Transcript
Speaker: Welcome to No Pyro, No Podcast, Armada Fancast, where we talk all things Jacksonville Armada.
Speaker: And in this episode, we have myself, Daniel Dad Johnson, along with Derek.
Speaker: Hey, what's going on, everyone?
Speaker: Ian.
Speaker: Good evening.
Speaker: And the veteran, Jake Sillick from TheCup.us.
Speaker: Hey, guys, how you doing?
Speaker: Glad to have you here, Jake.
Speaker: Jake is a friend to the podcast.
Speaker: Some of you may not know, some of you that are new to...
Speaker: to the Armada.
Speaker: I may not know, Jake is one of the founders of Section 904.
Speaker: Actually, it was called something else at one point.
Speaker: What was the name of that, Jake?
Speaker: It was a bad name.
Speaker: It was the first co-syndicate.
Speaker: I still have my shirt.
Speaker: I love that name.
Speaker: I'll be real.
Speaker: I like that better than our current name.
Speaker: Of course you would.
Speaker: You would like it.
Speaker: That's you.
Speaker: Eric has to be contrary every time.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, I loved it.
Speaker: It just felt a little gangster.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There you go.
Speaker: So we got Jake with us and we're going to talk a little bit of US Open Cup.
Speaker: It's that time of year where Jake gets all excited.
Speaker: And where are we going to start, Derek?
Speaker: So let's start with this, Jake.
Speaker: You've been covering the US Open Cup for a while.
Speaker: How long have you been covering it?
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, just kind of informally since 2010, probably since I really started to pay attention to lower division soccer.
Speaker: We're not going to talk about
Speaker: what team I used to be a fan of are we we can't it's just uh we we got we got listeners that are Armada uh supporters so it didn't come in until you know 2013 is when the team was announced 2014 was the branding 2015 that's I was into soccer big time probably about 2008 2009 on and I was friends with a lot of people in college a lot of people from Tampa and
Speaker: and the Rowdies.
Speaker: Oh, no!
Speaker: He's gone.
Speaker: Not everyone's a person to take our pictures.
Speaker: So I got into that, and they were like, U.S. Open Cup.
Speaker: I'm like, what the heck's U.S. Open Cup?
Speaker: I go look it up, and I'm like, this is incredible.
Speaker: We get to play MLS teams if we advance.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: And just kind of dove in from there.
Speaker: So
Speaker: That's how you got involved with it.
Speaker: You guys are a group that does this, right?
Speaker: How many people are involved with it?
Speaker: Josh Hackle, the
Speaker: editor-in-chief or the founder.
Speaker: He's been doing it since 2003, which, man, that's incredible to think about.
Speaker: But he invited me on to be a part of this.
Speaker: Gosh, I'm trying to remember.
Speaker: I want to say it was about 2017, 2016, 2017.
Speaker: It was right before I moved away from Jacksonville.
Speaker: Yes, that seems about right.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And he's just like, Hey, I can always use help with, with things.
Speaker: He always needs help.
Speaker: If you, if you're a writer and you're listening to this and you can even write a little bit, we're always looking for people, especially in Florida.
Speaker: And we, we take, we take all comers, anybody who's new to, new to writing.
Speaker: or a complete expert or former sports writer or anybody, you know, we can always use the help.
Speaker: Feel free to reach out to us or contact us.
Speaker: So he was just like, hey, I need some help with things.
Speaker: I'm like, I'm not that great at writing, but I can do a little bit.
Speaker: We come to find out I'm definitely not the best writer.
Speaker: But I can kind of handle a lot of the logistics and a lot of the operations side.
Speaker: So I started taking over the Twitter and the social media from there because I was pretty good at that.
Speaker: And just kind of being the expert and it's like, hey, my God, question on the rules.
Speaker: I'm the rules expert.
Speaker: I always got the books on that.
Speaker: I've never met anyone who is more in tune with the bylaws of the U.S. Open Cup or any other organization than you are with that.
Speaker: Oh, I mean, it'd be a dream to just sit in on one of their meetings for me, you know?
Speaker: But those Open Cup meetings aren't open to the public, and they rarely talk about the Open Cup in the public board meetings, like this one that just happened last week, which is kind of why things are starting to move with Open Cup, because usually after this last board meeting, we start seeing kind of the final picture.
Speaker: So for the listeners who are not familiar with the Open Cup, Jake, how do teams qualify for it?
Speaker: Yeah, so since about 2012, so going on about 10 years of this, it's been U.S. soccer has required every single professional team that isn't owned by a higher division team or has their roster materially managed by a higher division team.
Speaker: Currently, those are just the MLS reserve teams and MLS Next Pro for the past 10 years has been all kinds of things.
Speaker: USL teams have had
Speaker: I've had some kind of arrangement, things like that.
