Transcript
Zachary Jeblonski: Hello, hello. Welcome to another episode of Midlife's Crisis. I'm Zach. I'm joined again by Charles. How are you doing today?
ciderspence: Good, Zach. How you doing?
Zachary Jeblonski: I'm doing better. We're getting there Bit by bit. Today was the first day I didn't take any medicine this morning, so. I was like... Just. Climbing a hill, and you know.
ciderspence: Nice. Yeah, that's a big that's a big milestone.
Zachary Jeblonski: Speaking of movies, what did you think of... a Pride and prejudice.
ciderspence: Well, we saw Sense and Sensibility, which I...
Zachary Jeblonski: Or sense of sensibility. Sorry, two different words.
ciderspence: I also basically think it's Pride and Prejudice, and my wife said the stories are pretty similar. I'll take her word for it.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: But yeah, I really enjoyed the movie. So. I remember that. She said she wanted to see it from a trailer we saw. And last week we saw the Street Fighter movie, so I owed her.
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh, i need to I need to ask about that too. How was the Street Fighter movie?
ciderspence: I mean...
ciderspence: It was as expected. I would say it. It. delivered and underwhelmed at the same time. Like. I will basically say I expect that my wife had a. neutral to miserable time.
ciderspence: But I had a great time.
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh. Okay.
ciderspence: But yeah, I mean, it was it was a bad movie that I enjoyed seeing. I'm considering seeing it again because I wanted to see it with my college roommate who I used to play Street Fighter with. basically throughout our... college time together.
ciderspence: There was like a...
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: arcade machine in the in the student center and we would just meet up there at night and play we play against each other there was this other weird guy who was in there sometimes we had all sorts of jokes about him so it was just like It was a formative part of much of my life, so I wasn't going to miss it. We saw the Mortal Kombat movie because it was kind of like Street Fighter.
ciderspence: So, but yeah, i was I was excited about the movie.
Zachary Jeblonski: Uh, Yeah.
ciderspence: i'm glad i went to see it it was not good But. I loved it.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay. Yeah. That's interesting. Cause like. I'm a big Mortal Kombat fan. And. The more comic movies have been letting me down, man, the last two. But I saw both of them in theaters. I had to do it.
Zachary Jeblonski: But yeah, I've been really interested in the Street Fighter movie, but I think I'm at... you know, at this point in my schedule, it's definitely going to be out the way for it to come out to streaming, but I'll probably check it out when it comes out in streaming.
ciderspence: Yeah, I think that's right. I feel like you could probably watch a 10 minute mashup that. gives you the hits and save yourself the rest of that. Hour and 50 minutes.
Zachary Jeblonski: Ooh. Okay. All right
ciderspence: unless Unless you really liked Street Fighter, and I really... like Street Fighter. So.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay. Yeah, I was more of a Mortal Kombat guy growing up than a Street Fighter guy so I don't have quite the attachment to Street Fighter. But the trailers really sold me on that movie. but
ciderspence: Yeah, if you were a Mortal Kombat guy growing up...
Zachary Jeblonski: I guess.
ciderspence: I'm guessing that at two hours long, you won't have the strength to. Finish him. If you know what I'm saying.
Zachary Jeblonski: I look. Yeah. really like that callback there. I pick it up what you're putting down, you know. But my propensity for bad movies, I have quite the the tolerance for them.
Zachary Jeblonski: a friend and i a friend of A friend of mine, we... We'll usually watch one or two bad movies every time we see each other. Because, we you know, we we we don't see each other often because we're we... geographically in two different spots but I think i can so i can I can soldier through it.
Zachary Jeblonski: I watched a movie recently that might be of interest to you because. It's a technically, I guess, a kid's movie. that I really enjoyed.
Zachary Jeblonski: which was Coyote vs. Acme.
ciderspence: Yeah, we saw that too. Not the family, just me and my wife.
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh yeah. Okay, yeah, I really enjoyed that movie. I was a Wile E. Coyote. uh fan growing up i used to watch looney tunes all the time growing up And I thought that movie was really good. I really enjoyed that movie.
ciderspence: Yeah, I think we My wife... My wife and I both had a... a positive A neutral to positive. experience at the movie. But I think We both kind of fell asleep in the middle.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: I think the story was fine, but it wasn't like... I don't know. I didn't find it especially compelling on the storytelling front or the action front I'm like, you know. Since the last two movies I saw were Street Fighter, that was compelling on the action front, and Sense and Sensibility, that was compelling on the story front.
ciderspence: So I feel like those are the axes where I like. derive most of my enjoyment from movies and Kyrie vs. Acme was... Kind of thinky, but...
ciderspence: Not like... It wasn't like a zingy. It wasn't like Gilmore Girls. It was more like. I don't know, something that has a It was like a documentary.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, i I think. I think, I think it's precisely why I liked it because it's so weird because like. It's... you know there's like kid hooks to it right you know why the coyote does his thing But it's really about like bringing humanization to this. cartoon character wiley coyote so i almost looked at it in the through the lens of Who framed Roger Rabbit a little bit.
ciderspence: And it's also about lawyers, so of course you liked it.
Zachary Jeblonski: I know it is also about lawyers, which is why, you know, but I do. I just I like the characterization of Wile E. Coyote. I like the. I'm not going to lie, man. I'm not made of stone. You know, the ending scene when...
Zachary Jeblonski: uh roadrunner asked if wiley coyote's coming back i was like got me in the feels it got me in the feels
ciderspence: I was... Well, whatever. i don't want We probably shouldn't talk for 20 minutes about this movie, but there's a...
Zachary Jeblonski: It's our podcast.
ciderspence: seat are Can we...
Zachary Jeblonski: We can do whatever we want.
ciderspence: Okay, look. There's a scene in the middle where like. Okay. that Wiley is friends with this detective and there's a moment where the detective becomes uncertain.
ciderspence: of Wiley's true motives, okay?
Zachary Jeblonski: Yes.
ciderspence: uh
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: And that scene... Made me just very confused about. what our later Understanding was supposed to be about the relationship between the coyote and the roadrunner. Did you see? The movie where the woman puts on a helmet and talks to gophers or beavers or something it's an animated movie jumpers hoppers Hoppers.
Zachary Jeblonski: No, I never saw it. I think I'm regularly familiar with it, yeah.
ciderspence: There's a scene where this woman... what This woman, is trying she's an activist, she's trying to save a forest or something. she tries to hop into the body of a beaver, I think. and talk to the other beavers.
ciderspence: And there's this one scene where... She's running around and there's like a bear. And the bear is about to eat one of the beavers. And she stops the bear from eating the beaver. And all the other beavers look at her, they're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, what are you doing?
ciderspence: And she's like, what? He was about to get eaten by that bear. And they're like, yeah, I know. Sometimes beavers get eaten by bears.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: And then she was like. oh okay well if you guys are all cool with it bear go ahead and eat that beaver and the bear was like no no no you ruined it for me i'm not in the mood anymore So.
Zachary Jeblonski: That's pretty good.
ciderspence: But it's just that's kind of how I felt about this. revelation in the relationship of the of the relationship between the friendly relationship i guess between the the roadrunner and the coyote it's like the coyote was saying he wanted to eat the roadrunner like they can't really be friends
Zachary Jeblonski: So.
ciderspence: the roadrunner might understand the struggle, but they are.
Zachary Jeblonski: Look.
ciderspence: they're mortal enemies like one of them wants to consume for dinner the other one that's not You can't be friends with that.
