Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Episode 1: Wrapping Up The Elections With Dane Scalise
16 Plays1 year ago
New Hanover County Commissioner Dane Scalise joins our very first podcast as we delve in to election irregularities, late vote counting and green spaces in New Hanover.
Recommended
Transcript
Advocacy for community park development
00:00:02
Reuel Sample
Well, Nikki, I guess we're going to do a podcast.
00:00:06
Nikki
It looks like we are. Congratulations <unk> rule. You're stuck with me for a bar.
00:00:11
Reuel Sample
Good evening. Good evening, folks. Welcome to the Nikki and Rule Podcast Experience. I'm Rule Sample here in Wilmington, North Carolina, along with Nikki
2024 elections and political landscape analysis
00:00:24
Reuel Sample
Bascom. Good evening, Nikki.
00:00:26
Nikki
Good evening, Roal. I am so excited that we decided to do this. that We're crazy. How crazy are you teaming up with me?
00:00:35
Reuel Sample
ah
00:00:36
Nikki
Ah.
00:00:36
Reuel Sample
i am I'm crazy enough to hang out with you and and an all more. And Nikki, I'm going to have you introduce our guest.
00:00:43
Nikki
Oh, I am so excited because this is someone that I followed on the campaign trail everywhere. i cant i I don't even know if he counted how many times I crashed his parties, but I am so excited to introduce our guest, our County Commissioner, Dane Scalise. Thank you so much for coming, Dane.
00:01:02
Dane Scalise
Nikki Rule, thank you so much for having me on. What I understand is your inaugural podcast, your your first go at your your duo, your team effort, and you were scraping the bottom of the barrel trying to find somebody to get on.
00:01:17
Nikki
possible No.
00:01:19
Dane Scalise
And after you went through 12 or 13 different people, you finally said, I guess we could call Dane.
00:01:23
Nikki
but
00:01:26
Dane Scalise
He'll probably show up.
00:01:28
Nikki
ah
00:01:28
Reuel Sample
ah You know just for that I'm going to get I'm gonna I'm gonna do my Oprah Winfrey impression Dane Scalise is in the house
00:01:35
Nikki
No, wait, wait, wait, wait.
00:01:35
Dane Scalise
All right, I'm in the house.
00:01:37
Reuel Sample
ah
00:01:40
Reuel Sample
right
00:01:40
Nikki
We have to tell Beau.
00:01:42
Dane Scalise
We got props and everything. Very good.
00:01:45
Reuel Sample
Hey folks, before we get any any farther into this mess, this podcast is brought to you by Cape Fear Boat Brokerage. If you are looking to buy or sell a boat, contact us at capefearboatbrokerage at capefearboats.com, capefearbrokerage.com, and they will get you all hooked up since 2006, professional yacht brokers serving Harrington Harbor, the Chesapeake Bay, and now the Cape Fear area of North Carolina.
00:02:14
Reuel Sample
Cape Fear Boat Brook Ridge sponsoring this podcast tonight. So Dane, Nikki, we're going to talk about the elections of 2024.
00:02:25
Reuel Sample
Thankfully, thankfully, they're done.
00:02:28
Dane Scalise
Yes We do.
00:02:29
Reuel Sample
And they are in the bag for most of it that we still have one going on here in North Carolina, don't we, Dane? We've got the We're going to get to that here just a second, but at the top of the ticket, President Trump came through for North Carolina or North Carolina came through for President Trump.
00:02:47
Reuel Sample
We were the first swing state to be called for the former and now next president. Uh, Dane was there.
00:02:53
Dane Scalise
a three-peat for President Trump, one in 16, one in 20, and one in 24 in North Carolina.
00:02:56
Reuel Sample
It's a three-peat.
00:02:59
Reuel Sample
Why did he carry us, Dane? we It was a toss up there for a while. What were North Carolinians thinking when they got attracted to Trump?
00:03:10
Dane Scalise
Well we are always as far as I can tell over the last eight plus years and presumably moving forward going to be pretty tight whenever it comes to statewide and national races. You should of course take polls with a grain of salt. They do a lot of moving around and get a lot tighter and more accurate as you get closer to the election as I'm sure you're aware and your listeners and audience will perhaps not be surprised to hear. There's a lot to be gained from the vacillations and changes that the media represents whenever it comes to polling. The polling companies themselves have an interest in showing sometimes wild swings because that glues you to whatever their product is and their product is polls. So they're going to be kind of all over the place until you get closer to the election and by and large the polling that came down to the wire was fairly reflective of where
00:04:05
Dane Scalise
North Carolinians ultimately landed on election day as to why North Carolinians went for President Trump. I guess it's probably a similar reason that many others across the country went for President Trump and he ultimately ended up winning. There was quite a bit of disruption over the last four years whenever it came to things like COVID, COVID restrictions,
00:04:27
Dane Scalise
inflation, the economy, the issue of immigration. And ultimately, whenever you are effectively the incumbent, which Kamala Harris was the incumbent vice president, it's harder to make a case for yourself as a change agent from the circumstances that I think people correctly perceived were not good. And ultimately, President Trump was able to better represent himself as the change agent for the people of North Carolina and Americans at large.
00:04:55
Reuel Sample
Nikki, president Trump was very smart and the Republican party was really smart in recasting Kamala or Kamala or whatever her name was as the incumbent did that. And it's and it looked like it worked.
00:05:10
Nikki
Oh, I think it most definitely did. um They did everything they could to tie her to Joe Biden's record. And as much as she tried to distance herself, she could not. She couldn't do it. And I think the general public was just ready for that to be done and over. They gave it a chance and not anymore. Ready to move on. Let's get better. Let's move back up.
00:05:35
Reuel Sample
I wrote an article for the Wilmington Conservative the other day ah that said that ah even though Kamala lost the White House, her campaign was successful in getting Democrats out. And we saw that ah across the state and here in north carolina in New Hanover County, where our races were really, really close. Dane, you had to go to the mattresses to get to get your election done.
