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How To Be A Player 1 & 2
428 Plays1 year ago
Mark & Steve talk through the making of the "How To Be A Player Vol. 1 & 2" videos during their time with Duncan. Originally released in 2001, these VHS tapes were commercially released and quickly became cult classics yoyo players and fans of VHS kitsch.
This episode brought to you by YoYoExpert.com.
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Transcript
Introduction of Hosts
00:00:01
Speaker
I'm Steve Brown. And I'm Mark McBride. And we're two dusty old yo-yo farts talking about dusty old yo-yo shit.
00:00:29
Speaker
So what should we talk about today?
Today's Topic: 'How to be a Player' Series
00:00:32
Speaker
So I think we're going to talk about how to be a player. Oh shit. Here we go.
00:00:41
Speaker
Uh, so. So how to be a player was a two volume video series that we made for Duncan Yoyos while I was working there. Yes. the volume one was a, these are both instructional videos. So this is back at a point in time. I mean, this was early 2000. So these came out in 2000, 2001. So we filmed these in 2000, uh, and released them in 2001. So this is during a period of time when like instructional videos like on, this is like,
00:01:19
Speaker
whoo, this came out on VHS. So these were instructional VHS videos, one for yoyos, one for spin tops. Uh, and these came out when there was a market for that kind of thing, which is just that alone is kind of weird to think about. I mean, not really. That's like, again, pre-YouTube, this like, this was visual learning. This was great way to do it. Well, I mean, and now what you have is you just have single, YouTube didn't do this, but Instagram did this. Now all the instructional materials, single trick. Yeah. Yeah. But you can't ship a 30 second VHS. So right. So the how to be a player series was our attempt to create something for Duncan to be able to have in that.
The Role of Andrew Arveson and Marketing Strategy
00:02:07
Speaker
you know, that part of the market, that, that kind of skew that was the more interesting than what was already out there, which at the time was not very interesting. Very uninteresting. So let's do history, like his time and place in history. So this was after 99. So this was the point where, uh, Andrew Arveson had gone to Duncan and he was really kind of was bringing in the idea that yo-yo's could be cool. And then he wanted, He wanted us like new, interesting young guys to really kind of do something with Duncan. Andrew was the marketing and promotions coordinator at Duncan, which is the job that I later held. Yeah. He was your predecessor, I believe. Right. Yeah. And so we had convinced him that we needed to do a video and I don't remember. I don't remember when I started talking with Andrew about that.
00:03:03
Speaker
As far as I might've started talking with him in 99 before you were even working with them ah about him and Tor, we were talking about, we need to do a video. We need to do a video. Tor, Tor Circe at the time was the sales manager for Duncan. He did not last long.
Comparing Yo-Yoing to Skateboarding
00:03:18
Speaker
No. That was the... If this was 99, so 99, this would have been the same year as the Fiend magazine tour on Warp Tour. Yeah. Um, so I was still working for team Losi at the time. So this would have been started with Duncan doing stuff with them. So this, the entire, like the concept of this started then with you. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. It was like, and this was also, Oh, I'm going to do it. I'm going to do it. Are you ready? Are you scared? What are, Oh God, this I'm do the thing, which any old yo-yo guy,
00:03:53
Speaker
knows that this is the death, but I'm going to compare Yoyo-ing to skateboarding. Oh, God damn it. But to be fair, in 1999, ah the see Only two of us were doing that like that's true, man We had so many so many conversations the two of us just sitting around comparing yo-yoing to skateboarding Mostly it coming up short and us trying to figure out like what was the silver bullet? How do we make yo-yoing more like skateboarding yeah because at the time?
00:04:26
Speaker
And I mean, ah you know, obviously like yo-yo or skateboarding has had a very long cyclical up and down history. Similarly, yo-yo's, but like skateboarding was fucking massive. But also the thing in again, context wise, in fact, I wrote this. Oh, crap. This is probably for another episode. But when I started working with the Omega, I wrote an entire what we call the bug splat memo. I, you set that to me at one point. You asked for it. Yeah. When you start, I wrote this memo to Alan Amaral, which was how to run a yo-yo company like a skateboard company.
The 'Bug Splat Memo' and its Impact
00:05:05
Speaker
Yeah. And I remember, I remember you sent, you wrote that whole thing up. You were very proud of it. And yeah, it was called the bug splat memo because that's about how it was received like a fucking bug hitting a windshield. It was called the bug splat memo because hypeth it was the story of a hype. And I was like, okay, hypothetically,
00:05:24
Speaker
we would If you had a yo-yo company, we'll call it Bugsplat Yo-Yos. and so it was and The reason I'm proud of that is how much of that came to pass. yeah Some of it was definitely because when you went to Dunkin' and then took a step up into the Andrew's job, like you said, I got this job, would you be willing to send me that memo? and I was like, well, I wrote it so sure. It wasn't like I took it from Alan or anything because I had said to him and it just crickets. i don't like They just ignored it. you know and It had things like sponsor players, do yo-yos that were related to people. Worry about the personality. Worry about the the personality of your players and what you know people are interested in.
