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Ep. 5 Dortmund 2024
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Hello, everyone! This is Episode 5 of "The Show 6 Podcast", where we bring you the highest quality coverage of the Play! Pokémon Championship Series for Pokémon GO! We explore the plays, the players, and everything else happening in the competitive scene.
This week, we reflect on the Dortmund Regional Championships, where ArceusAurelius was the main character! We also reflect on Yacobervitch's dominance in Melbourne, the ValorAsh dispute, and more!
If you're ready, Lock In, and good luck, have fun!
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Transcript
Introduction to Dortmund Regionals
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome in to the Show6 podcast, where we break down the championship series for Pokemon Go. Today, we're taking a look at the Dortmund regionals, where 104 trainers competed. We'll discuss the championship run of Viking, Voria, Arceus, Aurelius, who merged Victorious in what turned out to be a talent flame meta. We'll also pick up some loose threats from our previous Knoxville and Melbourne episode. So let's talk in, good luck, and have fun.
00:00:49
Speaker
Welcome in
Hosts' Return from Dortmund
00:00:50
Speaker
everybody. My name is Deez Wireless and I'm here with Speedy as Chief too. Welcome in Speedy. How are you doing today? I'm doing really well, Zweilis. Good to see you. You are back. I guess you've returned home from Dortmund, Germany. I saw you cooking on stage. I can't wait to get into all that, but yeah, I'm doing great. How are you?
00:01:11
Speaker
I'm doing fine. I'm doing fine. It was actually like a bit of a stressful weekend, but in the most positive way possible because I actually did not plan on making day two, which meant that I actually had only booked on the hotel room for like two nights. And from Sunday to Monday, I had to book another.
00:01:33
Speaker
I had to work in the afternoon, actually, like my shift started at 3 p.m. I wouldn't even have been able to make the grand finals and losers finals. So good thing that I got knocked out just before that. So yeah, it was like all like very, very cut close in that regard. But yeah, had a good time and I'm back
Tournament Challenges and DRE Scare
00:01:52
Speaker
home.
00:01:52
Speaker
Well, I saw your, I saw your tweet as well, or I should say posts. You don't know that we're on, we're on X. I saw your posts and you said, uh, note for the future only book refundable hotels, because this was also the same weekend as the DRE scare, right? It was so scary. And like, we can, we can just get right into the, uh, interesting meta developments of Dortmund, I would say.
00:02:17
Speaker
Yeah, of course, like there's the classics, right? Like very, very tiny movements of stuff like an ILA, which has like a plus four compared to Knoxville. Charger mark plus 7.5, scum minus 4.5%. So all like very much around the same mark. There's like three developments I kind of want to get into.
Meta Developments and Pokemon Strategies
00:02:40
Speaker
One, Lickitung plus 25. Oh yeah. Two, Wiscash plus 20.
00:02:47
Speaker
And I think a first this season, Talonflame sneaking into the top 12 with 15% usage. And 24 hours before the tournament started, you couldn't have used Talonflame at all, because those incinerates did no damage.
00:03:03
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. I feel like time moves so quickly and there's so many different, you know, issues or small things that come up. I feel like it's worth encapsulating, right? So this is kind of like our own time capsule we can go back and listen to. This was a tournament where 48 hours, I think 48 to 72 hours prior.
00:03:20
Speaker
Essentially in co-battle league, you could throw two counters and a body slam against incinerate user and the incinerate damage would never come through. It would never register, right? Because there's some kind of issue with the damage registration in battle. You know, this isn't DRE like we're talking about in the tournaments, you know, where you should get a body slam on your third lick before the vault switch, that kind of thing. This is literally game doesn't apply damage, doesn't work, and it's consistent. And people were saying, is this a feature?
00:03:49
Speaker
You know, like the, like the, the meme of the guy,
Impact of Game Fixes on Talonflame's Play
00:03:52
Speaker
the guy holding the butterfly. Is this a future or a bug? And, uh, it was, it was devastating, right? So I just want to say, I just want to say is why you have massive cojones for locking in talent flame right when this issue is just barely getting resolved. That that was, that was wild to me seeing you play that.
00:04:08
Speaker
Yeah, I can walk you through the timeline a little bit because it was like around midnight-ish where my friend and European caster Martijn, an eloquence, actually, DM'd me and said, oh, by the way, my guy, it's fixed, you can actually bring your turn of fame to the tournament. And I tried some master league or go battle league action with a Ho-Oh, which is actually
00:04:32
Speaker
the only legendary I have built for the master league. That came in very convenient there.
00:04:39
Speaker
but my incident rate still didn't go through. So I don't know, maybe it was just like a case of needing to restart the game or like download a new update. That was like still something fishy, but I just trusted the amount of people that said, oh, it is fixed now. And some people even claimed it was only fixed for Europeans playing against Europeans and might go battle league. Your opponents might not have been from Europe at that point in time. So yeah, I took the risk.
00:05:09
Speaker
I went for the team that I picked out originally. I tweaked it at 2 a.m. still because I took out the Wiscash that I had. Because I'm just not a Wiscash guy. I struggle with nut shelters.
00:05:23
Speaker
like very, very close to the deadline. I actually have some background for you as well, because I'm not sure if Martijn told you this, but basically he was messaging in a secret discord that we all share. And he was basically saying, somebody sent me a battle. I just want to try it. I want to test it. And he sent a battle to me. I guess it was a fair time for me because he was trying to go to bed before the tournament.
00:05:47
Speaker
And we did a Talonflame battle, didn't work, right? Huge DRE errors in a Talonflame mirror. But then he took on Nighttime Clasher and Nighttime Clasher was in Europe. And for them, it worked. So what we determine is, is this is at first, yes, you're correct. It is region based. So depending on if he was battling another European or if he was battling somebody from outside of Europe, there was a difference, right? Secondly, it's also device based.
00:06:16
Speaker
So he was actually battling somebody on Android with his Android and it worked correctly. And when you look at something like iPhone, it's a different process. So yes, there are, there are multiple variables at hand and luckily, you know, saved by the bell, Niantic came through and fixed everything just before the tournament. So, but,
Regional Meta and Player Trends
00:06:34
Speaker
but I think it also like, like you said,
00:06:36
Speaker
With the meta shifts, it put a lot of pressure on people to pivot more towards one turn fast tech users, two turn fast tech users, because they didn't want to get caught by the DRE, which I thought was going to mean less charge bug, less town flame is going to open up a lot of space for steel, flying, water, and Pelipper, perhaps things like that.
00:06:55
Speaker
Yeah, actually I did have an alternative team locked in at that point in time, which was the Pelipa team that Jakobovic used to win the Melbourne Regional. So that was like actually like a plan B in place. But I still thought that the town film that I read into all those Skarmory and Nylip course that we've seen over time, that just looked really good and really interesting. And
00:07:23
Speaker
If you just plugged
Growth of Regional Championships
00:07:25
Speaker
in the teams that did well, for example, in Knoxville into PVPoke and basically looked at the top threads, Talonfame was always on top of that. So I really just crossed my fingers and prayed for it and took to flip the switch in time. And yeah, thankfully they did.
00:07:44
Speaker
Yeah, I think everybody wants to know about your town flame moveset. But as you're saying, in terms of the general meta, a huge uptick in Lickitung. It was already the leader, right? I think it was coming in at like 68% in Knoxville. So definitely very high usage. Wiscash as well. My prediction, unfortunately, did not come true in terms of Shadow Wiscash overtaking the regular.
00:08:04
Speaker
But we'll get to your prediction because you did a little bit better than me. But I think that you would agree the meta was definitely pretty condensed. Did you feel that way going into the tournament? Did you feel did you expect to see a lot of the same things? Yes, I have to say that I was a little surprised as to what the matter actually condensed around because of course, there's some Pokemon that you just expect to see a lot and that we did see a lot.
00:08:32
Speaker
For example, the Liketang Shadow Gligar Core, which has been popular for basically six months now. Also, Viscash, which obviously is the big winner of the most recent MOVE update and featured on all tournament winning teams, but the very first one this season. So probably the Pokemon of the season.
