Transcript
Speaker: Well, you wonder whether, you know, as HOSPO, either even maybe some owner-operated pubs do become a bit more, how do you say, sort of conservative with their choices, you know, because of what's going on, and more and more pubs get bought up and become part of big chains where, by their very nature, the choice is either locked into one or two breweries. and not so If you can get the word out that you are really getting behind as many small local breweries as you can, and those breweries get behind you and amplify what you do you've got to think there's an opportunity there.
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Speaker: Hello and welcome to the Crafty Pine Podcast. I'm Will. I'm James and Will, i feel a bit of a sort laid back episode here. almost feel like we've sort of moved to, is it is this 60s or 70s vibe? I'm not quite sure with the curved furniture and me trying to sort of not slump too deeply into my sofa here. Yes, if you're watching in YouTube, we've we've moved across to a different studio for the time being, but you know, it's above 25 in Melbourne, so it's good to be a bit more relaxed.
Speaker: Yes, certainly relaxed here and lots to talk about considering last week was a bit of a disjointed one with the the the fake long weekend or whatever we have in Melbourne, whatever. we sort of sat down to work out what we're to discuss this week and got a bit of a bumper bumper weekly news roundup. Definitely. You've been you've been keeping busy, Will. You've been out and about. yeah well, I've been off ah you know exploring the world. ah Late last week, I went out to Croydon. Well, and when it comes to exploring the world, things don't get much better than heading out to Croydon. So yeah if people don't know Croydon, ah eastern suburbs of Melbourne...
Speaker: Yes, Eastern suburbs of Melbourne. I was checking out the new Bright Tap House, which ah we broke the story on the site a couple of months ago, just before I went away. ah They took over. It was a Dainton brewery site. Before that, it was opened as the public brewery.
Speaker: I popped along there. It opened this weekend, just gone by. i snuck in on Friday to say, g'day to the team, check it out. It's a beautiful venue. um i was trying I did go in when it was a public brewery, soon after it opened, but then I realized that was about 10 years ago. No, it was a while ago. I went out but before they even opened because they had the um brew your own beer set up at the front as well as the the bigger brewery. Always been a beautiful venue with that lovely sort of beer garden out at the back as well. um But yeah, I guess it's been through a few iterations, but you'd think if anyone's going to have a bit of longevity there, it should be bright given they're already 20 years plus um in the high country.
Speaker: Yeah, they definitely know to run hospitality as well as, as well as make beer. It's actually, it was a grain store. It's very beautiful, old, almost barn-like, but it feels a bit like wedding kind of a place you might get married in a wine area right near Croydon Station though. So right in the sort of center of that. You've already got married in one brewery this year, Will. Don't get any ideas for a second one. No, definitely not. Yeah. They've, Bright have really broken up the spaces really nicely. So there's very different areas that feel very different within the one venue. They've got 20 taps of their beers, takeaway pizzas. They've gone for a very broad food menu as well to make it really accessible. Will you say all the pizzas are gluten-free, is that right? All of them. James, you'll have to take the family. Take my daughter there. She'll be delighted. Yes, definitely. Yeah. It's a great, it was a great looking space. Great to check it out. Roaring fire at the back. And they're not brewing there, purely hospitality. Is that right? Yeah. They've taken what the brewery that was there up to the high country because they actually haven't had a small brewery for some years now. So this will give them better opportunity to explore play. Not that Bright have been one of those breweries that are pretty happy to experiment. So not that they've slowed themselves down with the production.
Speaker: brery But this will give them even more room to trial stuff, test batches, small limited runs, all that kind of thing. Yeah. Cool. And it's near the station um as well. So nice, easy to get to for people. Yes, definitely. Look, looking at the photos from the weekend and and that kind of thing. And also being there on Friday, you could tell locals were ready for this place to open. It was like, you know, a classic delay of only um a mere month, with it which happens a fair bit. But, you know, ah there was a lot of people poking their heads in, few people going in to buy a couple of four packs. Like, ah yeah, locals very much um ready for it to happen.
Speaker: It's in an area of Melbourne that kind of has a lot of big, ah big box pubs with, you know, pokies and that kind of thing. Not somewhere you'd probably take your family, not somewhere you'd want to go with a large group of friends and unless you all had gambling problems. Before wanting to develop them. Yes. So, you know, I'm i'm sure it'll work out well for Bright. They definitely, they've um refined the venue in a really nice way.
