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Our Ruined Lives with Our Overlords - Ep 36
330 Plays5 years ago
Happy almost New Year listeners! We kick off the ending 2020 and beginning of 2021 with an interview of our overlord’s, Chris Webster and Rachel Roden. Chris is the co-founder of the Archaeology Podcast Network which started back in December of 2014, and Rachel is the lead editor of our Podcast. So please join us in welcoming the Cat Herders to the clowder we know as A Life in Ruins Podcast: Chris Webster and Rachel Roden!
Contact For Guests:
- Chris Webster's Twitter: @archeowebby
- Chris Webster's Instagram: @chris_archaeo_webster
- Chris Webster Facebook: facebook.com/captainwebby
- Archaeology Podcast Network Twitter: @archpodnet
- Archaeology Podcast Network Instagram: @archpodnet
- Archaeology Podcast Network Facebook: www.facebook.com/archpodnet
- Archaeology Podcast Network Website: https://www.archaeologypodcastnetwork.com/
Contact
- Email: alifeinruinspodcast@gmail.com
- Instagram: @alifeinruinspodcast
- Facebook: @alifeinruinspodcast
- Twitter: @alifeinruinspod
- Website: www.alifeinruins.com
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Transcript
Introduction and Episode Theme
00:00:01
Speaker
You're listening to the Archaeology Podcast Network.
00:00:14
Speaker
Welcome to episode 36 of a life in ruins podcast where we investigate the careers of those living a life in ruins. Happy almost new year's listeners. We kick off the ending of 2020 and the beginning of 2021 with an interview with our overlords, Chris Webster and Rachel Rodin.
Guest Introductions: Chris Webster and Rachel Rodin
00:00:30
Speaker
Chris is the co-founder of the archeology podcast network, which started back in December of 2014.
00:00:35
Speaker
And Rachel is the lead editor of our podcast. So please join us in welcoming the cat herders to the Clouder we know as of the Life in Ruins podcast, Chris Webster and Rachel Rodin. Thank you guys so much for coming on. I know, Rachel, this is your first time on Ruins. And then Chris, you are a returning guest. Yeah, thank you for having me. It was exciting to be asked to be on since I haven't had a huge role in the APN until really this year. Sorry, I was drinking heavily.
00:01:07
Speaker
Oh, that's how this is going to be heavily. Rachel's got to edit this show, which is, uh, yeah, which is really great. Yeah. How's that? How's that going?
Rachel's Archaeology Journey
00:01:20
Speaker
It's great. It's great.
00:01:24
Speaker
Excellent. Well, we want to start off with this segment by introducing you, Rachel, and who you are. You are an archaeologist, and so we just kind of want to start off this first segment, like I said, with kind of, we already know who Chris is. Everyone knows who Chris is on the APN. He's on like half the shows, been on here before. By the way, happy Veterans Day, Chris, and thank you for your service. Well, thank you. Absolutely. So, Rachel, what was your inspiration for getting into archaeology in the first place?
00:01:54
Speaker
really just like lack of direction in college, mostly. So it was like throwing, yeah, you know, like through paint at the walls, took every elective that I could and ended up in an anthropology 101 class. And I was like, okay, cool. I like this. So then I just kept doing it and yeah, ended up with a degree in archeology.
00:02:15
Speaker
Nice. Yeah, very cool. Did you do any sort of field school in your undergrad as part of it? I did. Yeah, I guess I should be a little bit more specific. I went to the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and my professor that I took one of my earlier classes with studied or worked in Peru
00:02:37
Speaker
And when his field school came up, I was like, cool, I want to go to Peru. And then I went and I just like fell in love with the archaeology down there. And I ended up going back for two following seasons in the early 2000s. So this is like 2004, five and six ish somewhere in there.
00:02:55
Speaker
And it was just it was great. It was a great experience. I love the field school. The people down there are amazing. The archaeology is amazing. And it's what really like inspired me to figure out how I could be an archaeologist in the United States, because up until that point, it was like academic, right? You go to school and you study to go to more school, to go to more school and then eventually teach students.
00:03:21
Speaker
But when I came back, people started telling me about how you could actually like have a job where you got paid doing archaeology. So I followed that route rather than the stay in school forever and ever route.
Archaeology Career Realities in the U.S.
00:03:33
Speaker
Yeah. I think you just described Carlton.
00:03:35
Speaker
Yeah, it's a really, really fun route. Object poverty for a decade. And then you're just like, wait, I'm probably going to end up working at McDonald's after this, not even in table management. It's not like I'm doing archaeology anymore either. So, you know.
00:03:52
Speaker
but you are still engaged with archeology content. You know, you're still on the public side of it. So you're still engaged. You're just not out there actively digging. We don't need, we don't need that many field archeologists anymore. We need more archeologists and other sectors of the field. So yeah, the outreach stuff is fun. Hey, did I tell you you could talk yet? Sorry, sorry. She, she,
00:04:16
Speaker
She's getting saucy now. She keeps her, um, nice. She keeps her toe in it though. Don't let her fool you because she did two projects this year, one with me at the same, same client, actually one in June, just for a few days. And then a month long, she basically ran the field crew for a month long project in September while I continued to, you know, do other stuff. Cause I just on the schedule for fieldwork anymore. And so
Miami Project and Marriage
00:04:40
Speaker
that was cool. So she keeps, keeps her toes in it when she has to.
00:04:43
Speaker
Yeah, just enough that I can say that I am still an archeologist. I don't do it a lot, but I still am one. That's right. Excellent. So as our listeners have probably gathered, there's a little bit of interplay going on between Rachel and Chris right now. They're actually in the same, I want to call, is it, would you call an RV a domicile or, or just a vehicle? Yes. Yeah. There we go. Yeah. Just our house.
00:05:13
Speaker
Excellent. And that is because you two are married. So Rachel, we wanted to ask like how you met Chris Webster and how did you get roped into this entire circus that is the archaeology podcast network?