00:06:12
Speaker
that stuff as well. Um, and this is all, these are all the conversations that you and I used to have sitting in the back of lofty pursuits. Yeah. These are, well, these are the things that yo-yo companies didn't know how to do, but skateboard companies did. And so again, so much of that stuff like came to pass, like the idea of having imprint labels, you know, that was something which again, I, that was written down in 1998 and ignored. for 20 years. you know and so One of the things, again, was it's got to be interesting.
Motivation Behind 'How to be a Player'.
00:06:50
Speaker
and so We said, look, Andrew, let's do an interesting instructional video. We got to have an instructional video. You got to teach people how to like do this.
00:07:02
Speaker
they But yeah I mean, at the time, like Duncan, you know, Duncan still believed that they were like the industry leader, but they didn't have any instructional materials out there. They had the the famous instructional book, which we have discussed at length. Yeah. And and they still had they still had that VHS video with Arnie Dixon, but they didn't own it. Arnie owned the rights to it and just licensed it to Duncan. Dude, he was like like he was a crafty guy.
00:07:33
Speaker
He was, he was very, very shrewd. Yeah, he was. Little shifty, but shrewd. They had a seer, like between him and, um, okay. Mike Caffrey, like that. Caffrey. Oh man. That's shifty. Like those guys. Fuck that clown. Those guys are different, different guys. I don't want it to associate too tightly, but yeah, like Duncan's had some That gets had some interesting characters. there's been some Yeah, there's been some real interesting characters that have gone through there, both as employees and as demonstrators, man. Like one, one of these days we're going to have to get into like the history of Duncan demonstrators and it's going to be gnarly. I mean, luckily I think the statute of limitations is up on most of the, you know,
00:08:16
Speaker
yeah night knife fights and prostitution charges. those that That statute of limitations was up before you and I started doing my friend. Probably. Probably. so so we said So we go like, look, if we're going to do an instructional video, we want to make an issue. we want to make it We want to take our cues from skate videos. And Andrew said, yeah go for it. I mean, yeah. Andrew andrew was really, really good at recognizing ah other people's coolness and just letting them run with it, which is amazing if you've ever met Andrew. like andrew is not Andrew is not cool, no
00:08:56
Speaker
but he but at the same time, like he was also so completely like totally fine with being exactly who he was. like i I've never met anybody who was simultaneously more awkward and self-assured at the same time. You are so correct. So correct. I mean, I love that dude. Like, and I, I need to get in touch with, I have not talked to him in forever, but he's one of those wonderfully unique people that was just like, this is who I am and I'm never going to be anything but who I am yeah and fucking strap in kids. Cause here we go. So Andrew says, yeah, sure. Go for it.
Approval Process and Production Challenges
00:09:32
Speaker
But it doesn't happen that easily.
00:09:35
Speaker
Of course not, because you know at the time, Dunkin' Toys is is ah just a division of a plastics company. And it's a plastics company. there's Plastics companies are not known for their you know fanciful flights of imagination. This is not Willy Wonka cranking out chocolate fucking flowers. This is you know some dudes from Baraboo, Wisconsin making fucking tackle boxes. And so they so we have this idea we're going to shoot. now this is This is not abnormal for Duncan. that like This recurs as far as, okay, you want to shoot the video? Cool. Can't get approval. Can we do it? Can't get approval. Can't get approval. We're working on it. Can't get approval. Okay, so that we had a schedule. Okay, we're going to do it. All right. All right, we got approval. You could do it, right? Well, not now. Yeah.
00:10:27
Speaker
Yeah. Like, I mean, yeah, approvals would get delayed by like months and months and months and months and months. And then when they were finally ready to do it, everybody else just had to like magically be ready to drop what they were doing and make it happen. So I had sent that into you and Andrew, like, here's the breakdown. Here's how we're going to do it. Right. Well, I mean, okay. So this process, like, again, this process started before I was even working for the company. Yeah. And so, I mean, this is at least minimum, a full year of prep.
Balancing Day Jobs and Creative Projects
00:11:00
Speaker
Yes and no, it was, we need to do this. And I went, okay, if we're going to do this, this is what you're looking for kind of thing. And then it was, then there was a moment where it was not just concept. It was like, okay, give me the numbers. Give me the timeframe. And I went, here's your numbers. Here's your timeframe. Submit. I need a sign off that you're going to send me a check, you know, and.
00:11:22
Speaker
Hem ha hem ha stall stall stall stall stall. No shit. I'm at my sister's wedding and I get a call like literally the date like I'm in Florida for my sister's wedding and Andrew calls me and says we're doing it
00:11:43
Speaker
And Monica and Monica was just like kick ass get off the goddamn phone mark So we're literally doing wedding prep I get this I'm like, yeah, hooray kind of thing You've got we're gonna do it like it like two weeks. It was it was legit like um two weeks this matters because I had talked to an old A friend of mine, not old, I mean, like it was a friend from college, only a few years earlier, Brent, he was a cinematographer. He went in college and film school. He was camera guy. ah So I got a quote from him to bring him on to be the cameraman. I get back to LA. Now at this point, I have a day job and it is a decent day job, you know? Was this when you were working at Gracie? No, this was after Gracie. This was New Line.
