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Other Therapists Aren't Your Competitors!
160 Plays1 year ago
From Intern to Entrepreneur is the podcast for counseling graduate students (and other grad students in mental health fields) to start planning their journey to private practice while they're still in graduate school! Host, Cori White, started planning her journey while she was still in her graduate program and it paid off BIG to start planning EARLY.
In this episode of From Intern to Entrepreneur, Cori interviews Amanda Hunter. Amanda talks about her journey to becoming a therapist, and her decision to open her own private practice and specialize in Perinatal Mental Health.
Amanda owns a practice in Pennsylvania called Everlasting Wellness, a practice that specializes in Perinatal Mental Health. Her practice has multiple locations and she has over 35 therapist working with her!
To learn more about Amanda, visit her website:
https://everlastingwellnesscounseling.com/
Recommended
Transcript
Corey's Career Journey
00:00:00
Speaker
This is from intern to entrepreneur, the podcast for counseling and therapy graduate students who want to start planning their journey to private practice while they're still in grad school. I'm your host Corey White. And within three years of graduating from my master's program, I had a six figure thriving private practice in large part because I started planning my path while I was still in grad school.
00:00:21
Speaker
This podcast is full of stories and information meant to give you ideas about how you can carve your own path to the therapy career that you
Planning Your Practice
00:00:29
Speaker
want. Please note that when you're listening to this podcast, licensure laws and requirements vary from state to state. So check with your state board about what you can and can't do on your journey. And without further ado, enjoy this episode of From Intern to Entrepreneur.
00:00:47
Speaker
This is the first episode of From Intern to Entrepreneur. And I am so excited to be doing this podcast. It is a freaking passion of mine to talk to graduate students in counseling and therapy related master's programs about how they can start planning their future, especially if they want a future in private practice while they are still in their master's programs.
00:01:12
Speaker
I am doing this podcast because it's what I did to start my journey to private practice, which eventually in a future episode, we'll talk a little bit more about my specific journey. But when I was going through my graduate program, I would listen to podcasts and I would read about how to start a private practice, even though I wasn't at that point yet.
00:01:36
Speaker
I felt like it really set the stage for me to be anticipating the next steps, to move me faster, to being able to live the life that I want to be living and the life that I'm living now and have all these other really cool opportunities like, okay, I'm a licensed professional counselor in the state of Pennsylvania and now I have a podcast. And so I think that thinking ahead has really afforded me the opportunity
00:02:01
Speaker
to create a really fun, cool career that I love and to do it in a pretty quick amount of time, if you ask me. So if you're interested in doing that, then this is probably going to be the podcast that you want to listen to.
Podcast Overview
00:02:16
Speaker
The first 10 episodes of this podcast are interviews. They are interviews with therapists who are at different stages of their private practice journey
00:02:27
Speaker
And it's meant to, not that you're going to copy anybody in what they're doing, but it's meant to give you an idea of like, oh, that's what that person is doing. I might want to do something similar or that idea makes me think about this other thing that could be a really cool way to get where I want to get or do the things that I want to do or learn the things that I want to learn. So all of these stories are not necessarily meant for you to replicate. They're meant to get you dreaming.
00:02:54
Speaker
They're meant to get you thinking about how you wanna put together a life that works for you. And I'm gonna tell you what, talking to these different therapists about their journeys, about how they've got where they've got, about the things that they're planning for in the future is super inspiring. And I just think we need to hear more therapist stories about how we're putting our careers together and what we're doing and things like that. So that's gonna be the first 10 episodes.
Corey and Amanda's Collaboration
00:03:23
Speaker
So today's episode is super special to me because I decided to do the first interview with Amanda Hunter, who is a clinician that is local to me in our Reading Pennsylvania area. And we started our private practices within months of each other. So we have been a part of each other's stories. We have watched each other grow. At times we have helped each other with different things. Like for example, she paid me to come in and do a couples training.