00:08:56
Speaker
And yeah, I expected those. And the high numbers that we see, like if you look at what was popular in Dortmund, 73% Likitung, 61% Wiskash, that is like basically
Comparing Tournament Sizes and Attendance
00:09:10
Speaker
old Medicham levels. But I think the reason why that is, is because historically German tournaments, especially in that Western German region, have pretty low turnout.
00:09:24
Speaker
I don't know exactly why that is. I personally assume that there are just fewer casual badness in Germany that just randomly go to those tournaments because nearby flag other countries have a little bit more of an active community.
00:09:42
Speaker
But we saw the same in Bochum, which was also like conflicting dates with the horn tour. So that was even smaller than this year. But if you compare it to Liverpool, this tournament was almost half the size. But because it's so easy to travel through Europe, it means that all the tryhards, all the people that actually have their eyes on world's qualification,
00:10:05
Speaker
are able to go to all these tournaments. And Dublin is basically in the heart of Europe, so it's very easy to get
Spotlight on Arceus Aurelius
00:10:11
Speaker
to. And the people that choose to get there are those that are the most tryhard about the game, basically. So it does make sense that the Pokémon that proved to be the most effective in previous tournaments are the ones that show up the most in such a tournament.
00:10:28
Speaker
Yeah, I feel like, so one of the side projects that I have in mind is to calculate the growth over time, right? Of these regional championships, especially the ones at recurring locations, you know, Liverpool, Lille, for the US, you know, we have Indianapolis returning this year. I'd really love to see what the year over year growth looks like. And honestly, like I was looking back at 2023, you know, we had 50 players in Salt Lake City and
00:10:53
Speaker
I was thinking, oh, you know, we got to grow this. We need to get more players coming. And I definitely think that's still the goal. But I do also believe that the growth over time is good because 104 in Dortmund, you know, if we were looking at 2022 or even last year, we would say, you know, this is pretty good. But but I got to say Liverpool and especially the Utrecht special event, the numbers are just going to be massive for those. Absolutely. Absolutely. Like I'm super glad that we're at a point in time where
00:11:23
Speaker
for events like Liverpool, Lille, Utrecht, we are expecting around 200 players because like last year, I don't have the Bochon Challenge open just now, but I do think it was just about 60-ish players, maybe 70 if we're lucky, but probably less than that. And to be disappointed at 104 now, like that's like already a big step in the right direction for sure.
00:11:52
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. I was actually engaging with someone on Twitter. Can't recall their name right now, but I will bring it up if it comes to mind. But I was talking about the records that we had set in terms of attendance. And I was looking back at last year and I was saying, well, our international competitions will cap. We'll hit 256 for those. But some of the other ones are just a little less clear cut. I found it here. It was actually against Kahuna Pat.
Talonflame's Role in Meta Shifts
00:12:16
Speaker
So Kahuna Pat, thanks for the question.
00:12:18
Speaker
Our records that we set in 2023 were 221 at Utrecht. And again, this is a signups and not necessarily accounting for no shows and things like that. Our biggest regional was actually in Mexico City at 247, which is massive for a regional and then EUIC and AIC both capped. And so far this year, our record is Liverpool at 197 signups. So I do believe that Utrecht should outsell that. I do believe we should hit over 200 for that. So that'll be.
00:12:48
Speaker
Kind of a new record, but I also put special events and regionals kind of separate, which I think is also fair. Yeah, especially with special events, if you just count the people that actually show up, I do think that's fair to compare to proper regionals. But if it's like a large cap, a free sign up, and some people just then decided to not go there.
00:13:11
Speaker
That will definitely skew the numbers a little bit. One thing that I'm really excited about is EUIC signups opening I think next week, if I'm not mistaken. So we're going to see whether we will still be capped at 256 or whether we'll actually shoot for the 512 this time around. And I would not be surprised for this to be the biggest Pokemon Go event to date.
Deez Wireless's Dortmund Experience
00:13:37
Speaker
LAIC, I feel like that one had a chance to go over well over 300 because I think signups capped two or three weeks before the event. So I do believe we could have, we could have hit it, but, um, sorry, I know we're getting into all the, all the numbers of attendance and things like that, but I know people are here to, to listen to us talk about Dortmund as well. I wanted to, uh, to ask you in terms of fire type Pokemon, right? We saw Skeletorge really kind of emerge with, I didn't mean to rhyme, sorry.
00:14:04
Speaker
with Doonbug in San Antonio, but I'm curious why Talonflame and how does it match up into the rest of the meta? The emergence of the dirge. Yeah. I did see that and I did like it at the time. I think, especially in the month of December, I experimented a lot with the dirge and I did enjoy it a lot. I do think it's still very good.
00:14:29
Speaker
GBL and Ultra League and Great League. But it's unique niche for play Pokemon isn't really there if you compare it to Talonflame side by side. Because what sets the two apart is basically the coverage with the charge attacks.
00:14:47
Speaker
And the Disarming Voice from Skeletorch is really nice against dark types that otherwise give ghost types trouble, or especially against dragons such as Gaslord, but those are fringe picks in the meta. And Pokemon that much more often will have to deal with are the ground types, right? There's Whiscash, which is on basically every team, and there's Gligar, which is on almost every team.
00:15:14
Speaker
And those two are way more easy for telling them to deal with because versus Gleiger, you just straight up have a positive matchup because you don't have to fear the dicks. The dicks are resisted, so they have to go for the lower damage per energy aerial ace. Yes.
00:15:31
Speaker
And you just can either ramp up incinerates or just hit a fly or a brave bird and really threaten big damage onto the Glaga, especially the Shadow One. And with Wiscash, it is actually the case that Skuld
Talonflame's Moveset and Strategic Choices
00:15:46
Speaker
plus Machot threaten the Knockout against the Skeletorch.
00:15:50
Speaker
But with Talonflame, you actually resist the mudshots instead of taking super effective damage from it. So you endure a skull and still are not really in danger of getting fumped down and are able to get to your charge attacks.
00:16:06
Speaker
And therefore it's not as RPS. It's not over if you have your talent flame locked into a whisk ash. And I do think people prefer, especially high-level competitors prefer to have flexible options, like win cons, even in bad matchups. And talent flame just offers that more. Like one thing that also I want to touch on is the Likertang matchup, because talent flame does win all even shields.
00:16:33
Speaker
I don't think it's as clear-cut what you prefer for Likitang teams, though, because the one nice thing about Skeletorge is that if you have to bring a Pokémon into a loaded Likitang that has a lot of energy, the Body Stamps actually threaten Tunnel Flame, while the energy is rolled entirely by Skeletorge. So that is a bit of a trade-off. You do take Super Effector from Nix, but you are able to
00:16:58
Speaker
take the energy better on Skeletorch, but the overall environment is still more of a Talonflame meta for sure. I love that you
Arceus Aurelius's Championship Journey
00:17:07
Speaker
use the word environment, right? Because on the last episode, we talked about environment and targets, but there's also threats. And I feel like the steep drop-off and usage of Lantern has also really opened things up. Because if you look at it in terms of water type coverage, yes, there's Azumarole. We saw plenty of Azumarole versus Talonflame actually in the Grand Finals.
00:17:26
Speaker
And I think Lantern is just one of those Pokemon where if you had a Skarmory six months ago, nine months ago, and you lined up against Lantern, it was just a death sentence. If you had Talonflame lined up against Lantern, you were basically hopeless because there was nothing you could really do. But Talonflame is able to target Pokemon like Charge Bug, like Registeal, you know, with their electric coverage.
00:17:44
Speaker
and deal back that super effective damage. And I feel like that's also a differentiator because again, sometimes you just don't feel like you can bring a Pokemon because if it lines up against one common thing in the meta, you really have no shot. So I think environment targets and also threats, right? It's another, another thing that a lot of top trainers look at. And it was a unique opening for town flame. And I feel like, uh, like you pointed out with, with the double grounds, right? We've seen so many whisk, cash, Gligar cores.
00:18:09
Speaker
It just seems really tough to run Skeletorch and that's still the reverberations, the ripples effects of Doonbug in San Antonio because after Doonbug won there, we saw Lyle Jeffs come in and Abhinav with their, you know, Vigaroth, Whiskash, Gligar team, and just absolutely leaving no windows for Skeletorch. Exactly.