00:12:37
Speaker
I'm like manager of creative services. So you got coffee. No, I was actually like hustling on this one. Like I actually coordinated. I coordinated the photographers, like all those guys at the red carpets, they take the pictures. I, yeah I paid them. They gave me photos and we got them to variety and Hollywood reporter to prove that our movie was cool. That was my job. Yeah. That's a pretty, you didn't ever, I don't think you've ever actually told me about that. No shit, really? Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was an office job, but it was, you know, good people. And so at this point, oh, that was one of the jobs I learned a lot as far as like how to be a manager. And I come back from my sister's wedding and I know that I've got, I literally just took a week off of work.
00:13:22
Speaker
yeah and it's so and I've got to ask for another week off in a week and a half. okay and I come back to my boss pissed that I dropped the ball on a big project. oh dude I somehow convinced myself that something was not deliverable and I left for my sister's wedding without delivering this big project. oh So I get come back to being in the like in the shit house. And I have to ask permission to take another week of work to go shoot a yo yo video. Yelling, yelling, yelling. Yeah, my bad. Anyway, so I needed a couple of weeks off.
00:14:15
Speaker
I remember the look on my boss's face she like again I was yelled at I owned it you know kind of thing fine and I'm like fuck What am I going to do? like this is like i'm really in I'm really in the doghouse. here and I was worried about it. and i thought and I was like, okay, so there's this thing we used to call we started calling corporate corporate Stockholm syndrome. okay Everybody goes to Hollywood to make movies and do all this cool shit, but then you got to get a day job.
00:14:46
Speaker
Because you gotta get a day job to pay your bills to stay there, right? Then at some point, you start caring about the day job so much that when somebody comes to you and says, I got this cool thing, you want to go shoot a movie? You go, I can't. I got this day job, corporate Stockholm syndrome. So right I'm like, this is a great job. I love these people. The pay is decent. But like i like I'm in LA to do shit like a skate video with yo-yos, so right I got to do it. and I remember walking into my boss's office, and I was like, how am I going to play this? and I went, look, I'm really frazzled. I understand that I'm fucking up. I need to get my head on straight.
00:15:29
Speaker
I need to take a week off to go get my head on straight. Oh my God. So you, so you basically positioned to this as like, I'm just going to need to take a ah short sabbatical here so that I can come back and do my best work for you. Exactly what I did. Holy shit. And she bought this. Oh my kind of, I remember I've never had, I've never had a boss look at me. I still vividly remember her. staring at me going, you're unbelievable. And I'm like, I mean, in fairness to her, you are just this what the fuck look on her face. And I'm like, but I just, I've like, I'm strapped in a ride this rollercoaster. I'm right. I'm right. It down. Holy shit. Yes. I mean, that is like, that is, uh, that is some real big Dick energy right there.
00:16:27
Speaker
Oh, you have like, I, I can't believe I pulled it off. So she says, she says, look, you fucked up. You get, so I've already got, I'm already, I've already fucked up. I've got a week and a half's worth of work. Both. I missed work before I left, then I left. So I've got two weeks of work out, like to catch up on, just to prove it. She says, you could do it, but you better have everything fucking done and out the door before you leave. And I went, okay. I did like a 70 plus hour week that week, like double timing, staying at work till all hours, finishing all the stuff that I had to do. I call Brent and I go, Brent, it's on, but I need you to
Filming in Extreme Conditions
00:17:11
Speaker
go get the camera. I need you to do all this stuff. And I threw, I basically just promoted Brent to producer and said, go get all the stuff. And he did, you know, so he was getting all this stuff and
00:17:25
Speaker
pulled it together at the last, like somehow got it all together. The plan, the reason that we had such a hard date was that we were shooting at the first world yo-yo contest in Orlando. Yeah. That was in 2000. Uh, and it was outdoors. Yes, it was a universal studios. Miserable. That was hands down the most shitty, miserable world. show you contest oh Oh, and it gets shittier.
