Transcript
Speaker: Welcome to another delightful episode of Why Why Why by Social Marie, your go-to podcast for sparking curiosity and diving into the world of social innovations. This time we have something truly special lined up for you.
Speaker: Hailing from Slovenia, Nika Kovács is joining us today. And she is not alone. Today's interview will be co-hosted by NonOtherDenŽiva, our project coordinator from Slovenia. She is bringing her charm and in insights to guide today's conversation.
Speaker: But don't you worry, folks. Jose, our ever-charismatic and regular host, is here with us too, because we just couldn't imagine an episode without him. So grab your favorite drink, settle in, and get ready to explore the creme de la creme of social innovations from Slovenia.
Speaker: And let's get this show rolling!
Speaker: Hello, everybody. Today i am very pleased to introduce Nika Kovac, a representative of a nominated project yeah of for Social Marie Award 2025, My Voice, My Choice.
Speaker: Nika is a very strong voice in in Slovenia, talking for women, ah representing women's rights. And i will not talk further. I will let Nika introduce herself.
Speaker: Please, Nika. Hi to all of you, my name is Nika and as it was said, I'm coming from Slovenia and I have the privilege and honor to be a director of Institute 8 of March, a group of um women fighting for social justice.
Speaker: And in the last year, we also coordinated My Voice, My Choice, an all European campaign to protect reproductive rights. This campaign is amazing because it managed to do something that a lot of people think unimaginable.
Speaker: ah You managed to activate the whole Europe. How did you manage to do that? Most of all, how did you even come to an idea that this is needed? Yeah, with a lot of hard work and suffering, but also a lot of joy.
Speaker: ah So basically, like I got the now almost three years ago when I was living and studying in the US. And at that time, I had the chance to see what happened when constitutional courts decided in the US to take away the reproductive rights from the women.
Speaker: And me and my best friend from France, we became like really obsessed with the idea how to protect abortion rights on the level of European Union. And what we discovered is that there is a special way how to do it, which is the European Citizens Initiative.
Speaker: um This is a special legal way how to propose to a European Commission a change of European law um and a change of how the European Union functions.
Speaker: What you need to do is that you need to prepare a legal document in which you propose a change and then collect one million signatures all across Europe. And we thought this will be easy. Women in the past did it like when they were fighting for our rights. We thought like one million signatures, like we will collect them um in different countries. There is a lot of people living in European Union.
Speaker: But we realized that it was like super hard because the page of the European Union when you where you need to like submit a signature is super slow. People need to put a lot of data in it. And we didn't know like organizations all across the Europe.
Speaker: So in last year, we were developing, we were finding out new ways how to organize people. um And at the end, we collected 1,200,000 signatures for safe and accessible ah abortion.
Speaker: And I believe we created the biggest movement in the history um of Europe for reproductive rights. Where does the magic happen or where is the secret?
Speaker: How did it happen? Why did it succeed? Yeah, you know, usually like the majority of those initiatives, they do not succeed. Like we are the 11th initiative, which was successful on the level of European Union.
Speaker: And I would say that the magic is within the people. like people who believe that the change is possible, people who go on the street, who collect signatures, people who spread hope, not fear, and people who were decided to actually do something.
Speaker: So what actually happened was that um after we got 500,000 signatures, we knew that our campaign is in a crisis. You know, it was this moment.
Speaker: It was summer. People were on holidays. No one wanted to do activism. And we started to think like what we should to do. And the idea which we got was to open a web page where we will be making activist matchmaking.
Speaker: So if you imagine that you are from a small city in Slovenia, other people from this small city could find you and you could all organize in person signature collection together. And um on the day um of um safe abortion, ah we organized the first in-person signature collection, which was happening in almost all the countries of European Union.
Speaker: And this was the moment when I knew that um the movement will succeed. But this wasn't your first try. You already did something similar in Slovenia beforehand, right?
Speaker: Yes. So my organization is like an organization which is now active for eight years. Like it's crazy. And in that time we managed to change like 14 different laws.