Speaker: But right now, as of today, it's just the reserve teams that are owned by Major League Soccer teams in MLS Express.
Speaker: That's your Orlando City Bs, your Inter-Miami 2s.
Speaker: Bethlehem Steel.
Speaker: Yeah, your Bethlehem Steels.
Speaker: They're not called that anymore, Derek.
Speaker: finally got rid of that branding because that was dumb.
Speaker: And they also moved down to the Lehigh Valley.
Speaker: I just always thought that it was a weird thing.
Speaker: The club that had the most U.S. Open Cup trophies in the history.
Speaker: Couldn't enter the tournament.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: So besides those teams, everybody else has to play.
Speaker: Everybody else has to come in.
Speaker: So that's your NISA teams.
Speaker: That's your USL League One teams.
Speaker: That's your independent teams in MLS Next Pro with the two that are joining next year, Chattanooga FC and Carolina Core FC, your USL Championship teams, and then, of course, every single Major League Soccer team.
Speaker: is automatically qualified.
Speaker: As for any team that isn't under the professional banner in that section, qualifying can kind of happen in a few different ways.
Speaker: Right now, what U.S. Soccer has found the best is they offer up
Speaker: to the large national leagues.
Speaker: And currently there are only three that fit that bit, that billing, the NPSL national premier soccer league, USL league twos, USL is a pre-professional soccer league as they, as they call it.
Speaker: And then the UPSL, those are all, those are the three leagues that meet these,
Speaker: quote, criteria as a national amateur league.
Speaker: They offer them up and say, you can take one of two ways to qualify for the Open Cup.
Speaker: Either you can pay the entry fee for every single team in your league, which comes out to $200 per team, and then you can decide how your teams are ordered, and then we can just invite teams until all your allocated spots are filled up.
Speaker: Or you could not do that, and then every individual team is left
Speaker: to do the other path, which I'm going to get into, which is what's called local qualifying.
Speaker: So every other league besides those, well, so two of those leagues take that first path of, of automatically having spots, the NPSL and you also like to UPSL does not plus any other league, any other team that's official that isn't a part of those leagues goes through what's called local qualifying.
Speaker: So at about like March or sorry, in August,
Speaker: March is when the tournament proper starts.
Speaker: August, they open up registration.
Speaker: They say, hey, anybody that wants in, pay the entry fee, pay a refundable deposit.
Speaker: As long as you participate, you get it back.
Speaker: Don't break any rules.
Speaker: Cool.
Speaker: And then you participate.
Speaker: And then you play through a qualifying tournament, single elimination, just like the regular tournament.
Speaker: And right now they do about four rounds.
Speaker: This year we had 109 teams enter and pared them down and eliminated all but 11.
Speaker: So between that, those are the main ways.
Speaker: Now there's a couple other small minor ways.
Speaker: So UPSL recently negotiated because they didn't want to do that large way of paying for all their teams to be entered and then figuring out the way.
Speaker: They didn't want to do that for whatever reason, probably because it is $200 times $10.
Speaker: however many teams they've got, which is like, what, 250, something like that.
Speaker: So they said, well, can we at least get like one automatic spot?
Speaker: And U.S. Soccer agreed.
Speaker: Said you're a huge league.
Speaker: You should at least get one automatic spot.
Speaker: So the UPSL spring champion, not the fall champion, the spring national champion gets an automatic spot.
Speaker: That was a team out of Orlando this past spring.
Speaker: AS Frenzy, I believe I'm pronouncing that, won the UPSL spring national championship.
Speaker: They qualified.
Speaker: And then the USASA has had for just about as long as the US Open Cup has always had an amateur cup.
Speaker: And U.S. soccer and them kind of agreed, hey, that's kind of a really cool thing.
Speaker: We should have that be worth something for the Open Cup as well.
Speaker: And so the U.S. ASA National Amateur Cup champion qualifies for the Open Cup.
Speaker: That's been going on for about, oh, gosh, six, seven years now, maybe even longer.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so the past one was this team out of Los Angeles, SC, Mesoamerica.
Speaker: They play in a kind of Latin American Sunday league called Liga Marazan.
Speaker: And they kind of had an easy path to the National Amateur Cup.
Speaker: But hey, when you get down to like the final four and it's all the regional champions, those are all good teams.
Speaker: They beat the good teams and they qualify.
Speaker: So that's a total between all three of those things.
Speaker: And I'm going to finish this up right now.
Speaker: Between all three of those leagues plus the teams that qualify, that's about 325 teams, which is a lot.
Speaker: It's more than people would think.
Speaker: Everyone's like, well, why is it?
Speaker: That's a lot more than I thought.
Speaker: I thought it was like way fewer teams.
Speaker: Like, right, with 323 teams paid $200 entry fees this year.