Zachary Jeblonski: And that's what, but but i I like that because it's like. Oh man, it it almost gets a little meta, which is like, yes, the relationship remains the same and that why the coyote wants to eat the roadrunner and roadrunner doesn't want to be eaten by the coyote.
Zachary Jeblonski: But at the same time, almost like. I think the idea is that both Roadrunner and Wiley Coyote Enjoy the Sisyphine task. That they're both... You know, like, Roadrunner enjoys being chased by Wile E. Coyote, I think is ultimately what it is.
Zachary Jeblonski: And then Roadrunner gives why they could he sense a purpose. You know, it's like kind of the way I read that. And. And I think they both miss that. they You know, Roadrunner missed being Chase.
Zachary Jeblonski: And Wile E. Cody misses chasing him. You know, I don't know. i Yeah, at the end of the day, that's what the why the Coyote won. And at the end of the day, Riverrunner... equally doesn't want to be eaten.
Zachary Jeblonski: And I think. they both have an appreciation for the other's desire in a way, you know?
ciderspence: Yeah, that's what I, I, I just, if someone wants to kill me, I don't have an appreciation for their desire to want to kill me. Even if I derive some perverse entertainment and like. avoiding being killed. Like, I think it's.
ciderspence: i I just don't. I don't.
Zachary Jeblonski: I sort of see it like.
ciderspence: That message needed some refinement in my in my mind.
Zachary Jeblonski: or Or maybe... I think there's two different ways I can also think about it. now You know, like you're you're certainly entitled. I'm not trying to like convince you, but like. I almost look at it as like a Batman.
Zachary Jeblonski: Joker thing a little bit. Where the Joker deep down kind of wants Batman to chase and catch try and catch him right like kind of similar
ciderspence: But wouldn't you think it was wrong if Batman deep down wanted the Joker to keep murdering people so that he'd catch him?
Zachary Jeblonski: And.
Zachary Jeblonski: I know. I know.
ciderspence: But isn't isn't that...
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: Isn't that not? novel or interesting but it but actually problematic. Like. I don't know. but one My daughter was asking me if there were bad guys.
ciderspence: Like if that was like a real thing that happened in life and I was like, yeah. There are bad guys. I mean, hopefully we'll never interact with them. She's like, you don't want us to ever see a bad guy. And I was like, I don't think you get what a bad guy is like.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: That's that's when someone commits a crime. Those are things you don't want to have happen. She's like. oh, but the police stop crimes. I was like, yeah, but I mean, ideally, they wouldn't have any crimes to stop. And then she's like, would there be no police? And I was like, well, that's tricky. But I don't think we should want crime because we think police are cool, right?
ciderspence: So I don't know.
Zachary Jeblonski: You know what?
ciderspence: maybe Maybe she's right. I don't know.
Zachary Jeblonski: I don't know. Like, I see your point, though. I mean, like, certainly, like... and i also think that goes to the movie strength a little bit that we're even having this conversation about why the coyote and roadrunner which is this like five minute shorts from the 40s and 50s or whatever but
ciderspence: That's fair. That's fair
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. I, I don't know. I, and you know, a lot of the, you know, to be fair, a lot of this is covered by my own, my own nostalgia. Why the Cody was. you know, above and before beyond one of my favorite cartoon characters growing up.
Zachary Jeblonski: And I laughed my butt off in the beginning of that movie when they kind of reenacted a bunch of his famous scenes. I was like, they still hit for me, you know? So.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, I'm glad that movie came out. Yeah, I want to see more of that. Like, you know, my wife was mentioning like at the end of the movie. the law firm kind of becomes like the go -to place for all these.
Zachary Jeblonski: cartoons i want to sue acme or and stuff like that i'm like i would watch a
ciderspence: Right.
Zachary Jeblonski: you know,
ciderspence: You want to watch their other cases?
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh, yeah, I would watch a Pepe, you know, not not Pepe Le Pew. He's problematic. Maybe like. You know, Marvin the Martian versus Acme. I'd watch that movie. you know or whatever like
ciderspence: I feel like Marvin the Martian has some interesting... claims. That's fair.
Zachary Jeblonski: Bugs Bonney versus Acme? That'd be good, right? like So anyway, we are ostensibly a magic podcast.
ciderspence: well I don't know what you're talking about. That that whole 10 minutes was magic. You're welcome, everybody.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. maybe maybe we'll Maybe we'll just put a little movie addendum in the beginning of our podcast. Nobody can stop us. All right. You want to talk about some games?
ciderspence: Well, speak of transitions. I only got in one game this week.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: But that game came with a story.
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh.
ciderspence: So. I think I've mentioned on the podcast a few times that I've been trying to put together this Megatron deck. Because I have i have a Transformers deck, but I saw the Transformers movie with that same buddy I was telling you I wanted to see the Street Fighter movie with.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: We saw that movie maybe three or four weeks ago together in theaters. And I was like, man, it's awesome to be back in the world of Transformers. I want to put together another Transformers deck. So I identified Megatron.
ciderspence: And I started working on it. And it just, I don't know, it just wasn't. It didn't excite me. I got a bunch of the cards. I like got as far as bringing some lands together. I was trying to put together a deck.
ciderspence: and i just i just can't finish it like everything else i see i'm more driven towards. But this week... I had about the same feelings, maybe a little stronger. Because again, I went to the Street Fighter movie and I was like, okay, look.
ciderspence: I know I have complicated feelings about my Chun -Li magic deck.
Zachary Jeblonski: I was like I know where this is going and
ciderspence: But I 100 % insist on honoring her this week. in a game So. I spent. A lot of time. Thinking through what do I want this deck to be because I didn't So I think.
ciderspence: and You've heard me talk about the Chun -Li deck. It was fun to play. but it It came close enough to winning that it was agonizing to lose and it hasn't won yet I've played it a few times and like it's just I don't know. It feels a little too Sisyphean.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: So I want to play it. I'm committed to playing it until it wins. but Because it's like now and it does it's not gonna feel good until it finally gets a win. It's not like as fun to play as other stuff that I reach for.
ciderspence: So I decided. i'm going to look through my collection and see if i have another chun li like the card Because what I would love to do is build another deck. Like, not even touch that first deck. I'll figure out what to do with it in the future, but I want to find a deck. That is fun to play.
ciderspence: still has a chance to win. but that has a theme. that I can enjoy playing even if I don't win. So I went with Heavy Kicker. I tried to find all the cards I could that Half kicker.
ciderspence: And so I got.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: maybe 20, 25 cards with Kicker. And of those, I had maybe 15 to 20. Instance with Kicker. And so Chun -Li's ability... When you cast her, you can multi kick her.
ciderspence: Uh... Each time you kick her, you can exile a card from your graveyard exile an instant from your graveyard with a kick counter on it, and when Chun -Li attacks... You can cast. You can copy any number of the cards you have exiled with a kick counter on them, and you may cast the copies. So it's a little. It's tricky to pull off in the right way. It doesn't do quite the thing you want, which is to be able to cast him for the rest of the turn or something.
ciderspence: You have to cast them all at the same time, and they don't like Resolve. before you can cast the other one so you can't like Cast a spell that would give you more mana and then have more mana to cast spells They all resolve or none of them resolve so you have to put them all the stat on the sack at the same time So it's a little It's a little...
ciderspence: It's a delicate balance. there's There's certainly a way to do it right.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: I think you can build a strong version of this deck. I think a seasoned. strong magic player could build. a more fun version of what I've been trying to do with the deck. But I was like.