00:05:26
Speaker
mostly not by choice, but I met him on an archaeology project. It was, I think, my third project ever. And it was his second project, I think. So we were both pretty young and just starting out as field archaeologists. And we were working in downtown Miami, which was
00:05:51
Speaker
just a really, really cool site. We were excavating human remains like all day long. It was really, really interesting. And we were all like in this bubble together, living in a hotel together. Like you spent all your time with the people that you worked with and we just, you know, we became really great friends and then we started dating and then five years later we got married and 15 years later we're still together. So there you go. That's a nice story.
00:06:18
Speaker
It's mostly good. There's some times where like he threw me in a pit of mud and things like that one time. Oh, well there's other stories. We're not going to talk about them, but yeah. Oh, okay. What, what is like, so I've worked in Tennessee where it's just brutally hot. What the hell is Miami like doing archeology?
00:06:42
Speaker
Well, we were there in the winter. So I think we got there right around Thanksgiving maybe. And we were there until March, March, April ish. So it was like 90 instead of 110. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Like 80. It was perfect. Okay.
00:06:59
Speaker
Yeah, it actually wasn't bad. Rachel, you got there a little before I did and I got there in mid-December or something like that. Because I got there in mid-December and I was getting paid $12 an hour, I didn't go home for Christmas. Me and two other people that didn't go home as well.
00:07:18
Speaker
We actually went and hung out on South beach on Christmas day, like South beach on Christmas morning, hung out on the beach. It was like probably low seventies and, and pleasant. And we just sat there and it was really strange. They were playing Christmas music with like snowmen and Christmas trees on the banners on the light poles on South beach. And you know, people are wearing sunglasses and putting, putting sunscreen on. It was very surreal. Plus South beach is a partial nude beach and that's where all the hotties go. So that was weird to see on Christmas day as well.
00:07:48
Speaker
Anyway, yeah. And I think we were there much later than March. I thought we didn't leave until like June. So, um, for a while it was on South beach until June. Yeah. And never really left to be honest. Yeah. So yeah, I'm gonna get my photo albums out. Anyway, it was a, that was a good project. Yeah. Miami was interesting.
00:08:15
Speaker
So, so is this, this kind of like a historic project dealing with historic stuff down in Miami, or was it prehistoric or?
00:08:23
Speaker
It was prehistoric and it was just really cool because it was, uh, there were these solution holes. That's what they were called solution holes down through the, the bedrock there. And, and yeah, Chris, you were working in like the well part too, right? Like what was, I can't really remember what was going on with that, but we were just pulling up bones and fragments of bones. And at one point, like a full like skull that was attached to the top of the spinal column. And like there was just.
00:08:53
Speaker
It was just bones everywhere and I think most of it was Native American. Was it Seminole? It was Tequesta. Yeah, Tequesta. Pre- Seminole. Yeah. Yeah. I think there might have been some like colonial settlement stuff going on there too, but it was all mixed together so it was really hard to know what was what.
00:09:15
Speaker
Yeah. So the, the crazy thing about this site was it, it was the last like empty lot in downtown Miami. Now it's high rise hotel room and, and, or condos or something. I don't know. It's crazy, but it was the last like undeveloped empty lot in downtown Miami. And I don't know why it stayed empty for so long, but the last thing that was there was the Flagler hotel in the 1930s.
00:09:35
Speaker
And it burned down. It was up for a while, then it burned down. And after that, it was a parking lot for, you know, 80 years. And across the river, so the Miami River comes in right just south of where this site is. I mean, like just a few hundred feet south of where this side is and enters into the inter coastal waterway on the other side of the Miami River. I don't know if you guys ever heard of the Miami circle.
00:09:57
Speaker
It was these limestone solution holes that were augured out in a circle pattern, and posts were put there. Then platforms built on top of those, or at least, I don't know how much evidence there is towards that. I think that's the conjecture. That's what we think because the only thing that remains really is the limestone solution holes. I don't honestly know the details of the Miami Circle, but from what I understand,
00:10:20
Speaker
the Tequesta Indians would leave their dead on these platforms, these wooden platforms, and they would just desiccate, they'd be eaten by animals, whatever the case may be. They would just let nature take its course with their dead on these things. And then after a certain period of time, they would gather up the bones that remained, the really disarticulated remains at this point,
00:10:41
Speaker
float them across, they would go across the Miami River to this natural well, which is where we were digging, and then basically dump them in the well in these limestone solution holes. And we found evidence of sea turtle shells that had burn marks on the side of them, like they were using old, like dead sea turtle shells, just the shells to burn, I don't know, burn something in there. And then they would dump their dead in there. There was also manatee bone mixed in there as well.
00:11:08
Speaker
It was just a whole bunch of disarticulated human remains dumped in this natural well. At some point, the Tequesta Indians got moved to Cuba, basically, from what I hear, by the people that were settling the area. This was before the Seminole even had their plight over there. But the Tequesta were moved to Cuba by the Spanish, probably. The Spanish were all over that place. There was a Spanish fort on the site for a while back in the 1800s. They dug out the well. They specifically dug the well down with natural formation all the way down.
00:11:38
Speaker
So we found, um, presumably a little more modern human remains as well, plus other artifacts actually down in the well site. And then sometime after that, I think I can't remember if there was a mission there. I think it was just the Fort and then emptiness and then the hotel. And then that was it. So it's quite a, quite a crazy history. They say it goes back, you know, the artifacts and stuff indicate presence back 10,000 years, right on that one site. So it was pretty neat to work on as like my second excavation ever.
00:12:08
Speaker
Yeah, that's not, that's really not bad. Yeah. And my third, yeah, it was crazy. I don't know how we lucked out with such amazing archeology. Yeah, it was great. I'm like, I'm like, CRM is great. Let's do more of this. Then I got a job digging, digging shovel tests in North Carolina. And I was like, Oh, yeah.
00:12:32
Speaker
You transition from like, you know, you know, at like five o'clock, six o'clock, you start hearing clubs going in downtown Miami with like awesome archaeology to like the middle of nowhere, North Carolina. Is that... Yeah. Basically, we both move... Well, I moved first to this company in Columbia, South Carolina.