Speaker: Excellent. And I guess sticking on the topic of Victorian independent beer, um you visited another venue rather close. it's actually, I guess, the closest good pub to where we're sat now. For some reason, we still haven't managed a ah we needed crafty slash full-measure team day out there. But we have all been overseas and doing various things. um The Woodlands, and which has been a great supporter of um craft beer, independent beer for a long time, but has become an even better supporter in the last couple of weeks. So you popped up to re redo their listing on crafty. Yeah, seven minute walk, according to Google Maps. I would have done it in four at least. That's just because you knew there was an IPA waiting at the other end. so Well, I knew about all this independent beer. So, you know, they've um they've long championed independent beer. it's
Speaker: The team from the Rainbow took it over in 2019. All these dates are really aging me. It's like, is it that? long since they they took it over. Yeah, I remember popping in like sort of in the midst of COVID and was like, God, that's actually a long time ago now. So they did have some line on tap, particularly Fixation, one of the co-owners and Dave who sort of steers the venue very much. and He's always there. he He's a big Fixation IPA man. They had Guinness as well, Stone & Wood, but... um More recently, just a couple of months ago, they were like, okay, no, let's let's just do independent beer at the moment. They've tried to they've also really singing about it, about why it's important to support independent beer, what it means, those kinds of things. ah Yeah.
Speaker: We put out um people really excited to see what they've done with it. Yeah. I mean, they've got. what, 18, 16, sorry, taps in the front bar. They've got a container bar at the back. They've also got further taps upstairs. Like it's a sprawling, beautiful pub and it's great to see that they've sort of doubled down on what they're good at. They also, Dave said, you know, I'm not gonna always do this, but at the moment, the front bar taps are individual, like they're getting a lot of different beers in, rotating through, supporting a lot of people. And he's like, it's working so well for us right now, which is, you know, in these, this era of doom and gloom, it's lovely to just be like, no, we can just put a double IPA on. Sours are working quite well for us. We'll just keep rotating through different beers. Well, you wonder whether, you know, as HOSPO, either even maybe some owner operated pubs do become a bit more, um, how'd you say sort of conservative with their choices?
Speaker: you know because of what's going on and more and more pubs get bought up and become part of big chains where by their very nature the choice is either locked into one or two breweries. um and not so good If you can get the word out that that you are really getting behind as many small local breweries as you can and those breweries get behind you and amplify what you do, you've got to think there's an opportunity there. We talked about it with Ian Ling last year from the Lincoln you know about this golden age of pubs that if you do it well, There's so few there's an opportunity if you do something really well, you know do the food well, do the experience well, do the hospitality, do the drinks well, and get the message out there because it's a point of difference. um and you know we've had and We did a new listing recently for Bottle Keg Can, New South Wales. you know They're initially a bottle shop about to open their bar at the back, all independent, only in sporting breweries under a certain size as well. You were at Elwood, EB Co Taproom the other week in Elwood, 100% independent.
Speaker: You know, we need need to get behind and celebrate these people. You know, there's there's a place for everything. And, you know, and we've talked about that about this over the last 10, 15 years that even the bigger, you know, i guess, you know, and multinational owned brands, if they are putting a Bolter XPA or a Stone & Wood Pacific Ale in front of someone who's never had anything other than a big box lager. That does help change taste. But, you know, it's such a struggle for small businesses, you know, as the likes of Bolter and Stonewood once were that, you know, really getting behind and celebrating and supporting these venues that are willing to take even those, you know, i guess, safe bet beers off tap. um It's cool. You know, and if anyone else is out there and is doing the same thing, you know, we'd love to hear from you and and celebrate what you're doing as well. Yeah, definitely. And, you know, there's a reason you go into the woodlands and there's a lot of families there. There's a very diverse mix of people. They're going there because they... They like giant, giant wooden toy soldiers. Yeah, it's a very, it's kind of like a... theme park. It is. It's ah it's a fascinating pub, but...