ciderspence: I'm not. I'm me. I'm gonna build a deck that I think is fun. And so I leaned heavy into kicker. So. i I put in the two mana rocks that have kickers, Skyclave Relic and Everflowing Chalice. Other than that, I tried to... keep my mana to just cost reducers. And I ran.
ciderspence: 12 to 15 of these kicker instant spells i I had a list of about 110 cards. rolling into commander night and i showed up late so while i was waiting i tried to pare it down eventually like they were ready to start the next game and i was in the pod
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: I just, I don't even remember what I cut. I i think I want to. playing with 35 lands or something because i was just like i got i i will play this right now It was a blast. I had more fun putting together that deck than...
ciderspence: Uh, I've had... playing some of the games that I've played in the last six weeks. I think. Tuesday night was also the start of the NBA season. So I was up late and I just like.
ciderspence: laid out probably 200 cards on the table and i was just like shuffling back and forth i was like okay this is my car you know i When I build a deck, I like lay it out. on a play mat in sections i've got okay commander here
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: protection spells here, card draw spells here, recursion spells here, interaction removal spells here. ramp spells here, theme spells here. So I've got all these cards. I try to keep the categories. you know I've got numbers in mind. I listen to some of the templates and stuff. But anyway.
ciderspence: I was just kind of moving them back and forth moving some cards out cutting iteratively i cut more on the train, on my way to work that day. uh this was thursday or this was wednesday sorry and on the way home i was trying to make the final cuts that's when i got it down to 110 cards But it was it was great. The whole process was really fun. And then the game was pretty fun.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: The deck is underpowered, but I think it's basically fine. I think I did stumble into a play style that I think works. which is basically... Don't commit to the board.
ciderspence: Try to... develop resources while keeping over open flexibility like and i don't think i tapped out Until... Turn six or seven. I counted a pretty big threat on like turn three.
ciderspence: you know And it was it was kind of one of those things where the whole table is like... The rest of the table is like. taking turns throwing haymakers. But by getting in an early counter spell. I kind of had to...
ciderspence: the wild guy element So. All right. I was a little safe because people I was a little unpredictable. But. I got to the point where I Built up a decent board. I think I had four or five creature tokens uh Chun -Li was out and Tura Kenarude who's like a what a much worse
ciderspence: What's the guy? Talrand. She makes a... One, one, white. Soldier. creature token whenever you cast an in instant or sorcery So it doesn't fly so that's not as good. And it's smaller than the 2 -2 drakes. but
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay, yeah.
ciderspence: Chun -Li is also a soldier, so I tried to have like a kind of soldier sub -theme in there. and That was you know among the many things that I was considering doing when the card list was at 200. One of them was kind of. go wide with. solder tokens. and try to get an effect like the Harbin aviator variant. Vanguard Aviator.
ciderspence: whenever you attack with five soldiers they get one one and flying But he was like a late cut. and I didn't cut down the theme. Anyway. I had... i had the kind of whiteboard oh god and one of my opponents also had out Wandering Archaic.
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh.
ciderspence: So whenever you cast an incident or sorcery, you have to pay two or they copy it. So.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yep.
ciderspence: My mana was already in a position where... i was in a position for a given turn so oh she had wing boots so she was pretty safe She had Ward 4. and flying so she could she could attack somewhere pretty safely. And she wasn't in any immediate danger.
ciderspence: from the board. There were no board wipes cast this game. which, you know, both helped me, but also meant that like. everybody's board was just outrageous. But anyway. I got to a point where I had in my hand.
ciderspence: But I'll call it my card of the week. The Eagles are coming.
Zachary Jeblonski: oh
ciderspence: So I think it is. One and a white. And you can kick it for. Two and two white, I think.
ciderspence: So that altogether, the kicked cost is six mana with three white pips.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yep.
ciderspence: And you may. So if you don't kick it, it is you may choose target creature, return it to your hand. at the beginning and then you At the beginning of the next upkeep...
ciderspence: Put a 4 -4 flying bird soldier creature token into play for each. Card returned to your hand this way. If you... Kick it. You may return any number of target creatures instead.
ciderspence: And I... screwed up the rules i thought that When I cast it, I was excited about it because I thought I could return my tokens to my hand and get bird tokens for those. But then I was like, oh, but they're not cards.
ciderspence: And it says for each card returned to your hand.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: you make a token. you make a bird token. So I thought I would not get credit for those, but I think. I actually do Because it does say each creature. Hold on. I got to read the. with the rules again.
ciderspence: Something on Reddit made me think i I would have gotten bird tokens.
Zachary Jeblonski: You do actually.
ciderspence: Yeah, because it's like when tokens go to the graveyard.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: They actually go there. It's just that they stop existing and you can't do anything with them. I think the same applies for when they're sent to your hand. They do go to your hand, but then they kind of stop existing.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, so they have... a rule they did a rules on it which is any creature tokens that were returned to your hand are counted by the delayed triggered ability you'll get a bird soldier token for each of them.
ciderspence: Okay.
Zachary Jeblonski: So you do get... Birds.
ciderspence: Yeah, so I had a moment there and that was a pretty big swing because I... I didn't bounce the tokens and I bounced my two creatures. which meant that I had to recast my commander the next turn, which took up some of my mana.
ciderspence: And it also meant that I didn't. Bounce the five. I think it was five at that point, sold a token. So I could have had a board that was... five four four flyers and my commander out and ready to swing again next turn so I could kind of spin the wheel, draw some cards, see what I could do.
ciderspence: it ultimately didn't matter because what happened was the player in turn order after me Tried to... kill the table actually couldn't get through me because i had two flyers it's like he gave all his creatures flying And he had a huge board. of it's uh just green and green and something else like oh no it was at a diona stack so it was like elves with counters But he just had huge creatures. He gave them all flying with.
ciderspence: Gunship. Thunderhawk or something like that But anyway, so he like...
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, and Thunderhawkmanship, yep.
ciderspence: Yeah. The other two players were much much bigger threats, so he correctly wanted to kill them. But one of the players he killed had a stuffy doll out and sent a lot of damage at the stuffy doll to bring him down to 10.
ciderspence: But he eliminated the other two players. So I got one more turn. And actually, the the creatures I had on board would have been lethal. But he cast a... Galahadrim. Ambush. uh prevent all damage that would be dealt by non -elf creatures this turn and make some elves
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: And if my commander had already been out, I would have had a chance to dig when I swung with her. But she wasn't out. or you know I recast her and she didn't have haste. Uh, you know.
ciderspence: Didn't get there, but I was close. But. The Eagles are coming. I was very excited to see it show up. Had a lot of fun that game. it it was It was a much more entertaining experience than I had with the last deck. It could just be because it was the first time playing with this new deck. I'm open to that possibility. But I think this is the deck I'm going to move forward with.
ciderspence: But anyway, that was my game.
Zachary Jeblonski: No, that's... But.
ciderspence: I loved it.
Zachary Jeblonski: No, that was really cool. I mean like I bought a couple copies of the eagles are coming when The Hobbit came out. And I just... It's like... I'm sorry. It's like one of those things where. Once I got the cards in my hand, I was like.