00:18:31
Speaker
And yeah, I think what you said about lantern is actually interesting because I don't think lantern actually got worse. Like only a couple of months ago, we were asking ourselves whether the lantern actually got buffed. I think the real lantern nerf was just Chargiburg actually picking up in usage because that's just an electric type that beats Spark lantern consistently.
00:18:56
Speaker
has a bit more of a playable matchup against the Mud Boys and that's why Lantern all but disappeared. So yeah, sometimes it's just about the environment really.
00:19:07
Speaker
Interesting. Interesting. Well, so I obviously, we've mentioned a couple of times so far that you actually competed in Dortmund. You ended up placing fourth, which is also super impressive. Definitely given your,
French Community's Impact
00:19:18
Speaker
your move set on talent flame, which man, you're that, okay. That's, that's one thing you can do, right? For, for everybody who listened to the last week's episode, if you want to win a core breaker prediction, just run it in the tournament yourself and then, and then just in place top four, easy, just, just do it that way.
00:19:34
Speaker
Uh, but so I wanted to ask you about your run through the tournament in Dortmund. So I'm looking here at the bracket. Uh, I noticed a name that I recognize very well already in the semi-finals of group B on day one. So I'm curious how your run was, how your, your experience was.
00:19:51
Speaker
Yeah, as I said, I took my sweet time team building, going back and forth between teams, and at the last second, kicking out Wiscash in favor of Gligar is my charge of my gun, so just sort of personal preference, really, because I didn't want to be stuck against the Cresselia and make a time with little opportunity of counterplay. So, I basically settled on my Obama-Snower-Tone fame core team,
00:20:20
Speaker
It also featured a Likertang, a Glaiger, a Charjabach, and a Nihilype. And I managed to win my first two rounds cleanly 2-0. Those were Mandibuzz teams and I just had really good matchups into Mandibuzz. Especially with Charjabach and Abomasnow putting in a lot of work and Townflame having great neutral play. And then
00:20:44
Speaker
I'm always happy if I don't have to play my first match-ups on stream so I can warm up a little bit,
Melbourne Tournament Highlights
00:20:49
Speaker
but it was inevitable. Like, my winner's semi had to be put on stream because it was against the one and only Nighttime Clasher, the public enemy number one of the European continent at this moment in time after his impressive Liverpool run and taking home the first-place medal.
00:21:10
Speaker
So we were talking a little bit ahead of time about team building and the overall meta. And I knew that Snowman, who was also in my group just on the other side of the bracket, brought the Shadow Charizard. And I was saying, like, oh, I really hope that somebody, like,
00:21:28
Speaker
No hate against the guy, but somebody needs to kick him out because I really don't want to go up against the Shadow Charizard. And then I face Night-Time Flasher. I do not know what he's running. We go on stage. He has this funny little chat set on. He hands me his team sheet, and there it is. Shadow Charizard. And I just... My heart sings, alright? And...
00:21:52
Speaker
Yeah, I somehow managed to come back from, I think I go down 0 and 1 immediately and then I somehow claw back and it comes down to a lengthy dispute at the end, actually, because I managed to sneak a full world switch from my charger back onto, I do think, his naked tongue at that point in time.
00:22:16
Speaker
Turns out that that was just because he only reached the body stem after Follix and had no choice but to throw it on alignment, so there was no lag going on there. I just escaped with like a 1 HP victory after I completely misread what he would have in the back. I expected the Charizard. It was the Annihilator. I almost gave up the entirety of
00:22:39
Speaker
my, my glider, which would have been the perfect counter for the NILI. Um, but yeah, I managed to get off two discharges from my charger bug and then close it out with a power whip that my nicotine reaches on one HP. And yeah, like by the summer stuff margins and, um, as a display of top tier PVP television, I managed to take back Europe's honor. Um, Logan rocket finishes the job in the lower bracket.
00:23:04
Speaker
Knocking nighttime pleasure out for good, denying him another top cut. I originally had planned to just yoink the chef set and do the winner's interview with it, but the dispute took its sweet time, which I appreciate. I just think that's how disputes should be done. Yeah, I'm stuck with just a picture that I post on social media,
Knoxville Tournament Dispute Discussions
00:23:27
Speaker
but it was good fun. It was like,
00:23:30
Speaker
I was not only like defending Europe. This is like basically just a bit that we're doing, right? This is like all in good fun. It's just spicing up the season. I was also like battling a friend that I met the first time a year ago in Buhom actually, which is 15 minutes away from Dortmund. And yeah, like we came as almost nobodies back in the day. And now we are both regional champions face off against each other with very similar teams that we build.
00:23:58
Speaker
And yeah, came down to 1HP in a dream. Very, very fun experience for sure. So I've noticed this and I feel like a lot of other people that are watching the Championship Series really closely have probably noticed this as well. But Nighttime Clasher is kind of like your Padawan to you being the Jedi Master, right? I mean, I think he's actually like many people's Padawan because he really gets his insights and his
00:24:26
Speaker
um strategies and you just ask a lot of questions a lot of questions which is great if you want to improve and but yeah i do think i do think that especially in terms of team billing he probably took a few pages out of my book here and there
00:24:42
Speaker
I remember you and I talking before San Antonio and you pointed out that a Skeletorge Obama snow core could be
Looking Ahead to Upcoming Tournaments
00:24:49
Speaker
really, really impactful. It could be a great core to play in a tournament play. I almost brought it to San Antonio, but I recognize that nighttime clasher actually did.
00:24:58
Speaker
And it seems like, you know, toga tomorrow for him, you know, that was one of his breakthrough Pokemon. And I remember a lot of Americans actually cheering for you, especially if they were to a butters fans because they wanted to see shadow and froze when a regional championship last season. Right. So wacky electric types, similar teams. And then you come into this tournament and and and he's got shadow Charizard and you got talent flame.
00:25:23
Speaker
What's going on here? There's so many similarities. I think Padawan to your Jedi Master, I think that's definitely... He's definitely someone who has a good taste in Pokemon, that is for sure. Yeah, maybe he wants to be just like me. I do not know.
00:25:42
Speaker
First, I win a regional in Europe, then he wins a regional in Europe. It's really just him copying me, I would say. Let's see whether we can predict where he's going from here just by watching my steps. Maybe that is how it works. I do not know, but it was a very close set. It was a very fun set. I do think he does have some originality to his team building, like his Liverpool team I would never have run.
00:26:11
Speaker
Yeah, there's definitely some parallels there. I don't think it will be the last time that the two of us meet on stage.
00:26:21
Speaker
Well, despite finishing fourth, I'm looking here at the day two bracket. You actually got knocked down to the loser's bracket by Colin. And then in the loser's bracket, you took down tragic comics and then was eventually defeated by Arceus Aurelius. So that's, that's, I mean, honestly, to be knocked out by the two grand finalists is definitely admirable. I think that that shows you kind of the sign that you were a contender, right? You're right on the cusp. And again, this is a two one to each of these players as well. So you took the game off.
00:26:48
Speaker
off of both of them. So it's not like it was, you know, to shut out. So definitely very, very well played. But I'm curious because a lot of people are looking at Arceus Aurelius. He's definitely got a reputation. Right. As as somebody who who likes to rile people up, he likes to get people excited whenever whenever the camera always pans to the crowd. He's he's the loudest one. He's standing up. He's always excited and animated. And I haven't experienced it in person.
00:27:14
Speaker
But I'm but I'm curious, you know, how is the environment over in Dortmund or over in Europe when when archaeologists is in the crowd?
00:27:23
Speaker
I have to say Marcus is actually the sweetest guy. He brings a lot of excitement and enthusiasm to the stage. And I remember after one of his matches in day two, he just fell to the floor, basically, and he just was lying there for a full 30 seconds. And it's just really in the moment, really, he wears his heart on his tongue.
00:27:52
Speaker
definitely has no filter. Sometimes he tries to have more of a filter because his very first interview in Europe was actually one that didn't go over well with the Pokemon Company International after he basically announced that he would get shitfaced with the homies after getting knocked out of the tournament eventually.
00:28:14
Speaker
That didn't play really well with a family-friendly audience. But yeah, I think he's definitely someone that is a character that makes the entire experience for the viewers at home even more immersive and even more exciting.