Speaker: You know, and it's one of the few non-corner pubs in Melbourne as well, which which I like about it. It looks kind of looks like a castle from the distance. It does, yeah. i You know, people are going there because the experience they get is different from other places. And, you know, as a lot of places reduce their range, this is a perfect time. I i personally think to go like, no, we we're going the opposite direction. Come here. You'll be supported. You're going to find something different and delicious to taste all the time, every time you come in, even if you come in twice a week or three times a week. Yeah, yeah that's great. So, we yes, I'm now thinking have there this afternoon, but, you know, just here let's just call this quits now, guys. We'll we'll complete this this week's weekly news next week. um
Speaker: Anyway, so moving from here and now to, I guess, a bit of a slice of history that takes in both this country, big beer, small beer, hops, New Zealand, bit of everything. A bit of everything. You've been chatting to couple of brothers who have done a huge amount of stuff in many facets of the the local beer industry here New Zealand who are calling it quits. Yeah. So Matt and Doug Donnellan, Doug Donnellan, we featured a few times on the site before when he left New Zealand hops. He, yeah, he ran New Zealand hops and was sort of the first, but basically general manager and then CEO to really steer it. He, he,
Speaker: led the, well, basically the name changes like Mottwek, all these varieties are named after New Zealand locations. That was very much Doug Steer saw it. Before that, he was at Malt Shovel Breweries, head brewery, long time, spent at ha working with Chuck Hahn and that, and his brother, Matt Donnellan, who we had featured on the site a few times, but ah Yeah, I didn't know much about Matt. I'd never met him before. um i'd met I've met Doug a few times. It was really lovely to catch up with him. In particular, he owned ah St. Peter's Brewery in the suburb of St. Peter's. Yeah, well, that was one of the first breweries I ever went to visit in Sydney when i was starting the Crafty Pint. I had a great chat with Matt. He was making a lovely pilsner. He had a cinnamon, spice beer, a cinnamon girl. um Told me he was a titanist, which I had to go and look up. um his his His particular but political story. I had to go and do a bit of reading that. described it having a healthy mistrust of authority. Yeah. But yeah, two two um real characters. Yeah. And so they and they've decided to both sort of... Well, they're both coincidentally. I mean, they studied at the same time, food tech. They've both retired at the same time, effectively. So Matt most recently was working... at, uh, Mountain Goat Newtown. So with the closure of that, which is just this weekend, I think. Yeah. Has become young Henry's new home. Uh, Matt, uh, decided to retire. He was only working there a couple of days. ah He said that he reached out to the team at Mountain Goat and Asahi. Uh, Mick Bentley, he was running Mountain Goat at the time. He's now at HBA. And and he said there was a Matt shaped hole in Mountain Goat Newtown where he could just work for a couple of days, and brewing there, you know,
Speaker: St Peter's Brewery ran from 2000 to 2016. I mean, we talk a lot about the Inner West Ale Trail, how it's, you know, so many breweries now. Matt really led the way there at a time when you couldn't have ah hospitality offering really because councils couldn't understand it it was It was a fairly rustic setup. He built it himself. you know he he never He was like, I never lost any money or anything like that. yeah he was a bit of a hand-to-mouth subsistence occasionally, but he always paid his bills. He only sold beer into the six suburbs around, um had this real village brewer mentality. And I think really importantly... um He called it a sort of, he did this informal internship where anyone who wanted to brew with him, he would invite around and it would be over two days a week for three weeks. So sort of six days in total and show people around. One of those people was Ben Holtstock who went on to co-found and is a head brewer at H.Normal and also Brodie French, head brewer at Hawkesbury. I spoke to both of them for the story.
Speaker: Both of them were actually on holidays and they both got back to me immediately, which says a lot about that and how much they look after him as brewer. um You know, he he showed them around, showed them the ropes, didn't told them how hard working the brewery was. Both of them said, you know, we reached out to so many breweries and they wouldn't be in the industry without them. um I really loved what Brodie had to say in particularly where he talked about, like, we talk about how collaborative the industry is and that we're open books. And you like to think that maybe, you know, that's because of you or you invented it in the industry. it's It's because of people like Matt. that He was always an open book, loved working with people, loved showing them around and building them up. So yeah, I mean, cheers to both of them for retiring. um You know, a lot of, yeah, really big figures in the industry. They both started brewing in the late eighties. They were home brewing together. basically since Gough Whitlam legalized home brewing in the mid seventies. A lot of stories to tell about traveling to America and and that kind of thing. But yeah, they're both- A lot of stories that tick Will Siebel's interests as well. Politics, history, travel, beer. Big time. but
Speaker: But yeah, I mean, shout out to them. Like ah incredible careers on both sides of the Sassman. But um yeah, they've really inspired a lot of people. And yeah, really nice when you talk- how quickly you can find people to say kind words about people who've just retired as well. says a lot about them. So yeah, with that, I think we should probably take a quick break, James. Sounds great. And we'll come back and start again in another part of New South Wales. Cheers.
Speaker: Cheers.
Speaker: Registrations for CIBD 2027 are now open. Held in Brisbane from the 15th to the 18th of March, 2027, the edition of the Chartered Institute of Brewers and Distillers Convention is a must attend for every forward thinking brewery and distillery.