00:06:04
Dane Scalise
Yeah, even more so than new york North Carolina at large being ah a purple state or close on the margins or whatever you want to call it, New Hanover County is that much more so. We had some successes in New Hanover County in terms of getting Republicans elected, but a lot of Republicans did not get elected and yeah that begins quite frankly at the top of the ticket.
00:06:28
Dane Scalise
Vice President Harris was successful in New Hanover County, as well as the gubernatorial candidate, as well as the Attorney General candidate, as well as quite a few of the Council of State positions. Obviously, the local races include both the County Commission and the School Board, and there was a bit of a mixed bag there, but by and large, New Hanover County trended toward Democrats in this last election.
00:06:53
Reuel Sample
Nikki, you ran for school board and had a tough, tough time. What did you hear when you were out there?
00:07:01
Nikki
um A lot of frustration, um I think there was a lot of frustration with top of the ticket, just like Dane was saying, um but there was also a lot of frustration with, a lot of people felt like, they didn't know ah a lot of the down ballot races. They didn't realize that the ballot was going to be so long and I just kept saying make sure you finish the ballot, make sure you finish the ballot. um When you look at the tapes after some of the polling sites put the tapes up on the doors and you see how much the under vote took place, there were a lot of people that either didn't finish the ballot or like in Dane's race where there's multiple people running or in my case where multiple people are running they either didn't finish the ballot or they only voted for one or two they didn't vote for all three um and I think there was a lot of frustration with that as well it was a huge race there was a lot going on
00:07:58
Reuel Sample
What about the shenanigans we're
Election integrity and legal challenges
00:07:59
Reuel Sample
seeing? We saw that with you here in in the county.
00:08:05
Reuel Sample
I think our our our poll, our our elections are, come on, there they're not that bad, but there are some issues that we're facing. Dane, what happened here north in New Hanover County with your election and some of the questionable ballots that came through?
00:08:25
Dane Scalise
well the
00:08:25
Nikki
Mm.
00:08:27
Dane Scalise
development that was unexpected, and I guess I'll take you back to election day itself.
00:08:32
Reuel Sample
Hm hm.
00:08:32
Dane Scalise
We were one of the last, if not the last reporting county in the state of North Carolina for our election results. And that essentially meant that nobody really knew what was happening with a lot of the races, especially the down ballot races.
00:08:48
Dane Scalise
Down ballot races mean school board, county commission, register of deeds, the the races that are not the top of the ticket, the president and the governor. we didn't really know what the outcome of those races were until approximately midnight on the night of the election. So at the end of that time frame, it looked pretty good for just specifically calling out my race, my race, because it seemed that incumbent Republican chair Bill Rivenbach had come in first place, I had come in second place, and
00:09:19
Dane Scalise
Stephanie Walker who is currently on school board or was just previously on school board it just became county commissioner was going to be in third place so that's what we left with the impression of on the night of the election and the next morning rolled around and came to find out that actually there were at least 1,500 votes that had not been counted by the local board of elections. And that's a real problem because state law says that ballots that are received, absentee ballots, those are mail-in ballots, are supposed to be required to be counted on election night. And they just weren't. Instead of counting them, they sequestered a large number of votes starting on the prior Friday and held those off to the side.
00:10:03
Dane Scalise
Now, that's ah a big issue for a number of reasons because, again, they were supposed to count them. It's in violation of state law that they didn't. But it's also a problem because whenever you have these mail-in ballots, these absentee ballots, and you don't know exactly what they're going to be, but you do know that the outcome of the race was quite close. And in fact, first, it was pretty comfortable in the county commission race, but second, third, and fourth were all very close.
00:10:31
Dane Scalise
And whenever you start to take into account the normal ratio of absentee ballots, and it's about 60-40 benefit to the Democrat candidates, there's ah a high likelihood that there could have been a shifting in the way that the ballots were ultimately going to end up resulting in who would won and who lost.
00:10:52
Dane Scalise
And that especially became the case whenever that number went from 1,500 to 1,750 to 2,000.
00:10:58
Nikki
them
00:10:59
Dane Scalise
And it kept growing over time and sort of unexplainedly so. Additionally, there were quite a number of provisional ballots, almost 2000 of those, and provisional ballots are basically ballots from individuals that maybe didn't have ID, maybe weren't in the right polling place. Their ballots couldn't immediately be counted at the time that they were submitted, but they have to be later evaluated by the board of elections to determine are they in fact valid ballots or do they need to be discarded?
00:11:29
Dane Scalise
Now the interesting factor for New Hanover County is that we had significantly more provisional ballots, not just proportionately, but significantly more total number than counties like Durham. Durham County had 1100 provisional ballots, we had 1950.
00:11:47
Dane Scalise
so
00:11:47
Reuel Sample
is that is that all coming from this the unc w is that wherere it just ah
00:11:47
Dane Scalise
job
00:11:50
Dane Scalise
ah There were quite a few that were from UNCW. There are all kinds of stories that are out there about how we got these provisional ballots. The issue is how do we ensure that the right provisional ballots are counted and the wrong provisional ballots are not included because they shouldn't legally be counted.
00:12:08
Dane Scalise
And furthermore, why did the shifting number of mail-in ballots go from 1,500 to 1,750 to 2,000? So there was a lot of uncertainty that resulted in the immediate aftermath of the election because very easily those uncounted ballots could change the outcome of the election. Now, what I always said from the beginning is that if I'm beat by a legitimate exercise of the public and voting. I will accept that all day long. But you're absolutely creating some amount of uncertainty, some amount of doubt in the mind of the public whenever you don't count ballots as you're supposed to under the law. And furthermore, the number keeps shifting as time goes along. I mean, one of the easy questions for me was why was it 1500 that next day? Why was it not the 1970 or whatever and it ended up being known? Why didn't we know that number?