Speaker: That's not like 500 like the FA Cup gets for all these preliminary rounds to get, but it's a lot.
Speaker: We're getting there as a country.
Speaker: That's so great.
Speaker: And so...
Speaker: Right now, they pared them down.
Speaker: And what kind of happens towards the end of this year, calendar year, is they kind of figure out and they say, okay, this is how many pro teams we're expecting.
Speaker: And these are the spots that they're going to open into.
Speaker: And we're going to open up for 32 spots this year, as was just recently announced.
Speaker: And so since we had 13 teams already qualified, the 11 that went through the qualifying tournament, plus the two automatic spots that left 19 open spots for the two, the two leagues that said that they wanted their spots and to automatically USO league two and NPSL, those then get divided up proportionally based on their league size, 120 in USO league two, 92 for NPSL.
Speaker: So I ended up with,
Speaker: 11 for USL League 2 and 8 for MPSL.
Speaker: And that's how we ended up with our 32 amateur teams.
Speaker: And that's pretty much how everybody gets in.
Speaker: I feel like you have... Do you remember all this?
Speaker: No, I seriously remember all this.
Speaker: It's kind of crazy because we look at this so constantly.
Speaker: So I want you all to rewind about 10 minutes, I think it was, before we asked these questions.
Speaker: When I mentioned Jake knows every single bylaw for Open Cup, these last 10 minutes or whatever...
Speaker: That's Jake, guys.
Speaker: That is Jake.
Speaker: That's the Jake.
Speaker: The Jake we know and love.
Speaker: Have you been able to take a breath now, Jake?
Speaker: Yeah, I'm good.
Speaker: You ready for your next question?
Speaker: All right, here we go.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: So in last year's competition, were there any favorite stories or games for you?
Speaker: Anything that stood out to you or sort of touched your cold, cold heart?
Speaker: Oh, I mean, come on, man.
Speaker: You told me you all...
Speaker: I had to watch that on TV.
Speaker: Y'all were there for that game against Miami United.
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: What happened in that game, Jake?
Speaker: We saw penalty kick shootout go all the way and keep for penalties.
Speaker: That's half the story.
Speaker: That was the game.
Speaker: Micah Thomas had that rebound goal, put it in, celebrated with Section 904.
Speaker: And then...
Speaker: Got the red card early in the second half.
Speaker: We hold on to a 1-1 draw.
Speaker: Go through extra time.
Speaker: We even have Jamal Johnson out there playing.
Speaker: Who saw that coming?
Speaker: And then keeper versus keeper.
Speaker: And, ah, it was glorious.
Speaker: It was such an amazing night.
Speaker: I just keep going back to so many games that I've attended that mean so much and what this means for these lower division teams and such.
Speaker: And, yes, I'm going to go back to my
Speaker: Tampa Bay Rowdy fan days, but I was there.
Speaker: I was there.
Speaker: This was 2013 in May.
Speaker: I believe that was before the Armando was announced.
Speaker: Maybe by a few days.
Speaker: It wasn't much.
Speaker: The Seattle Sounders had to travel all the way across the country and play in Tampa Bay.
Speaker: Seattle had won
Speaker: Was Seattle MLS at the time or USL still?
Speaker: They were MLS.
Speaker: So they had won the 2000... Let me make sure I get this right.
Speaker: The 2010 Open Cup.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: The 2011 Open Cup.
Speaker: 2009, 2010, and 2011 Open Cup.
Speaker: And just lost in the final on penalty kicks in the Open Cup.
Speaker: This is the next game after that.
Speaker: So we're talking about a team that had...
Speaker: Never lost in regulation in their entire MLS history in the Open Cup at this time.
Speaker: Over four years.
Speaker: The Open Cup, Seattle, that was the team.
Speaker: They went all in and all that stuff.
Speaker: They go all the way across the Tampa Bay.
Speaker: And, man, you're just talking about a tense game.
Speaker: It's nil-nil, whole game.
Speaker: Things are going...
Speaker: Things are going back and forth.
Speaker: Tampa is getting some stuff, getting steps up, and they finally get a goal, a goal late into the second half.
Speaker: I want to say it was about somewhere in the 70-something minute.
Speaker: And just, you know, Seattle immediately has to, you know, start suppling on all their good players.
Speaker: They got a player called Obey Fanny Martins, who was a big-time goal scorer.
Speaker: Oh, man, I haven't heard that name in a while.
Speaker: Big-time goal scorer.
Speaker: Well, they get a penalty.
Speaker: Seattle gets a penalty towards the end of the match.
Speaker: It is saved by the Tampa Bay goalkeeper.
Speaker: They hold on for the 1-0 victory, as was probably one of the biggest upsets I think you'll ever see in Open Cup, because you're just talking about a team that just didn't know losing in the Open Cup, unless it was all the way down to penalty kicks, which is a crapshoot.