Speaker: um We started with the law to um about redefinition of rape. Yes means yes. um It was in the time of the Me Too movement. when so many people were talking about sexual harassment, when people were talking about the victims.
Speaker: And we said it's not enough to raise a awareness. um Now there is a moment when we need to change a law, when we need to accept the legal change ah which will protect victims of sexual harassment.
Speaker: So we did a huge campaign to do this with victims. um And at the the end, we managed to convince like almost all the people in National Assembly to support us. Then we led two different referendums, one against privatization of water and the other one um against politicization of the media, um get out and vote campaign for last elections.
Speaker: We led the campaign for free school lunches in all the schools um and many other different stuff. So um we believe that like democracy is something that belongs to all of us, that democracy is a beautiful system where you sometimes lose and sometimes lose wins, but every single citizen needs to be part of it.
Speaker: You also once mentioned that you consider yourself or the Institut of Osmi Marec kind of a feminist group, but not really the in the bad way, but in a very good way.
Speaker: Yeah, we believe that like feminism is fighting against all sorts of inequalities. So if we are speaking about poverty, we need to fight against poverty. If we are speaking about like problems with environment, we need to protect the environment.
Speaker: And we also always say we need men in this fight. you know It's not nothing that we... like um cant like We cannot do things alone. We need like different people from different levels of society who are joining us, who are doing stuff.
Speaker: um And we are also super proud on one additional thing. like People usually say these are young girls fighting for democracy, but I always say it's not just young girls. It's young girls and retired people who have a lot of time to be on the streets and to fight.
Speaker: And it's like this really, really beautiful community. And actually young girls and retired people are among the vulnerable groups everywhere. So it's very important that we fight for this kind of rights.
Speaker: And the fight comes from these people, not from somebody else fighting the fight for us. And why do you as an individual actually persist in in this in this mission? Because as you said, you've been doing this for eight years.
Speaker: You all do it but more or less voluntarily, which means it's a lot of time, a lot of energy, a lot of personal involvement in these campaigns.
Speaker: Yeah, you know, I never wanted to be an activist. I always wanted to have my own bookstore um and to read in peace and to um enjoy life. But then somehow life brought me to a situation situation where I needed to be what I am.
Speaker: And why we are doing this, even though it is hard, is because we believe a change is possible and we develop this beautiful community full of nice people who are fighting with us. And when you are part of the community, nothing is hard. And um we are doing because we all believe that we can make this world more beautiful.
Speaker: Thank you. I believe that as well. Jose, what would you like to add? I'm full of questions right now. The first one is, how do you deal with ah the powerful people that disagree with you?
Speaker: Everything looks like it's designed for powerful people to win. Right. So what would you recommend a person like me that doesn't know yet how to how to act or to react to ah powerful for people that is ah too influential?
Speaker: You know, like, um I think that the most important thing is to know what are you fighting for? What is your mission? What is your final goal? And for me, whenever i have like a final goal in front of my own eyes, I always know that I need to do everything to achieve this goal.
Speaker: And um I was facing a lot of death threats. Just today, someone wrote on my Facebook that he wants to rape me. Like a lot of terrible things that not a single woman, not a single person um should hear or should experience. I was physically attacked on the streets of Ljubljana.
Speaker: And for me, like what helps is that I am not too attached on myself, that I know that I'm just like one person. And if they do something to me, if they um attack me, if something happens to me, if they remove me, there will be other people fighting for this idea.
Speaker: And I think that our mission should be making ideas loud and clear. and speak about nice stuff and speak about things that are good and that can happen to us um and um believe that there will be always others who will fight when you won't be able to fight.
Speaker: And this is what is giving me hope. That's really wonderful because that means to me detach from the goal, focus on the goal and trust on the community.
Speaker: Yes. Right? I think yeah. And I also think that like... I think that we like we are living in neoliberal society, which is pushing us again and again and again to be focused on us, like on us as individuals, on our ego, on our needs.
Speaker: And what I always try to say to me again and again in a really hard situation, it's that this is not about me. Like I'm here and I'm just like... something where people can throw a lot of things into it because like I'm publicly known, but in reality, like we are fighting for ideas. We are fighting for real people who are like um in danger and it's our responsibility to do something for them.