00:17:56
Speaker
So you were still in Tallahassee Yeah, so we were going to shoot in Tallahassee. Mm-hmm crash at your place. I think um We were and use Greg's warehouse so we had warehouse studios warehouse to use as a studio Yep shooting Tallahassee then go down to the world yo-yo contest and get footage of everybody of the world yo-yo contest Yeah, voila Mm-hmm. Yeah, it sounds simple totally so We, yeah, man, we got like, I don't know if Greg had the black fabric. Yeah, he must've had the black fabric. He did photography stuff. So we set up. No, we went and bought it. I remember like, I remember us running around and buying all of that. Oh, we bought so much shit. I mean, like, I know that we were running around and I, so. Yeah. I mean, I remember like there was, there was an afternoon where it was literally like, we hit like three hardware stores and two fabric stores. Yeah. Yeah. The hardware stores we, um,
00:18:55
Speaker
Cause we had to, we had to build the apparatus for Chris and you know, we had to get all this fabric and like one Joanne's was only had this much and the other one only had this much and we're buying, you know, shitload of just like random clamps and like work lights and all of the, all of the hardware store lighting kits. So, so apart from it being July in Tallahassee, Florida, we're in an RNA condition warehouse and all of our lights are halogen hardware store lights. Yeah. I mean, it was. It was 110 degrees in the warehouse and then we turned the lights on. oh my so it was like
00:19:34
Speaker
It was like, yeah, and this is a movie thing, like that movie sets are like that, where you go like, okay, so we, again, I went to film school in this shit, so I know how it works. You go, you wipe off your, so you you go like, okay, everybody ready? Wipe off the sweat, action, shoot, shoot, shoot, pause, okay, run, get some cold drink, wipe it off again, get ready to go again. And so we basically did every trick we could
Instructional Material versus Creative Interests
00:19:57
Speaker
think of. Yeah. Like I went, I went and rewatched it recently and thinking back on the video, like I remember all the silly shit we did because that was the stuff that mattered to me. The instructional material in the video, that was literally just us justifying the cost of the whole thing. Yeah.
00:20:14
Speaker
You know what I mean? like You and I didn't give a shit about like and making an instructional video. like That was just the hook that we used to get money for. No, no, no. Here's the thing that you keep forgetting is that like you got to be the star who just kind of rolls in and has everyone point cameras at him and we gets to have fun. I was put that shit together. I know that that shit was not magic. Yeah. I was totally just the talent on this because again, like I, you know, this was, this was before I was working at the office. I was just a demonstrator for Duncan at this point. So, I mean, and I was literally like, I was a demonstrator just like on retainer. So I was still living in Tallahassee and I was basically sitting around with my thumb up my ass, waiting for them to be like, Hey, we got a gig for you. And I'd be like, okay, cool. And I'd run out and be Mr. Yo-Yo guy. And then I'd go home and you know, play Nintendo.
00:21:05
Speaker
Yeah. I was not involved in that side of it at all. So yeah, you're the one that had to do all the work on this. All I had to do was show up and be charming. Yeah. And so you and Chris Neff, you know, so like like, let's give a little context. Chris Neff was the other demonstrator. Andrew had two demonstrators, you and Chris. Yeah. So it was me and k Chris Neff. And we were, I mean, we at the time, I, I want to say that we were the only demonstrators that Duncan had like on any kind of, I know I was on retainer of Chris was or not. I don't think Chris was. I think Chris was just somebody that we wanted to get because he was great. And he was funny. I mean, I almost don't want to say this cause I don't want it to seem like a slight on Chris, but
00:21:56
Speaker
my like When I was talking with Andrew, and Andrew brought me on to do the duncan to be Duncan's guy on the Warp Tour. right Basically, Andrew got two demonstrators, was my understanding. He wanted it to be you and me. and I was like, I'm not going to be a professional, I make movies. Chris was just like, well, if we can't get McBride, like Chris Neff is the guy. so I was always under the impression that you two were the two demonstrators. yeah Right. So I think I, this is one of those like weird, fuzzy little things that like, I'm not a hundred percent sure and we'd have to ask Chris. If only we could contact him, if only we knew him and hadn't, and it's been so long since we talked to him.
00:22:44
Speaker
Yeah. Uh, so we'll have to, we'll have to figure that out. But like my understanding is that at the time Chris was, Chris was still working for wind wizards was he as like a, an in store, like house demonstrator for them. And then he was, he was like officially sponsored by Duncan and he would, um, they would fly him out for stuff. So, you know, it would either, either he would do it or I would do it, or we would both do it together. My buddy Brent from film school and I came in from LA, flew to Florida and I don't know if this happened at this time because of this. So Brent, Brent was actually a camera assistant on
00:23:35
Speaker
for a little while on pornos. Like, cause again, this is first, first year out of film school, you get whatever jobs you can, you know? Right. Yeah. Which is, and it's, and, and, you know, there's, there was no shortage of that stuff filming. So there was always a ton of churn. And so they always needed warm bodies, so to speak, to like, you know, run cameras, load film. There was a point around this time, and I don't know if- Fetch moist towelettes. there was a point where you're supposed to like, you have to use, like everybody used fake names on Portos, even the camera assistance, like he used a fake name and some point one of the companies fucked up and published his real name in the credits and he, and he slammed him on it and got some kind of like, you know, like version of a settlement as far as like, like here's 500 bucks kid, don't sue us, you know, type thing. And,
00:24:33
Speaker
either that's what he got and let him take on this gig. Like, or it happened like right after that. So, amazing so we stole them away from porno to come shoot our film.
00:24:46
Speaker
yes Oh, there's, yeah, there's a joke there. Uh, and I'm just going to leave it. I'm just going to leave it alone. yeah I'm going to leave it the fuck alone. So he got everything together. We jump in like, like, We head out to Florida, shoot as much as we can. We just come up with every fucking thing we can again. Like at this point, it's like, I don't know if we're gonna have enough, I don't know if there are enough yo-yo tricks to make a 50 minute video. again, like the the actual instructional part of it was literally just the justification for the rest of it. But the rest of it is what we were all supremely interested in. in Like, yeah again, we wanted to, you know, we were very keenly interested in like, how do we make yo-yoing look cooler?