Speaker: And that was before all the travel, like, US soccer started regionalizing everything, right?
Speaker: No, it always was regionalized.
Speaker: The issue was, and still is, especially in that part of the country, is there's still, there's only Seattle Sounders in Portland, and there's nobody else.
Speaker: This year, we're going to get Spokane Valley, USL League One, which might help things a little bit, but a lot of the amateur teams were usually either already gone by then or stuff.
Speaker: So,
Speaker: Also, at that time, there was a lack of teams in the Southeast.
Speaker: Atlanta United didn't exist.
Speaker: Orlando City wasn't in MLS at the time.
Speaker: Miami, Charlotte, all these teams didn't exist.
Speaker: So there was just a natural, just like, well, after we did all these easy, clearly geographic matchups, the leftover teams just kind of get screwed over.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And so that's generally how this kind of works, is just they basically...
Speaker: Try to regionalize the draw as best they can.
Speaker: They've gotten a lot better about it, and they even do even better once the MLS teams come in as they group them together into groups.
Speaker: So you don't always get the same teams.
Speaker: You at least get some variety, but the groups are about four to six teams usually.
Speaker: So not a huge variety, but it keeps it still within a good geographical area.
Speaker: But, you know, in these early rounds, sometimes you're just like, well, there's just nobody...
Speaker: to play that's nearby.
Speaker: So you're going to get kind of randomly selected to play somebody that's farther away.
Speaker: Yeah, that, that, that, that messy in that semifinal, um, last year, uh, you just, you just, right after coming off the league's cup victory, where it just looked like messy just could do anything.
Speaker: And then you, you just see him make that two goal, come back in that second goal, where it just looks like he just looks up and he just sees, uh, what's his, what's his face.
Speaker: Uh, the guy from Miami, I don't know very good with players sometimes, but he just,
Speaker: You know, he's just like, well, I can, I can easily put, put a ball on his platter and boom, he does it in like two seconds flat.
Speaker: And it's there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's just like, Messi's good.
Speaker: Who would have knew that he would have made it in the U S man.
Speaker: And, and just kind of speaking to him, you know, everybody's talking about his impact on MLS.
Speaker: We're kind of seeing the impact also on, on the U S open cup.
Speaker: There's some things that I, that unfortunately are, um,
Speaker: I have sources for, but I can't really talk to you about it.
Speaker: Let's just say that that money didn't just go to MLS.
Speaker: U.S. Soccer got a decent chunk of that money from CBS, Turner, whoever, Univision for the Spanish rights and things like that.
Speaker: And there are definitely there's definitely more money to invest into this tournament.
Speaker: And it is affecting things very in a very, very good way.
Speaker: So is that going to help with travel costs?
Speaker: Because I know that's one of the biggest hurdles for smaller clubs.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So you got it.
Speaker: This affects travel costs.
Speaker: This affects how much U.S. soccer has to be able to pay for broadcasts for the tournament.
Speaker: Last year, they didn't have enough money to broadcast every game of the tournament on their own dime, and they were requesting teams to do it.
Speaker: The Armada was able to do it last year, which was great, but every team wasn't able to do it.
Speaker: Now with money coming in from Messi,
Speaker: And we'll probably go back to every team, every game covered by U.S. soccer.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: Which is exactly what you want to see.
Speaker: So, you know, Messi raises all ships, you know, high tide, all that good stuff, all those things.
Speaker: It really helps.
Speaker: And hopefully this really springs forward the tournament into even better things for years to come.
Speaker: Yeah, I was going to just say for all the people that are poo-pooing Messi and what is a fact that's been on the sport of the country as a whole, that's a good indicator of, what do they say, a rising tide raises all boats, right?
Speaker: That's a perfect example of that.
Speaker: It really does.
Speaker: There's going to be so much money that's going to come and help out for the U.S. Open Cup just because of him.
Speaker: I want inner Miami away at a little Haiti soccer club.
Speaker: I want them to get some money.
Speaker: I want to see them grow.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That was a fun, fun trip down there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, these amateur teams and, and, you know, good on the ones that, that do pull the upsets, but it's few and far between now it's tough.
Speaker: And we're talking about it today because, um,
Speaker: One of the problems is that was... They do get extra money, like they're the last team of a certain level, right?
Speaker: Yes, correct.
Speaker: The last team of the amateurs, the last team of Division III, and the last team of Division II get a little prize money.
Speaker: Maybe that goes up this year.
Speaker: Maybe the prize money goes up this year.
Speaker: So who knows?
Speaker: I have no facts in front of me.
Speaker: I'm just saying that there's money coming in because of Messi, so it could go to anywhere.