00:12:52
Speaker
And then Chris joined me like not too far or not too long after that. And then yeah, it's just like those awful like mind numbing, just shovel test after shovel test that's negative over and over and over surrounded by briars, just misery, absolute misery.
00:13:11
Speaker
There was a lot packed into the Chris joined to me later statement because I had actually left. I had actually left Miami and I left with a girl that was there. Um, we were, I guess dating at the time, by the time I left and we went to a project in Colorado up near. That must've been after I rejected you. So, so I made out with two women on that Miami project and I went away with one of them. The other one came a little while to come around to her census. Damn.
00:13:49
Speaker
But so, so I lived with this girl and we went to Colorado and then, uh, we worked on a, I worked in Tampa actually after that cause her and I split up over the summer. That was a horrible mistake. And then, uh, and then I went and worked on a project in Tampa, which was another horrible mistake. Tampa and like the Lake Okeechobee area in the summertime is the worst possible thing you could do. And.
00:14:10
Speaker
And so I said, screw this. And I got a job up in Vermont and working for Berger. I think it was amazing. I know I went from alligators and wild boars and just, you know, fire ants and mosquitoes, the size of helicopters to mix snow and rain solid for a month. Like I wasn't dry for 30 days and, and then near sometime, sometime around that time in the fall, Rachel got drunk with her sister and called me and the rest is history. So.
00:14:38
Speaker
Oh, that was quite, that was quite the story. I didn't know we were going to end up really abrupt. Okay. All right. In my defense, I had been thinking about calling him for a while. I had a job for him. So it just took, you know, my sister convincing me, well, I was drunk to call him. So anyway, there we go. That's right. All right. So then all that happened.
00:15:03
Speaker
And then, so Chris started the APN with Tristan Boyle, who I swear to God is nothing but a phantom. I don't know if he actually exists or that's just the second account that Chris uses to blame things on. That's a good idea.
00:15:21
Speaker
No, he exists because he was at the APN Expo and he just popped up on the screen and he was like, hello there. And I was like, Oh, you guys weren't there to back me up. And he just gave me this stare. Obi-Wan Kenobi. Yeah. So you started getting more involved with the APN Rachel like this past year, right?
00:15:46
Speaker
Yeah, so I had like a regular nine to five full time job until right before COVID started, actually, back in February is when I left that job. And then when I left, it was partly to pursue my own things and then also to sort of support Chris because he just
00:16:04
Speaker
He doesn't say no to anything. I don't know if you've noticed that, but he literally doesn't know what the word no means. And he just got to the point where he had so much work to do. He physically couldn't do it all. So he trained me on editing podcasts. And now I do a lot of the APN editing for him to help free up his time, basically. And how did he rope you into editing our podcast in particular?
00:16:30
Speaker
I'm not sure I was given a choice. It was basically like download this and do it. And I said, okay.
00:16:37
Speaker
We are so sorry. Pretty much. Oh, it's good. And like from a technical standpoint, he actually didn't give your podcast to me right away because the more people there are on a podcast, the harder it is to edit. So I started with the ones that are just two people and kind of worked up from there. So I didn't get into it right away, but now it's not too bad and pretty easy to handle. All right. Often do you have to cut out Carlton's dueling?
00:17:09
Speaker
Oh my God, that's hilarious. I did not know that that's what that was until Chris told me like last week.
00:17:32
Speaker
and everybody breathes at different levels. Okay. So I was just sitting here.
Commercial Break and Segment Shift
00:17:42
Speaker
Well,
00:17:44
Speaker
Well, we kind of lost everyone, so we're done with segment one anyways. We'll be back with segment two of episode 36 of Life and Ruins with our overlords, so enjoy these commercials. We'll be right back.
00:17:58
Speaker
Welcome back to episode 36 of a life in ruins podcast. We are interviewing our overlords, Chris Webster and Rachel Rodin.
Rachel's Historical Yarns Podcast
00:18:07
Speaker
And we wanted to start off this segment by giving you a little of Rachel, a little bit to talk about, um, historical yarns, which is her podcast on the APN. So do you mind explaining, you know, kind of what it is? What do you talk about on the podcast?
00:18:20
Speaker
Yeah, sure. So I am a knitter, like a capital K knitter. It's my hobby. It's what I do. I design knitting patterns because I can't just follow somebody else's instructions. I have to make my own. And I also, because I'm an archaeologist, have an interest in history and I have another friend of mine who also has the same like background and
00:18:48
Speaker
Between the two of us, we came up with the concept of basically a podcast that deep dives the history of a knitting technique. And you wouldn't think that there would be that much history there, but they're actually very embedded in the culture of, in particular, European cultures.
00:19:06
Speaker
because of in a lot of cases it was practical because they needed to be warm and in other cases it was more of an art form. But either way, there's so many cultures that have a really, really deep love and interest in knitting. And so anyway, we decided to investigate the origins of the
00:19:27
Speaker
the techniques. And yeah, so we only did one season. We haven't had a chance to do season two. COVID as usual has sort of thrown everybody off track, but we do plan to do more at some point in the future. So our first season was all about the history of lace knitting.
00:19:42
Speaker
Okay, because I do remember this was supposed to be a quarterly podcast. Yeah. You've only had one episode drop in 2020, which was about Neanderthals making the yarn. Yeah. So there was a really, my mom listens to that show, actually, she actually, she started knitting and I was like, you need to listen to this one. So my mom listens and she's been
00:20:05
Speaker
asking. She's like, there hasn't been an episode. She was like, it's COVID. So she's like, well, I want, I want to hear what's going on. Like, where is it? I'm like, I have no clue. This is not my podcast mom. Right. But yeah, my mom's a, my mom's a super fan. She likes to talk to me about it. I don't know anything about yarn. So I'm just like, yeah, that sounds
00:20:24
Speaker
Oh, that's awesome. That gives me inspiration to get back to it because my, my friend Heather is my friend who we were doing it, you know, the podcast together. And she just has like other things going on in her life. She's got kids and a family and stuff like that. Things that I don't have because, you know, we lived in RV and traveled the country. So
00:20:46
Speaker
I mean, you've got Chris, but that doesn't count as being, right? Well, so I will get back to it. And actually Chris and I, so the episode that dropped this year, the only one we've done this year was
00:21:06
Speaker
trying to follow like textiles in the news basically textiles and archaeology in the news because it's not common to find textile in an archaeological context because it just doesn't it just doesn't preserve you know but it does happen sometimes and when it does it's usually pretty significant so chris and i have plans on doing episodes where we break down you know
00:21:30
Speaker
things that have happened recently as far as textile and archeology. So we'll get back to that at some point and then hopefully we'll do a real true like season two at some point in the future as well. Coming someday.