00:28:33
Speaker
Seeing great plays is fun, of course, but you need the showmanship, especially because it's never disrespectful with him. He's just excited. And we all should be excited about playing this game, right? Because this is what it feels like if you win a game by those slim margins, if you achieve something that you worked for for years, because this is like this 10th tournament. He's been trying so hard to become a Pokemon master.
00:29:00
Speaker
And he finally succeeded in Dortmund, and it was just beautiful to see, especially with all the emotions that just came out of him at that moment.
00:29:09
Speaker
There's something special in proving something to yourself. A lot of people feel like they are contenders. They feel like they have the potential. And we talked about this before, after Abhinav won his tournament. He said, I know I'm good enough. I just need to prove it. And I remember that message really resonated well with you. And I feel like for Arceus Aurelius, it's almost like, yeah, I think I've got the potential, but I just love the game so much. I'm going to give my energy to it no matter what.
00:29:38
Speaker
And then he gave all his energy to competing and he got a great result out of it, right? So a lot of those people who live life very fully and they're very engaged and they're not afraid to, like you said, let their emotions show. I think there's a reward on the other side, right? It's kind of unusual for a lot of people because we're taught to kind of be reserved, to not express too much, not to reveal too much.
00:30:02
Speaker
and to be, you know, to act differently in a public setting, right? But, I mean, honestly, watching Arceus Aurelius is like being on a roller coaster. I definitely feel like Arceus Aurelius is a person where when he's really low, you can see it, right? You kind of resonate with it. You say, oh, man, this is the end times. It's all over. This is doom and gloom. And then he's got like a medium barometer, but you kind of see that every now and then. And then he's got a really high barometer where he's like,
00:30:29
Speaker
on top of the world, literally on town flames wings, flying through the match ups and winning and just feeling incredible about himself. Right. And then as we saw on stage and you alluded to after winning, you know, he was flying high and then he just crashed and just started to sob. And it's like, Oh my goodness. Like I think a roller coaster is the best way I can think of to describe it.
00:30:49
Speaker
Yeah. And like you have to also keep in mind that in the past, like he had some great tournament runs. I do think that's like his fourth top card after 10 tournaments. He sometimes brought his downfall onto himself by just playing misplays as we all do from time to time. But he was talking a lot about his plot armor during the Dortmund region.
00:31:13
Speaker
It was basically the main character who was too important for the story and he just couldn't die. And even when his opponents had him on the break of defeat, like in the grand finals, I think game four before the bracket reset, Colin had the flame charge loaded, tried to fly into the red ceiling.
00:31:35
Speaker
I'm so glad you're mentioning this because this has been bothering me. And Colin has a strong claim to being the best European player currently, like probably up there with Partoman and all the people who have won the tournament and made it to a grand final.
00:31:52
Speaker
But that was just a misplay that Asios Aurelius managed to benefit from. But this is how you win tournaments. You just need to be the player that makes the least amount of mistakes. And he was locked in. Asios Aurelius was locked in. He was this player. He was him this weekend.
00:32:13
Speaker
That is just this one weekend that you need to prove it to yourself that you are up there with the very best. Because sometimes it's difficult to believe. You need this solid proof. You need to take home the medal to remind you of who you are and who you can be. And I've heard them talk about, oh, sometimes I go up against a player and I think they're
00:32:37
Speaker
like more accomplished than me better than me and i always like feel like the underdog going into that matchup um and i think he stopped feeling that like that at some point um during dot months and that really showed with all his confident line calls um i know he completely outread me in game three um basically inviting india and i leap and then countering it with a talent flame in the lead
00:33:02
Speaker
And also in the grand finals, like whenever Colin had the annihilate on his side, it had nowhere to go because Arceus Aurelius brought three annihilate counters, excuse me. And that was just like, he was in everyone's head, basically.
00:33:18
Speaker
He was, and you could definitely see that on display, right? A lot of the time by game three, he had just locked in or even in the grand finals, you know, game two and three in the, in the first set of the grand finals, he just seemed to always call the lead. He always had his Azumar lined up against Collins talent flame. He just found ways to just be.
00:33:35
Speaker
just very like troublesome, like a problem. You just could not get rid of Arceus Aurelius and he just persevered through so much competition. And you call it being the main character, that's what he said as well. I just felt like I was unstoppable. I call it flow state, right?
00:33:54
Speaker
No, I know that that is a thing that creators get that and competitors get that. So in my opinion, right, you can kind of have a stiff approach to playing and you can look at all the matchups, all the variables. You can think about your energy. You can count really hard and you can just have like a really tight grip on the steering wheel when you're trying to play. And you can say, OK, well, you know, I'm going to throw here. I'm going to do this. This is my plan, etc, etc.
00:34:22
Speaker
And you can try that approach. A lot of players do succeed very well in that approach, but sometimes you just let your hands off the steering wheel just a little bit and you reflect back on your muscle memory and your intuition from hundreds and thousands of battles over time.
00:34:40
Speaker
And you have a team you really like and you know, you can play yourself your way out of certain situations and you just feel like comfortable, right? It's not as stiff. It's not as forced and you can just kind of play your own game. And I think that's also what Arceus Aurelius was doing. I mean, and a lot of match ups where the switch timer was displaced, he was taking advantage. He was swapping something in. He was gathering energy. He was banking charge attacks, not forcing situations, right? He was actually saving things for the later game.
00:35:05
Speaker
And I agree with you, right? This is a huge breakout moment for him, a big moment of realization. I mean, he even said in his interview, I took down Nezabethan. And then he pauses. It was so funny. He said, I took down Nezabethan. He says, oh, wait, twice. I took him down twice. And that's not a fluke. That's not a one-off thing, obviously. And I think that that's also something to reflect on. Once you do get that first big win, you can approach it one or two ways. You can say, OK, that was a fluke. Probably won't happen again. I'm still not that good.
00:35:34
Speaker
Or you can say, yeah, I can do this. I can take that Nezabethan and then I match up against him again and take him down a second time, right? This is our runner up to EUIC last season, who, uh, who went toe to toe with Tonton Batous. I mean, these are serious players. And we talked about nighttime class. You're kind of running through the bracket in, in Europe, taking down a lot of really talented players. Well, Arceus Aurelius did the same thing. And I think he's got a lot to be proud of.
00:35:57
Speaker
Yeah, 100%. On his way to the title, he took down Nesbethan twice, EUIC runner-up, he took down two regional champions, and the other talented trainer that he beat, Wolfpack, Icelandic Lapras, Kashtan69 on day two, didn't drop a single game against them. So that is just someone who's really in the zone and is unstoppable on a given day.
00:36:24
Speaker
Yeah, that was like a tour of vengeance. Right. That was like, that was like, I'm going to prove myself no matter what. And nobody, nobody can stop me. Right. You're all just obstacles, but I was really impressed by Arceus relish's play grand finals. We can talk about a few breakdowns there, but I want to touch on the top eight meta before we dive right into the grand finals as much.
00:36:42
Speaker
Um, very interesting to see double Obama snow, double town flame in the grand finals. We also saw seven annihilate in the top eight. And the only non-annihilate player was Arceus Aurelius. And he ended up winning it. And, uh, one, one more stat here. He won with registeel, which was also a relatively unique pick only one in top eight in Dortmund. And he's actually the third register player to claim a regional championship this season.
00:37:07
Speaker
I was very surprised by that pick, because it was one of my stronger Pokémon when I brought it to Liverpool, but I thought people would drop it after the emergence of Shadow Whisk Ash. Because Shadow Whisk Ash has just a way more comfortable matchup against Regi's Steel, because too much bombs basically threaten the knockout, while Regi can actually take a shield of regular Whisk Ash if that counter swaps.
00:37:32
Speaker
So yeah, this trend didn't really translate from North America to Europe. And it really just gave Reggie a moment in the spotlight. And what I think also was like one of the main purposes of
00:37:51
Speaker
register on his team was to prevent his opponents from doing certain strategies like the Likertang save swap. Oh, yeah. For many people unpunished against the register team, difficult, difficult. Also like stuff like leading
00:38:11
Speaker
in Abama Snow or in Azumarill and having Lickitung in the back doesn't really work when there's the threat of the big trashcan corebreaker. And yeah, I think the Reggie was, even though this was like, oh, tongue in flame, Abama Snow showcase. I do think the Reggie was actually his strongest Pokemon on his team.