00:13:00
Dane Scalise
actually prior to the election day being over and saying hey look for whatever reason we didn't count these we we should have but either we couldn't get around to it or whatever the case may be but they didn't do that. They they hid that information from the public and as a consequence I elected to hire legal counsel and to send a demand letter to the Board of Elections and basically tell them you have violated state law. And furthermore, we then filed a protest saying that this violation of the state law could conceivably end up in an illegal exercise of
00:13:36
Dane Scalise
your right and power as well as my rights as a candidate and we demand that you follow the law and of course they sort of ignored it they put it off for as long as they could whenever they eventually did hear the matter they ended up rejecting my protest on a split vote 3-2 and i will note as an interesting aside a lot of people say board of elections are bipartisan and in in a way they are but as a fact of life A matter of fact that you can't run away from under current North Carolina law 100% of all Board of Elections are run by Democrats. The state Board of Elections is run by Democrats. All 100 counties have Board of Elections that are run by Democrats. And the reason for that is that current state law says that the Democrats get to appoint two members to the Board of Elections, the Republicans get to appoint two
00:14:28
Dane Scalise
members to the Board of Elections, and then the governor, whoever that is, gets to appoint a fifth member. So as a practical reality, North Carolina has had Democrats run all of our Board of Elections for every year, other than the years that Pat McCrory was governor, which was 2013 to the very end of 2016.
00:14:34
Reuel Sample
it's partisan
00:14:35
Nikki
Mm hmm.
00:14:38
Reuel Sample
It's partisan.
00:14:48
Reuel Sample
yeah
00:14:48
Dane Scalise
So I think that it was fair for some people to ask some questions, and it was fair for me to advance my legal arguments that I did.
00:14:55
Dane Scalise
And ultimately, I will suggest to you that the spotlight that we put on the Board of Elections helped them to do their work in the right way. And they excluded a lot of the provisional ballots, if not all of the provisional ballots that should not have been included.
00:15:10
Dane Scalise
And they were very careful in going through the mail-in ballots that ultimately were received. Now, I still have some open questions about that Delta of 1500 to 1950. I never got sufficient answers on those, but at the end of the day, the only races that it would have made a difference in is mine and David Perry's on the school board.
00:15:32
Dane Scalise
And so I don't know that there were a lot of ballots that are hanging out there that it would ah would have made a difference in some of the other races, but it certainly could have in those two races. Thankfully, it did not. Both David Perry and I ended up advancing as victors in the election.
00:15:47
Reuel Sample
It is we call it.
00:15:48
Nikki
Oh, I want to say something.
00:15:50
Reuel Sample
Yeah, go ahead.
00:15:50
Nikki
I want to say something real quick. rule um As far as the provisional ballots, there were a lot of provisional ballots that people showed up at the polls without a driver's license, um where they were told that they could do a provisional ballot.
00:16:02
Nikki
But if you don't know that you have a certain amount of time to bring your driver's license back to the board of elections to what they call cure your ballot, it gets tossed out.
00:16:15
Nikki
So um we had a very wonderful group of people here working for the GOP. um One of our um precinct chairs actually organized about 30 people that were going out and chasing down these provisional ballots and making sure that people knew go down to the board of elections you have until five o'clock today to show them your driver's license so that your ballot will be counted.
00:16:38
Nikki
We wanted to count every single ballot, um which was absolutely
00:16:41
Dane Scalise
That was the last Yeah, that was the last piece that I was sort of going to bring home because it's really the most important piece. All of those other things that you can say that the Board of Elections did right or wrong. What the volunteers did that was 100% right is put in the sweat equity and they were able to cure, as you said, Nikki, hundreds of ballots.
00:17:02
Dane Scalise
And whatever, you win by only 249 ballots like I did. That's the difference between a win and a loss. So the ball the volunteers that were out there that did the ballot cure efforts, this victory is as much theirs as is it it as it is anybody. And I've told them that. I am beholden to them in a huge way because they were able to make sure that those victories that we obtained on election day were ultimately preserved as we went through the process. Thank you to the volunteers.
00:17:30
Reuel Sample
You started off this whole thing though, Dane, by saying they did some things in clear violation of the law. And we're seeing that here in New Hanover County, we're seeing it with the continued discussions about the Supreme Court race.
00:17:47
Reuel Sample
Isn't there any room for redress on this for i they broke the law?
00:17:53
Nikki
the
00:17:56
Nikki
He died.
00:17:57
Dane Scalise
Well, maybe, maybe yes, maybe no. The law does not have a clear remedy provision as it is currently drafted. If you break this law, what are you supposed to do with these ballots? Well, we don't have a clear answer on that. And ah arguably, it would be very hard for you to tell people who did in fact legitimately cast a ballot, but had their ballots mishandled by the Board of Elections that we're not going to be able to count your ballot.
00:18:24
Dane Scalise
That's not a very good remedy. so ah Because that cuts all ways. That that really impacts everybody. it it It impacts Republicans. It impacts unaffiliated. It impacts democrat Democratic voters. And um as a consequence, we have got to, I think, hone in on how are we going to fix this moving forward. It's probably going to require some of the changes that the state legislature is contemplating as well as if for instance the Board of Elections needed more resources to count ballots in a timely manner. All they had to do was ask. I assure you that the County Commission would have on a unanimous 5-0 basis given them every dollar that they needed to timely count ballots but they never asked us for any additional dollars and there are all these people who claim oh you cut their budget no we did not cut their budget we increased their budget and
00:19:17
Dane Scalise
And had they needed more temporary help to count these ballots that came in, we certainly would have provided that to them. But we have got some things that we're gonna have to work out. I will say that this is an endemic problem with the proliferation of provision, I'm sorry, with absentee mail-in ballots. They take so much more time to process than people showing up and voting in person. And I would argue that whenever you have as much early voting as we do,
00:19:46
Dane Scalise
with all these polling places that we really should emphasize that the absentee ballot process from ah just a time management perspective, from a workflow perspective, you would be better served as a voter to vote in person because it takes so much more time for the Board of Elections to process mail-in absentee ballots. Please vote in person.