00:21:42
Speaker
All right. Excellent. I'm looking forward to it.
Impact of 2020 on APN
00:21:44
Speaker
And I'm sure my mom is too. Um, moving this towards a different thread. Ha ha ha. Um, Chris.
00:22:04
Speaker
Chris, we brought you... Excellent. Well, yeah, it's a lot of it. You know this already. Chris, we brought you on last year as our introduction to 2020 and the bright things that we were looking forward to of the APN in 2020. And we told you then that we wanted to have you on every year to kind of summarize the year, keep people up to date with the APN shows.
00:22:28
Speaker
With that being said, we've had a lot of things happen. How has the APN changed, both due to political and social discourse that has occurred since January, as well as we've alluded to already, there's been some drastic changes to yours and Rachel's lifestyle?
00:22:50
Speaker
Yeah. Well, I think, I think just to talk about the elephant in the room here, the biggest change to the APN was the no swearing ban by the life and ruins podcast. I mean, at that point, the numbers really just went through the floor. People stopped listening. They were like, what am I going to do now? But anyway,
00:23:10
Speaker
So we had that, uh, otherwise everything's been pretty good. So, so some of the positive things, we picked up a new podcast, the dig it podcast. So that was good. There was a couple others. We were actually in the process, like an underwater archeology podcast. That's kind of stalled a little bit. A bunch of things just kind of got put on the back burner because of COVID and which really actually kind of surprises me because what the heck else are you going to do when you're sitting in your, in your house and you're quarantined and not doing anything. You may as well record a podcast. That's what I say. But some people just.
00:23:40
Speaker
They get too daunted by the prospect of keeping it going, especially starting something new. In fact, I have podcast clients that, that stopped podcasting long-term ones that stopped podcasting and now are just kind of getting back into it as they realize, okay, they're, this kind of is the new normal and we're just going to keep on going with that. I mean, I can really, I would rather go knit and watch RuPaul's Drag Race than record a podcast about knitting. So, you know, that's what I've been doing for a lot of six months. True.
00:24:09
Speaker
It's actually true. You know how many seasons there are of that show, guys? Many, many seasons of that show. More than one? At least five? More than one. So many. It's awesome. So many. Anyway, I mean, we probably spend $200 a month on internet just so she can watch RuPaul's Bad Drag Race. Oh, that is garbage. That's what it is. So anyway,
00:24:32
Speaker
No, another good thing that we did because the APN is really, when it comes down to it, it really is a passion project for not only myself, but I have to imagine everyone that's a podcaster on here. And we have a number of volunteers. Tristan is real and he wrangles our volunteers because if he didn't, I'd have to. And I simply don't have time for it. And we have
00:24:52
Speaker
I don't even know how many we have. We have three or four volunteers right now that I know that are working and then some others that are just like when they can have time, they do stuff. We have other people that are doing things as well, like David has been editing the Rock Art Podcast. That is a new show that we started this year as well, around the same time as we did Dig It and Dr. Alan Garfinkel has been killing it on the Rock Art Podcast.
00:25:15
Speaker
He's, it's a weekly show and he's got just a huge catalog of people that he knows. And the rock art podcast has been going surprisingly well because I, to be honest, he's in his sixties and I was like, is this guy, I mean, I know Alan pretty well, but I was like, is he going to be able to keep this podcast going? And he is just, he loves it. He just gets into it and it's a good show.
00:25:36
Speaker
And then, as I was saying, this really is a passion project for everybody. But in order to really keep this going, and I want to have more and more and more shows, but to be honest, we just don't have the time for more and more shows. But I have a hard time saying no to a new show because, well, we need more information about archaeology out in the world. So I just kind of try to make it work. And one of the ways we do that is through
00:25:59
Speaker
funding. We don't have any grants or anything that we apply for. This is technically run under my company, so it's not a nonprofit.
00:26:07
Speaker
So it's difficult to apply for stuff like that. So the only way we can really bring in funds is through realistically through advertising and membership and advertising is the bulk of that. So one of the things I did was hire our first employee for the first time and her name is Madison and she has been basically working our advertising and she put together a whole bunch of materials and has been contacting people and right about the time she was getting everything together, you know, the world shut down. So she had a little bit of a struggle in the first few months, but,
00:26:36
Speaker
now things are starting to pick up again a little bit. And if we could get just a 30 second ad in a few slots on every single show on the APN, we'd be able to really sell the editing. That's the first thing we want to do is sell the editing, get that off our plate so we can focus on producing more shows. And then at some point, maybe even compensate hosts for being on the APN. And that really is the goal. It's never going to make anybody a million dollars, but if we can
00:27:03
Speaker
clear a little bit while doing this and then bring more shows to light, then that's the goal. That's pretty much where we're at. Our numbers dipped a little bit when COVID first hit because people stopped listening to podcasts because they weren't commuting or going to the gym or doing the things that they normally listen to podcasts when they're doing.
Popular Podcasts and APN Goals for 2021
00:27:20
Speaker
Archaeologists stopped doing fieldwork for a little while for the most part. That's typically when a lot of archaeologists listen to podcasts and our numbers just kind of took a hit the first few months.