00:03:50
Speaker
for her therapists and I have sent referrals to her and I've sent supervisees to do group supervision at her practice. So we are super collaborative whenever it's possible and one of the things you're going to hear us talk about in the interview is that
00:04:05
Speaker
Given our situation, it would have been really easy for us to turn into competition. But because neither of us come from that mindset, we have been able to play a role in each other's careers and help each other grow, which is super important in business because business and being a business owner and being in private practice can be really lonely. So you want people in your corner who understand what you're going
Amanda's Professional Path
00:04:28
Speaker
through. Some of the things that we talk about in this episode are about the importance of getting consultation and paying for support.
00:04:35
Speaker
the branding mistakes that we've both made. She talks about perinatal mental health, which is a specialty of hers and of her practice. Her practice name, by the way, is Everlasting Wellness. You should check them out online. They have a great website. They have a lot of different programs, but they focus a lot on postpartum depression, anxiety, infertility, pregnancy loss, along with all kinds of other things that go along with women's health. And she has 35 therapists. That is so many therapists, and she's really created a culture
00:05:03
Speaker
in her practice where people want to work with her and they want to work together and they're really helping a lot of people in a lot of ways. So I hope that you love Amanda as much as I do. I hope that you can tell the vibe that we have and I hope that you want to create that kind of vibe with people that are going to be in your sphere and other private practice owners that might be starting a practice at the same time that you are because trust me, you need people in your corner. So grad students.
00:05:33
Speaker
Meet Amanda. Welcome to the podcast, Amanda. Thanks, Corey. I'm so excited to be here. Yeah, this is super exciting because you're actually a podcast guest that I know in real life, and we kind of started our private practices at the same time. Yeah, right around.
00:05:56
Speaker
Yeah, right. It's so crazy. It's so crazy because it feels like 10 seconds ago, but it also feels like a million years ago. Um, so I'm curious though, we've never really talked about your whole journey to becoming a therapist or to becoming a private practice owner. We've kind of just been like doing it in parallel and, and kind of crossing paths here and there along the way. So why don't you start by telling everybody a little bit about your therapist journey and also about your journey to private practice?
00:06:23
Speaker
Yeah, that's a really good question. So I feel like a lot of people always just ask like, what was your journey to private practice? How do you do this? And no one actually talks about like, where did your passion originally start? Like, where did this even like come from? So good question. So I actually went to Westchester University. And I went for physical therapy. And I was in one of my classes. And it was something about like,
00:06:48
Speaker
It was a vignette about somebody who had gotten a car accident, broke both of their legs, probably no longer going to be able to play sports, et cetera. So they were like, what's the first thing we should do? And I like raised my hand and I was like, I maybe like check to see how mentally they're doing. That's a lot. Like this all-star basketball player is no longer able to play. My professor was like, talk to me after class. So I was like, okay.
00:07:11
Speaker
So then he was like, I really think you should look to the psychology route of things instead of like the physical health. And I was like, Oh, I didn't really thought about that. I don't know. We'll see. So I talked to the psychology department and they were really focused on like the brain and like those type of things. And I was like, yeah, that's a nervous thing. And what about like the environment? Like, what about like all their trauma and how that affects the brain and like, what if they're still in a traumatic environment?
00:07:37
Speaker
And then they were like, you should go talk to social work. So then I went over to the social work department and I just felt at home, like as soon as I walked in, it was like a nice cozy building. It wasn't in like the regular buildings. It was like a little Cape Cod and like it looked like a home. So I was like, this is awesome. This is where I want to be. So that's actually how my social work journey kind of started. And then I realized that it was just there was a lot of like generalist practice where it was a lot of like advocating and even though it's so important, that's not me.
00:08:07
Speaker
I didn't want to go on the state capitol and do all that. That wasn't my thing. I know in the community, people were like, oh, social worker, you're going to steal babies. I was like, oh my gosh, no, that's not what I wanted to do. I was not happy to steal it. No, seriously. So I was like, all right, well, I want to go to therapy route. So when we started doing internships, I only did therapy. So at first, I was a juvenile probation officer, school social worker.