Zachary Jeblonski: I actually don't really have any place to put these cards. So I didn't actually put them in any of my decks, but like listening to that story and remembering that like. You know you can for two mana save one of your creatures even if you don't have the whole kicker and all that So I was like I gotta go back in Put those cards somewhere and find some homes for them.
ciderspence: it's a little tricky like it would be a lot better if you got to make the creatures now
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, but I'm glad.
ciderspence: Because the thing it doesn't help you with. is somebody's swinging for lethal. And what you'd really like is a bunch of bodies. Or what you'd really like is not to have to block with your valuable stuff so that it gets eliminated.
ciderspence: You'd rather create some blockers. Maybe some will live, some won't, but then you also have your... your creatures to recast. But it doesn't give you the creatures until the next upkeep. So it's really only board practice.
ciderspence: worldwide protection. Or like beef your board protection like my like my case would have been if I played it correctly.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, it's part of my production. Yeah.
ciderspence: See, I mean, which is probably smart. We don't need more overpowered cards, but But yeah.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. Alright. no i mean like i i do kind of like the way it's designed yeah i yeah i understand your point that it is like You know. You're not getting help with a.
Zachary Jeblonski: like blockers and stuff like that. but i like that they don't come back to upkeep so they'd like If your parents don't interact with it, They can't do anything to them at sorcery speed because they gotta wait till the upkeep to come in, you know, any kind of thing, so.
ciderspence: Yeah, it's true.
Zachary Jeblonski: It's a really good Borbae production in a way.
ciderspence: I think the other good thing about this deck is that because it was so heavily kicker themed, it did make me... Have a gimmick. which was every time I cast a kick spell, I made the Chun -Li kick sound from Street Fighter II, the original game.
Zachary Jeblonski: Huh.
ciderspence: So when I cast her, every time I kick something, I said, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because that's what I remember from the the original arcade cabinet. Uh,
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, that's good stuff.
ciderspence: And I enjoyed that. The pod was... the pod was understanding I think. But yeah, it was a great time.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay. I'm glad that's awesome. Yeah, i got I got out. I played... I think three games. And, you know, my normal place on Tuesday.
Zachary Jeblonski: I got to debut. My first game I debuted my... The... the the The new Nyssa from Edge of Eternities, the one that's missing green.
Zachary Jeblonski: I made a budget deck out of it.
ciderspence: Nice.
Zachary Jeblonski: Comes in at about $58. Bye. Just. Do you recall? She is Nyssa Leyline Tamer. three white blue black red so all but green Uh death touch vigilance, which I kept forgetting the whole time. I played that game. I kept forgetting she had vigilance
Zachary Jeblonski: Whenever a land enters, draw a card. Then if it's the first time, this ability's result is to reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal a creature card. Put that card in the battlefield and the rest of the bottom of your library order. Yeah, so it's basically just like...
Zachary Jeblonski: You know, I kind of went out of my way to make sure I didn't buy any cards for this deck. I just wanted to utilize the cards that are in my library. Or I guess it's just that in my collection, I guess. So it's just a hodgepodge of high, you know, high meta value, but... monetarily cheap creatures.
Zachary Jeblonski: the that the The thing of note is I... I got the original. Lorehole dragon out. from the original Strixhaven, not the new one.
ciderspence: Yeah, the old ones are not as good
Zachary Jeblonski: No, they're not. Just to remind people, it's this is... velimachus lorehold five red white uh elder dragon flying in vigilance haste which is a big reason why isn't that because I'm like, oh, those are pretty good keywords.
Zachary Jeblonski: But he has when he attacks, look at the top seven of your library. You may cast an instant or sorcery spell with mana value less than or equal to. Velimachus' lore holds power from one them without paying the amount of cost, but the rest in the bottom library in random order.
Zachary Jeblonski: you know so the best i can get off of this guy with the instant surgeries i have in his deck are just like some card draw spells and stuff like that So I got him out. he eventually was stolen from a but i was actually playing against so nissa is the secondary commander of the pre -con and i was actually playing against the pre -con with an upgraded an upgraded pre -con but him running the planeswalker chase the planeswalker so it's almost like a little bit of a mirror match a little bit his deck was not budget
Zachary Jeblonski: But it was still a pretty good game. He got... Very far ahead. but the whole kind of table kind of ganged up and over a series of turns really kind of really kind of brought him low and then that eventually let me win.
Zachary Jeblonski: Because once he got brought low, then I was able to kind of go off. I guess the only other highlight was that I... I... Well, I guess two last notes is I...
Zachary Jeblonski: It didn't really impact the game that much because he was immediately removed, but I did get the ETB off of him. But I... I put Lord Xander the Collector in this deck. And he's commander. I've thought about building a couple of times, but he's from Nukapana.
Zachary Jeblonski: He's a four blue, black, red. So another seven drop. And. but When he enters, the battlefield target opponent discards half their cards, rounded down.
Zachary Jeblonski: When he attacks, defending player mills half their library around the down. And when he dies, target opponent sacrifices half the Nihilan permanents they control around him down. so I was able to get the EGB.
ciderspence: Ouch.
Zachary Jeblonski: And then I think he got. Yeah, he got... exiled So I got the ETB, but I didn't get that any of the other triggers, which is fine. But he's he's a fun guy. And yeah, the last thing of note is i'm I'm kind of doing this experiment. I'm slowly doing this with my decks.
Zachary Jeblonski: Nyssa. This deck, Nissa, is built around this. And my sin, which is my soul tie reanimator tech is built around this. and i'm i I realized playing Sin that I actually really like.
Zachary Jeblonski: I think I talked about this on a couple episodes. like the mo Modal cards, specifically modal. counterspells. So these are. cards at.
Zachary Jeblonski: You choose one option. One of the options is casual. The other option is usually some kind of card advantage option. And the good news is that they are monetarily very cheap cards usually because they're not very good, I guess, technically in the grand scheme of things.
Zachary Jeblonski: But this Nissa has like seven of these now? And because I just basically just did a scryfall search and just found like. Every counter spell that had a modal option for a non counter spell option It didn't really impact this game that much because I didn't i just didn't have any in my hand, nothing.
Zachary Jeblonski: Like there was never an opportunity, whatever. But I found some new ones. that actually i thought i think are just genuinely good
ciderspence: I think I know what you're going to say because I cast it in my game.
Zachary Jeblonski: What's that?
ciderspence: Confusticate and Bebother, I'm guessing, is on your list?
Zachary Jeblonski: Yep. Yep. That's one of the ones I want to talk about. Yeah.
ciderspence: Yep.
Zachary Jeblonski: That card's just good. Like, I don't know. It's it's two and a blue. Counter target spell unless its controller pays four mana. Or draw two cards and then discard a card. i don't know i think it's just good
ciderspence: yeah they're not all good but i think that one is just good Three mana to counter. Anything? unless its controller pays for Like.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: In the early to mid game, that basically is just a counterspell. and you can draw two cards off of it if you don't need it that like if you're a deck that hold holds open mana or plays at instant speed. I think that's just something you want.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, and the way I've been playing these cards, and I play them similarly as I do in my Sin deck, which is... The early game. I almost always just fire them all for the card advantage. And then late game when I'm. when my card engines are going and i've got cards at the wazoo i hold them all for the counter spell like So Coffee Skate and Bibata is one. The other one that i is an older one is Thassa's Intervention.
Zachary Jeblonski: And it's X Blue Blue. Choose one look at the top x cards of your library put two of them into your hand and the rest in the bottom of your library in random order. Or counter target spell unless the controller plays twice X.
Zachary Jeblonski: So I think of it almost like a four mana card because if it's at four mana, they're paying four mana. to not be counterspelled. Or I'm looking at the top four cards in my library and inputting two in my hand.