00:27:29
Speaker
everything started to level back out and even grow again. So I think we're, we're starting to hit our stride again. What are your, uh, top three most listened to podcasts on the APN? Wow. Without looking at the numbers, I'm going to have to think about it. The dirt podcast is probably the number one podcast. Um, those girls, they, they do a, they do a great job. It's not a competition guys. It's not a competition. We're talking
00:27:58
Speaker
Pure numbers here. It's probably the dirt podcast. And then I think the archeology show, the archeo tech podcast, then the Sierra Mark podcast, then the new one, the data podcast, and then rock art podcast. And then, um, then there's some old shows that haven't produced episodes in years and they're still killing it with the downloads. And then we have a show that did like one episode. We have a show that did like one season and then they stopped podcasting and they're still doing pretty good.
00:28:26
Speaker
And then there's the Life in Ruins podcast. I mean, you guys asked for it, so... We are the bottom dwellers, let's be fair.
00:28:40
Speaker
Oh my God. Your guys' show is doing well. To be honest, it's got, all joking aside, it's got the highest entertainment value, I think, of any show on the network. But along with providing entertainment through your guys' interactions and just the way that you not only interact with each other, but with your guests as well, you also impart knowledge. And it's a fun and educational show to listen to, and that's a hard combination to hit.
00:29:06
Speaker
The only reason I think some of the shows like The Dirt are getting more downloads is it's math, right? They publish every week. You guys are every two weeks as of this recording. And it's just, if you guys were every week, you would probably have their numbers. But since you're not, it's hard to compare. You know what I mean? So that's just math. If you publish more, you get more downloads. That's how that works. Yeah. Well, we'll try to crunch the map here in the future.
00:29:34
Speaker
But yeah, also thank you for saying that we're educational because I don't believe that all the time. But going from there, where do you see 2021 for the APN? What are the goals of, you know, of this venture? You know, where do you want to see it go?
00:29:52
Speaker
My goal every year has been really twofold. One is to increase our number of listeners and partly through just advertising and whatever else we can do, not advertising, but promotion and social media and stuff. Just get more people to learn about archeology through what we do.
00:30:07
Speaker
And not only that, but to learn about our website, because a lot of people don't go to the website. They just find us on iTunes or whatever their Spotify, whatever their player of choice is. And then go to the website, realizing that we have nearly 3000 episodes of content over the last, not just five years or almost six years, actually, we're coming up on six years as of the time of this recording.
00:30:28
Speaker
But there were a few shows that we absorbed like my CRM archaeology podcast that's been going for eight or nine years now. We just recorded episode 200 a month and a half ago. So there's a lot of content on the APN that people can search through and learn from and go to. So I want to try to promote that more every single year. But then the biggest really ongoing goal is to continue to try to make the APN self-sustaining. Anybody that says you can
00:30:52
Speaker
Make a Living podcasting is either Joe Rogan or already a celebrity somewhere else. It's just really difficult, especially with such a hyper niche topic like archaeology. We have fans around the world, but it's difficult to increase it into the numbers where you're getting like a million downloads an episode. I don't think that's ever going to happen for
00:31:12
Speaker
and archaeology podcast. I mean, that's just a really tall order. It might, when we have 10 quadrillion people in the world, but that's just math again, that's just percentages. But I think if we could get the APN to a point where we're at least paying for a professional editor and we're able to use that money to, again, pay for the editor, but also bring in some other more professional materials, maybe revamp our branding a little bit, and all that with the goal of
00:31:39
Speaker
increasing the number of people that these podcasts get to because it's important information, especially, especially now in 2020. I mean, is anybody surprised that there's a second wave? Literally the same thing happened in 1918. I mean, literally, I think the curve is identical and we're just like, I think we beat, I think we beat that. We have three waves. We have the original, we have the summer and now we have whatever the hell this is. So yeah, I think you're right. Is this like cod, like zombie waves? Is that where we're on?
00:32:10
Speaker
Right? Right? Oh, I'd kill for an apocalypse right now. But anyway, it just keeps coming.
00:32:17
Speaker
So this is because you both edit our podcast and have edited our podcast. We also want to give you this platform to grill us, you know? Throw shame. Oh no. Throw shame. So because I, you know, want to introduce this. So we want to ask what is the most annoying thing about editing Connor freaking Jonin? Rachel. It's like silence.
00:32:46
Speaker
My existence doesn't count. My existence doesn't count. No. Here's what I would say, and I refuse to call out any one person in particular because I think that everybody does. I already hate myself, so you can't hurt my feelings.
00:33:02
Speaker
It's not even about that. Like the stuff that people do when they're recording, it's the same stuff. They all do the same stuff. They do it in slightly different ways. But the big thing is, and I think the biggest takeaway I could have for anybody who is being recorded is if you are unsure of what you want to say,
00:33:20
Speaker
that is totally okay because you are being recorded if it's not live. You know, live is a different story, but if it's not live and you are being recorded, just pause. Just pause, take a breath, think through what you want to say because we can edit it. We can edit the crap out of it. If you want to stumble around before you get there, that's fine too, but just pause and take a breath before you start talking. That's all.
00:33:46
Speaker
I hear myself doing it too. Yeah. No, not, not, not calling anybody out, Connor, but you know, it's, it really is just stop and take a breath.
00:34:06
Speaker
I stand by what I'm saying. I am not calling Connor out. This is for everybody, myself included. I hear myself doing it and I'm like, slow down, take a breath. You know what this is going to sound like when you have to edit it. So slow down, think about what you want to say, then start talking.
00:34:24
Speaker
Wait, you don't do everything in one breath. That's what Chris does. Are we, are we, are we talking about what Chris needs to work on? Cause Oh, the run on sentence. No, this is, this is shut up. This is good advice for, uh, for future guests of the, uh, life and runs podcast too, because I know they're all listening because you guys have a lot of friends and I'm sure they're going to be on, but, but future guests and Connor seriously, just take a breath.
00:34:53
Speaker
And, you know, just relax. It's all going to be okay. I mean, when I listened to the episodes over, I realized I say like so much and it's going to be a pain that like edit.
00:35:08
Speaker
Well, many people do. Like and um and uh and all of those vocal crutches people rely on. It's fine to say them cause I can shop it right out. It's no big deal. It's when they run into a word that it gets really hard. So a lot of people will be like, but um, and it's like, okay, could you please separate that? But from the um, cause like it's real hard to get the um out of there once they're connected.