00:08:37
Speaker
I think I was school social worker twice actually. And then when I went to grad school for clinical social work, I was very focused on like, I want to find something that's clinical and not generalist. So I had this professor and he was like, Amanda, I think you did really good down at Berry University. And I was like, what's Berry University? And he was like, it's down in Florida. I used to teach there. And I was like, Oh my God, well, it's super competitive because it's only eight months. So they put two years, eight months.
00:09:05
Speaker
And I was like, I don't know if I have the grades for that. I don't know if I can do that. He's like, Amanda, I do a 4.0. Like you said, I'm going to have the grades for this. Like this is what you want to do. If you're willing to move, I'm sure they'll accept you. So I was like, okay. So then I applied and I got in right away and I was really excited. And I was like, all right, let's do this. So my husband, the boyfriend at the time, was like, all right, let's move. We're moving to Florida. Let's go.
00:09:29
Speaker
So we did it and it was also super trauma informed, which back then, which I'm sure you remember, you had to like find those like, you know, grad schools who were trauma informed, like everybody was just like clinical or whatever, or you had to take like an extra concentration. So like, so this was all clinical. I loved it. I actually worked in a foster care.
00:09:51
Speaker
agency down there but it's called SOS Children's Villages. So it's really cool because like you would like thrive into the neighborhood and then they had like a whole part of like a neighborhood in a cul-de-sac and all of the children lived there and they had house parents and then we worked in the middle of their development. So we got to see the kids like in their house with like their house parents. The house parents were there every day. They lived there with them but it was just such a really cool experience. That's awesome.
00:10:21
Speaker
I loved it. And then I tried to find a job down there. I'm not bilingual. So that was kind of like, I need to move back home. So I moved back home. And I started doing school based outpatient work, thought that was my dream job, thought that's where I wanted to be forever. And how was this?
00:10:41
Speaker
How long was this? Yeah, how long ago was it that you transitioned from Florida to back here in Pennsylvania to do your dream job at the time? Yeah, so I graduated undergrad 2013, graduated grad school 2014, got married in 2014, and then moved back up the end of 2014.
00:11:03
Speaker
So it was all like back to back. So we're talking about less than a decade ago. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. So you're in your at the time your current dream job. Yeah, yeah. So I thought it was gonna and it was it was phenomenal. And I absolutely loved every second of it. I love the hours. I loved all of that fun stuff. I actually worked in an inner city around here. So I really got to
00:11:30
Speaker
see how other people lived. I loved going into the houses, even though I wasn't supposed to. Like I did to go pick up the kids and like, it was just fun. It was a lot of fun. And then I was like, dang, I think I might need benefits. So I was like, I might want children eventually. So then I started looking at other positions, still went into schools. And then unfortunately, my mom had a heart attack. So then I decided to go part time so I could help take care of her.
00:11:56
Speaker
and be there for her immensely. I just like wasn't there to be there for other people at that time. So I ended up working for a healthcare agency and was with Jerry Atricks, never in a million years that I think that's where I wanted to be. I loved every second of it. I was a true social worker. I teach management, help people fill out forms, but stories. And that's what I loved. I loved hearing their stories or like, remember this like 90 some year old man I was talking to and
00:12:26
Speaker
He was like, I never told anybody any of this before. And I was like, this is the one. I want this one to one. I miss this. I thought I only wanted to work with kids. And I was like, you know what? I actually like working with adults. And this is something I kind of want to get into. And got pregnant, had really bad postpartum issues. And I decided that I didn't want to work. Ran out of money so that I had to go back to work and realize that, wow, corporate America does not support moms.
00:12:54
Speaker
at all. Like, there is no answer about around that. So, and I understand now being a business owner, there has to be policies, there has to be rules, I understand that I get that. But there really is no leniency. So I decided to bust my butt start the practice, which I know we can like, focus more into that. But like, yeah, that's kind of how I found this was my own personal experience of like, I love the one on one. I love meeting with people. I love working with families.