Speaker: This year's theme is Brewing and Distilling, the Adaptive Future, Resilience, Relevance, Reinvention. Celebrating innovation and craftsmanship, the convention brings together professionals from across the Asia-Pacific region and beyond to share knowledge, explore new ideas and strengthen the connections that make our industry so collaborative and compelling.
Speaker: From match to mastery, the future of our industry will be defined not by volume alone, but by value, quality, adaptability and bold leadership. This convention is an opportunity for attendees to contribute to that future together.
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Speaker: Welcome back. And James, last week's guests managed to pick up a bit of gold at a different kind of award to the one you'd normally see a brewery achieve well at, hey? That's right, yeah, yeah. So last week's guest was Oisin Sweeney, one of the founders and head brewer at Jervis Bay Brewing Co. This week they have picked up gold at the new New South Wales Tourism Awards in their category, which is brewery and distillery. um Also a shout out to the business that came second is Husk um Rum Distillery up on the Sunshine Coast. um But yeah, so I believe it's the second year in a row that Jervis Bay have picked up gold in the category. um
Speaker: ah But we talked we definitely sort of talked about this the tourism side of things, being on the south coast with Oisin last week, and it has sort of been central to what they do, but I'm sure they'll be pretty chuffed. See, when you're in a beautiful part of the world, you kind of don't have to do anything, do you? So it says a lot. Just be open. Yeah, you just need to exist. So when you're picking up awards for also what you're doing in the community and to bring people in, that kind of says a lot because the beach is doing a lot of the work. I think so. But also, you know, where they are isn't, you know, they're the beach. They're actually on an industrial estate just, you know, a little bit inland. So just shows that what they're doing, you know, guess celebrating, you know, the local region and bringing people in even if it isn't, you know, sat there on a beach looking out over the waves rolling in, is doing it well. So congratulations to those guys. You can obviously check out last week's long form, we call them these days, extended interview. It's still up on all the platforms now. Yes, go check it out if you haven't heard it yet. And another brewery worth celebrating in New South Wales, Sunday Road Brewery, who I caught up with just late last week. Yeah, well, we had Brad and Mick on our end of year series for 2025. had chat there, year in 2025 at Sunday Road. Picked up a few trophies along the way. To be honest, there's been pretty much a sort of constant success story, I think, at Sunday Road, from when they started out, Contract Brewers, whatever you want to call it, brewing elsewhere. The beers were always very good from the start. They've picked up a few trophies along the way at Aber's and that kind of thing. They just seem very well loved.
Speaker: beers are always good. They seem to present themselves in a very sort of, you know, positive way. And I think when we called in with them last time, they were talking about this expansion that's now sort of finally coming to fruition well. Every time I've spoken to Brad for the last three or four years, he's been talking about this expansion. Well, when I was reading article other day, I'm like,
Speaker: Pretty sure when we went to see him back in February, this expansion was coming. So I guess these things do take time. Yeah. It's been massively delayed. I love Brad's unbridled optimism though. Getting off the phone from with him, I was like, oh my God, he's just such a positive fellow. i thought 2026 was pretty rough. Maybe I was wrong. Well, I even asked, you know, are you moving more into o but your own hospitality because wholesale is tough? And he was like, look, maybe we're in our own little world, but... We're still finding a really strong market for our beers, um for the limited releases. We're not slowing down on that at all. The new venue, they've sort of stopped, I mean, it's in the story, but they' they've kind of stopped talking about it a bit as well because it's been so delayed. It should be open soon. The building's going on right now. um
Speaker: They're also really doubling down on beer service. They'll have. uh, traditional English, uh, casks. Um, they'll have Luca sidepaws. They've designed the, uh, proper sort of sink baths, put the handle, the check handles in, which Brad said he had to get sort of specially designed himself. Like they're yeah, really excited about it. you know, showcasing beer in a certain way. They'll also add us still in there, but yeah, it was great to reflect on 10 years. I love Brad saying, he's like, you know, every time we release a beer, it's a highlight, like yeah yeah you know, it never gets old. Like he's yeah still as passionate as he was since day one. And the reason for chatting wasn't because this venue is getting closer to potentially being open. It's 10 years, even and even that might be confusing. you If you...