Speaker: That went to, for the teams at our level, that went to Tulsa, right, last year?
Speaker: Yes, correct, because they pulled off quite a few upsets, won their first round game, and then beat the local professional team.
Speaker: So, you know, these upsets are a little few and barbed between.
Speaker: Some people are like, well, it's because we don't have our NCAA players, and we can't play because these games are in March and April instead of May like they used to be.
Speaker: And I was going through it.
Speaker: I'm just like, guys, if we try to play in May now, we're playing every single midweek for about five weeks straight.
Speaker: Let's do it.
Speaker: That sounds fun, Derek, but it's also dangerous for the players to play that because they're also still going to play on the weekends for the regular league games.
Speaker: That still happens.
Speaker: That's a lot of games for those guys to be playing.
Speaker: You know, then you also have travel.
Speaker: They get to set up on short notice in a week instead of two or three weeks and things like that.
Speaker: So, you know, it just makes more sense to spread this tournament out and started a little bit earlier because of that.
Speaker: At the cost of these amateur teams that rely on these college players now have to find different ways to build rosters.
Speaker: And at the end of the day,
Speaker: They want in.
Speaker: They're still coming in.
Speaker: You know, there's still 11 spots for USL too.
Speaker: And there wasn't like, we're not scraping the bottom of the barrel for teams.
Speaker: These were playoff teams that are still accepting invites.
Speaker: Same with NPSL.
Speaker: There are two teams that declined.
Speaker: There's still eight other teams that obviously clearly made the playoffs or were very good in playoffs.
Speaker: For USL too, did Redlands make it?
Speaker: Redlands, I think, was a little bit farther behind by a few spots.
Speaker: Oh, that's disappointing.
Speaker: That's my hometown, so I'm kind of rooting for them.
Speaker: I was actually talking to my brother today who has COVID now.
Speaker: He...
Speaker: I think I'm going to get him and his son some season tickets to Redlands FC so that they can have a father-son time together.
Speaker: USL 2 gives priority to their division champions after their playoff champion.
Speaker: So when the division next year, you got a good chance to at least be invited.
Speaker: whether you accept the invite, well, that's up to the club and whether they feel they can make that roster.
Speaker: 50% of the USL2 teams this year that were invited said no.
Speaker: And some of those could be, well, we're not going to have a team in the league next year, which is another requirement.
Speaker: You have to still be in the league the next year.
Speaker: And so we may not know that for a little bit, how many of those were because of that.
Speaker: And so just know we can't physically do that.
Speaker: can't physically play.
Speaker: As you know, this is a Armada podcast and most of our listeners are Armada fans and supporters.
Speaker: Are there any chances the Armada still making into this year's tournament?
Speaker: No, we're done.
Speaker: That's already been done.
Speaker: The 32 teams have been announced.
Speaker: We haven't clarified with U.S. soccer whether that could increase.
Speaker: It definitely won't decrease.
Speaker: They're not going to take away teams from the tournament after announcing them.
Speaker: But if there was to be more teams added in, it'd be in the range of two.
Speaker: One or two more teams.
Speaker: So that's not going to be the Armada.
Speaker: The Armada were very much farther down the list.
Speaker: I don't have the list actually in front of me.
Speaker: I want to say they were 20th, 22nd.
Speaker: I think 22nd in the NPSL standings last year.
Speaker: NPSL went down to about 10th.
Speaker: Pretty much any team that was at the top wanted in.
Speaker: Which is always interesting to see because there's a lot of teams that decline out of the USL League too.
Speaker: But the NPSL...
Speaker: Not really a lot.
Speaker: Yeah, I figured I'd ask that question.
Speaker: I kind of knew it in my head, but I figured I would ask that for the listeners.
Speaker: You're breaking our heart, Jake.
Speaker: You're breaking our heart.
Speaker: 2025 on, it's automatic.
Speaker: You're in.
Speaker: They're on or in.
Speaker: They will continue to be in as long as they remain professional.
Speaker: And if you win the tournament...
Speaker: You can go on to attempt to be the conca champs the next year.
Speaker: The draw just concluded just before the start of this recording.
Speaker: You know, Hey, you never know.
Speaker: Cause we've, we've talked about, like it can happen.
Speaker: Sacramento was there and, you know, and then the next year you get an automatic spot in the round of 32, which that makes that even shorter for the following year.
Speaker: Not that,
Speaker: A lot of teams went back to back, but Sacramento could have been entering two rounds ahead had they won that game ahead of the rest of their league, which would have been very interesting to see, but it didn't happen.
Speaker: One of the Armada's biggest rivals in the last few years was Southern State Soccer Club.
Speaker: God of spit.
Speaker: We thought they qualified for the Open Cup by reaching the regional final.
Speaker: Did their exclusion from the NPSL Open Cup list surprise you, Jake?