Zachary Jeblonski: So anyway, so I got... I think I got seven or eight of these now. And I'm so i'm experimenting in this deck. I'm kind of experimenting in Sin. And I'm starting to like change a lot of my blue decks to have these kind of cards in them. And I'm sure eventually I'm going to get burned one of these days where like.
Zachary Jeblonski: somebody fires off a path to exile when I have like five mana available. They're like, yeah, I'll just pay an extra four for that. I'm like, all right, well, it is what it is. but i think more than likely what's gonna happen is like these are just straight up counter spells like when i See people hold up matter for interaction.
Zachary Jeblonski: People don't generally hold up. Mana for these extra costs unless they have nothing going on right and they just pass their turn and whatever.
Zachary Jeblonski: So we'll see. We'll see if I continue to like these cards as we go on. but So far, i'm a big i' been I've been a fan of them. Even I haven't had a lot of opportunity to really use them.
ciderspence: yeah there are some that are terrible like there's one i think it's called school days from the Spider -Man set.
Zachary Jeblonski: yeah i almost Yeah, I almost did that one, yeah.
ciderspence: That was a late cut, but that one's for blue blue. It's like you i don't know it's six mana right
Zachary Jeblonski: Now, school days is five mana. That's why i I think that's a bridge too far for me.
ciderspence: Yeah. Yeah, i I think that's... yeah but the the three minute there's there's also i don't know if you saw this when there's what's called dismissive denial. It is a four -mana counterspell that has basic land cycling from Marvel Super Heroes The Commander set.
ciderspence: And it's just like, if you're willing to play a super tapped land, which which is what I think the two mana cyclers are, it's great. it's it's It's even freer than the spells, basically.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, that's an interesting one.
ciderspence: I've land cycled that one several times. In fact, there's a cycle of...
Zachary Jeblonski: That's an interesting one.
ciderspence: Landcyclers from Marvel Super. from the MS -8. labeled set and a cycle from the MSC labeled set. I think. All of the ones from MSC are...
ciderspence: playable. playable Two of them are removal. I think the black one and the white one are... remov all The red one is also removal, so maybe they're mostly removal. I forget what the, oh, the green one's like a pump spell or something.
ciderspence: But they're all like... Again, they're land cyclers, so you... could just get a basic with them. and they're they're they're spells like they're over -costed spells but they're spells like they're things that I think a gen a generic deck would use.
ciderspence: So yeah, those are worth a look.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, I like that. Like, i yeah, I just I like the idea of like. You know the the game moves in phases and then in different phases I want my cards to do different things, you know and like And I like cards that kind of kind of adapt to that.
Zachary Jeblonski: uh the other one the one that i'm on the fence on i'm running in a few decks but i'm going the fence on is You find the villain's lair And it's one blue, blue.
Zachary Jeblonski: choose one counter target spell which is nice because it's just straight up counter or draw two and then discard two so it's not really card advantage you do to go down a card So I'm still...
Zachary Jeblonski: wishy -washy on that one, we'll say.
ciderspence: Hi. I think that one's good too. Uh, especially mid to late game. look at two more cards and get rid of the worst two. like
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: Sometimes you get benefits from drawing cards. Sometimes you have a card draw amplifier, so you're really drawing four and discarding two. Sometimes you want to discard something.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: I feel like. That's the type of card that I think I would need to find a reason not to play these days.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: like if it's really bad for me to discard or if i if i'm in a discard deck so i'm not in a position to be able to discard cards. I need to keep everything I see. But yeah, I mean.
ciderspence: It's just a slightly over -costed counterspell or get to see more cards get to dig a little deeper. Yeah I would also play that one for sure.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. Yeah, I think... i think I think my favorite right now is still Spellgeier out of this whole, like. Thing and that's to blue blue counter target spell or surveil to draw to but Yeah. I mean, regardless, I think, I think this is just overall, this just kind of, and I'll kind of talk about my car of the week here.
Zachary Jeblonski: Because this is technically and in this. which is i have the full cycle and nissa of the budget fetchlands and these are Bad? I don't know.
Zachary Jeblonski: there's not really any way to to describe them they are they just like the fetch lands they can tap sacrifice and fetch up a land type one of two
Zachary Jeblonski: But they come in tapped, unlike the actual Fetchlands. and i've been experimenting with these two and like I've been kind of digging them too. like i'm not trying to say they're good obviously if i had the money to like Or if I wasn't building a budget deck, I would put the actual fetches. There's no...
Zachary Jeblonski: possible argument I can make. to say that these fetches are better than other fetches. But. I find that like, even though Commander is getting faster. Hmm.
Zachary Jeblonski: Excuse me, even though commanders getting faster I don't think I don't feel the speed pressure as much as I feel the pressure. of versatility. and being able to to have my cards do the things I need them to do when they meet when I need them to do it.
Zachary Jeblonski: So that's kind of my thing. I was like, yeah, even though these counter spells are overly costed compared to the good ones or even though these lands are slower than the than the good ones.
Zachary Jeblonski: I still like the versatility of being able to get a land type or and in the other case. Oh. I don't think I need to count. I just got bored. Why? So I don't need to counter anything for a while, probably. Let's just do some card advantage, right? Or whatever.
ciderspence: Yeah. I... I agree. wholeheartedly. I feel like. The games that I feel best about are the games where I was able to hold open mana for something.
ciderspence: and do something with the mana if I didn't need to do the thing I was prepared to do. Because it stinks to hold open.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: four mana for your over -costed Counterspell not need it. and then have just wasted four mana. But if you can do something with that four mana, like if you got a utility land that you could dump something into, you got a permanent on board, you could use that mana to do something with.
ciderspence: if you don't have to use it to fire off a Counterspell or some removal.
Zachary Jeblonski: Hmm.
ciderspence: Yeah, those games feel really good.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. Yeah, so that's... Yeah. So that's Nyssa. So that was really fun. i It was like seven cards short.
Zachary Jeblonski: of being able to play. My Tomeo, the Boris Tomeo Monarch deck. So stand by for that. Hopefully I'll get a game in coming Tuesday with that, but I have the cards and now for that. Didn't get a chance to play that.
Zachary Jeblonski: Played my Xerzoth Devils deck, the mono -red one. I... Don't know about this deck, man. It's just not. Doing it. But I also have trouble like blaming the deck first.
Zachary Jeblonski: for this last game because i played against The new monoblock Avacyn that I mentioned, I think on an episode or two ago. And my. you know uh pod made that i
ciderspence: Angel of horror.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. was it what's the so What's her subtitle?
ciderspence: Think Angel of Horror.
Zachary Jeblonski: i can have
ciderspence: as opposed to Angel of Hope.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. Yeah, Angel of Horror.
ciderspence: Or maybe not Angel.
ciderspence: Yeah.
Zachary Jeblonski: So there's a pod mate that I played with many times at the store on Tuesday. he has He's a huge Avacyn fan. He has this deck. The first time I saw it, I was like, oh, that's cool. And this is the second time I've seen it.
Zachary Jeblonski: And he got off to an amazing start, like soul ring threat and dynamo kind of start. And. It is so... hard to deal with this commander. So just to remind people.
Zachary Jeblonski: what it is. It's five black, black. Five, three blacks. Angel FlyingDeathTouch88. When I have a sin, that's an important one. When Avacyn... or another non -token creature your control dies, return that card.
Zachary Jeblonski: to the battlefield under your control at the beginning of the next end step. So... He had Avacyn out. and a SAC outlet. So it was almost impossible to deal with this commander because if you'd fired off like I had a chaos war from my hand But it doesn't matter because he could just sack Avacyn in a response.