00:20:07
Dane Scalise
during early voting, on election day, whatever the case may be. But that's how you're actually gonna end up saving these folks at the board of elections a lot of time and effort. And if they need more assistance in the future, I hope that they will ask the commission in the future. It will be, at least from my perspective, advanced. I want them to have the resources that they need to comply with the law.
00:20:27
Reuel Sample
Nicky, do you think you were affected by some of this by some of this stuff?
00:20:35
Nikki
I have no idea.
00:20:39
Nikki
i as a um So this was my year. I was supposed to be a chief judge this year and step down from that because I started running for the board of election or board of education. um And I have to say, being on both sides of that fence, it is a long and grueling work day every single day on early voting. And then you've got and On election day, I honestly, um I'm not sure how anyone does this year after year after year. the Those are long days. It's a long early voting. It's a long day that you're working all day and mistakes are going to happen. I mean, we're human with all the human fallacies. Mistakes are going to be made.
00:21:25
Nikki
And I just wish we would look more into that so that we can make sure that mistakes aren't made. And we're not working people to death. It's a lot of work.
00:21:35
Dane Scalise
Yeah, I do want to actually show some sympathy. All sincerity, as you're pointing out, Nikki, these are human beings, and I believe that they work really hard, and the overwhelming majority had nothing but the best intentions in doing the work that they do. But from a workflow perspective, from a leadership perspective, whenever you're charged at the top of the board of elections with running an operation and running it smoothly and properly in compliance with the law, that's on you as a leader to get the resources and materials that you need to achieve that and if you can't do that then you need to make people aware of that. That is, that's leadership and it is a failure of leadership if you're not able to follow through on what you've been charged with. So it is undeniable the state board of elections has said repeatedly that the new Hanover county board of elections did not comply with the law and that they were not advised to disobey or disregard the law by the state board of elections and
00:22:32
Dane Scalise
The question is, why did they do it? And why are they not taking responsibility at this stage for having failed to do so? I don't want everyone that's there to feel like I am pointing at them and saying, you're a bad person, you're a bad employee.
00:22:44
Nikki
Yeah.
00:22:44
Dane Scalise
I'm not, but I am suggesting that leadership made a major mistake and they have still not taken ownership or responsibility for the mistake that they made.
00:22:45
Nikki
No.
00:22:51
Nikki
100% agree.
00:22:52
Reuel Sample
it should be interesting exactly It should be interesting to see what happens. This latest bill that the governor vetoed, the the Senate overrode the veto, and I think the House is supposed to vote on it either today or tomorrow, places oversight of the Board of Elections in the auditor's office.
00:23:12
Reuel Sample
Is that right? And and now the the governor will still have appointing authority
00:23:14
Dane Scalise
Yes.
00:23:18
Reuel Sample
But everything is run through the auditors. That should be interesting to see how that turns out. So.
00:23:25
Dane Scalise
Yeah, I'm not sure of the nuance of the law, but I understand that some of the authority and appointing will be now under the the auspices of the auditor's office as opposed to the governor.
00:23:35
Reuel Sample
So we're coming into. that We always have an election season here. 2025 is the election season for the municipal, so we'll see if they've got that figured out.
00:23:44
Dane Scalise
Yep.
00:23:45
Reuel Sample
The difference is is that it's a fraction.
00:23:48
Dane Scalise
The scale is so much lower at the municipal level.
00:23:49
Reuel Sample
up
00:23:50
Dane Scalise
Whenever it's just city of Wilmington, whenever it's just Riceville Beach, whenever it's just Carolina, Curry Beach, there are a lot fewer candidates and a lot fewer voters that ultimately participate in municipal elections.
00:24:02
Dane Scalise
Even the off-cycle congressional elections, for instance, in 26 will generally speaking have fewer voters that turn out than the presidential election years, which is again what we just finished.
00:24:14
Reuel Sample
Yeah, that'll be that'll be a big year, Nikki, for the Senate to see what happens with the U.S. Senate position because Tom Tillis is up for reelection to see if he actually ah actually runs again.
00:24:28
Nikki
Oh, he's gonna have a tough one.
00:24:28
Reuel Sample
maybe
00:24:30
Nikki
I haven't heard. of I've just seen some really bad publicity for Tom Tillis here lately.
00:24:35
Reuel Sample
Nikki Baskin for U.S.
00:24:36
Nikki
But who knows?
00:24:37
Reuel Sample
Senate. I think Nikki Baskin for U.S.
00:24:39
Nikki
Ah!
00:24:39
Reuel Sample
Senate. I think yeah that'd be a great thing.
00:24:42
Nikki
yeah
00:24:42
Reuel Sample
so
00:24:43
Nikki
Rule it sample for a padded room.
00:24:43
Reuel Sample
okay
00:24:49
Reuel Sample
that
00:24:52
Reuel Sample
All right, the next, go ahead, Dickie.
00:24:53
Nikki
yeah So I was going to um ask about the Supreme Court race. we um There was a recount between Griffin and Riggs, right? A partial recount.
00:25:05
Dane Scalise
Yes.
00:25:07
Reuel Sample
Now they did the, yeah they did the recount.
00:25:07
Nikki
And from what I hear, there
00:25:10
Reuel Sample
yeah
00:25:11
Nikki
for from what I hear they're not going to do a full recount that they're they're done because in the partial recount um Griffin had to get at least 35 votes he had to gain 35 votes to um trigger a full recount and Riggs actually got 70 votes out of the partial recount did you see that?
00:25:31
Reuel Sample
I didn't see that, but wasn't he actually also challenging the votes themselves? 60,000 votes that might not be, I think at this point in time for the, he needs to take one for the team and just step down so we can and keep on going.
00:25:45
Reuel Sample
Dane, you might have another.
00:25:46
Nikki
i mean It was just so close for a state race. That was a really close race.
00:25:49
Reuel Sample
Yeah.
00:25:50
Dane Scalise
Well, we and we unfortunately have seen this, I guess fortunately or unfortunately, maybe it's neither one. In 2020, the same thing happened.