00:25:36
Speaker
So Mark, how do you feel about yo-yos and yo-yo related accessories? Oh, I mean, you know that I i like the yo-yos and the yo-yo related accessories. How do you feel about punching children? I generally vote against it. So at yo-yoexpert.com they have lots of yo-yos and yo-yo accessories and they do not endorse punching children. That's excellent because I definitely check the footer of all websites that I order from and see their terms relating to the issue of punching children. Yeah, my understanding is that no one who is currently or even previously employed at yoyoexpert.com has ever punched a child on purpose. They also have very reasonable prices on yoyos and yoyo accessories. Well, because they don't have to pay for all of the, you know, core costs of being children punchers. That's right. If you ever wanted to support a yoyo retailer,
00:26:24
Speaker
who is very much against punching children. Very against it. You should support YoYoExpert.com because they don't punch children. YoYo's big tops, chocolate gift, they even sell clothing you can wear. YoYo Expert makes them turn their heads. YoYo players rule, that's what I said. YoYo Expert really is the best and they don't punch children. YoYo Expert doesn't punch children.
Extensive Filming and Unexpected Challenges
00:27:00
Speaker
Yeah, Brent was an old film school buddy. We were just like, shoot first, ask questions later. And are there enough yo-yo tricks out there to fill up a 50-minute video? Yeah, I mean, and at the time, that was kind of debatable. Yeah, we were on the edge. We were so we were shooting fucking everything we could think of to make sure that we had 50 minutes of footage. yeah And then we still had to do it again to make sure that we had another 20 minutes for the top video. yeah So 50 for the video, 25 minutes for the tops. And I was still shooting stuff like in backyards when I got back to LA with like whatever DXL friends we could find.
00:27:56
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, and that's the funny thing too, is if you go back and you watch the video, there's a not insignificant chunk of it that was very clearly shot after the fact. Oh yeah. So we shot all over Tallahassee as much as we could. Yeah. And then drove down to Orlando. And and I don't remember us getting much footage in Orlando. You know why? Because other than the fact that it was 110 degrees outside with 90% humidity. You don't remember why I was only there for a day. No. So the story I want to tell is about Brent that I still tell to this day. He's one of my zen stories in life. So at some point, ah the tapes got stolen. Like our blank tapes, our tape supply. like you know Not the stuff that we shot. OK.
00:28:49
Speaker
And so we get to Orlando and we checked it like first day, first day we check in into the hotel. We're coming out and Brett's like, uh, I don't know where the, tap I don't know where the tapes are. I went, what are you talking about? He's like, somebody stole the tapes. Like I have like the vaguest recollection of this. And I remember. the day go and i been like what are you talking about he's like obviously they were stolen because they're not here i'm like wait a second you're telling me but somebody reached past the three thousand dollars camera to a half a dozen $5 tapes. He's like, yes, because that's the only explanation. I know that they were, I'm like, if we checked everywhere, we looked, we couldn't find them. So they like, yes, that's obviously the explanation. So that's, we spent the whole day finding our setup and he would ask everybody, Hey, can I get some tapes that people at Universal were like, man, that's terrible. So we saw your tapes like, yeah, I know I can't, who steals tapes? And then we're fine. We set up and he comes like, he's like, Oh, I found the tapes. They were just underneath the back seat. god And I went,
00:29:55
Speaker
what the fuck? And he just goes, yep, I was wrong. And that was it. It's such a tiny thing, but it's exactly that moment where you want to say like, what this, you know, he was right. He just, he just owned it. There was nothing else to say. And we moved on. Oh my God. Amazing. Absolutely amazing. So yeah, I competed that year. So I was still in like, I was still in competition mindset. I mean, kind of minimal as much as I ever gave a shit about competition, but I was also still, I was just of the talent on this. So I wasn't, I remember we didn't film much, but I don't remember why. So, um, at that time and your eyes are going to pop when you, because there will be a point where you remember
Personal Tragedy Strikes During Filming
00:30:49
Speaker
this. Um, I lived with, uh, I had a girlfriend named Dana that I lived with. i remember dan And
00:30:56
Speaker
So I remember being in the hotel room, in the hotel. It was like, this is like, like we shot a little bit a day this, I think it was like the afternoon of the first day or maybe the morning of the second day, but it was like very early on. And I get a phone call. Actually you get a phone call because I'm sitting there in the hallway. All of a sudden you come running up and you, and you go, Dana's on my phone crying. and you put the phone in my face and I go, what? Because this I didn't have a cell phone at this point. You were the only one with a cell phone. Give this thing. She's bawling, I can barely understand her. Her mom and grandmother were killed in a car accident. Oh, fuck. Her brother calls her and says, mom and grandma in a car accident, their other brother in the hospital. Oh my God, now I do remember this.