00:38:29
Speaker
Interesting, right? Because he actually brought it to five games out of the nine that were played in the grand finals. And I have to agree with you, right? We saw a lot of situations I mentioned earlier where we saw his Azumarole lined up against Collins Town Flame, which is definitely problematic, but not, you know, incredibly, incredibly bad. But then he would couple that with, when the Lickitung save swap came out, it actually happened two games in a row, I believe in the first grand finals set and Registeal immediately popped out. And this is like,
00:38:57
Speaker
I want to contrast this against what a lot of top players do, players like Wadaj or Jokobrovich. They might have like a neutral pick for something. They might have a way to deal with Liketang or handle it, but some players are, they lean more towards team prediction. I definitely feel like that's what archaeus Aurelius did because
00:39:13
Speaker
He knew the Lickitung swap was coming and he had the register right there and Colin tested him not once or twice, but more like three or four times. And every single time Arceus had the answer. So again, being in that flow state, right? Not thinking so rigidly, not thinking, Oh, well he's going to expect register because that's his best Lickitung counter. So I'm just not going to bring it and I'll try to play my way out of it. That's how you could have approached it. But Arceus really says, no, I've got this matchup locked down.
00:39:39
Speaker
I know the look at tongue state swaps coming and I'm going to punish him. I'm going to come after him and be aggressive. I think that's definitely what Arceus did very well in that grand finals. And it paid dividends, right? The stars just aligned. Absolutely. Absolutely. I especially just admire the confidence of just locking in a line that looks risky on paper, but that turns out to be the exact answer to a strategy that you basically invite. I'm still not over my.
00:40:07
Speaker
game three against him in our match. That was a great set of battles, by the way. That was probably the most exciting set of three the entire weekend. The games against Nighttime Clasher and against Colin were also great and competitive, but especially versus Colin, I was not happy with my calls.
00:40:30
Speaker
against us is Aurelius. I felt like I did everything I could, but he still just was always one step ahead of me. And I think what sets apart a good player from a great player is to anticipate
00:40:47
Speaker
the reactions you invite with your own choices, because you give your opponent information with every single match. And you can expect your opponent to adapt to that information that you give them. And if you just weaponize that in future matches and always come up with the exact counter lines here, what apparently makes sense for your opponent, then you're just unstoppable.
00:41:14
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's really an amazing thing to see, to just watch things kind of come together that way. And they definitely did for Arceus Aurelius this past weekend. I've got some talent flame stats from the grand finals, because I remember, uh, in previous episodes, we've broken down skull debuffs. We've talked about how many times mud bomb has been thrown, how many, you know, uh, different charge stacks were used. You want to hear my talent flame breakdown. Oh yeah, please.
00:41:39
Speaker
All right, so I watched back the grand finals and the reset and lo and behold, Colin actually brought his town flame every single game. He brought it nine out of nine games, right? So a lot of usage for him. Meanwhile, Arceus Aurelius brought it six out of nine games. Nice. I think that was on purpose, right? But.
00:41:59
Speaker
Arceus Aurelius and Colin flames, town flames matched up again. I'm rhyming and I don't mean to. It's super annoying and I'm sorry. Colin ended up throwing only seven flame charges in the grand finals and grand finals reset combined. Meanwhile, he threw 12 flies. So fly, definitely a game changer, right? Less energy intensive than braid bird. And obviously it doesn't come with that massive debuff to your defense.
00:42:21
Speaker
So seven and 12 are the flame charge and flight numbers for Colin. Meanwhile, Arceus Aurelius in only six games through four flame charges and seven flies. So definitely a trend towards the fly usage. You know, maybe you could argue one of those fights from Colin was, was not ideal, but you brought that bike up.
00:42:40
Speaker
Sorry, sorry. I have it in my notes and I remember watching it and I was like, he must just, he must just not be confident that he can reach another attack against the whisk cash, right? Cause cause the whisk cash through charge attack, he had to use it protect shield and then Gridget still came in. Maybe he just wasn't confident he could get there in time. Cause incinerate is such a long fast attack, but regardless, yeah, seven and 12 and four and seven. And that's with, uh, you know,
00:43:03
Speaker
Arguably 30% less usage, I guess you could say from Arcus Aurelius. So definitely some interesting talent flame stats and lots of flies, but no Brave Birds. Why? What happened to Brave Birds? I have to say that I do think that my run did not end because I opted for the double flying move set.
00:43:22
Speaker
Because whenever I had to pick and choose what move to throw, Brave Bird just gave me more options, right? Because in the zeroes against an Ice Beam player of Azumarill, some of them actually winced that by going Fly first and Brave Bird second.
00:43:40
Speaker
because you can tank a charge attack and you get to two moves and if one of those moves is Brave Bird you actually eke out a victory by the slimmest of margins. Then there was a situation against Arceus Aurelius in our game 2 where
00:43:57
Speaker
It basically came down to my tunnel flame with 100 energy. His whisker shot like 70% with a shield and if he shielded the brave bird correctly he would win that game. If he shielded the fly and I landed the brave bird I would win that game. But he made the right shield call but still that was a 50% chance of winning that game.
00:44:20
Speaker
And if I had flame charge, I would have had a 0% chance at winning that game. So I still do feel confident that the double flying tunnel flame does have a lot of play.
00:44:32
Speaker
Flame Charge definitely can spiral into something really dangerous if you win a matchup and maybe go down a shield to come up with energy. So they're definitely married to Flame Charge and the two Grand Finalists using Flame Charge on their time with Flame definitely proves that. But I'm still happy with my Wusset and I do think that
00:44:51
Speaker
especially because I was like a little soft to certain threads where I wanted to have the harder hitting move as an option. It was better for my team. But yeah, tongue of fame just has a great move set overall. Incinerate, like the buffed incinerate, at the start of the season, you would have thought that the tongue of fame meta would have arrived way earlier. It took a while, but now we're here.
00:45:18
Speaker
Yeah, we don't have any more tournaments within this specific meta, but I do think Talonflame might be here to stay. It won't change too dramatically, I don't think.
00:45:30
Speaker
Mm-hmm. I think with town flame and the move set choice, if trainers are looking to bring town flame to a local championship, maybe you were inspired by archeos or Elias and Colin this past weekend, uh, or excuse me, like a local tournament, I should say, uh, I do think that the move set depends on how you want to close the gap against your opponents, because like you said, flame charge can kind of spiral or, or snowball or build towards something more impactful. I feel like flame charge plus fly can help you close the window against Pokemon, like whisk, cash a little bit more safely.
00:45:58
Speaker
But if you want to just, you know, take this wireless approach and just brave bird the crap out of stuff, then that also can, can close the gap in bad match ups. Cause talent flame has that unique ability where you're not kind of stuck. You're not static in what you decide to do. Uh, it's kind of like having a close combat, a user or a wild charge user. You can kind of fire off that kind of YOLO attack.
00:46:19
Speaker
to uh to really drop your opponent's hp and try to win a matchup i think that's really unique so whenever you're trying to fit talent flame into your composition i think that's something to consider like how you want to approach it and how aggressive you can actually afford to be so again huge shout out to archaeos Aurelius for winning in Dortmund i know that was a huge moment for him he was really really excited and we could see it right he's one of those those characters that just shows everything like we talked about before
00:46:43
Speaker
And, uh, I also want to give respect to Colin as well. I feel like I brought up the fly in game four several times. I just want to say, Colin, it's all love really, really respect you. And like, like, so I just said, definitely one of the top players in Europe and a lot of people that are that good when they do make a single mistake, it's just magnified.
00:47:00
Speaker
You know, by, by tenfold, because people are saying, Oh, well, they're so talented, you know, how did Michael Jordan miss a shot? He's so good. It just feels like if, if, you know, Colin doesn't land that one charge tag, people are going to remember, but I think he's going to try to write that wrong in a future tournament. I think I remember like a certain rise to occasionally once shadowboarding and all that type on stage. That's true. That's true. Like even people who are basically the indisputed goats of, uh,
00:47:24
Speaker
play Pokemon PvP have done those things in the past and it really doesn't take anything away from anyone's quality as a battler.