Speaker: Super. Thank you so much for that. have a few more questions. um So now if we focus on Slovenia, ah what would you say is missing in our ecosystem for social innovation?
Speaker: I think that like, it's a really good question. I think that um there are like material conditions for people who wants to be innovative, like needs to be fulfilled.
Speaker: And I think that when you are like a young person who wants to do something, but you don't know how you will pay your rent, you don't know how you will pay for your food. um You have a precarious job, you don't know how to take some days off.
Speaker: um It's really hard to be creative and innovative. I always say that like I could create my own organization because I'm coming from a relatively privileged background. like My both parents are professors. I always had the option to live somewhere. I have my own apartment.
Speaker: um And I had the opportunity and time to think creatively. And I have some social security and safety. And I think that um in terms of Slovenia, we should push people less to be more creative, more innovative, but think more about how to give them life full of dignity, which gives us the condition to follow our dreams.
Speaker: And do you see that the Slovenian ecosystem is too different than the one in Europe? You know, I always say that we are super happy that we live where we live. I think Slovenia is one of the most beautiful places in the world.
Speaker: We have clean air, we have free universities, we have a public health care, we have so many amazing things which are like, making it possible for us to live very safe and comfortable life.
Speaker: And I also think that people in Slovenia are much more united than someone wants to convince us. I believe that like even though we vote for different parties, I believe even even though we believe in different gods, different religions,
Speaker: Like there are some things that we all have in common. And I think that like living in that kind of safe environment is actually something um which is making us very different from all other countries in the European Union.
Speaker: And I always say we don't have excuse to be miserable, to be sad, to have poor people. We are so small that we can protect everyone. I 100% agree with you. Everyone can sit on the same table in Slovenia.
Speaker: Yeah. And that's that's wonderful. Now, I would like to switch a bit to Social Marie. I would like to know what is the meaning for you of award ceremonies or initiatives like that that are trying to put ah the eyes of the public on social innovators?
Speaker: Yeah, you know, like we so often face such a big shit with our work. Like it's from death threats, from people attacking us, from threats with rape.
Speaker: um So often we are like also so insecure. Like I think people think that we are super brave and super loud. But every single day again and again, we are having a feeling that we are not enough, that we would need to do more.
Speaker: That um there are so many obstacles, you know, and sometimes when you're recognized and nominated for something, um it means that maybe you are doing something good, you know.
Speaker: And in all this mess, in all this like darkness, which is sometimes around us, it's giving you like the opportunity to say maybe we are doing something right. Now, you know, I've met so many people that would love to become a social innovator, a social entrepreneur, and they have a lot of questions.
Speaker: And i would love to know, what would you recommend anyone that wants to join this kind of new world of of social innovation? You know, like for me, the catch is in the community.
Speaker: Like I always think that we are presenting some people as superheroes. And I always say like, without my team, I am nothing. So if you find like a group of friends who is willing to work with you on some crazy ideas and who will trust you and who will work with you and who will fight, um then you can do anything.
Speaker: Like if I just speak about my voice, my choice, can you imagine that like a group of girls from Slovenia decided one day that they will collect 1 million signatures all across Europe and change a European law?
Speaker: And like now, if someone would say to me, will you do it again? I would think twice. But at that time, we just believed that we can do it and we didn't stop. And we didn't stop because we had each other.
Speaker: And it took you a year to do that, right? Yes, even more like a year and a half, because we needed to prepare like all the legal documents, all the creatives for the campaign. Like, and I need to say that most of us worked for at least like 18, 19 hours per day to make this happen.
Speaker: Jose, just like with Nika, we have seen an incredible rise in human rights defenders who use social media and viral content to advocate for human rights and social change. What's your take on this trend? How do you think the rise of new media platforms and the way people consume content today can drive meaningful societal transformations in future?
Speaker: but such ah That's such a great question. yeah It's clear that social media has changed a lot about how we live and connect. These platforms have a huge influence.