Zachary Jeblonski: And I'll get it right back on the next end step. So it was only a matter of time we found a cuckoo show and then wiped us all out. Because basically... you sack the cuckoo show every turn and every turn he comes back sack Tag turned.
Zachary Jeblonski: boom boom So it's at a very strong commander. If you don't have active graveyard hate. you are just SOL against this commander. So my recommendation is if you play against this commander.
Zachary Jeblonski: You either got to counter spell it, you got to remove it before sack outlet comes online, or you got to have graveyard hate going.
ciderspence: Yeah, or you'd have to keep the sack up.
Zachary Jeblonski: Amen.
ciderspence: outlet off offline like you got to target that instead of avacyn the first time you see one
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, you... Yeah. If Avacyn and its stack outlet are on the board at the same time... You are s SOL unless you have active graveyard eight like you you will lose like It's just...
Zachary Jeblonski: the fact that she brings herself back it just makes it so difficult to deal with which i can't complain too much because she is eight mana it is what it is and in reality what i should have done and the lesson i learned is when he casted the sac outlet Oh, no way.
Zachary Jeblonski: he Yeah. When he casted Avacyn with the sack outlet on board, I should have chaos warped the sack outlet.
ciderspence: Yep.
Zachary Jeblonski: That's what I should have done.
ciderspence: Yep.
Zachary Jeblonski: But I just. Didn't put two and two together until it's too late. so
ciderspence: Yeah, and I think that's the thing about commanders like this. We talked about the Iroh deck, right? The Teemer, Iroh. lessons or you can cast lessons for, is it zero?
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: It might, no, I think it's one generic, but the way the deck is played, you need a... a cost reducer.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: Something to put all the spells in your graveyard and then basically you cast you effectively cast your deck from the graveyard for free and you have like some burn or you make tokens or something you know something bad for your opponents happens every time you cast a spell and you just basically win the game
ciderspence: And yeah, if you know that. like i think i was saying I think I mentioned that I played against one of these decks and I played with some people who weren't familiar with the deck. While I was familiar with the deck, And I basically just kind of shouted out the pieces. I was like,
ciderspence: Oh wait a minute. i see you've got a mill engine over there you're putting all the stuff in your graveyard I see you've got... uh cost reducer Now all you need is a... is a burner right and he's like I don't know what you're talking about, but he like.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: Not in the, no, no, no. It was in the cool way. He said it with the wink.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: So that he was like.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: i i pick up what you're laying down but i'm not going to spell it out exactly for the rest of the table but i was like okay i respect that Because he wasn't he didn't deny it. He wasn't upset he was being targeted. He was like, yeah, I mean, you know it might be something to keep an eye on.
Zachary Jeblonski: Heh.
ciderspence: But yeah, you kind of. Those decks are going to run away with it. if People don't. Like if you haven't. if you haven't seen the drill before.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yes.
ciderspence: And I feel like just more and more cards do that these days, right? Like there's some interaction that if you heard about it on a podcast or you're a fan of the lore and you learned about the card and you were like, oh, what can I do with this card? You know it. The rest of the table doesn't know it because there are a billion cards and not everybody's up to speed on every card.
ciderspence: Uh... you know, there are more and more ways to get got. in that fashion. And yeah, Addison definitely seems like one.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yep. Yep, yep yep. yeah and then Last game was just... Played Lucy, which is continuous. she I always have a lot of fun when I play Lucy, this Mamata White deck.
Zachary Jeblonski: I think that the the interesting thing about that game was... We, had you know, me and my partner had lost the other two players. And there was a gentleman walking around the store. kind of doing that walk when you like you can tell they're looking for a game but maybe they're new to the story they don't know the people and all that so i kind of reached out and i was like hey you want to join he's like yeah sure And then he.
Zachary Jeblonski: He came in and and we basically had to do a three pot for the last game. And. i guess I guess the interesting thing about that game was he played Kilo, which is the...
Zachary Jeblonski: One of the pre -con alternative commanders from Edge of Eternities where... I believe when he taps, he proliferates. Hmm. And. He never wants Casa Kilo. He didn't really have any whole lot of proliferation synergies. It was more like a generic artifact deck.
Zachary Jeblonski: But it was this really weird situation where. He's like. I'm kind of new to magic. I know the mechanics. I'm like, okay. And he's playing it.
Zachary Jeblonski: And it's like. turn one or like turn one, turn two, Moxopole and this and that. And he kind of goes off, right? But at the same time, he's playing... i don't know why i'm telling it i guess i'm still trying to process this game because he's playing really slowly like he doesn't really know what he's doing By the same time, the deck seems clearly well put together.
Zachary Jeblonski: but he doesn't really understand what his cards do sometimes. It's just really bizarre. combination of things like i've never really run into a player that felt both new and experienced at the same time
ciderspence: I've seen this before. I think there's a difference between being an experienced player and what you looked up online to prepare yourself to play the for the first time. was a good decklist and you had the resources to get it.
ciderspence: Like.
Zachary Jeblonski: that might be it yeah that might be it
ciderspence: Sometimes like sometimes you you know your first show that you watch is play to win. So the cards that you see are like bam, bam, bam, blam bam, blam bam, bam, bam. and you know if you've played you've played and if you haven't played your experience is watching people play and so the first couple of times you do anything it's going to be clunky If you don't...
ciderspence: If you don't get your cards because you you know bought a booster box and pieced it together or somebody gave you their commons and you had to figure it out. if instead you're like what are the best cards i want to have a good time and you'll get all those cards.
ciderspence: Yeah, yeah i think I've seen situations like this. And I think they also sometimes lead to those situations we've talked about where... a person comes to a game and they say it's bracket three or whatever but then they're Bussing out.
ciderspence: you know. thousand dollar decks and shocking this shocking that and going off on turn three, and you're like, well... It looks like your deck is prepared to do this all the time. I don't think it was suitable for the table.
ciderspence: And they're like, well, what was I supposed to do?
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: I tried to follow all these rules. And they're like, no, it's not about the rules. It's about the spirit of the deck. and you know These cards aren't suited for this type of gameplay. And then the person says something like, well, I just want to be able to play the best cards.
ciderspence: Why do I not? play the best cards.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, we... We told that story. yeah
ciderspence: Yeah. but i mean i guess
Zachary Jeblonski: The classic story.
ciderspence: yeah i guess what i'm saying is i think there's an honest -ish way to come about that It's like you don't know what cards to play. You haven't played very often. now There's also a dishonest way where you've played plenty of times and this is your spiel because you like to pub stomp and you want to feel...
ciderspence: Like. Nobody can tell you not to. But yeah, I mean, I think the first time you play, it's it's kind of a mixed bag where you get your advice from on how to build the deck. So yeah, I think it. I could... I could see anything.
ciderspence: being what what the first collection of cards looked like. like i'm not I'm not sure what people would have said about my first collection of cards.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, for sure.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, I mean like I... you know, like. what What was interesting is like, yeah, the game started off really strong for him. you know, you know, Mox Opal, Mana Confluence, like some very strong cards, high powered, you could say cards.
Zachary Jeblonski: Then he kind of... That is that kind of burned out. like he didn't really do much But where it got silly is he played Platinum Empyrean.
Zachary Jeblonski: Is the card I haven't seen very often I've played against it a little bit plat. plat Let's see if I can even spell Platinum Imperium. Platinum Imperium. It's so for eight generic it's an 88 artifact creature golem your life total can't change
Zachary Jeblonski: And then he played like a magistrate scepter. So eventually he's going to do some kind of extra turn loop thing with charge counters and stuff. But he kind of ran out of cards. He was down to like one card at this point.