00:35:39
Speaker
What was that new verbal tick that you guys were talking about the other day? Yeah. Kind of. Oh, yeah.
00:35:47
Speaker
Yeah. A lot of people are saying kind of now, Connor, you actually do say it quite a bit, but you're not the, you're not the only one. A lot of people say it. They say, can you kind of tell us what it was like to be in our, no, I'm not going to kind of tell you. I'm actually going to tell you. And it's a weird, it's a weird vocal crutch that I've noticed, not just with other hosts on the APN that we edit, but other professional. I mean, I, I edit other podcasts and they say it too. And it's becoming like a thing, right? Where people just say kind of.
00:36:14
Speaker
And it's really interesting. I don't know where that's coming from. And on that point, we're going to kind of go to the next segment.
00:36:38
Speaker
with our overlords, Chris and Rachel Rodin and Chris Webster. Sorry, I forgot. I forgot. You can call him Chris Rodin if you want.
00:36:48
Speaker
Okay. All right. Chris and Rachel. So you guys have recently, uh, took up the millennial lifestyle and they are traveling the country in a, in a traveling RV.
RV Lifestyle and Roadster Adventures
00:37:01
Speaker
Is that what it is? Or is it a van or is RB bus? Okay. Do you have like a YouTube channel where you like talk about like your lifestyle, like living in there or like, can you, can you discuss about it with us?
00:37:14
Speaker
Yeah. Our, our YouTube channel name, first off, I feel like I need to explain that real quick. It's roadster adventures and it's an, it's the O with the little line over the top of it. And the reason for that is because if there wasn't, there would be rodster adventures cause it's ROD, but it's a, it's a combination of our last names because when Rachel decided to dishonor me by not taking my last name, we, we actually know 10 years ago, it's still a thing.
00:37:44
Speaker
I'm kidding. I actually don't care. I don't want to hate mail from all the feminists that listen to this podcast. I know. I know. That's right. No, I, uh, no, I actually don't care, but we are. It's funny because our families and it's really kind of Rachel's family that when we get like a Christmas card or something, it says, it says like Mr. And Mrs. Chris Webster or Chris and Rachel Webster. Like they just, they just can't wrap their heads around the fact that she didn't take our last name. So we started calling ourselves the roadsters.
00:38:12
Speaker
road and Webster roadster. So that's where the YouTube channel is roadster adventures. And that's where that comes from. You actually have a YouTube channel. Oh yeah. I was like, wait, is David onto something that I didn't know about? Yeah. Right now. And there is a little lot over the, Oh, I didn't know it.
00:38:37
Speaker
Yeah, we've got Instagram, we've got a Facebook page, and we've got the Roaster Adventures. And I see Caleb Welch follows you. Shout out to Caleb.
00:38:54
Speaker
We decided, you know, when we decided to do this, we're like, you know, we, I mean, we do a lot of things like you guys know. I mean, you guys are archeologists. You, you travel around, even if, even if you just stay at home and record podcasts, uh, poorly like Connor, you still have a lot of adventures, right? And you still do stuff. Um, shade, shade. Could you answer the question? Could you answer the question?
00:39:25
Speaker
So anyway, no, I mean, we decided if we're going to go live in an RV, I mean, our intent wasn't to just live in an RV to start a YouTube channel. We decided if we're going to do this, let's go ahead and start it. We actually started the YouTube channel back in, I think February or March, right about right before the pandemic hit, I think, actually, because I remember our first video was us, we were walking down to a restaurant. So Rachel, that must have been back in February or early March before the pandemic because we wouldn't have been able to do that. And
00:39:50
Speaker
That's right.
00:39:53
Speaker
We're like, let's just start this channel now before we even decided we have been thinking about doing something like this for a long time. And then Rachel, like she said in the earlier segment, quit her job. And, uh, I hear somebody listening to our YouTube channel right now. I'm hitting that like button real quick. All right, there we go. There you go. I know. I know.
00:40:17
Speaker
But anyway, so we had, uh, we just decided to start, start recording just the things that we do about a few GoPro cameras and just decided to start doing that. And then honestly, just, it was the right timing for the RV that we ended up finding. It's not a converted bus. It's a 2015 holiday Rambler vacationer. And it's, um, this actually, I think episodes 18 and 19 are our walkthrough with the, um,
00:40:40
Speaker
with the company that we bought it from, they'd give you like this three hour walkthrough on how to do all the systems and stuff on your RV. I recorded it just so I could remember everything. And then we dropped those in case it would be helpful to somebody. But yeah, we have a ton of recorded content just from the stuff we've done. I'm having a hard time finding time to edit that content, but otherwise, yeah, that's where we're at. So, and I just got the notification for a new subscriber. Thank you, David. No problem.
00:41:12
Speaker
So are there drawbacks kind of advantages to being highly mobile for YouTube?
00:41:19
Speaker
You see how concise that was? That was great. It was great. It was perfect. No, I mean, the drawbacks are exactly what you would think they are. It's really hard to get good internet sometimes. So like the situation that we're in right now, we're both tethered to our separate cell phones. Cause the only way we can get our computers to work is through our AT&T signal. So there's that there's also the whole like getting from point A to point B. So.
00:41:49
Speaker
That can be really stressful sometimes. More for me than Chris, apparently. But, you know, he just gets behind the wheel of this thing and it's 36 feet long. It's a full on bus and he just gets behind the wheel of it and just starts driving. Like what? That's cool. I got this. Oh yeah. I haven't driven it yet.
00:42:13
Speaker
You just got a plan for the corners. You just got a plan for the corners. They're not that hard there. There you go. No, but the positives far outweigh it though, because we're like last weekend we were in the outer banks of North Carolina. We literally went to see Kitty Hawk National Memorial and we went to a bunch of the lighthouses and we were just, you know, walking along the beach in the outer banks. And now we're in Charlotte, North Carolina, visiting my families. We're just able to go to all these places where
00:42:40
Speaker
we couldn't take the time to do all these things. Like we couldn't take a little trip out to the outer banks when we were visiting my family in the past, but this time, you know, sure go on two weeks done. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's the best part, you know, even though, and we're staying smart about it because we understand that there's a pandemic on, but you can also now that we're beyond now that, I mean, things are probably going to change this winter because we're recording this in, you know, pre 21.