00:31:55
Speaker
And so I'm like, now this she has two brothers. The brother reporting this is always, you know, he like, we wanted to check, I wanted to check up on it. Okay. And so I call, I've got her uncle's phone number and I go, so I call her uncle. Her uncle says, yeah, we didn't, we're still sorting it all out. Basically like in what I learned later, her mom, grandmother returning with her brother, little brother in the back seat of the van, returning from whatever kind of family out, you know, like, you know, trip a state away or something on the highway, middle of the night drunk driver in an attempt to avoid the police goes down the on ramp and then the wrong way on the highway to try and get away from the police. Cause he's like a DUI threat, full speed head on collision.
00:32:49
Speaker
shit so he So the uncle's like, we know there's an accident. We're still figuring out what happened. her you know The brother is in St. Louis. um That's all that we know. We didn't want her other brother to call because like until we knew something, but he you know kind of against better wishes did. So at this point, I don't know what, like what the hell. You can't be like, wow, bummer. Anyway, let's go shoot some more shit in front of Universal Studios. So I'm like, I got to get on a plane. I got to do something. The uncle's like, we don't know where anyone's going to be. Don't come back yet.
00:33:33
Speaker
We're probably not gonna be in l la we're probably gonna be in st louis we don't know where the fuck we're gonna be so it is a fuck is a word or we're gonna be just what hold yeah you know still hold tight until we we can tell you where to go. So i've got so i've gotta to go back to shooting this yo yo video and knowing that my living girlfriend of i know her mom or grandmother i had just hung out with a killed in a car accident. So we shot for like half the video. And then by then at some point, half it world, you know, like, like all that stuff, like with Jason Gallagher running around, grabbing people, yelling Trumpo in the luchador mask, like all that stuff that we shot. Again, I'm sitting there being like, what the hell am I doing?
00:34:23
Speaker
Now, if we remember how this story starts, Mark doesn't know if he's going to have a job. Yeah. So, and so, boy, you just are really in a sharp series of transitions during the filming of this. Cause again, we're filming cause yeah, we're filming parts one and two at the same time. So at worlds we were mostly, I feel like by the time we got to worlds, we were mostly trying to get spin top content.
Post-Production amidst Turmoil
00:34:51
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like with the spin top, like we had obviously done the tricks and we had done the,
00:34:57
Speaker
We had done the thing where we wanted to do a sacred heart, like the sacred heart, cause you were doing that tattoo, we'll call me now, but that, uh, that look, yeah, you still got my, my secret turnip. I mean, it looks, it's technically a sacred heart style, like spin top, but it, you know, so we shot that with like fireworks and Tallahassee. And, and so at this point we're like, yeah, like we were running around with, uh, run around with Jason Gallagher, who's a big, crazy like like character in his own right in a luchador mask, who would run up and grab somebody and yell, trouble! Because all the Mexican guys, whenever you'd have a spin top, if there's anybody who grew up in South America, Central America, Mexico, they'd be like, trouble! ah When they see it, because they're big in that corner of the world.
00:35:55
Speaker
And so, and again, like I'm just like, this is insane. And and now like I said, I literally was about to be fired for leaving. And now I've got to call my boss and I get a phone call. Everyone's in St. Louis. I need you to come to St. Louis. oh man So I was supposed to go back to work on Monday. I have to call my boss and say, actually, I'm not coming back to work. I've got to go to St. Louis. And I'm like, how is this? possibly believable. yeah But they were they were like, you got to do it to the point where you even said flowers. you know like I got to give credit to New Line. you know like they they they they They were really classy about it. and so yeah i left i left there to um yeah i left I left the early.
00:36:52
Speaker
to literally go to the hospital and funeral of my girlfriend that I was kind of like honestly, I won't say it odds with, but it was like like we're we're going through a hard patch and I had to like buck up and go hold hands with her family. Wow.
00:37:20
Speaker
It's wild to have lived the kind of life where something like that can get lost in memory. Yeah. And so we came back and I don't remember the schedule ah as far as the timeline after that. I mean, we still shot a good chunk of the spin top stuff in Tallahassee before worlds. Yeah. I remember at worlds we were still trying to get, we were still trying to round out the spin top footage, but like the yo-yo video, again, like going back and rewatching it, like the overwhelming majority of that was shot in Tallahassee. And it was mostly instructional material. I mean, it was like a 50 minute video with like 35 minutes of instruction on it. Yeah. Yeah. I was doing post-production.
00:38:12
Speaker
At some point, yeah things ended with Dana. like it was It was sad, but it was ah that kind of ended because I remember things being tense and ended up moving the computer that I was doing all the post-production on into my office. So a lot of that video was edited after work. Like I couldn't, I didn't, I didn't even have space to edit home because whatever was going on at home. So I would literally be staying late at work when I was, yeah I think I must've been moving at that time, moving out. And I just remember was this was work wise. Was this when you were at Kung Fu? No, this is before this is still, this is still, uh, all, this is all at new line, like my office. So what did we shoot? Was that the DV, the CD-ROMs?