Zachary Jeblonski: And the other gentleman I was playing with was playing a clone deck. So he starts making clones of Platinum Empyrean. All right. So I'm the only one without a platinum appearing at this point.
Zachary Jeblonski: Bye. The clone deck had a Identity Thieves. which exiles a creature when it attacks and becomes that. and at the end stuff comes back. So the clone deck. attacks the artifact player, or the Platinum Imperium, exiles his Platinum Imperium, so his lifestyle can change.
Zachary Jeblonski: And then on the artifact player's turn, he plays a mass threat effect, steals the other guy's threats of Imperium, the Platinum Imperiums. and makes it so his life can change. So they beat each other down, each with having platinum appearance, which I thought was pretty funny.
Zachary Jeblonski: that they both had cards on their board that said their life i can't change, but they both found ways around it. and as And eventually they... uh both beat each other down to like very low life totals and i kind of was left out of it a little bit because i was just a little bean over there playing lucy and just making little one ones
Zachary Jeblonski: and they got each other low and eventually a couple board wipes happened and then i was able to just finish them off with some tokens essentially But that was very interesting to see multiple Platinum Empyreans going. And people dying when they have Platinum Imperiums.
Zachary Jeblonski: So that was kind of interesting
ciderspence: Yeah, Endgame is... If the game goes enough turns, the end games can be pretty silly.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yes. Because I'm like, wow, I've never seen somebody take so many beatings from a Platinum Imperium and lose life. But yeah, you know. It's one of those things where you know it was a good game.
Zachary Jeblonski: I hope that newer player had fun. i don't think he's technically a newer player he mentioned that he played back in like new phyrexia But she goes back to like the 20. 10 2012 or something like that I don't know. It was a bizarre kind of play experience, but he could have just been having an off day or whatever. Who knows?
Zachary Jeblonski: But yeah, those are those are my games I played this week.
ciderspence: Glad you got some in.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, I was it was i was very happy.
ciderspence: What was it like coming back? Did it did you... Did you feel rusty? Did you feel nervous? was it Did it feel like it always feels? Or did you notice that you hadn't played in a few weeks?
Zachary Jeblonski: No, I felt normal. And part of that is because, like... I spent a lot of time deck teching and working on my collection in the meantime since I couldn't play. So I kind of didn't let magic sit. or Even though I wasn't playing, I was goldfishing a lot. So I was really kind of...
Zachary Jeblonski: you know. Ready to go. Raring to go. but no it was good to get back in there you know i was very excited to be back in there I was very sad that I couldn't make it this last couple times.
Zachary Jeblonski: even though i think it was the right decision at the time you know i probably could have stumbled into the store last week, but it would have been not a great experience.
ciderspence: Yeah, I think you would have been actually stumbling so I think that indicates you made the right choice
Zachary Jeblonski: Yes. Yeah. So. No, I'm glad. that Yeah, I was glad it it all worked out. It was good. It put me nice and behind in schoolwork, which is, hey, you know, we got to do it. We got to live a little.
Zachary Jeblonski: But yeah, do you want to talk about some decks on deck before we kind of? uh rads up
ciderspence: Sure. Actually, what was the thing we kicked to this week? Oh, we were going to talk about the Marvel set. The Darkhold Destinies I think it's called.
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh, yeah. yeah
ciderspence: maybe let's talk let's just share some broad thoughts about that and then we'll do a quicker decks on deck at the end
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay. Sure. I have not. you know let me pull it up actually marvel dark old destiny oh yeah i've seen some of those cards Yeah. So my understanding.
Zachary Jeblonski: is that it is It takes place in the Marvel Universe written by magic writers. Right.
ciderspence: Yeah. Yeah, that's my understanding too.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay. Yeah. I mean, I think that's cool. I would like to see more magic integration with the universes beyond. So it feels more. cohesive to the overall magic.
Zachary Jeblonski: Broke. Now, as far as the quality of magic of Wizards Riders. I've heard. Many things. A lot of times not good.
Zachary Jeblonski: So I don't know. But if it gives a sense of cohesion, I'm i'm here for it. But you're more of a Marvel. Fan, so what do you think about that idea?
ciderspence: I love it. I i think.
Zachary Jeblonski: Amen.
ciderspence: My hope is that... Some of the people who find universes beyond distasteful will appreciate this. i I guess my concern is that this is a solution.
ciderspence: Uh... that missed the problem. Like. I fear that it's the type of thing that... makes it less fun for Marvel fans to enjoy and still not fun enough for people who don't like Marvel to get into because they don't like Marvel so that it misses out on both camps.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: I suspect it will not do that.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: I suspect it will be I think. The early reactions I've heard online are positive to the fact that they're trying this. It's not like... I guess if you didn't like Universes Beyond... There's no way you could spin this as a step in the wrong direction.
ciderspence: right like This is them trying to bridge the gap. Now, maybe you say, no, just you just have to cut Universes Beyond out. Okay, well, you probably weren't going to do anything marble. they haven't really lost you.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: I think that. it'll still have the... Marvel characters that people know of. i think that's going to keep at least most of the marvel people there so i hope that this will kind of broaden the tent and get some people who didn't. check in before.
ciderspence: Into it and I'm definitely looking forward to it. I think it's a cool idea I'm excited to see how they pull it off. quality wise i don't know i mean if you like magic you've liked the things that people at Wizards have done. before so hopefully that some sort of quality control check for you.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, yeah, it's... It's interesting like I am I don't know, what do you... What do you think about... Yeah, I guess. i Yeah, I mean, like.
Zachary Jeblonski: are you You know, like, yeah, this was a criticism. Let's just say a criticism that some people had of like the Marvel and the Spider -Man sets. And frankly, I kind of feel when I look at the Star Trek set.
Zachary Jeblonski: of like uh it's just like a real world location and it's a magic card like it's a hot dog cart right or guy eating sandwich right Did you feel any of that or did that? doesn't really matter to you on like magic cards if that's kind of the art
ciderspence: i guess it matters to me i get it i mean i think There are other things in magic that kind of... break the suspension of disbelief.
ciderspence: that maybe other players don't mind as much. So I'm not. I don't know, like... when i was I think some of my early sets were Brothers War that had the Transformers cards.
ciderspence: right like Transformers don't really fit with the rest of Magic, but I love the Transformers.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: like i was I was all about those cards. So I think the time I was introduced to Magic... I was already aware of the... the kind of genre breaking stuff and i i had a positive reaction to it so the fact that the Spider -Man set takes place in New York. I'm okay with that. like you know. To me, that's also kind of...
ciderspence: wish fulfillment because i used to live in new york so to me i think that stuff is kind of cute it It doesn't bother me, but I understand how some people...
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: who really appreciate the fantasy setting. of most of magic. Would not. like things that are set in real places. But I think that's another thing that... Darkhold Destiny has going for it is that it's going to focus on a lot of Marvel's magic characters. And it's going to feel like.
ciderspence: i Sorry, Marvel's magic -wielding characters. So it's going to feel like it takes place in a fantasy sci -fi setting. as opposed to just the city. so yeah i'm I'm very optimistic. I hope it's...
ciderspence: I hope that it is more broadly enjoyed, but I'm... i'm confident I'm going to like it. I'm looking forward to it
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, that's why that's kind of why I wanted to brought it up because I am a little bit in that camp of like... Like... You know, I think the Doctor Who set in general was like...