00:43:07
Speaker
But things are probably really bad as you're hearing this podcast right now because that's just the way things are going. But we're still, even if we moved from park to park and we didn't actually leave the RV, I'll tell you what, I'll take it, right? Because I can sit outside the RV. I can look outside the window. I usually, when we're not stationary somewhere, like we are here for a couple of months, we actually have a private office in a building down in Charlotte.
00:43:30
Speaker
that we've rented for a couple of months just because we're going to be here until for like two months. And when we're not doing that though, I set up the passenger seat of the RV as my office. I have my microphone there for podcasting. I have a screen behind me so my calls can't, because I do Zoom calls all day long so they can't see into basically our living room in our kitchen. It's nice because like I said, even if we never left the RV and we're moving around every two to three weeks, which is pretty typical,
00:43:57
Speaker
The scenery is changing out my office window. You know what I mean? It's changing out the living room window. And that's an amazing concept because we can still go places, get groceries delivered, get food delivered if we want. It's just our surroundings are changing. And that's amazing to me. And it'll be even better when we're able to do a lot more things when we go back to whatever normal is going to end up in.
00:44:19
Speaker
So you have an interesting patch choice model it seems, but like your foraging radius, how do you get things like shipped to your house, like Amazon and stuff? Like how does that work? Yeah. How do you develop your least, least path cost analysis and determining your, your settlement patterns?
00:44:38
Speaker
Actually, living in an RV is the highest cost path analysis. That's what that is. It's not as chief as one would think, but most parks actually, most RV parks, which is typically where we stay, at least right now, we're going to be doing a lot more of what they call boondocking, which is just staying off in BLM land on your own, probably this coming spring and summer if all goes to plan. But anyway, when you're staying in a park, a lot of parks won't even allow deliveries.
00:45:02
Speaker
And if you need a signature, forget about it. They're just not going to do it. And a lot of times, depending on the park, the delivery people, whether it's FedEx or UPS, whatever, they wouldn't even come into your spot. Sometimes they will. We had that happen one time, actually, out in Nevada. The guy came all the way up to our spot to have something delivered, and we actually weren't able to get stuff delivered there anyway.
00:45:23
Speaker
But for example, the world is really expanding. As you get something from Amazon in particular, for the first time at the Outer Banks RV park we were at last week, I had a few things delivered to an Amazon locker. And that's pretty cool. If you just look up Amazon lockers, your shipping option, there are locations around most cities. And there were two within probably 20 minutes of us at this
00:45:46
Speaker
really kind of small town area, which I was surprised to see. And, um, and I mean, I had to drive and go get it, but I was still able to have stuff shipped in to the Amazon locker location, but having mail and stuff like that, I mean, honestly, we haven't really, we haven't really had time to really deal with that stuff. Cause we have a mailing address in Reno, our houses rented, but we have a mailing address there. And, um, every once in a while we have to have like a big bulk thing, a mail shipped that we didn't have them destroy for us. And you know, so far we've been working it out, but it's, it's definitely tough.
00:46:16
Speaker
I did not know about Amazon lockers. That's cool. Oh yeah. Yeah. It's going to be good. I think for us, there's also the general delivery option. So we do have a mailbox in Reno where all of our mail is getting forwarded to you right now. And then if we're like right now we're near my family, so I can just have stuff shipped to my family's house. But once we're away from here, having stuff sent general delivery to the nearest post office is going to probably be the way to go.
00:46:44
Speaker
And I think, I know we use that when we were traveling archeologists too. I think that's a pretty common thing for archeologists to rely on when they're traveling for work and they need to get mail somehow. So general delivery, that will be very useful to us in the future.
00:46:59
Speaker
Yeah. That's, that's like the other thing about all this too. Like people say, well, how can you do that? How can you live on the road? I'm like, listen, we were archeologists for a long time. And, and honestly, when we first got together and, and she got me on that job down in South Carolina, it was only a year, year and a half later before
00:47:18
Speaker
I mean, I don't know how long you just stayed there, Rachel, but I was like, screw shovel tests. Like I do not want to do this anymore in the Southeast. I hate shovel testing. Oh, it was miserable. Oh, it was miserable. Yeah. So instead of doing that for the rest of our lives, we started looking at jobs out West where it's pedestrian survey, largely in a lot of places out West and, but you can't just go work out West, right? Like there's very few jobs that will just hire you without experience in the area.
00:47:43
Speaker
So we sold all our stuff. Well, we didn't sell anything. We sold our cars, bought a 4Runner, and so we could share that and camp out of it and live in it and put all of our stuff in storage and shovelbund our way across the United States for a year without having a place to live. We didn't have a house. Everything was in storage. And we basically lived in hotel rooms and tents until we got to the west doing projects in adjacent states. We went from Ohio, shot all the way over to New Mexico, up to Nevada, and eventually landed in Nevada and just kind of stayed there.
00:48:13
Speaker
And that's how we did it. So we've spent many, many hours together working on the same projects, living in the same tent or hotel room or whatever, way before we ever decided to get into an RV. So people are like, oh, how do you live in such close quarters? And I was like, I mean, it's just business as usual for us, pretty much. Yeah, pretty much.
00:48:33
Speaker
Well, I think that's one of the coolest things I've realized is, you know, I've dealt with a lot of folks who are in CRM and, you know, the couples that live together and kind of had this nomadic lifestyle are like some of the strongest couples that I've actually met. Yeah. It's really interesting to see that, you know, kind of happen.
00:48:55
Speaker
You have to, like you're not going to make it as a couple if you can't handle living in a very small space together. It's just as what it is. Like when we were shovel bombing, we would have companies hire us specifically because they could cram us into one hotel room together. It was like a money saving measure for them. So we got very used to being in small space together and you know, it works.