00:25:59
Reuel Sample
Hmm.
00:26:00
Dane Scalise
chief justice Now Chief Justice Paul Newby was in the race of what seemed like the century, and he ended up winning statewide by 300 votes. And so this is really just the same thing, ah but the shoe is on the other foot. And I'm not sure what the the legal machinations are that are left for Judge Griffin, um but i um I know that it's not the position that you want to be in where you're down approximately 700 votes at this stage.
00:26:34
Reuel Sample
Yeah.
00:26:34
Nikki
Yeah, it was like 758.
00:26:36
Dane Scalise
And i'll just I'll just say that I know him very well and he is a wonderful judge and a wonderful father and a wonderful husband and he's going to keep doing great work on the Court of Appeals. And I have no doubt that he will continue on in his effort there and perhaps again at the Supreme Court because as many people who follow politics and especially politicians know, you don't win them all.
00:27:01
Dane Scalise
some you win some you lose and you got to get right back on the horse and He's the sort of guy that I wouldn't suggest that I know what he would do or not do but I could see him Absolutely getting right back in the saddle at the next opportunity
00:27:15
Nikki
I would love to see him back from the saddle. I'd love to see Griffin doing that.
00:27:20
Reuel Sample
I would love to see it when we get to the point where elections are done. And there's no question is that just like you said, Dane, is that if if you got less votes than the other person, fine.
00:27:32
Reuel Sample
But when it becomes there's so many issues involved, you know, the state of Florida, which is what, three times, four times the population of the state of North Carolina, they have their stuff done by 11 o'clock at night.
00:27:45
Reuel Sample
Why can't we do that? And it's just ridiculous.
00:27:46
Dane Scalise
It is a peculiarity that I don't have an answer for. And it's not just the state of Florida. It's countless countries around the world, and including Brazil, that are able to tabulate their votes and the same day that elections occur. And I think that it would go a lot it It would go a long way for everybody, regardless of your political persuasion, to be able to tell voters that we know essentially the outcome of every race on election night, not dragging on for a month. Like for instance, in California, there are various congressional races that have been sort of tripping along in this fashion. And I will say in fairness, part of it also does turn on a lot of our elections being very close.
00:28:27
Dane Scalise
Even on those election nights where we want to be able to declare victory, you can't always declare victory whenever the margin is only 10-50 votes, and that happens all the time. But by and large, we should be able to tabulate all of our ballots on election day, including those 1500, 1750, 19, whatever. However the the correct number should have been, they should have been counted on election night and we would have had a much better sense about where we were and a lot of the concerns that the public had wouldn't have manifested.
00:29:01
Reuel Sample
Well, let's let's move on to the next section of our podcast that we call, What's Going
Land use debates: housing vs. park development
00:29:06
Reuel Sample
On? And yeah the the the ever, ever industrial and resourceful Nikki Baskin came up with most of these to- today. So this is all her fault. So the first one is brand new news. so When we talked about with Dana ahead of time,
00:29:25
Reuel Sample
ah He didn't even know about this one because this actually just came down ah Yes, or last night actually wasn't it? um This is from the port city daily Nikki. What's going on out there at Market Street?
00:29:40
Nikki
Well, it looks like the um Wilmington City Council is going to be annexing about 20 acres just off of Market Street. um And they voted unanimously to do it. There's gonna be, um the proposal is to annex it and have 253 multifamily units. But here's where they really start reeling people in is that 10% is going to go to workforce housing.
00:30:09
Nikki
So um a couple of people like Natalie English from the Chamber of Commerce said that, you know, this is something that we really need. You know, prices of homes are going up, prices of apartments are going up. So it's um kind of which which coin are you on? Are you are you on the side that want that knows we need workforce housing? Or are you on the side that we're just too congested up here in Ogden? So um That's a tough one, but you know what I want to talk about?
00:30:39
Nikki
Now that we put that one out there, I want to talk about what Dane was talking about with the property off of, what did you say, Independence Boulevard?
00:30:49
Reuel Sample
Yeah.
00:30:49
Dane Scalise
yeah
00:30:49
Nikki
Are we still, am I still here?
00:30:50
Dane Scalise
so um
00:30:52
Reuel Sample
You're still here, Nikki.
00:30:53
Dane Scalise
you're you're still You're still there, we lost you a little bit. um Just so that your audience is aware, there are a variety of different governments ah that are in the immediate area that we live in, New Hanover County. There are councils for the City of Wilmington, for Wrightsville Beach, for Carolina Beach, for Curry Beach, and there's also the County Commission. So the County Commission primarily handles issues that are in the unincorporated areas of the county, which means those areas of the county that are not within a municipal district such as Wilmington. So this particular project, the City of Wilmington Advanced, I can't say that I know too much about, but I can tell you a little bit about a project that falls within the City of Wilmington but has some connection to New Hanover County.
00:31:42
Dane Scalise
And it is basically over approximately near the intersection of Carolina Beach Road and Independence Boulevard. There is a 60 acre parcel of land that was owned by someone named Flossy Brian. And she left this land to the county in the early 2000s. And she said, I want this land to ultimately be preserved and turned into a park.
00:32:09
Dane Scalise
Well, fast forward a couple of years, and Ms. Bryan made an effort to withdraw her will and not leave it to the county, but instead leave it to some other folks. And there was a whole big, long piece of litigation that ensued. And the the point of the litigation was essentially, did she have testamentary capacity, meaning the mental wherewithal, to make this change to her will? And through a negotiation, ultimately what the county agreed with the individuals who Our heirs meaning the individuals who family members associated with miss Brian that we would sort of co-own this property we would own part of it they would own part of it and that we would sell it and
00:32:51
Dane Scalise
we would split the proceeds. And that was like 20 years ago, like I said, so it's kind of been tripping along for a long, long, long time. And there is a proposition to rezone this property now and turn it into multifamily and ultimately sell it and then split the proceeds. Well, what I've been advancing instead of doing it that way, I said, since the county already owns this piece of property in Southeastern New Hanover County, and these other folks own a piece of this property,
00:33:21
Dane Scalise
Why don't we go talk to one another about us buying out their interest and instead of building multifamily, turning it into exactly what Ms. Brian wanted us to do in the first place, which is build a park. And I've been calling this early 2.0. So, you know, we've got early gardens and the county owns early gardens.