00:47:31
Speaker
You know, the rises situation actually destroyed all of my confidence in the deaf win clause. Like I don't know. Seriously, I don't believe in deaf wins anymore. I used to write coming from the old self days. But after that, I was just thinking, you know, you could say, OK, well, obviously this trainer would have won if they would have just thrown the charge tech, which charge tech, you know, it's a high stakes situation. What if they press the wrong button and it's double resistant, you know, and something crazy like that happens. Yeah, it really kind of flipped my world.
00:48:01
Speaker
Yeah, we can have maybe a little discussion about the nature of death winds and wind conditions.
00:48:07
Speaker
later in the episode, but I feel like I should finish Dortmund with one closing thought, which is a big shout out to the French community, because if you watch the broadcast, if you heard the crowd roaring when anything happened on stage, that was all the Frenchies. They came with like 20 people. Four out of eight top cutters were French, if I'm not mistaken. Maybe it was four of the top 12, but there were like a lot of French people making it very far.
00:48:37
Speaker
And their team building was so creative. TomTom is at this point known for his creative approaches, especially with dragon types. And he brought the Gas Lord, he paired it with the Shadow Zapdos. That was incredible. And Tragi Comix,
00:48:54
Speaker
who I had the honor to play, made top five with a tackle greetant. A tackle greetant! This is unheard of and it was definitely something that made the tournament infinitely more exciting and entertaining to just have the energy from the crowd and the spicy battles on stage. Big shout out to my friends over in France. That was a great showing.
00:49:22
Speaker
I just can't believe that, that Tonton was able to win EUIC last year with shadow Charizard shadow dragon air core. And so far this season, he's brought seeking to grand finals. He's brought Gus Lord shadow Zapdos shout out to Evan seven seven. Right. And I just can't believe he was able to perform the way he is, but.
00:49:39
Speaker
I agree with you, so I wanted to piggyback off your point because I feel like the crowd at LAIC was definitely the most electric crowd. I highly, highly recommend anyone that is a hardcore battler who loves the game to travel to the next LAIC and just be a part of the environment because the crowd is incredible. I feel like
00:49:59
Speaker
Cheering for the GB Lindos was a big part of it. Cheering for Chilean trainers or Peruvian trainers was also a big part of it. So there's some national alliances there. I think we also get a bit of that in EU, right? You said there were 20 Frenchies that showed up. I definitely think that cheering for your comrades, your friends, your other locals is important.
00:50:18
Speaker
And I just want to challenge again, every episode, I just want to challenge North Americans to actually cheer, right? We're so individualistic. We're so, we're so damn, you know, uh, in our own silos about winning. And it feels like we're all kind of in it for ourselves, but I would love to see, uh, and hear some more cheers, especially, um, coming up here.
00:50:36
Speaker
Vancouver, I'm just going to punt on that one because the Canadians are nice. The rumors are true. They're incredibly kind people. And I really doubt that they will, you know, make a, make a big Russell in the crowd given the, given the situation, but maybe the next North American tournament we'll see.
00:50:53
Speaker
So I, I wanted to touch briefly on Melbourne because I was able to watch back the VOD of, uh, of the grand finals actually provided by PVP, Steve and PVP, Steve had incredible people on his cast. Uh, Dr. Trotter, Rocket, Claire and Mickey morgues all broke down the day two battles and a reminder to everybody, these were recorded over someone's shoulder.
00:51:16
Speaker
And by Zoe two dots with her, with her camera. So shout out to Zoe as well for, for all that she did. I also heard that Debbie pebble made a recording, but apparently it apparently it wasn't high enough resolution. They weren't able to see the battles as accurately, but shout out to everyone involved in, in the, in the Aussie PPP scene. I have a new phrase. Why do you want to hear it? Please.
00:51:35
Speaker
My new phrase, and I'm going to use this if I see it again, it's Yakomode. That sounds like Hakamoho can either evolve into Komoho or Yakomoho.
00:51:55
Speaker
Exactly, exactly. Well, Yakovovich, Yakov evolved again here at a regional championship in Australia and Melbourne to kick off the month of February. And he did it with a really interesting team, right? I think that's why you're a big fan of the team. We touched on this briefly. Super flexible play.
00:52:13
Speaker
incredibly flexible and trying to prevent key things, right? Honestly, follow Jokobrovich on Twitter. Definitely one of the most creative minds in PVP. And like you pointed out with Arceus Aurelius bringing the register to punish Lickitung safe switch. Jokobrovich just really kind of nullified all the scaldy buffs, all the night slash boost. He found ways to kind of temper those, you know, shovel dirt onto that fire and kind of put those out.
00:52:37
Speaker
uh, Pelipper shadow, whisk, cash, charger, bug shadow, Gligar, Obama snow with icy wind and Lickitung was his team. He went up against a Basset on team in triple crit in the grand finals. So anyone that takes down Basset on is a friend in my book. Sorry. Triple crit.
00:52:53
Speaker
Uh, but I just want to give some interesting usage stats here for the grand finals. This series went to game 10. This series went the distance, right? And, and watching this back, this almost felt like the old Rocky movies with the Apollo versus Rocky. And they're in the final round and they're just both just battered and bruised and they can barely see.
00:53:12
Speaker
And they're just swinging, right? Just swinging at the air, trying to hit something. That's what this series felt like. Right. And you cover which was in the chat during the replay. He actually said, yeah, at this point in game 10, I had no idea what to bring. I just wasn't sure what to play because they were so exhausted. But Cobra, which ends up winning it in game five. The reset in particular was back and forth. You cover which game one, triple crit game to you cover which triple crit. You cover which finally got the better of him.
00:53:38
Speaker
But in terms of usage, it was fascinating to look at these numbers, right? Because Triple Crit, Annihilate, Lickitung, Shadow Gligar, Bassedon, Charged Bug, Azumarill, he brought Annihilate, Lickitung, and Shadow Gligar six times each in the grand finals out of 10 games, right? He also brought Azumarill seven times for his most used Pokemon.
00:53:57
Speaker
Meanwhile, Yakko, and this is going Yakko mode. You ready for this? Yakko brought Shadow Gligar nine times in Shadow Whiskash 10 out of 10 games. I think he needed to do that just because of the bastard on thread. True. True. Double ground, right?
00:54:14
Speaker
And he kind of rotated in a couple other Pokemon, Lickitung five times, Chargibug four, Abomas not only once, Pelopor only once. But this is not unfamiliar for Yakko's play. And this is where Yakko mode comes from. Because watching back his other tournament run, I believe at Brisbane, he did the same thing in the grand finals where he brought superior lantern Medicham,
00:54:34
Speaker
to almost every single damn game. I think he only brought Frost House maybe once and then Kanto Ninetales maybe once. And again, this is probably team composition related, maybe his opponent had weaknesses. But whereas we saw Arceus Aurelius kind of make those risky choices, punish his opponent's safe switches, Yako just brings the same thing over and over with slight variations. Maybe he switches the lead, maybe he changes the order.
00:54:58
Speaker
but he just wears you down he just beats you down over time just with the same pokemon again and again and again and yes it is predictable but Yako just plays it better he just seems to play those pokemon better than everyone else around him and it's really really wild to see so so again next time i see somebody in the grand finals who's bringing the same pokemon every damn game and just doing it better than his opponent i'm gonna say they're going yako mode i think especially shadow glagger is also such a
00:55:24
Speaker
strong Pokemon for that playstyle, because its energy is basically walled by nothing that is not a Skarmory. And if you manage to just get a farm down, position it well, catch a move, like you can take down everything just by outplaying your opponent. And somebody as decorated as Jakobovich definitely has the skills to do so. I haven't watched it back yet, but I really want to see
00:55:51
Speaker
Um, how he tackled, um, especially the, the bastard on threat because like you, um, mentioned a lot of stats, but I don't think I, I heard the name bastard on among those. How often did the Bastion came out? Yeah, that's a really, really good question, right? Bastion came to three out of the 10 games. So mainly relegated to a bench pressure Pokemon. I guess that makes sense with how often the.