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, it surprises me any time an NPSL team declines because it's usually much, much fewer.
Speaker: It doesn't seem like that they're folding at this point.
Speaker: So the only conclusion I can make is that they either didn't feel like they did it or maybe they're not even going to be a part of the NPSL next year.
Speaker: You have to be a part of the league to be a part of it.
Speaker: And that could be a reason.
Speaker: That breaks my heart because I want revenge for
Speaker: I really want revenge.
Speaker: You may not get it.
Speaker: I'm still the only one of the three of us that have seen us win it out there at Southern States.
Speaker: You may forever be the only one.
Speaker: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker: After every trip, I say I'm not going to do that trip again, and I guess maybe now I'll get my wish.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, Jake, I know this is going to be tough, but imagine that I'm a miserable bugger.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: And that I don't pay any attention to the Open Cup.
Speaker: What is your one biggest reason I should pay attention to if the Armada aren't involved?
Speaker: Because, man, you know, the Cup set, it really is the greatest thing that so much in America just can't see.
Speaker: If you're a fan of any kind of football that's in Europe,
Speaker: Like, the Open Cup should be like an instant watch because what do you mean?
Speaker: You don't watch the Scottish Cup?
Speaker: You don't watch the FA Cup?
Speaker: You don't watch Copa del Rey?
Speaker: Of course you do.
Speaker: So then why wouldn't you watch the U.S. Open Cup?
Speaker: Because it's the same thing.
Speaker: Like, you know, who did Bayern Munich just lose to?
Speaker: Well, the same thing happens here.
Speaker: It happens.
Speaker: And I've seen it.
Speaker: In fact, we have seen...
Speaker: Twice before an MLS team go down to amateur opposition.
Speaker: It has happened.
Speaker: It's as frequent as a 16 over one in the NCAA tournament, but it happens.
Speaker: So you're telling me there's a chance.
Speaker: There is always a chance.
Speaker: That's why it's worth watching because you just never know.
Speaker: Jake, I am throwing a curveball question out here.
Speaker: No, for no, man.
Speaker: If there is a power that B is listening and wants advice from Jake Sillick, what would you change about the Open Cup?
Speaker: What would I change about the Open Cup?
Speaker: Man, we're kind of getting there, to be straight honest with you.
Speaker: So I don't think that these changes I'm proposing are that far off.
Speaker: More prize money.
Speaker: So as I mentioned...
Speaker: We're getting money in for Messi, so that could happen.
Speaker: More teams overall in the tournament.
Speaker: Right now we're about...
Speaker: Two thirds of the other teams are pro teams and about one third are the amateur teams.
Speaker: I would love to see that be closer to maybe 65 or like, yeah, like 60% or even 55% pro teams and just more amateur teams that are allowed.
Speaker: But at the same time, they got to be good teams.
Speaker: We can't just allow, you know, teams that are going to get beat 10, 10 nil.
Speaker: That's no fun for anybody.
Speaker: So, so I'm with you there.
Speaker: I want more teams, but I want more than just like the good teams.
Speaker: I want like, I want every NPSL, every UPSL team to qualify for opening rounds and just start not battling it out.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, knockout style.
Speaker: It's really what we kind of do.
Speaker: Derek, that's what we kind of do.
Speaker: I mean, that's what there's 109 teams.
Speaker: I mean, nobody's,
Speaker: saying that every UPSL team can't enter qualifying.
Speaker: They could if they all wanted to, but they don't.
Speaker: Why?
Speaker: You have to ask them.
Speaker: Why wouldn't you be a part of the Open Cup?
Speaker: It's probably because it costs too much for them.
Speaker: So maybe we need more money to go in.
Speaker: There just needs to be more money overall that has to happen with that.
Speaker: Their travel costs need to be paid.
Speaker: They're not in qualifying, although I'm being...
Speaker: told that that's changing a little bit, that maybe for some of the longer travels that some of the teams did, U.S. soccer kind of helped them out a little bit.
Speaker: But, you know, we go through qualifying rounds.
Speaker: That's the same as an FA Cup, you know, preliminary round, first qualifying round, second qualifying round to pare down all the non-league teams down to 32 non-league teams.
Speaker: What a coincidence.
Speaker: We have 32 amateur teams.
Speaker: or open division.
Speaker: So they split the gate, you know, they don't, you know, so that's an interesting thought.
Speaker: And maybe there is some, some merit to that.
Speaker: So some merit to having a split gate or something like that, but,
Speaker: what a lot of people don't talk about when it comes to, comes to splitting the gate is it's splitting the net gate.
Speaker: So that's taking away all the costs of running it.
Speaker: And so the, the FA cup allows the home team to deduct security costs, staff costs, um,
Speaker: Yeah, but that can go a long way, though, like for a really small club.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: It depends.