00:33:40
Dane Scalise
And had we not purchased Early Gardens some number of years ago, it could have easily ended up being something different than what it is now. So the county had foresight. And as you might imagine, there were people at the time that said, this is not a good spend of money. Well, I would argue it absolutely was a very good spend of money. Early Gardens is a beautiful area of our community. It's a gem. It's something that people like to go see. We just went, my family and I, to go see Enchanted early. And I'm very glad that we have this. If we're going to, in our small county, carve out some places for preservation, we've got to take deliberate action to achieve this. So I think that the better outcome here for this property, and the reason that I said that it's technically within the city, is that the city is the one that would make the decision on rezoning.
00:34:24
Dane Scalise
even though the county owns it. The county owns a piece of land that's inside of the city's jurisdiction, if that hopefully makes sense to you. But I think that we can go back to the court and we can say, we've talked with these heirs, we've struck a new deal. I think that probably what these heirs want is to be paid some amount of money for the land. And they don't care particularly if we build apartments there or not. And then we can recreate over the years a new, wonderful park like we have in Ehrly at early in the southeastern part of the county. And so that's a a big project that I'm working on. I don't know whether or not it will land, but I do think that we have got to be deliberate about the where and how of the building that we're doing. I am not somebody who is going to say that we should never build. There are too many people whose livelihoods have to do with building, not just real estate people. Of course, everybody thinks of that, but there's construction folks, people who deal with equipment.
00:35:21
Dane Scalise
And it's furthermore, quite frankly, illegal for you to just say, we're never going to let anybody build anything. That's not good for private property rights. The county can't do that, shouldn't do that. But we can be more deliberate about the where and how that we allow dense building to occur. And we can also be more deliberate about carving out places for preservation, like we are talking about here with this parcel on Independence Boulevard, what I have again termed early 2.0.
00:35:47
Dane Scalise
I think it's a good idea. We've got to figure out how to pay for it. I'd love for the endowment to get involved with helping out with this. you know This is the money that was created from the sale of the hospital, the people's money, and it would be great if that endowment was willing to assist us with the purchase of this parcel.
00:36:04
Dane Scalise
But I don't know where it's all going to land. It's in the early in the early phases of discussion. And obviously, I've got to put together a coalition of people at the city and the county and these heirs to see whether or not it's feasible.
00:36:16
Dane Scalise
But I am hoping that I'm going to be able to to get it across the line.
00:36:17
Nikki
Not me.
00:36:20
Dane Scalise
People would love to see some more green space in our community, and I'm going to try it my best to get that done.
00:36:26
Nikki
And if I can suggest um the Honorable Ted Davis, he he was very um very instrumental in helping procure early gardens.
00:36:40
Dane Scalise
Yep.
00:36:40
Nikki
he He was there from the very beginning. He might have some very good advice.
00:36:45
Nikki
I think he I think it would be a great idea.
00:36:45
Dane Scalise
Well, we're going to bring everybody to the table on this.
00:36:47
Reuel Sample
You know, I think about one of the largest cities in the United States, New York City. And if you've ever been, never heard of it.
00:36:54
Dane Scalise
Never heard of me.
00:36:56
Reuel Sample
Yeah. and And they've got this, this acres, a acres and acres and acres of Central Park that they have set aside for exactly what you're doing.
00:37:06
Reuel Sample
Green space. It's not just about building. It's about setting aside places for, for green space. I think that's a great thing.
00:37:17
Dane Scalise
Well, we'll see what happens with it. I think it's ah a great idea and I hope that we're ultimately gonna be able to get it done.
00:37:23
Reuel Sample
So next, did you know, Nikki,
AI and privacy in schools
00:37:26
Nikki
Oh boy.
00:37:27
Reuel Sample
that AI face detection is coming to North Carolina?
00:37:31
Nikki
I did hear that. I actually heard it was coming to New Hanover County Schools.
00:37:37
Reuel Sample
are we one of the Are we one of the testing places for that?
00:37:37
Nikki
um
00:37:40
Nikki
We are, it is, um there was $5.5 million dollars here. I gotta look up my numbers, make sure I'm saying that right. $5.5 million dollars set aside for AI detection in the schools. um There's two different school districts in North Carolina that are getting a portion of that money. 3.2 million is coming to New Hanover County schools.
00:38:06
Nikki
they get they're thinking about things um like a threat detection if there's a weapon in the building if there's a door an outdoor door open um if there's an intruder if there's a person down um definitely having face recognition um where they might have problems with that is we do have our parent bill of rights here in north carolina so doing any kind of scans or facial recognition um I'm pretty sure that it spec it specifies somewhere in the Parent Bill of Rights so that parents have to be on board with it, that they have to sign off on it. So um definitely something for us to keep an eye on.
00:38:43
Reuel Sample
Dane, is that something that you're going to be worried about on County Commission? I mean, AI is here. AI is in everything. I'm actually AI. I'm not really here. So is that is that is that something that that you guys are going to be concerned about?
00:38:56
Dane Scalise
Well, i I have to confess that I don't know too much about this. The county's role in connection with the school board is primarily one where we provide funding to support school operations, salaries, as well as helping to build buildings. The setting of policy is one that belongs to the school board and I try really hard not to ah either tell the folks up in Raleigh what they're supposed to do or the school board what they're supposed to do. They've been elected by the people to make decisions that they believe are correct.
00:39:29
Dane Scalise
and so I'm going to have to defer to the school board on whether or not this is a good or a right thing. I also don't know enough about it to really weigh in, but I assure you that my goal is to continue to support the schools in the best way that I can moving forward from a monetary perspective. The County of New Hanover has been very diligent in trying to increase the school funding that we provide last year. In fact, during this budget cycle. It was the the most money that we've ever provided to the school system and you know ultimately I think that that's a good thing. We want to support our students and we want to support our teachers. We want to support our school board but that's the way that I can help. I can help with dollars. I can't help with policy.