00:56:17
Speaker
where Skash and Shadow Glagar came on. Three appearances of Bassenon. Triple Crit actually led it into Liketongue twice, right? In games two and three of the grand finals. And then he brought it in the fifth game of the grand finals reset. So he brought it three times, led into Liketongue twice. The third time he brought it, he led into Shadow Glagar. Jukoberwitsch won every single one of those three games. Whoa, okay. Okay, so we basically have confirmed that Bassenon is a liability rather than an asset.
00:56:46
Speaker
Exactly. Right. Definitely can hamper you if you don't find the right alignment. It was definitely interesting to see as well, because in the final game of the grand finals reset, he brought into shadow. Gligar triple crit took the dig on Bassey Don. It definitely looks like an XL Bassey Don because it ate the dig quite well. And Steve, or excuse me, not Steve, but Trotter and Mickey Morris were talking about the shielding situations and how this is actually not that bad for Bassey Don.
00:57:10
Speaker
But in the end, Jokobrovich did prevail, which is definitely pretty impressive because, again, taking down Basudon is awesome. Even Triple Crit in the chat for the replay was saying, yeah, I don't mind that he took down Basudon. He deserves it. If even the Basudon user agrees, who am I to disagree?
00:57:27
Speaker
Exactly, exactly right. But again, shout out to our regional champions for this month, Jokobovich, as well as Arceus Aurelius, and then our Knoxville regional champion, Doonbug, who was able to do the two-peat. But that being said, that's why I think there's a couple of different directions we could go. I'm wondering if you want to touch on the dispute we had in Knoxville, or if you want to move towards the end of the show. What do you think?
00:57:52
Speaker
I feel like we can just talk about the dispute situation briefly, because we did get an update from Valor Ash, who was affected by a controversial decision during the Knoxville regionals, where his Glaiga lost some wing attacks in the mirror match in the lead, and thus basically
00:58:13
Speaker
who was prevented from fighting for switch advantage and just was generally disadvantaged in that particular situation. And now I saw on Twitter that he posted a bit of a resolution after contacting, I'll say, the authorities. Like he checked back with TPCI and definitely wanted some clarification about it.
00:58:38
Speaker
And to my surprise, they actually said, oh yeah, this is how it should have went. You should not get a rematch for that particular situation. Because even though that was a disadvantage, you still had win conditions left. So it wasn't over for you, and therefore you shouldn't get a rematch. And I personally do think that this is problematic.
00:59:02
Speaker
But I also don't really think that we should judge the volunteers on the ground for too much because really it just shows that the rulings might need an update if there's still so much, so little clarity around those issues where basically everyone just assumes, okay, there's only one real ruling and now it was determined that
00:59:31
Speaker
know what the ruling made on stage, that many people seem to disagree with, was actually within what the rule book said. What are your opinions on that situation, Speedy? Yeah, I just want to apologize first. So I feel like every time there's like a dispute angle, either you're involved or you're stuck talking about it. And it's like a really tough position to be in, but I also think you handle it really well.
01:00:00
Speaker
Yeah, I just want to start by saying that rematches suck. Like nobody wants to do a rematch, especially if you are in a solid position and you want to try to win the game. I think it's really dangerous to kind of assume win conditions, right? And we saw this as well.
01:00:16
Speaker
Uh, again, going back to the rise, shadow ball, knockdown situation, you can go in one of two directions, right? You can say that losing a mirror match in the opening moments of the game meant that, you know, the game is still winnable and you had other wind conditions. And in most cases, sure. You could argue that.
01:00:32
Speaker
But then you go to the other direction, you know, the old self direction, you say, oh, well, if if if, excuse me, if Ryze had the sky attack, that's a death win. And if the game crashed right before the opposing knocked out came out, we just give the win to Ryze. And you could say that kind of robbed his opponent because what if Ryze messes up in this one moment and throw a shadow ball? You know, so there's always like a balance. You have to strike somewhere in the middle.
01:00:56
Speaker
And I do think that, like you said, we can't hammer the judges. We should never come after the volunteers. I feel like we talked about this last week as well. But I do want to say I respect Mason for showing the judge ruling, right? Giving more feedback and following up.
01:01:13
Speaker
But I do think it needs to be from a constructive place. I think it needs to be like, okay, we see what happened. We don't agree. How can we improve it? If you have suggestions for how to change the judging ruling structure, then we should definitely explore that. We should hand over solutions. Don't be problem oriented. Don't just be an armchair quarterback who just complains and actually think about solutions and try to offer them. I think that's the most constructive thing that we can do.
01:01:40
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. I'll say that, right? Because as a caster, as a representative for the game, I do think it's a very precarious thing to just assume that more wind conditions exist, but it's a judgment call, right? I mean, no pun intended, but it is a judgment call on the end of the day. Correct about that. And at the end of the day, every judge can only work with what they're given. And there's just so much, there's such a big gray area where
01:02:09
Speaker
A lot of it comes down to interpretation and it comes down to how do you yourself view the game? Do you just play out the game in your head basically and come to a conclusion as to what would have happened there? Because I do think that even if the lead matchup went another way, it would have been still difficult for Mason to wiggle his way out of the situation because the team comps overall didn't look
01:02:39
Speaker
Um, to, to amazing for him. But then again, is that really the precedent that we want to set that if there is lag that impacts the game in a meaningful, meaningful way, that that is not necessarily rematchable. And I do just think that we need to strive for more clarity.
01:02:58
Speaker
And I do also think that one major gripe that I have with the current rematch rulings concerns the way the replays themselves are handled. Because in grassroots formats, we don't just have, okay, this was affected by lag. You have to basically completely nullify this match and start from zero. Instead, it is handled in a way that
01:03:26
Speaker
the person that got their win overruled gets to choose whether they want to keep the exact same lines and just play out the same matchup again or whether they just want to keep the same leads but the back lines could be changed. This gives a little bit more authority towards the party negatively affected by the ruling because if you get a win taken away, it's just difficult for you. That just sucks and that's why
01:03:54
Speaker
Um, some judges might be hesitant to, um, hand out rulings that, um, are in favor of a rematch because, um, of course now, um, Valor Ash Mason feels, um, disadvantaged by how this went down. But as Sam could be said about his opponent, if he has a favorable team comp, um, his opponent lacks and then he can't capitalize on this, on this favorable team comp anymore, even though he made the right strategy calls.
01:04:23
Speaker
So if we maybe adopted the best practices from the grassroots circuit, there would just be a higher level of acceptance for rematches within Play Pokemon. And we would come closer to playing out the original matches that get reviewed, get disputed, closer to how they actually should have been played out, because we keep the same leads, we maybe keep the exact same teams, and we get closer to
01:04:53
Speaker
just the original outcome of what would have happened without the lag. It can never be entirely identical. There's variables like skull debuffs or just the amount of information revealed during a match. So it can't ever be perfect. But I think we can just find a middle ground, especially through the years of grassroots experience that we have collectively assembled. And I do think that the best way of dealing with this situation going forward
01:05:23
Speaker
is just to strive to communicate with the people calling the shots and maybe implementing positive changes.
01:05:30
Speaker
There's so much we can learn from our grassroots experience, right? And that's what Silverina did for so long. It actually worked through a lot of these problems and dealt with them in real time, took player feedback, and tried to make the right calls. So I definitely think there's credence there, and I have full confidence in our staff team and everyone who's developing the rulesets in order to adopt best policies and evolve. That's the hope, right? And I need even a higher hope, honestly is why, is to just stop having these rematches.
01:05:58
Speaker
Like, just had the game work well. There have been so many tournaments that we went to where everything was smooth, everything was working great, and there weren't rematches and everybody was happy. And I feel like that's the ideal situation where we just don't have those rematches and everything is stable. And I promise you, right, being on the inside of a lot of these events,
01:06:18
Speaker
They're trying, they're trying so hard, right? They're working with so many different variables and it's like a constantly moving target. And a lot of times it's just things that you don't anticipate, right? Like a spike in internet usage and VG can cause the whole network to come down to the venue. It can go prepare for that, right? There's so many different things that you just can't account for. There was one venue we were in where
01:06:40
Speaker
Lo and behold, the GPS kept defaulting to a location inside the city instead of where the venue was. We had that in Dortmund too. We had that in Dortmund too, just to interject here. Because a lot of people who connected to the wifi that was basically the Pokemon wifi that was brought from Liverpool to Dortmund,
01:07:04
Speaker
just had their in-game character appear at the Liverpool venue because that was the last destination where the GPS basically picked up the location and people were able to spin Liverpool stops from the Dortmund Convention Centre. So yeah, that's just a lot of technical difficulties that come with an event of that size.