Speaker: If we did that in America, the net gates in a lot of these games are minuscule or negative.
Speaker: I was going to say negative because I'm going to charge nothing this past season.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: If it's negative, then there's nothing to split.
Speaker: They made that beer money, though.
Speaker: They made that beer money.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, like, that's good in theory, but it has to be done smartly and it has to be done in a way that makes sense.
Speaker: So maybe it's just better just to have the prize money just be a per-round thing.
Speaker: You win a first-round game, you can get a few hundred dollars or whatever makes sense for that.
Speaker: But I think the overall prize money has to be larger.
Speaker: We have to go way bigger than $300,000.
Speaker: And I think that's what Don Garber is talking about when he talks about this.
Speaker: He's not talking about, oh, well, you don't want to be the Open Cup because we don't care about it.
Speaker: He just wants the Open Cup to really mean something for his league and for everybody else, too.
Speaker: So I think they just want more money involved in it.
Speaker: They want either more prize money or a cut of the TV deal.
Speaker: You know, hey, it's MLS's player at the end of the day.
Speaker: Maybe they...
Speaker: Maybe they have a right to some of that TV deal.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: But that's what I think Don Garber is talking about.
Speaker: He's not talking about leaving the Open Cup.
Speaker: They can't leave the Open Cup.
Speaker: Professional League standards stipulate that they have to participate.
Speaker: And everybody agreed to that.
Speaker: And they were just agreed to this year.
Speaker: So if they were considering changing that, they would have like...
Speaker: worked on that then instead of, you know, just talking about that.
Speaker: So that's what I think Don Garber is really talking about.
Speaker: So what you're saying is all the conspiracy guys got it wrong.
Speaker: They're just not.
Speaker: The 10-Hat Brigade.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: They're just not talking about it.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And he's talking about participation.
Speaker: But I think what he's talking about is he's talking about if when we participate, we should get some of that money that comes from that, that we're being put on broadcast.
Speaker: That money should go to us.
Speaker: But so is USL.
Speaker: So they should get some of that money, too.
Speaker: You know, if they're playing a USL team or when it's two MLS teams.
Speaker: You know, that's right.
Speaker: Even though it's an open cup, like they they're the ones being broadcast.
Speaker: So that that's what I think he's actually means by that.
Speaker: He doesn't mean he doesn't mean, oh, we're going to take out the CONCACAF, that makes no sense.
Speaker: That makes no sense whatsoever, because why would you take away the good teams out of the tournament?
Speaker: then that makes the tournament worth less.
Speaker: NCBS and Turner or whoever doesn't pay nearly as much because now there's no Messi.
Speaker: Now there's no any of this.
Speaker: That makes no sense.
Speaker: No, those teams have to be in, but that money may have to just be distributed out differently.
Speaker: And so that's what they're talking about.
Speaker: Well, when conspiracies are coming to play, nothing makes sense.
Speaker: Yeah, nothing.
Speaker: That never makes sense.
Speaker: All right, Jake, we want to thank you for taking a little bit of time with us.
Speaker: Can you give us your socials?
Speaker: Yeah, it's an old... I'll put you on the spot.
Speaker: Come on.
Speaker: S-P-O-R-T-Z-F-R-K.
Speaker: Sport Z-F-R-K.
Speaker: It's just an old high school thing.
Speaker: I haven't abandoned.
Speaker: Too lazy for it, I guess.
Speaker: Whatever you want to call about it.
Speaker: That's me.
Speaker: And then I'm usually the one tweeting from thecup.us, which is at US Open Cup.
Speaker: Why the Open Cup is...
Speaker: hasn't requested us to change that.
Speaker: Nobody knows.
Speaker: Josh is like, I don't even know.
Speaker: They may have changed our website name, but not our social media handles.
Speaker: Go figure.
Speaker: I want to pivot, though.
Speaker: Just because, Jake, you've been kind of a diehard Armada supporter, even though you've moved away and moved to a state that happens.
Speaker: Yeah, I know.
Speaker: What state are you in?
Speaker: I'm in Arizona now.
Speaker: You know what's weird is I looked at our analytics.
Speaker: We have zero listens from Arizona.
Speaker: Do you?
Speaker: Wow, Jake.
Speaker: Man, I just moved here like four months ago.
Speaker: Give me a minute.
Speaker: Just give me a minute.
Speaker: We're moving our house now, you know.
Speaker: You keep in touch with a little bit from Jacksonville, right?
Speaker: I do.
Speaker: Did he catch the news yesterday, which would have been Wednesday, December 12th?
Speaker: Yeah, man.
Speaker: You know, it's good to see.
Speaker: You know, hey, that's another thing to talk about is that that's the biggest change that he's having is there should be not just a men's Open Cup, but a women's Open Cup.