00:49:21
Speaker
I've got my back bedroom here where I can escape him, but it's good. Yeah. And you know, noise canceling headphones will save your marriage. I'm just saying, but, uh, two toilets will save a marriage. Well, we've only got one on this, so hopefully we went down to one. So we'll see how it goes.
00:49:46
Speaker
Yeah. But you know, we've all seen that on CRM projects, right? Like there's no middle ground either for couples living together. They either, like Connor said, are some of the strongest couples or they explode in a ball of flames at three o'clock in the morning when one of them rage quits and leaves. Right. Like I think I feel like we've all seen that. So, um, yeah, it's, it's one of the other, it seems. I don't know how Carlton's doing.
00:50:08
Speaker
I mean, I only did like one, one or two serum projects. That's not true. I did. I did my time and I did not like doing shovel tests in the Southeast and it only affirmed my desire not to do that sort of labor for anyone but myself and my own research. That's fair.
00:50:27
Speaker
I think, I think shovel testing in the Southeast has spawned more advanced degrees than literally anything else in archeology because it's like, I need to get out of this crap right now. I think a master's degree will solve that. Nope. I'm going to get a PhD instead. So yeah, that's, that's it. Yeah. Shout out to Lorcan.
00:50:49
Speaker
If all goes belly up, I'm just going to do survey for paleo West out of, out of Longmont here and just avoid the Southeast for the rest of my life. I have no intention of going back to Virginia, not in the slightest. Yeah. Yeah. I'll find it's better. I'll find this better. Yeah. Would you be able to get me a job, Connor? Like what would I move? Could I move to Montrose? Could you hire me? I wouldn't hire you. Yeah, I wouldn't hire you, but I would.
00:51:18
Speaker
The people around me might hire you. Actually, I'll get that ready for graduation in 2022. That's right. Connor, when I mentioned I worked in Colorado, have I told you before it was Alpine that I worked for when I did that one month project in Colorado? Yeah. I feel like we also almost redid that project recently. That wasn't surprising.
00:51:45
Speaker
Cause it's just like what we do is that we just keep, keep redoing these projects. Oh my God. I'm so succinct. I'm so succinct.
00:52:01
Speaker
part of my dissolution with CRM when I worked for SWICA, like not only was I like, I don't want to dig negative shovel tests in the desert for the rest of my life. And then it just dumped snow on me after it was like sunny all day, like literally sunny all day. And then in three minutes that just us clouds came in and dumped snow on me while I was in that depressed mood. And I was like, all right, guess I'm making an Instagram. But we went to like,
00:52:25
Speaker
all these different sites that like had been dug and already surveyed and excavated 10 years before. And they're like, we're doing it again. And I was like, why? That was, yeah, that was what we just did too. That project that I was doing for Digtech for Chris, like we didn't find anything new on the entire project. The only sites we found were the ones that had been previously recorded. And I'm like, why am I here right now? Why am I here? Yeah.
00:52:53
Speaker
And it's like kind of like taxpayer money in a way, but yeah. Yeah. Well, that was working for a goldmine. So that was goldmine money. That was Canada right there. Yeah. Nope. That's free money. Yeah. I didn't feel bad about that part. Nice. Nice. Where, uh, where's your next location? Where are you guys going next?
00:53:16
Speaker
Hey, we don't really have plants right now. We want to spend most of the cold winter months, January, February, March in Florida, but we don't have a
Future Plans and Episode Conclusion
00:53:27
Speaker
location yet. So hopefully we'll be down there, but we don't know where yet.
00:53:31
Speaker
And we did apply for tickets through our senators for the inauguration. So since we're on the East Coast and we're highly mobile and we have this RV park until early January, we figured, well, instead of going straight to Florida, we could always go to DC for a couple of weeks. And if we get to see the inauguration,
00:53:47
Speaker
Great. If we get to see them drag the Cheeto out by his, by his short and curlies, that'd be awesome too. Um, if we get to see just some museums and stuff and Carlton's cousin, that would be fantastic. So, you know, either way, I think it's going to be a good time and then we'll go to Florida.
00:54:04
Speaker
Yeah, if you guys end up going to D.C., let me know. That's where I'm going to be over break and working on watching the inauguration from the balcony of the American Indian Museum in D.C. No way. That would be tickets. I just use it as familial, familial more tickets to get me up there. So we'll see.
00:54:22
Speaker
You can just chalk us up for two more. I'm just going to say we're going to be there. I'll bring the bourbon. Stay warm. Yeah. Well, thank you, Chris and Rachel for being on the podcast. Chris, you don't have to answer this. You already answered this and you said you wouldn't start the APN over again because you hate the APN and everything it does with it. Rachel. Kind of.
00:54:50
Speaker
Rachel, if if you had the opportunity again, would you choose to live a life in ruins and possibly an RV with Chris Webster?
00:55:00
Speaker
Oh, so many layers of that question. It wasn't an immediate yes. Let's just go with yes. Let's just go with yes. Sounds good. Yes. Well, everyone, it's time to hit the old dusty trail. So we just interviewed Chris Webster and Rachel Rodin, our editors at the Archaeology Podcast Network, and a godsend for editing our voices into something palatable and doesn't make your ears bleed. So with that, we are out.
00:55:36
Speaker
Thanks for listening to a life in ruins podcast. You can follow us on Instagram and Facebook at a life in ruins podcast. And you can also email us at a life in ruins podcast at gmail.com. And remember, make sure to bring your archaeologists in from the cold and feed them beer. These are dad jokes featured from my father, Dean John. And so these are actual dad jokes. Why didn't the astronaut come home to his wife?
00:56:02
Speaker
Why? He needed his space. Oh, God damn it. Oh, bad. All right, we're done. Oh, bad.
00:56:28
Speaker
This episode was produced by Chris Webster from his RV Traveling America, Tristan Boyle in Scotland, and the Archaeology Podcast Network, and was edited by Chris Webster and by Rachel Rodin. This has been a presentation of the Archaeology Podcast Network. Visit us on the web for show notes and other podcasts at www.archpodnet.com. Contact us at chris at archaeologypodcastnetwork.com.