01:07:26
Speaker
Yeah. And there's just so many, that's hilarious. There are so many critical moments in, in other e-sports too. I know Pokemon go making its way into an e-sport. A lot of players maybe aren't as familiar with some of the other games, but just in my own personal watching experience at the halo world championships last season, which were on land, right? On land, local network in Seattle, they had multiple, uh, down moments where the observers dropped, where players just started walking into walls because essentially, you know, they couldn't get inputs going.
01:07:56
Speaker
And they even had game restarts. And that's in the grand finals of a game that's been in esports for the better part of 20 years, right? And then my brother used to play Apex Legends quite a bit. Watching back the grand finals from a couple of years ago, there's, you know, in a lot of games, there are ultimate attacks you can use or ultimate moves. And then there's, you know, basic gameplay. Well, I remember it was, it was the final ring, right? The ring hit closed and there were two teams remaining and one player tried to use their ultimate.
01:08:25
Speaker
And the game just crapped the bed. The game just didn't work and the ultimate didn't go off and it just immediately went to cool down instead. And this was, you know, for, for multiple six figures worth of money. This was an incredibly large tournament hosted, you know, by, by EA Sports, a developer.
01:08:41
Speaker
And it just didn't work and there was no rematch and that was it because the game is just how it is. It's one thing to lose a game in Pokemon go and have to rematch or get knocked out of a tournament. It's another thing to lose a hundred grand because of a game issue, right? Or to be.
01:09:00
Speaker
at the world championships on land and expecting everything to work and just have things not work. Right. So again, it's a moving target. We have to have perspective on this. I think that's really important. And I do appreciate what Mason shared. But please also listen to the other things he said, you know, treat judges with respect, be constructive. All those things I think are really critical. But so unless you have any other thoughts on that, we can move towards the championship points update and we can actually ask the viewers a question.
01:09:28
Speaker
We can, we should, we should wrap up the season of timeless travels. Yeah. We're about two weeks out, right? About 14 days. Uh, I think exactly 14 days until our season of timeless travels is over and we don't have another tournament. Like you mentioned until after the season update and very, very soon after the season update. So I think this time's why I don't really have a prediction and, uh, I'm kind of curious what the viewers think. What do you say?
01:09:57
Speaker
Yeah, I feel like we should rather predict what changes we would like to see for this upcoming season, because we know there will be changes, right? We have already like, there's like data miners who predicted some faster tags maybe added to the game. I don't know how those will impact the future of PvP, but we have seen what succeeded over the last three months, but
01:10:23
Speaker
Whenever something is strong, maybe too strong, people will call for a nerf or an introduction of new counterplay. And yeah, I'm curious what people think, what we need, because I do still think the meta is relatively healthy. I don't think we need big changes, but we would definitely benefit from some fresh blood.
01:10:45
Speaker
There's always a big target, right? I think a meta champ was a target for a long time. Most wanted a Pokemon in the meta and it's finally been erased, right? We don't see it in top cut at all anymore, which is really fascinating to look at. Uh, I think that Skarmory whisk, cash core is definitely something I would love to see kind of tempered, kind of tampered down because Skarmory by itself is just a gravity. Well, that's pushed all the other grass types.
01:11:09
Speaker
uh into oblivion basically and i'd really love to see something kind of break that up um we have some really incredibly talented trainers who give inputs as well on twitter that i always read through all the threads right maybe you think you know i'm not liking everything so i'm not seeing it but uh players like tomahawk made a really long thread actually back in november of last year and he gave some additional updates recently as well on twitter
01:11:31
Speaker
Uh, I read what John Kess writes. I read what chasing Polaris writes. And I look at a lot of different players perspectives on what kind of move sets. So I'm curious, right? Uh, we're going to post this, this episode and a link to it on, on X. Let us know what kind of move set updates you'd like to see. And, uh, we'd love to hear your ideas because my, my personal targets, why to get back to your question, we gotta, we gotta somehow temper this skarmory whisk, cash core. We have to do something about that.
01:11:58
Speaker
I am very positive that we will see a slight rework of the move Scald specifically, because I do think that is what pushed Whiscash over the edge from Pokemon that was usable, that was good, to something that is essentially just a better swamp bird. And if you are a better swamp bird, you are probably slightly too good to be forever a part of this meta. And yeah, if I just look at all the teams that succeeded this season,
01:12:28
Speaker
It was very difficult to do it without Wiscash, without Lichtal, without Shadow Gligar and without Chargerbug. Those were basically the biggest players and for some of them I do think that they are neutral enough so that they don't necessitate a nerf.
01:12:46
Speaker
But occasionally I would just, like, some counterplay to those Pokemon being introduced, or maybe some slight nerfs. Like, maybe Dig needs to be slightly worse than it currently is. That is also maybe a discussion we could have, because the ground types, like double ground, is kind of everywhere.
01:13:09
Speaker
But yeah, let's see what Niantic has in store for us. I do think over the last few seasonal updates, we have actually been privy to some really meaningful meta changes. And over the last six months, I would say this entire year of competitive Pokemon Go has been one of really balanced and
01:13:37
Speaker
kind of exciting matters actually. I'm confident that we will see something entirely new emerge at the Utrecht special event that actually takes place at the very first weekend of March, just a day or two after the changes come into effect.
01:13:55
Speaker
Yeah, it's going to be an exciting tournament. I know a lot of European trainers will be looking for scrims as well. So if you are in a North America, Latin America, or APAC, and you want to battle some of your European friends, I definitely think that's, that's worth looking into because they'll want all the practice they can possibly get. Speaking of upcoming events, Utrecht, like you said, is the next one, first weekend of March. We also have Gowani, which is the following weekend, March 9th through 10th, followed by Vancouver, which is March 22nd through 23rd. So.
01:14:23
Speaker
If you are a championship series fan and you want to get continued coverage, unfortunately, we're kind of hitting a dry spot for a couple of weeks. I'm excited to get this episode out, but it might be the last thing you hear from us for a little while. And if you are listening to this today, Thursday, the 15th.
01:14:38
Speaker
I hope you had a great Valentine's day, but secondly, remember that there are only at 112 days left to earn championship points. The cutoff is NAIC 2024. So if you're trying to qualify for worlds, you know, I remember when it was 120 days. I remember when we were recording, it was 130 days. Well, let's do a million down.
01:14:56
Speaker
Now that being said, I do think that we're coming to the end of the show. Uh, so I always a pleasure and honor you. You mentioned having some time off and, uh, I'm glad you have some time off today, but we also have essentially two weeks off. So excited to see what you, what you cook up in the meantime. And, uh, for myself, I will not be going to Sino tour. I'll be in Philadelphia in Boyerstown for the asylum event. And, uh, that's going to be a great time hoping to meet up with house Stark there. And, uh, for you, I hope you have a good rest.
01:15:26
Speaker
Thank you so much. I hope I will have that too. I'm actually looking forward to the Boya's Town event. I will not be there, obviously, because I will be in Europe.
01:15:36
Speaker
A friend of mine, XX Monarch, might actually be competing, so good luck to him. He's an excellent betler. I wouldn't be surprised to see him make it far. And yeah, I'll be playing the global center tour. I will not be at the Rose Bowl. But yeah, I don't mind a few weeks of rest, a few days of recovering and just not being a tournament after tournament. And we'll see each other again at the beginning of March.
01:16:06
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. A couple of, uh, well, I guess one other project that's kind of long running, we did get some interest in terms of the meta breakdown over time. And we started making some notes on that. So homework for you, if you're listening to this, you've made it this far. First of all, thank you for listening to our first five episodes of the podcast. Secondly, let us know what move set updates you want to see in that March rotation that's coming up in two weeks.
01:16:29
Speaker
and leave any other thoughts that you have for us because we like to, uh, to get engaged and get involved anyways. So I hope you have a great couple of weeks. I will talk to you soon, but until then.