Zachary Jeblonski: from a mechanical perspective is pretty good. Like, I still find myself finding new Doctor Who cards where I'm like, wow, this is really good. I should use this. But the art is always like. a dude you know sitting in a chair or leaning against a ladder or you know it's just like uh you know so i you know i do want that more gothic, high fantasy, low fancy, sci -fi, whatever. i I do want that more fantastical element. So Darkhold does... appeal to me a little bit more on the art front.
Zachary Jeblonski: i Just looking at the first batch of cards that they debuted. I'm like, okay, this. Like this this seems much more like a tighter, more cohesive. marriage between two ideas.
Zachary Jeblonski: You know, so I'm i'm excited for it. like You know, like i I want to, you know, I was thinking about like. You know, how cool would be if...
Zachary Jeblonski: You had. you know, a premier comic book author. Write a storyline. You know. for like a set like this or Or, you know. what what would it What would it be like if maybe we got like a Universes Beyond set?
Zachary Jeblonski: And maybe some of the magic characters showed up there, right? like and a Marvel set. you know It's like Chandra shows up to help out. Wolverine or something. I don't know. I think that'd be kind of cool.
ciderspence: Yeah, I mean, comic book companies do crossovers all the time, right?
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: like Well, not sorry, not all the time, but they have. notably done it before. So you I could see something like that. But I just like the idea that they have begun to...
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: either think outside the box or create a bigger box for how Universes Beyond works. And I think the idea of having magic writers write a story within an outside IP is a good one.
ciderspence: I think that opens up the possibility that maybe at some point in time... A Marvel writer. They could hire someone. wizards could hire someone else they could give them a storyboard and say can you turn this into a story like so that the collaboration avenues have been widened.
ciderspence: I think that's only a good thing for Universal Beyond going forward.
Zachary Jeblonski: now Darkhold. Oh, is it Dark Old Destiny? Dark Old Destiny.
ciderspence: Destiny. Darkhold Destiny, I think, yeah.
Zachary Jeblonski: This is a... this is a concept in comic books like this is not a brand new thing right like i don't know enough about this
ciderspence: Well, I think that so the dark hold is a book of magic in the Marvel universe.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay, that pre -existed this magic set.
ciderspence: Yeah, that pre -existed, yeah.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: And I guess it's like, this is a story about the Darkhold and about some of Marvel's magic users and their relationship to whatever event. they are creating.
Zachary Jeblonski: Gotcha.
ciderspence: And it works perfectly on the comic side because, I mean, people...
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay.
ciderspence: People write stories all the time. So, yeah, I think it'll probably be Marvel canon. There may be some interesting comic book or. uh mcu ramifications of this going forward i think that's a cool possibility But yeah, it should create some more.
ciderspence: characteristic. magic play so hopefully hopefully magic players will enjoy it
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, I mean, it works out for me because like I. I played... Played and really enjoyed and finished Marvel Midnight Suns which was a video game that came out a couple years ago.
Zachary Jeblonski: i featured a lot more i think of these type of characters like magic is a featured character in that game.
ciderspence: Yep.
Zachary Jeblonski: So I'm like, oh, I was like, I know who magic is from the video game. So... Now we need, is that Nico Marano? Marino?
ciderspence: She's already on the card. I've got an eco menorah deck
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh, is Nico already on a card?
ciderspence: She's the one who burns when she casts from exile.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yes, you're right.
ciderspence: I think it's anywhere outside your hand.
Zachary Jeblonski: uh Yeah, well.
ciderspence: She's from The Runaways, yeah.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay, well...
ciderspence: I mean yeah you're right.
Zachary Jeblonski: Maybe they'll add another one.
ciderspence: I hope they bring her to so to a set in the future.
Zachary Jeblonski: It's good.
ciderspence: That'd be sweet.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah. because that was like my team and Midnight Suns was Nico magic and I forgot who I had for the last one. I think it was Venom.
ciderspence: Yeah, they should make a Venom card too.
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh, you, you guy. They did make one. Yeah.
ciderspence: They made several.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, but I only think of the Jund one. the
ciderspence: The Jun one is good. There's an Anti -Venom. And I think Venom was one of those cards that they even made. Maybe not a common, but there's certainly an uncommon venom. I think there are three or four of them.
Zachary Jeblonski: Did it did they announce an X -Men set or that still hasn't been announced?
ciderspence: I don't know if it's been announced yet, but I think the fact that so few X -Men have been in the Marvel sets. suggests that one of the One of the... many marvel sets on the horizon. is probably going to be a dedicated X -Men set.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah, because, I mean, I need my Gambit, man. Like, come on.
ciderspence: Gambit should be fun. I mean, he his thing is playing cards, so yeah.
Zachary Jeblonski: Can't make me more. Yes, exactly. We can get meta with it, like the Deadpool card. That worked out so well last time.
Zachary Jeblonski: All right. Well, we'll get to. Decks on deck next week. Is there anything else you wanted to talk about before we wrap it up?
ciderspence: maybe Maybe we just do... One minute each on Decks on Deck.
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay, one minute.
ciderspence: I'm working on a Torwalkie, the younger deck, and I'm starting to think through what decks I take to Magic Con Atlanta coming up not too far from now.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yep.
ciderspence: I think I'm going to try to do a celebration of the stuff I loved as a kid. So there'll be some turtles. There'll be definitely this new Chun -Li deck, maybe also the old Chun -Li deck. some Transformers decks.
ciderspence: uh some of my my new faves but i wanted I basically want to only take decks that make me smile to think about the original properties. So that's that's what I've been thinking about. How about you?
Zachary Jeblonski: Okay, probably next up is... Maybe Jeskai. I am. through the early planning stages of raska soul stone which we talked about a little bit last week And this is just going to be.
Zachary Jeblonski: I'm not going to like metagame this super hard. I think if you're really going to metagame or really strategize this commander. You were cast. Really cheap. non -creature spells that you can make a bunch of your sculpture.
Zachary Jeblonski: Treasures. I'm going to put all the Artified cards in that I haven't been able to find a home in other places. And a lot of them are going to be... big, balmy -type cards like Chimol. And stuff like that.
Zachary Jeblonski: so i'm not gonna try to mitigate it too much But it's just fun to kind of go through and be like, oh wow That's a big artifact or that's an artifact. I just never found a home floor And so that's kind of on the way. But yeah.
ciderspence: Nice.
Zachary Jeblonski: And oh yeah, that's another deck that I'm planning on putting in all those modal. uh counter spells so
ciderspence: Yeah, mo modal spells.
Zachary Jeblonski: We'll see how it goes.
ciderspence: mod
Zachary Jeblonski: Oh, did you cut out? Modal spells what?
ciderspence: Sorry, modal spells are great. I would encourage anyone listening who thinks that.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yeah.
ciderspence: The ideas that we share here are... worth anything. please play more modal spells, even the ones that are slightly over costed. Maybe not the ones that are horribly over -costed. But you'll really appreciate in games that go.
ciderspence: seven or eight or nine or 10 turns. having something to do when you might have otherwise not had anything to do.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yep.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yep. All right. Not a lot. All right. Well, Charles, well, you have a. How do I usually close these out? Uh, Thanks for joining me, Charles. There we go.
ciderspence: Yeah, thanks for having me, Zach. Glad you're feeling better. Keep up the good healing work.
Zachary Jeblonski: Yep, I plan on it. You guys you guys you have a good weekend. You guys are listening out there, have a good weekend, and we will talk again next week.
ciderspence: Take it easy, everybody.