00:39:11
Speaker
Oh, soundss all right. Another episode. Sorry. Another episode. And so yes, we finally, like I got it all together and shipped it out. Yeah. And then it took a while. Like I remember it took a while to get it done. And I can only assume that that was because, you know, personally your entire life was in a dramatic fucking amount of upheaval at that moment. oh yeah And you were like, yeah, anyway, listen, let me go work on this studio video.
00:39:45
Speaker
yeah
00:39:50
Speaker
how
00:39:55
Speaker
I mean, here's the it it did really well. People were really excited about it. Yeah, it did really well. um People were stoked. It was the thing about it is that like a lot of our personality came through in it, you know, and, and not just me and Naf, but you as well. And, you know, you aren't physically featured in the video a ton, but you're in there a bit. You and I, you know, spent a lot of time like writing bits and gags for this. Yeah. There was an awful lot of like our shared sense of humor. We didn't spend that much time.
00:40:31
Speaker
the little bit of time of writing time that was committed to this. like you know um But the thing is, is that you know like you and I had developed some kind of comedic rapport back when we were sitting in the back room at Lofty, and like we really carried that forward ah into the video. You were in multiple of my student films. Yeah. Yeah. I was in multiple student films of yours. And then I started getting drafted into your friend's student films. I was in high demand for like six months at the. You were so cool. Such a star at Florida State University's film school. I mean, I definitely ah parlayed that into some smooching of some girls. um Well, because you got some. Yeah. Yeah.
00:41:18
Speaker
But yeah, I mean, it was the the the whole vibe of the video was very different. And this was, you know, this was kind of, ah to me, this was sort of like my opening shot in all of the work that I did later when I, you know, became, when I became like ah an office guy at Duncan, as far as trying to ah rebrand the personality of the company. You know what I mean? like This was yeah this was like that first shot. This was me establishing my personality as ah as like a pillar of the brand identity, which then you know I spent all of my time at Duncan like building. All I knew how to do was the Steve Brown show. right um and so like That was what I built Duncan around because I knew that I could pull it off.
00:42:09
Speaker
yeah And, you know, building, you know, between like, between the the vibe of how to be a player one and two, uh, the bug splat memo, all of the time that you and I had spent, you know, pontificating in the back of the lofty pursuits warehouse about what we thought yo-yoing should be. Like all of that kind of coalesced. And once I became the, uh, marketing and promotions coordinator at Duncan, like that was, That was the basis of like what I did for Dunkin' Crew worldwide. That was the basis for yeah a lot of the yo-yo designs, a lot of the the marketing stuff.
00:42:44
Speaker
you know i mean everything from like i mean like you know i I convinced Dunkin' to pay to have a dunk tank at US Nationals one year. what i How do I not remember that? Yeah, dude, I was sitting on the platform of a dunk tank wearing my Dunkin Yoyo boxers and a t-shirt and had people, you know, trying, you know, trying to dunk me at as like our booth bag. I hope somebody out there has a photo of that. I hope so too, because I certainly don't have any evidence of it. And this was a direct extrapolation of like what we did on the how to be a player videos like that. I tried to always carry that personality and that kind of humor forward into everything else that I did with Duncan at the time. You know, this was the, those videos were the foundation of what I wanted Duncan to look like. Like that was my, that was like my brand guide.
00:43:42
Speaker
your brand guide was frosted tips and skin cheats. Yeah, let's not talk about our hair this time.
00:43:54
Speaker
It's so wonderfully dated. This was the period in time, fashion-wise, where I was mistaken for Eminem at an airport three times. How is that fucking possible at all? I do not know. Oh, in the chin art. The chin art. I mean, you know, all of us white people look the same. yeah It's so true.
