, but um it's not like super a super sweet wine at all.
00:51:57
Speaker
Man, we're doing we're doing we're being wine guys. Yeah, man. we're we're We're in the zone. And I think there's a pepperiness that also Zinfandel is. infiel's is um People taste
Flint Knoll Cigar's Value and Legacy
00:52:08
Speaker
it, but they don't talk about it.
00:52:09
Speaker
They don't really kind of realize that there's a spiciness to Zinfandel. It's kind of cool. Pepperiness, I should say, specifically peppery. that's Yeah, I definitely do get a little bit of that.
00:52:21
Speaker
Now, the White Zinfandel is a different beast altogether, and when you talk about Zinfandel in general, people kind of go like, all right, I i know White Zinfandel. I don't like it. It's not my thing.
00:52:33
Speaker
But White Zinfandel, it was kind of created by accident in 1972. Really? Who was it? It was... Hold on. Let me remember my notes.
00:52:44
Speaker
Okay. Sutter Home Winery. That's what it was. Okay. Yeah, they created by accident when the batch of the the Reds and Fidel didn't ferment all the way and they were like, right, we're going to make this, we're just going to release this sort of a sweet pink wine and it got huge in the 80s and It was huge.
00:53:04
Speaker
wow I mean, that doesn't surprise me too much because the 80s and 90s were the time of like the... It was the time, for sure. The cleaner flavors, the softer flavors. like Yes.
00:53:14
Speaker
And that may be where my impression of Zinfandel in my head came from, like seeing my parents or whatever drinking those those boxed boxed wines Zinfandels and then being probably white at the time.
00:53:27
Speaker
Yeah. Wouldn't make sense. Yeah.
00:53:32
Speaker
but That does kind of make sense. But yeah, anyway, the 80s and 90s were like the time of like vodka drinks. um Cocktails like the Cosmo started to get more popular where it's, you know, it's it's a little bit more fruit forward, little bit cleaner. um Oh, also gin and tonic was another one that was like starting to get big in the U.S. at that time. Anyway.
00:53:56
Speaker
Yeah, it was it was the astringency as well. but It was kind of like gin tonic. It was in your face, but it was clean. yeah and And the the the American palate at the time kind of wanted to see that.
00:54:10
Speaker
Rob Goodhead says Zima. Yes, the clear spirit. Oh, Zima. The clear spirit and malt beverage boom. Oh, boy. That was the time, for sure. It sure was.
00:54:23
Speaker
It was. um
00:54:27
Speaker
Zima made me think of something, but I can't remember what it was. What are you thinking of this cigar? Oh, balls. You were thinking of balls. B-A-W-L-S. The energy drink. Yes, sir. It's good stuff, man. The energy drink. Good stuff.
00:54:39
Speaker
I miss those bottles. Yeah. i think it's only in cans these days. I think so. Yeah, you're right. They moved away from the bottles. What are you thinking of this Flint Knoll, reserve number two?
00:54:53
Speaker
Man, I i think I really dig it, but I think with the wine that we have tonight, at least, you know, well, you have some wine too. So the wine that we have tonight, I think I would love coffee with this.
00:55:05
Speaker
I think this is a really great cigar for a a almost like a pour over Ethiopian blend. I think it would sit so well with a cup of coffee.
00:55:16
Speaker
I've had it with a cup of coffee a couple of times and it it does go really well because it's got that It's a Connecticut shade, but it's it's a really, really very complex Connecticut shade.
00:55:29
Speaker
um There's a lot going on here. it's not It's not like that super intense style of Connecticut shade where it's trying to like you know be super aggressive. Oh, yeah.
00:55:40
Speaker
But it's also not like that classic creamy, papery kind of Connecticut shade. It's more intense. It's a little bit more spicy. It's got a ton of flavor.
00:55:52
Speaker
Oh, Rob says you can still buy bottles and cans of balls. They're the same price. The cans are 16 ounces. The bottles are 10-ish ounces. I think they're like nine and a half or something. I remember them being weird number. Anyway, um yeah, I would definitely recommend this Flint Knoll. $20 is not as expensive as it seemed when I bought these because of just how much the cigar market has changed in the last two years.
00:56:22
Speaker
um it's changed a lot the things have things have increased in price and there's a lot more like 30 50 100 cigars out on market at this 20 still lot for cigar 200 for a of 10 um um twenty dollars is still a lot first cigar two hundred dollars for a box ten is a lot um But i I think this cigar is kind of up for the the challenge, you know?
00:56:47
Speaker
um I haven't smoked the release three, which, unfortunately, we're a little late to the party here because we're smoking release two. Release three came out in November, I think it was.
00:57:01
Speaker
it was like, I think, late November, right? And then they announced that the Flint and Oll collaboration with Macanudo is over. um So there will not be a release four, at least for the moment, which is disappointing.
00:57:12
Speaker
Because we got to know Aaron at Aaron, the, ah the owner of Flint and all at PCA last year. And he was a blast. yeah So yeah, he's great.