00:40:13
Reuel Sample
Now a grant like that, would that come through you first then to be, and then washed down to them or would they get that money directly? That Nikki.
00:40:21
Dane Scalise
I would assume that they get it directly from the state. and Is this where it is coming from? It's coming from the state, Nikki? I don't know the answer.
00:40:26
Nikki
it's coming and It's coming from the state, but it's coming from um it'll come through the Department of Public Instruction.
00:40:32
Reuel Sample
Okay.
00:40:32
Dane Scalise
So you know the local schools rule, they get funding from the federal government.
00:40:33
Nikki
and correct
00:40:36
Dane Scalise
They get funding from the state government as well as the county commission. And so the only piece that I am in charge of is the funding that comes from the county commission.
00:40:44
Reuel Sample
Again, I'm really not here.
00:40:45
Dane Scalise
And and that's and I say I am in charge of with the other commissioners.
00:40:46
Reuel Sample
I'm okay.
00:40:48
Dane Scalise
I'm one of five.
00:40:49
Reuel Sample
Again, I'm, I'm, I'm artificial. My father would say, I'm not really intelligent. So, uh, then the, the second thing is the third last thing is, is that, uh, uh, Dane, have you taken the phase two Wilmington city test yet?
00:41:05
Reuel Sample
Have you checked that out?
00:41:07
Dane Scalise
No, what is that?
00:41:07
Reuel Sample
The Wilmington the city of Wilmington is actually going into phase two of a development system. And so they're asking folks to take take a take a series of questions to see what they would like to do, ah the whether it's more building more green space or building more public service or public service areas. So you can actually go to the city of Wilmington website to check that out.
00:41:33
Dane Scalise
but Yeah, I guess they're um they're doing it probably similarly to the county doing it. We're in the process of revising our comprehensive plan now also. I'm guessing that's what you're talking about. A couple of months ago, the county had a meeting between the county commission and our planning board. And we heard from a number of people about what we'd like to see, how we'd like to develop moving forward. And there were a lot of great ideas that were thrown around, at least at the county.
00:42:01
Dane Scalise
including things like preservation of green space, deliberate preservation of green space. One of the concepts that I like to talk a lot about and I'm very much in favor of is adaptive reuse, which is essentially taking existing buildings that can perhaps be rehabilitated or upfitted and already have an existing footprint.
00:42:18
Dane Scalise
and trying to put those into better use rather than creating new footprints. Of course, there will be new footprints. That's an inevitable part of life, but as I've already said numerous times, it's about trying to time it correctly with traffic considerations, with ah DOT developments that are underway, and we do have a lot of those that are underway, but it takes time.
00:42:41
Dane Scalise
And the county is trying to be more deliberate about how we approach these items. And I am confident that we have an excellent advocate in Councilman Luke Waddell, who is on the city council to make sure that the city is doing the right work there. ah Same as the school board, same as the state. I try not to weigh in too much on how they do their work. If if asked, I'll provide feedback, but i don't I don't know exactly what their plan is for their comprehensive plan update. I do know what the county is doing.
00:43:12
Reuel Sample
Have you taken the quiz yet there, Nikki?
00:43:15
Nikki
I have not. I actually don't live in the city limits, so I didn't pay attention to it much at all. I'm so glad that you that you mentioned it. um Now, I have a question about that. is Are they taking this survey for anyone? So someone like me that doesn't even live in the city, I can say what I want in the city.
00:43:38
Reuel Sample
It does. It actually asks you where you live. And so they've got live in the city, live in the city, but outside of the urban limits, because that's where I'm at, because I'm part of the city, New Hanover County, they even will take people from Pender counties.
00:43:55
Reuel Sample
or So um they're, at least they're asking questions on it. They're, they, they, they they want it.
00:44:02
Nikki
Yeah.
00:44:03
Reuel Sample
So yeah.
00:44:04
Nikki
That's really good. So, Dane, you have, well, not you personally, but the county commissioners have an agenda meeting on Thursday at
Local government planning and public engagement
00:44:13
Nikki
four o'clock. Is that correct?
00:44:15
Dane Scalise
yes Yes.
00:44:16
Nikki
Do you know what's going to be, what you guys are going to be discussing or just putting together your agenda for your next meeting?
00:44:25
Dane Scalise
Some committee and board appointments. We're going to be discussing for both the county commissioners as well as various appointments that we'll make to the boards and committees from citizens. ah There are a number of items that are on the agenda. I don't have it pulled up um at present.
00:44:44
Nikki
Oh, it's okay.
00:44:44
Dane Scalise
i
00:44:45
Nikki
you don't You don't have to pull it up. Just curiosity.
00:44:48
Dane Scalise
Yeah, no.
00:44:49
Nikki
Making sure you know. we we We want you to be able to get as much information out to the public as possible. One of the things um that I think a lot of the public doesn't understand is how many boards and commissions are ah under the county commissioners.
00:45:00
Dane Scalise
Cool.
00:45:04
Nikki
You have, what, 38
00:45:05
Dane Scalise
So I pulled it up while you were talking. We're going to get a presentation from the Cape Fear Public Utility Authority on their annual report. There's going to be a presentation on New Hanover County water quality quality monitoring program. There are going to be some financial updates that are provided as well as committee appointments and actually doesn't look like a a very large number of items that are coming up at this next meeting. Sometimes, you know, we'll have quite a few matters that are
00:45:36
Dane Scalise
public hearings that take a long time. If I were to guess, this will be one of our shorter meetings on Monday because we have the the gender review for Thursday for the meeting that we have on Monday.
00:45:46
Reuel Sample
Thank you.
00:45:48
Nikki
Sounds like you guys are getting ready for Christmas. Making.