Speaker: And when USL launches their Super League, if that does happen.
Speaker: Let's talk about the other league.
Speaker: Yeah, there's an NWSL team that the owner of the Armada has announced that they're planning on forming a team here in Jacksonville.
Speaker: You know, exploratory group, which means he's in the initial stages, which is good.
Speaker: He should be starting that, of course.
Speaker: But it's just like, you know, could be many years off.
Speaker: And I do think it's, you know, in the phase one configuration of the Armada Stadium at 5,000, that's clearly not enough.
Speaker: So that's why it still could be many years off.
Speaker: But hey, at least he's starting that, and it's good to see.
Speaker: So we're listening to another podcast that Nathan was on.
Speaker: It was, what was it, Dan?
Speaker: What the Health?
Speaker: What the Health.
Speaker: Yeah, it was a local business podcast.
Speaker: So the Armada president, Nathan Walter, was on that.
Speaker: I think he threw out a number a lot higher than 5,000.
Speaker: I think it's going to be expandable up to 20%.
Speaker: Well, of course, but nobody's doubting it's going to get to that point, but when?
Speaker: It's not going to be in 2025.
Speaker: I think the target is like 2027, 2028.
Speaker: Okay, cool, that's great.
Speaker: So when that happens, that's when an NWSL team is finally available.
Speaker: If you read the press release, it does mention Phase 2, for Phase 2.
Speaker: So that's definitely not going to be...
Speaker: 2025 because phase one scheduled to be completed in time for the 2025 season.
Speaker: So it'll be interesting to see what happens.
Speaker: I did not even catch that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That they're going to be.
Speaker: I'm reading it right now.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it won't be 2025.
Speaker: That's very interesting.
Speaker: Well, you know, they're expecting MLS Next Pro to become bigger by then, which is good.
Speaker: And so, you know, who knows what happens in the in five years from now.
Speaker: And I hope they're successful.
Speaker: And I would love I would absolutely love to see a professional women's soccer team in Jacksonville.
Speaker: Look at where we were five years ago.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: We didn't know we would have a soccer club.
Speaker: Didn't know anything.
Speaker: So it was a lock and change in five years.
Speaker: I don't know how many of y'all remember, but Patton Park was a little light in attendance.
Speaker: Still had a good time.
Speaker: As we discussed a couple episodes ago, still had a good time for sure.
Speaker: And Jake, if you had a chance, that was maybe two episodes ago, you can get caught up.
Speaker: I will go back and listen to some more, guys.
Speaker: I will.
Speaker: I got time now.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: We thank you for... Jake, we love you.
Speaker: We do love you, Jake, and we thank you for sticking around.
Speaker: Just to touch on a little bit, because this is Armada podcast, they've got an event coming up next week, Derek.
Speaker: Is that correct?
Speaker: Yeah, Tuesday, what would that be?
Speaker: The 19th.
Speaker: The 19th of December.
Speaker: Only for season ticket holders, though.
Speaker: Or season ticket deposits.
Speaker: Or deposits, which is $100, and they give you a jersey.
Speaker: Yep, and you get, for this event, I think they're doing a free beverage at Wicked Barley.
Speaker: And hors d'oeuvres.
Speaker: Or horses d'oeuvres.
Speaker: And I think they're going to be having a roundtable discussion with
Speaker: Tommy Kay, Kata, and Jamal Johnson.
Speaker: So that should be a good time for sure.
Speaker: Some greater model legends there, man.
Speaker: Yeah, for sure.
Speaker: That we're going to be singing about for so many years.
Speaker: Years to come for sure.
Speaker: And also... The real question, though, is will Ian be sad that night?
Speaker: Obviously.
Speaker: I mean, you don't expect anything else.
Speaker: There's a free beer involved.
Speaker: Come on.
Speaker: Unless I round up everybody else's tickets, I'm probably still going to be sad.
Speaker: There's a hors d'oeuvre.
Speaker: Tommy K will be there.
Speaker: What's sad about Tommy K?
Speaker: Beer and horses doofers.
Speaker: Who can ask for more?
Speaker: All right, so we're going to hopefully see Ian with a smile on his face for sure.
Speaker: And also a little bit of breaking news here that there may be some special hosts for the roundtable discussion.
Speaker: What do they call it?
Speaker: A fireside chat, I think they called it.
Speaker: So show up to find out what that's going to be all about.
Speaker: So I believe that is going to do it for this episode.
Speaker: So we want to thank the veteran, Jade Sillick, for coming and joining us and talking about Open Cup.
Speaker: And I guess we'll end this with a Go Armada!
Speaker: Go Armada!
Speaker: Gun yourself, guys.
Speaker: Bye!
Speaker: Bye!