00:57:24
Speaker
It's a bummer that these aren't going to be available anymore, but but if you can find them while they last, they are pretty fantastic. um I'm very impressed with this. um What are you thinking on pairing of the night?
00:57:36
Speaker
Dennis, you know, I'm, I'm just going through my pairings now. I think, um I'm going to have to say Cab Sav, Ben. The Cab Sav that I had, which was this really cool Ouija bottle, it's not because the bottle is snazzy, but it is snazzy.
00:57:55
Speaker
um I just think I love the the intensity of the wine and the style and the grape. Cab Sav is really cool because it's so, it's it's full. It's full of flavor. i think it's it's a good pairing in general. That that grape is really great for cigars.
00:58:11
Speaker
And these guys nailed it on the head in terms of the the kind of the profile, the jamminess, that sort of a great stone fruit that we talked about.
00:58:22
Speaker
I love it because my favorite part of the cigar generally is is the final third of any cigar, for the most part. Middle to final third, I love. That's my favorite part.
00:58:33
Speaker
And that tells me everything that I need to know when I'm sitting down on a pairing specifically. If I'm like really thinking about how my pairing is going with the cigar, that's when I'm going to make my my decision if this is good or not.
00:58:46
Speaker
Yeah, I get that. but the for the For the cigar as much as the pairing, yeah, man, I think Cap Sav is a really good... What's yours? um What was the price point on that Ouija wine?
00:58:58
Speaker
Oh, you don't want to know. Was it a lot? was No, it was actually not that much. um It was, ah, geez, what was it?
00:59:08
Speaker
I think $26 something. Okay. Not bad at all. not It's not not awful. But again, for most people, buying wine, like they're looking at the $12 to $15 range.
00:59:20
Speaker
Yeah, I would call that an $11 cigar. Right? Like, it's it's a little bit more than the $10 somebody who's a little more budget conscious is going to cap out at. And even $10 for somebody who's shopping with kind of a budget.
00:59:36
Speaker
um A lot of times they're going to go for the $7 or $8 cigar. I feel like that's, you know, $11 is the equivalent price of a cigar. be fair...
00:59:47
Speaker
um for me to be fair but you know To be fair, also, i I came into it thinking, well, this is kind of a snazzy bottle and it's a little bit more expensive. I thought it was going to i mean that's what If it comes with a free Ouija board, i would expect it to be awful, too.
01:00:05
Speaker
yeah right like oh i I bought it for fun and actually pleasantly surprised. I would buy this wine again. Nice. For me, a prisoner.
01:00:16
Speaker
Cabernet. Oh, yeah. um It's not like super incredible. I don't know if I would pay $40 for this bottle again, um but it's it's good, and it's going well with this cigar. If I could buy a bottle like this for $20 and $25, I'd do it every day, but maybe not every day, but as often on as I would drink wine, which is not that Every day.
01:00:38
Speaker
but You know, it's an expression. That's right. I'm
01:00:44
Speaker
Turn of phrase. I'm trying to remember what the something of speech. ah andt I don't know. I can't word today. I'm very tired. Baby was up early this morning. And I'm paying the price.
01:00:58
Speaker
But yeah, the the Prisoner, I thought was pretty solid. And again, Cabernet Sauvignon, I think, is the the ah wine style to go with this cigar.
01:01:09
Speaker
The varietal. um I mean, it is the namesake of Flint Knoll, right? That's their bread and butter. Yeah, it's aged in Cabernet Barrel.
01:01:21
Speaker
Well, the binder is, rather.
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01:01:23
Speaker
um But yeah, i I'm impressed with both the cigar and ah how it pairs with all of my pairings tonight. I think all of them worked pretty well.
01:01:33
Speaker
um But the Prisoner, think, was the winner for me. And with that, it's time to move on to our... One for the road segment. um Dennis, you want to take it first?
01:01:45
Speaker
Or shall I? Yeah, man. ah I'm actually trying to remember the name of the latest album for for a band that I saw. Okay, I got it.
01:01:59
Speaker
It just came out. Actually, ah when was it? When did it come out?
01:02:06
Speaker
Was it January? have no idea. Okay, so January just came out. Album for a band called Lacuna Coil, which is near and dear to my heart because I grew up with Lacuna Coil.
01:02:18
Speaker
I saw Lacuna Coil in 2007 in Prague. And it it was just an incredible experience. It super cool. The band before them had to cancel, so they kind of took over the set and played for three hours.
01:02:34
Speaker
Oh, wow. They played their set, and they played the other band's set time. That's always a cool experience when that kind of thing happens. they They were so awesome, and i think like really growing up in the 90s and with the all the different kinds of music that we had back then in early 2000s, really, to me, Lacuna Coil will always be a ah band that's really special. And they're kind of a... What do they consider? They're, guess, a gothic gothic metal band.
01:03:02
Speaker
Yeah, like a goth metal band from Italy. It's hard to classify most bands, I find, especially in metal, because metal is so like specific. Exactly, yeah. it's It's so tough, but the new album from Lacuna Coal called Sleepless Empire is awesome. I've been digging on it. I've been i've got my kids on it.