00:45:52
Dane Scalise
Well, it's it's it's been a pretty busy season and we we also have a new commissioner and a lot for her to get caught up on. So I think it's probably going to be well taken by her that we don't have the craziest of schedule for our last meeting of the year.
00:46:01
Nikki
Yeah. That's awesome. So speaking of Christmas, is there anything big on your Christmas wish list, Mr.
Conclusion: reflections and trivia
00:46:16
Nikki
Scalise?
00:46:17
Dane Scalise
oh gosh uh... no peace on earth and i mean that literally uh... that that'd be great if we could be nicer to one another stop killing one another that would uh... that That'd be great. I'll take that on my Christmas wish list. But absent that, I'm just looking for ah an opportunity to spend time with my family. I have been very busy, as I know many others, you yourself included, Nikki, during the campaign season. And I have rather enjoyed the opportunity to get away a little bit from politics and spend time with my children and my wife. And I hope to do that on a more extended level with my my wider family over the Christmas holiday.
00:46:57
Reuel Sample
so
00:46:58
Nikki
That sounds amazing. And I, we do apologize for taking you away from your family, but we appreciate you being here.
00:47:05
Dane Scalise
No, I'm happy to be on your inaugural podcast.
00:47:06
Reuel Sample
Are in goal podcast say that five times?
00:47:06
Dane Scalise
What a great honor.
00:47:10
Nikki
i do have the di but It's like saying an illuminated.
00:47:12
Reuel Sample
Yeah.
00:47:13
Nikki
it ah So, um, so rule and I are going to come up with every podcast. We're going to have a trivia question and rule.
00:47:21
Dane Scalise
Okay.
00:47:21
Nikki
Did you decide how people are going to be able to respond to the trivia question and
00:47:26
Reuel Sample
So yes, so our podcast is going to be featured on the Wilmington conservative, which is a conservative publishing platform for folks here in Wilmington. If you are looking to write or report, please give us a call. So you can, uh, you can leave your comments there on the Wilmington podcast, a Wilmington conservative. That's the Wilmington conservative.com.
00:47:52
Reuel Sample
You can also leave it on our our our Facebook page. You can leave your comments on our YouTube channel. ah Like and subscribe, like and subscribe so that you can follow us.
00:48:03
Dane Scalise
That's the key, right? Like and subscribe.
00:48:04
Reuel Sample
that's it yes if we if because Because its subscription doesn't cost anything. ah However, you can always write us a check. But you can you can leave your comments there and and give the ah the answers there. And they're all time stamps. So the person who comes in first, we will we will we will mention their name on our next week's podcast. So Nikki, fire away.
00:48:27
Nikki
So we're gonna, our trivia question, but just so everyone knows, you're not gonna get bored to death with me and rule all the time. We're gonna have some guest podcasters coming in and taking over for us sometimes, which will be really fun.
00:48:41
Reuel Sample
Yes.
00:48:41
Nikki
Okay, so our trivia question for tonight is, what president started the official pardoning of the turkey?
00:48:52
Nikki
And no, I don't mean Joe Biden, okay? yeah the first official pardoning of the Thanksgiving turkey. And if you're feeling kind of froggy, you can tell me the unofficial pardoning of the turkey, because there was a president back in the day that did an unofficial pardoning of a turkey because it became friend a very good friend to a son. So you can tell us either one, both, we'll be fine with it.
00:49:22
Reuel Sample
Like and subscribe, folks. Like and subscribe. We are on all of, and so the question is, who is the first official turkey partner?
00:49:31
Nikki
Pardoner.
00:49:31
Reuel Sample
i i actually have I actually have no clue on this, even though you told me the answer. I'm just artificial, so I have no idea what's going on. So, ah hey, Dane, thanks for joining us tonight.
00:49:44
Dane Scalise
Thank you for having me on I enjoyed our conversation.
00:49:46
Reuel Sample
i
00:49:47
Dane Scalise
Now, I'll just, I like to sometimes end on um a conciliatory note. You know, we went through a really difficult and hard election season. And I know that there are a lot of people, myself included on behalf of Nikki and Nikki herself, that but you would rather see Nikki on the school board.
00:50:08
Dane Scalise
And it doesn't always work out like that, but it's a really wonderful thing that she submitted herself to the crucible, that she worked so hard on the campaign. And now that we've landed where we are, it's really incumbent upon us to, as best as we can, to work alongside one another and win people over to our way of thinking. It's not just about Republicans and Democrats. I do want to point out that we've got a lot of unaffiliated voters in New Hanover County. And unfortunately, a lot of those folks did not vote for Republicans.
00:50:37
Dane Scalise
in 2024. So we're going to have to do better as a party and as individuals in reaching out to people to making sure that the sensible policies that we advance are the ones that resonate. And that's what I'm going to be trying to do over the next four years of my commissioner work.
00:50:54
Reuel Sample
Nicki Bascom, I'm going to look forward to doing this with you. i you know Would you have rather have won the election or and and not do this? or or
00:51:09
Nikki
ah You know what, in in all honesty, um looking at looking at it now, um i'm facing um I'm facing my husband getting ready to go through back surgery. So knowing that he's going through that and I can be with him. um And also I'm subbing in the schools like crazy. I got to sub at Williston today. So I'm in the schools and I'm still making a difference. And I'm still doing what I can for our school district, which is,
00:51:39
Nikki
why I ran in the first place. And that's what I'm going to continue to do. And I'm just happy to be able to be able to do this podcast. And and thank you both for your support and and kind words.
00:51:49
Nikki
And I appreciate it.
00:51:50
Reuel Sample
all right all right well well folks there is there is no replacement for number one and i think uh that i think it has been a a a kicker of a podcast so thank you thank you all good night
00:51:51
Nikki
We're moving forward. We're moving on and up. Keep going.
00:52:03
Dane Scalise
I enjoyed it. Thank you, y'all. Good to be with you.
00:52:05
Nikki
Thank you.
00:52:06
Dane Scalise
Take care.
00:52:06
Nikki
i um go