00:13:21
Speaker
I don't want to just hone in onto one population. At that point, I wanted to hone in to like everything. And then I did have some postpartum issues. I had a birth trauma and nobody was there to support me. A lot of therapists in the area didn't specialize in that or if they said they did, they didn't after talking to them. So then I kind of had to find my own journey to the perinatal mental health, which means like pregnant postpartum.
00:13:47
Speaker
And then that kind of grew to reproductive therapy, which is like anyone who's struggling with infertility or other people taking a pregnant, going through fertility options, surrogacy, anything. Like I ended up loving that piece of it. And then I started the group practice.
00:14:03
Speaker
So yeah, all this kind of happened within like three years. Yeah, it was a quick journey for you. I'm really curious though, like what kind of gave you the guts to like start a private practice? Because the way that you told the story is like, you know, I did this and then I did this and then I did this. Like I imagine you didn't wake up one day and go, you know, I got a baby now and I don't really want to go back to corporate America. So I'll just start a practice like I feel like there was a little more in there.
00:14:26
Speaker
Oh, absolutely. I mean, it's, it's gut wrenching, which I'm sure you felt that too. Like you're not sure, like, are you any full or are people going to like you or are they going to want to like comes to you? Um, I, at that point I had a family. So it's like, Oh my gosh, I need to make sure that I'm bringing in a lot of income. And it was a leap of faith. Essentially. I'm like a fly Corey, you and Carrie also kind of gave me like a nice push because like you kind of guys were already starting your practice.
00:14:51
Speaker
And I was in that phase of like, do I want to work for somebody in private practice or do I want to start my own? I actually also interviewed with another private practice owner and I was like, you know what? Like, why am I going to drive an hour? This is pre-COVID, right? So everyone had to be in person. So I'm like, why am I going to drive an hour and a half away? Because she was all the way down like Lancaster.
00:15:12
Speaker
if I could just start it here. So then my brain started going a little bit. And then I talked to my husband who's always been supportive of like everything I want to do. He's like, I know if you want to do it, you're going to do great. So just do it if you want to. But I'm more practical where I'm like, okay, I still need X amount of money. I need to have this much of savings. Like what can I do? So even though my dream was to not work as much, I ended up working more. So then I had to work
00:15:37
Speaker
at the hospital from like, you know, 730 to four every day. And then I did the private practice on the side. I had an awesome supervisor for my LCSW who was like, you can use my space on the weekends. It's just sitting here. You don't have to pay me. And I was like, oh my gosh, thank you so much. So he kind of helped start that. And then I got more clients. I started a free support group and then those people wanted to come. And then it kind of just grew from there. And then I went from full time to part time.
00:16:08
Speaker
COVID hit. So then I started as pregnant again. And then I was months pregnant and they still made us go into people's rooms at the time. And I was like, uh, no, that's doing this. So, uh, I said to my husband, I got to quit. I have to quit this job and I just have to focus on the business. And I actually remember sitting or standing at my, like in my living room, we have an open concept house. So I was like standing at my living room and looking at him in the dining room. He was working.
00:16:36
Speaker
for the same company, the hospital, that I was working at, too. And I was like, I have to be noticed. Like, I have to. It's like, then do it. And I was just, like, hysterically crying.
Overcoming Challenges in Practice
00:16:44
Speaker
And I was like, we're going to lose all this money. We have a two-year-old. I'm seven months pregnant. Like, what are we going to do? And he's like, you're going to make it work. That's what we're going to do. And I signed up for everything under the sun. Like, all the EAPs, Teladoc, all of those. Like, just to try to get referrals to keep coming in. And I didn't need to.
00:17:06
Speaker
because my niche was so specialized that I got so many people. So then I started getting on insurances, which really like amped that up. Like I was like too many at that time. And then I'm like, you know, nine months pregnant. So now I'm like, okay, wait, I need to slow this down for a second. And then my husband got laid off at his job when Weston, my youngest was two weeks old.