01:03:22
Speaker
kids are digging on it. just it It brings happiness to me because it's that era. It sounds like that time where I was young and now I'm not young and now want to go back to being young again and feel happy.
01:03:38
Speaker
And so, yeah, dude, it's fantastic. You know, albums are tough because people like different things. So it's always hard to recommend music. You know that. Oh yeah. But yeah, definitely my one for the road.
01:03:50
Speaker
if If you're into that kind of scene, get down on, on a sleepless empire by lacuna coil. It it'll make you happy. If you like it, if you know about it, it'll make you happy.
01:04:03
Speaker
Awesome. um What do you got? It's hard for me to recommend this, but I enjoyed it so much it's hard not to. Oh, God. Terrifier 4? No, not yet.
01:04:15
Speaker
maybe Maybe by, i think, comes out next June. um It will. yeah might It might be late this year, but I think it's early or mid next year. um Anyway. It's a movie. it's not like It's not hard to recommend for the reason that ah but Terrifier is. it's not super gory or super scary or anything like that. It's a little movie called Companion.
01:04:38
Speaker
um Whatever you do, this is the reason it's hard to recommend. Whatever you do, do not read a description or watch the trailer.
01:04:50
Speaker
Makes it very hard to justify spending $20 because that's how much it costs to rent it right now. Really? 20 bucks? Yeah, it's it's because it's still in theaters. They're doing that thing.
01:05:01
Speaker
mama. But I wasn't able to get out to the theater, so I figured I would throw $20 at it. Sure, sure. I did not see the twist in this movie coming, and it is so good. Apparently, they ruined it with the second trailer, which I never actually saw, so I'm glad.
01:05:16
Speaker
um But if you don't know the twist, it's very worth it going in. just go in blind and sit around for the ride. And the less you know, the better.
01:05:30
Speaker
But what I will tell you is it is about a guy and his girlfriend who go on a trip with some friends. um
01:05:40
Speaker
And then somebody dies and mysterious things happen. That's all going to say, because I can't. All right. You just watch the trailer and ruined it.
01:05:52
Speaker
No, I didn't watch it. okay i read I read about it. I looked it up. Did it tell you the twist? you son of No, there was no twist. but
01:06:05
Speaker
Oh my. yeah it's It's really good. I really enjoyed it. um Unfortunately, the twist was ruined for most people. but if you If you haven't had the twist ruined, I think it's worth watching.
01:06:16
Speaker
um If you enjoy kind of really re horror-y movies. Good. Real good. um Sam Fiddle says he rewatched City Slickers and he's reading Two Lives of a Hero about Bader and the founder of Scouting.
01:06:32
Speaker
The founder of Scouting. I love City Slickers. it's It's one of my all-time favorite films. Such a cool movie. There's so much going on. ah it's it's It's Chef's Kiss. It's wonderful.
01:06:46
Speaker
Yes. Really a great movie.
01:06:52
Speaker
Putting the cork back in my wine bottle. Oh, you're not going to finish your three bottles of wine? no Two bottles of wine. Yeah, it's only two, but I got to wake up early get kids to school.
01:07:06
Speaker
So there's that. um Breakfast wine and second breakfast wine. Exactly. That's more like it. I need the sleep, then I need the wine.
01:07:18
Speaker
That's right. Alright guys, well thank you everybody for hanging out with us tonight. um We appreciate you watching, chilling with us and having a cigar and hopefully a libation or at least some kind of pairing to go along with it.
01:07:32
Speaker
um Dennis, what are we smoking next
01:07:39
Speaker
Ooh, good question. Because I sent you a big old bag of stuff and I know you've looked through it at least once. I have a couple ideas. I've had pilfered. Yeah. um The one I was thinking was Black Angus, because i'm I'm just kind of dying to try out that pairing.
01:07:56
Speaker
Oh, actually, you know what? Let's do Black Angus, because I had an idea for a pairing for that that's going to be weird and uncomfortable for most people. All right, I'm in.
01:08:07
Speaker
Let's run with that one. Next week, we're doing Black Angus by Steve Saka from Corona Cigar Company. It is Steve Saka's first attempt. Maybe not first attempt. His...
01:08:19
Speaker
ah refined experiment. yeah He's spent a lot of time on this, so i don't want to call it a first attempt. But it's his first release um that he's happy with using FSG tobacco, tobacco grown in Florida by Jeff Borchewitz, owner of Corona Cigar.
01:08:38
Speaker
um And they're sold exclusively at Corona Cigar. So go check so check those guys out. um If you're interested in picking up some Black Angus, it is a $30 cigar, which is, it hurt.
01:08:52
Speaker
We'll talk about it. But we will talk about whether it's worth it, whether you should spend your hard-earned dollars on some, and how it pairs. Dennis, hit him with the catchphrase, and we will talk to everybody next week with the FSG Black Angus from Dunbar and Tobacco Trust.
01:09:12
Speaker
Thanks, everybody, for watching and listening. And to remember, we wanted to drink better, but we wanted to drink less.