Speaker: They can shape opinions, spread ideas quickly, but also polarize people and create a completely distorted version of reality. They've even changed the way we interact with others on a daily basis, especially for younger generations.
Speaker: Now, even though ah there are definitely negative sides to it, I still believe the potential for positive impact is there. My latest reflection on this is that social media today feels more transactional than ever.
Speaker: People often use these platforms not to connect or build relationships, but to get something back. Likes, attention, followers, visibility, right?
Speaker: Or even validation. That's quite far from the original promise of social media, which was all about building communities, exchanging ideas, and ah bringing people together.
Speaker: Unfortunately, most platforms today have turned into marketplaces for attention or even engines of propaganda. For activists and human rights ah defenders, this creates a real challenge.
Speaker: Not only is it harder to have deep, meaningful conversations online, but sometimes communicating openly can even be risky. The platforms just aren't offering the conditions for safe, effective communication anymore.
Speaker: ah But here's the good news. New alternatives are starting to emerge. We're seeing platforms that are ah more aligned with the values of community and privacy.
Speaker: Things like Signal or a Blue Sky, which are decentralized, open source and not built ah around profit. Because the potential is still there, because the tech can be used in the right way, I'd encourage any social innovator, activist, or social entrepreneur to focus on community building, not just growing an audience, not to engage with this transactional way of using the Internet.
Speaker: And when I say community, I mean creating safe spaces, spaces where people can really show up, share openly, listen to each other and offer value to one another.
Speaker: That's where change starts, not with going viral, but with building trust, purpose and connection. On the other, more serious note, as hurt, being a human rights defender often comes with significant risks.
Speaker: In your view, what steps can we take as society to create a safer environment for human rights defenders to continue their vital work? Okay, so here is my um opinion.
Speaker: I think that our civilization is so focused on individualism that we often fail to recognize the people working every day to solve the problems our leaders and governments aren't addressing.
Speaker: social entrepreneurs, innovators, activists, e etc., are people dedicating their lives to human rights and societal issues. But they are often seen as fringe, ah they are misunderstood, ah they are even considered weird.
Speaker: i think that misunderstanding comes from the fact that we are using completely different metrics to define and to define success most people are taught to think in economic terms If something doesn't generate profit, it's hard to understand its value.
Speaker: Meanwhile, ah these defenders, these social entrepreneurs, are working with a completely different logic. oh They are looking for social impact.
Speaker: They are looking for solving social issues. I can't count how many times someone has asked me after I explain a project I'm working on, for example, but how does that pay you?
Speaker: And I get it. It's not a bad question, but it shows that there is a gap we have in how we understand value and contribution. So I believe the first step we need to take as a society to protect human rights defenders is education.
Speaker: Not just formal education, but cultural education. We need to help people understand the role these individuals play in building a more fair, sustainable society.
Speaker: That their work is valuable, even if it doesn't fit into the usual boxes. Even if it doesn't produce money
Speaker: In the last few years, I've also noticed something worrying. More and more powerful, wealthy, or influential individuals are flexing their muscles, using their position to force others to submission.
Speaker: Of course, bullies have always been there. But its inequality rises and power becomes concentrated in fewer hands. These abusive tendencies get louder, more visible and more normalized.
Speaker: That's why the work of the people ah we see at Social Marie, the projects, the ideas, the communities they are building, is more important than ever.
Speaker: They are pushing back against those imbalances. They are doing the work many don't see or don't dare to do. And they need our support, our attention, and our respect.
Speaker: So we need to educate our young people. We need to educate our leaders, the persons that are in charge of big institutions and organizations.
Speaker: so that everybody understands and values ah what they are doing.
Speaker: Oh no! And that's a wrap for today's captivating episode of Why Why Why by Social Marie. A huge thank you to Nika Kovac for sharing her story, making us ponder the why's that matter the most.
Speaker: A special shout out to my bestie, Jiva, for steering the conversation with her thoughtful questions and adding her own unique touch to the dialogue. I hope you will join us again soon. Thank you, dear listeners, for joining us on this journey. Don't forget to subscribe and stay tuned for more.
Speaker: Until next time, keep innovating and asking why, why, why. bye