00:17:29
Speaker
So I had to amp up the practice again. And at that point, we had like no money coming in. So I was like, I need to do this. So two weeks postpartum. And I was like, I got this. Let's do this. And a maternity leave, right? No. Who needs that? I don't, right? But actually, one of my best friends who still works here with us, she was like, her mom was sick. And she was working for Corporate America, essentially.
00:17:59
Speaker
were like, I'm sorry, but like, you can't keep taking off to take her to her chance. And she's the only child and she has her own child. And there was just so much that I was like, this is not fair to her. Can I come work for you as a 1099? And I was like, oh no, you're like my best friend. And I also like don't want to know if I want to mix this, but hell, let's just try it. And I was like, okay, this is nice. It was all virtual. We weren't paying for any overhead at that point, really, other than like, that's why I'm an aggressive, whatever.
00:18:25
Speaker
And then I was like, all right, let's hire another person. And then Allie came on board, which she lives in North Carolina. So yeah, it was really random. But she was licensed in Pennsylvania. And she was like, can I come on? I was like, sure, let's see what happens. They're 1099s, not that much of a risk. And then one of my husband's friends came on. She was actually asked me how to start a private practice. And at that point, I was like, don't do it. Just work for me. I already did all the legwork. Like, you know, just do it. And then
00:18:52
Speaker
then I started doing consulting. And that really just like helps. So I started attending consulting, like consulting things. And Amanda, you mean you started like for yourself to like grow your business and learn things? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 100% recommend that to everybody. Like, please don't try to reinvent the wheel. Somebody already did it. And somebody already messed up 100 times. So even if you're paying $100 a month to $2,000 a month, like,
00:19:22
Speaker
wherever you're at in your practice, that's where you need to like really focus because it's worth it. Like right now I'm actually in like a leadership lab and I'm paying $2,000 a month, but I'll tell you like it's helping grow this business. Like that's like I need it. Like she already reinvented or she already invested the wheel. So why would I, but you do need to pay for people's support. Like you do need that. I read this quote. I wish I could remember where it was, but, but this person, whoever they said it, they were like,
00:19:52
Speaker
When you pay for coaching or consulting, you're paying for a shortcut to your success. And I was like, yes, 100% when I heard that, that's exactly what you're doing. Like you could do it and you could take the time, you could take the years, but you're right. If somebody's already done it, pay them to tell you how they did it rather than wasting your time and energy, especially if it's around something that it's like not your forte or you're not like great at anyway. Yeah, so I love that.
00:20:21
Speaker
Hey, grad students. Real quick, before we get back to this interview, if you are loving the idea of being a part of a community of like-minded graduate students who want to own their own private practice one day, then you need to head to Facebook and join my Facebook group from intern to entrepreneur. There's already a community set up of graduate students who one day want to own their own private practices and be entrepreneurs just like you.
00:20:48
Speaker
So head over to Facebook, join that group and stay in the loop and get connected with people who are doing things that you want to do. Back to the interview.
00:21:01
Speaker
I want to, there's so many things that you've already said that I want to kind of go back to for a second. And I think that these are really important things. The first thing that stood out to me that you said was that you, as you transitioned to private practice, you had your hospital job and you were starting a private practice on the side. And I think that's really important for grad students to hear because
00:21:23
Speaker
So often I hear these stories about people who just have this idea of, okay, I'm just going to quit my job and I'm going to start a private practice and I'm going to get 25 clients in the first month and then I'm going to be set. And then one of two things happen. They get close to that and they never actually jump off the ledge to do it because it's too scary because it is too risky or they do it and then they get no clients in the first month and then they get into scarcity mindset and they don't understand what's happening. Right? So I always advocate for people to,
00:21:51
Speaker
do a transition or to do a slow start up so that you build momentum that gives you the guts to go to the next stage so i love that what you're saying is yeah like i kept my job and so i did have to bust my ass more at the beginning.