Speaker: know Sunday road and live locally and have been going there since the venue opened. That was 2019. But the first beers were out 2016. So it was a bit of a, um yeah, having a chat because they were 10 years in and just finding what's going on. Yeah. And those three years are before they had the brewery as well, like Brad built some really good strong relationships, obviously. I remember talking to their brewer Mick when they opened and he was like, you know, we're brewing Enigma, which is sort of the flagship. He's like, it's just going out the door straight away because like there was already such demand and interest for it because Brad had really done the hard work early on to to build strong relationships. And and that's that's only just gotten better and better. The collaborations they do often with local sports club, local businesses, like they really tie tightly into their community, which Southern Australia is one of those slightly. um
Speaker: ah Sydney is always, for me as a man who's used to the Melbourne grid, you know, it's ah it's multiple cities in in one. And Southern's one of those places where people who live there want to work there. It's got beautiful beaches. It's kind of a very insular part of of Sydney. Well, and I remember when we were driving up, when we did our road trip sort of starting down in Milton and making our way north last year, we sort of hit the outer sort of southern edges of Sydney and we were driving for about 40 minutes before we even got to Sunday Road. So it really is, ah but it feels like a whole bunch of cities together. um Good stuff. And I guess you we mentioned their success with the awards. and Another award that's upcoming at the start of next year is the Royal Queensland Beer Awards. um Submissions open for them on the 16th of November. It's a pretty quick turnaround. The awards itself takes place on February the 4th, with judging on February the 2nd and 3rd. We're media partners for them again. We're media partners for the first time last year, and they had a 30% uplift in ah entries. So don't let us down. Yeah, yeah we we need at least 50 this year. So um so yeah so that opens on the 16th. And if you make spirits as well, um ah our sibling publication, The Full Measure, is a media partner for the Royal Queensland Distilled Spirits Awards. um The awards take place on the same day, February the 4th, but the ent entry is open two days later on November the eighteenth So do get your entries in there. I believe Neil Desperandum, who had some Sunshine Coast-based rum distillers, who just overnight picked up ah another major award in um and States. They are the reigning champs there. So if you want to try and have have a... have a pop at Nil Desperandum, which it seems like a pretty tough gig because they they seem to win everything wherever they go at the minute, then November the 18th is the day for you. um And I guess talking of something that we'll be up to, we mentioned it a couple of weeks ago on the show, we've sold half the tickets now. So if you do want to join us for our second Crafty Cheer at Molly Rose on December the 2nd, then we'll include a link for tickets there and get in pretty quick. We've confirmed the full lineup now, Will. So um on the beer front, we have Wren Blackman joining us from Blackman's Brewery. um I think we were thinking inviting him anyway, and then he won the Crafty Pite-sponsored Champion Media um Trophy, the the beer championships. That made sense. We'll also have Kat Howes, the head brewer, and Callum Riggs, one of the founders from Kaiju, coming along. All the Ks and Cs, or heart hard seas
Speaker: And Cal is a guy who looks really good in a Christmas sweater as well. So I don't know if we've asked him to wear one or not, but we will have to. Did I wear, don't know wore Christmas sweater last year. If not, we'll have to do it. We'll have to get some ugly sweaters. Cal just looks like he was designed to wear them all round. Is it the quiff that does it maybe? Potentially. And then on the spirits front, we have Chantel from King Lake Distillery coming along. I'm not sure what she'll be pouring. Presumably a whiskey, I'm guessing. And also the guys from Tano Spirits in Northcote. They're doing some amazing stuff. Got to go and check them out. They're making shochu and koji and Japanese-style spirits. Amazing-looking venue they've got there in Northcote. Something that I wasn't aware of until a few weeks ago. had them on the podcast recently on The Full Measure. Just pretty amazing to discover all these really cool things that happening. around the world of Australian spirits. So yeah, December the 2nd, come and join us. It'll be four courses of sharing food, cocktail, beers from each of those brewers and some spirits as well. And you know, whole bunch of festive cheer to kick off, kick off December.
Speaker: Yeah. Tickets are selling very fast. So make sure you grab yours now and come and enjoy a fine meal with us. And if you enjoy this podcast and make sure you like subscribe, leave us a review, tell your mates, Yeah, definitely tell your mates. ah Great. Thanks for joining us, James. I'll see you next week. so Thanks for joining you. I'm part of this world. I was talking to the audience. Oh, I see. I thought you said thanks for joining us, James. Anyway, it's lovely to be here with you, Will, and lovely to be here and in this lovely casual studio for the week. um We'll see you in a few days' time. Cheers.
Speaker: Cheers.
Speaker: The Crafty Pint Podcast is produced and edited by me, Matt Hoffman. For all partnership inquiries, please reach out to Craig Williams at craig at craftypint.com. To keep up to date with everything in Australian craft beer, head to www.craftypint.com.