00:44:23
Speaker
Uh, but the great thing about how to be a player one and two is, uh, they were released, uh, as a combined DVD a few years later, like 2005, I believe. Um, and now they're both just up on YouTube. Although I seem to remember that like one of them's on the Duncan YouTube and one of them is just on some random dudes YouTube channel. Like I don't, yeah I don't understand why Duncan hasn't specifically put them up. Um, you know, something and it looks like it was ripped off. It looks like it was like. pulled off of the VHS, not like the digital. I'm sitting there like, I remember thinking about like, I'm like, I know they're not the greatest quality, but I think they're better than that. I've got the original digital files here somewhere. There's something we didn't, we didn't talk about though was the music. And that was a huge get. It was, it was, that was like, we worked with by that point being like North Florida, we were already buddies with less than Jake and had gotten, um,
00:45:21
Speaker
and had been on Warped Tour with them. And Vinny the drummer was starting Fueled by
Utilizing Local Connections for Music
00:45:28
Speaker
Ramen Records. Yeah, Fueled by Ramen had kind of just gotten off the ground and yeah we basically got blanket permission from him to use anything that was on the label. So we had, we had a ton of really good music on these and that was... Well, it there was hey but He didn't have a ton of music. you know like so like he we basically got like I got all of the albums from him because also I knew of the music industry at this point. you know and so It was that kind of like, hey, how can we help each other? I really don't have anything to offer you because by that point, we were also friends with like I was friends with like Epitaph and a couple of these other the labels, but they were in a position where they're like, well, we got to look out for our artists, but Fuel by Ramen,
00:46:12
Speaker
They were young. They were like, we just got to get our guys out there. So they were super supportive. So we were just like, this is a fuel by ramen release. Yeah. So we had, yeah, we had a bunch of fuel by ramen bands. We had, uh, multiple songs by less than Jake on both volumes. Um, but it was like, you know, edit again, like, can you put it in the context of the time you look at like, you know, the handful ah of other VHS videos that were out and They were just using the cheesiest garbage canned royalty free music that they could get their hands on. Like it was, there was no actual music on any of these other videos. No, because they were, because again, they were in those situations, the music was the, it was just audio filler versus we were like, no, no. Half the reason you watch these videos is again, like you want, you want cool, fun, exciting. It was, they were supposed to be exciting. So you want music that's exciting. But the challenge was, and this is definitely a division between you and I, what in this continued well into like other Duncan releases where you wanted to just put on the music that you liked. And I kept on being like, well, we still got to choose music that other people will like. And I was just like, I don't give a shit, dude. I went on stoits and annoy about, and on this next Duncan video and everybody else can just fuck right off. Oh man. So.
00:47:37
Speaker
Yeah. So there was, it was a matter of like, I was choosing, I was trying to choose songs that I liked and were good, but yet were not so like inaccessible that it would be like, wait, what is this crap? You know? so Yeah. I mean, for me, you know, I was always like, I liked some poppy stuff, but I was also like, hey, we could, maybe we could use this song by millions of dead cops. And you're like, yeah, maybe let's, let's skip that.
00:48:13
Speaker
Exactly. So yeah. So in the end, I think that we did a pretty good job of like, well, I mean, let's be honest with it happened because we were just like, this is what we want to do. So, I mean, that was, again, and that this seems to be like a ah very common theme, but, We didn't know any better. So we just did whatever we wanted, yeah you know, and we did whatever we thought was cool at the time to us. And we didn't, um, we didn't spend a lot of time obsessing over what we thought other people were going to think was cool. You know, we were very, at the time we were just young enough to be very confident in our own taste.
Reflecting on Youthful Confidence versus Current Self-Doubt
00:48:50
Speaker
very Rick Rubin Zen about it. And, uh, and we were just, we were like, this is fun and this is awesome. And this is what we're going to do. And we just let it out and people responded to it. But we had the advantage of no expectations. It's true. I mean, yeah, like if you look at what we were competing with at the time, like, you know, your mega and play max were basically the only companies that had videos out and they were. um They were perfectly serviceable for the time. They were expected. They were very expected. Um, they did the, they did the job of teaching you your tricks, but they didn't do a whole lot more than that. Yeah. And so like the, ah again, the idea that you could do it this way,
00:49:39
Speaker
Like nobody was going to tell us we were wrong. We had no, there was nothing to measure you against. So you didn't feel bad. You didn't second guess yourself. You just were like, this seems like fun. And it was so much easier to work in that environment. Like that mental environment. I've had like a little bit of like a crisis of faith in recent years with, with myself, with my own tastes, you know, and like trying to figure out, you know, working, doing what I'm doing with Caribou Lodge and like trying to, trying to do stuff that's still cool to me, but like not trusting myself and my own opinion of what's cool anymore. Cause I'm not, yeah I'm not the market anymore. You know what I mean? yeah Um, and so I don't want to fall into that trap of thinking that like everything needs to be for me and trying to like force everything into my tastes, but also
00:50:29
Speaker
you know, understanding that like at some point I have to just be comfortable with my own taste. Like it's, it's such a weird thing to have to like actively think about now. And then to look back at like how to be a player, it was like, it was so effortless. You know, it really, we didn't think twice about a lot. I mean, the you know, the logistics, you know, sure. Yeah. We had to like plan stuff out and, you know, panic about timelines and budgets and crap like that. But like, as far as the actual content, what do you mean? What's this? We, Kim Asabi, you, you had to worry about timelines and budgets and all this crap, but like we didn't, um, there was like no moment where we ever doubted what that, what we were doing was cool. Like not even for a second. Yeah, it was great.
00:51:17
Speaker
that kind of i yeah yeah yeah i would like to i would like to I would like to have all our our our listeners take a moment to notice that they are now hearing in real time a man having his midlife crisis. I mean, I would punch a nun off a swing set to have that kind of confidence in myself now. yeah
00:51:40
Speaker
ah man, the never, never discount the value of being young. and I mean, it did wonders for us. It really did.
Awkward Banter and Restart
00:52:23
Speaker
Hey, how do you feel about yo-yos and yo-yo accessories, Mark? You know what? I'm hip to them. I think that there's something there. How do you feel about punching children, Mark? ah Well, you know what I mean? When it's Friday night, what else are you going to do? All right, we're going to start that over. I want you to ah react negatively to the idea of punching children.