00:22:07
Speaker
to get to being able to live the life that I actually want to live. So yeah, there's definitely, I don't know, I don't know, I'm not a graph person, but I feel like there's a graph to that. And then it comes back down or like levels out. So I don't know. I mean, I don't know what you think about that, but that's just, I think so important. Oh, absolutely. I think it's really important to be insightful on yourself. Like before you decide to take that leap, or even in the contemplation phase, right? Of like, do I want to do this? Do I not want to do this?
00:22:36
Speaker
almost asking yourself, are you a high performer? Because if you're not a high performer, you are how you may succeed. I'm not going to like down anyone who's not but like
00:22:45
Speaker
If you're going to need a lot of help in the meantime of that, because you do need to reach out. Like if you don't know how to start a business, there's a lot to those and just to like find a name, branding, like figuring all of that out. Like there's so like, I was listening to a podcast this morning actually on my way in and I was, they were talking about branding and I was like, wow, I wish I would have listened to this before I even started the practice because I didn't have like a five year plan. I never thought that I was going to be through practice ever. And now we have 35 therapists.
00:23:14
Speaker
I never would have thought that so I have like these random colors. And I don't want to read for it because it's gonna cost so much money. I also have it like everlasting wellness because originally I wanted a wellness center. So that's why I chose the name but now we're specifically counseling. Yeah, so it's like, oh, dang, like maybe I shouldn't and then like everyone knows us for perinatal population. But we also have a lot of trauma therapists. And so now I'm trying to like
00:23:44
Speaker
even with our shirts now, it doesn't say like maternal and women's counseling, it'll say like trauma and women's counseling. So like learning how I switch that, but yet we still are known for that. And I still want to be known for that. Don't get me wrong, but I also want people to know that we do have other people who see children or LGBT community. We are like, there's so many other therapists here. So I wish I would have like learned all of that before
00:24:08
Speaker
beforehand. I'm okay with learning it now. But yeah, if you're like not a high performer or self starter, this isn't going to be the thing for you. Yeah. Well, and to your point about kind of like wishing you learn things, you know, then I think that that's part of why this podcast I feel like is really important because like,
00:24:26
Speaker
if you're interested in private practice, you will save yourself so much time and energy by learning about the stuff now from the people who like you said earlier, already made the mistakes.
Business Strategies
00:24:36
Speaker
It's interesting, you guys are everlasting wellness, our initial practice name was our whole living project. And both I look at both of our names now and I go, how
00:24:46
Speaker
ridiculous is it that we were starting a business for counseling and neither of us were like, let's put counseling in the name. And now with everything I know, and I'm like, Yeah, no, when people search for counseling, they're searching for product or wellness, they're searching for counseling. So why wouldn't you just put it in your name, right? So it's this all this stuff that like, if I had just heard that one time, before we decided this, like, you know, cutesy name that sounded fun,
00:25:14
Speaker
I would have never done that. So yeah, it's just interesting thinking about the things that, yeah, if I had known that, that would have saved a lot of time and money. We did end up changing our name to our whole living counseling. But that was a chunk of change to get that changed. And that was also messed with our SEO on our website. And we did it years ago now at this point, but it was a transition that you can do it. It's not impossible. If you wanted to do it, you could do it tomorrow. And man, it would have been way easier if you started different.
00:25:43
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And I think like, you know, again, I was like trying to learn things myself and, you know, trying to be a self starter all by myself and no support in the beginning. And like, I remember listening to some things where like they said, don't put your name unless you only want to do it by yourself. And I was like, no, eventually, I'd like to have a wellness center. So you know, that's, that's what I'm going to do.
00:26:05
Speaker
But even like you said, like, but it didn't turn into that. So maybe start where you're at now. And then if you end up adding, then add to like, I knew not to do Amanda Hunter. Like I knew not to do that. Um, but I do see that now with some practice owners. Um, so one thing I definitely want to say is yes, you can pay for consulting. Please do listen to pass whenever you can, but also connect with people. Like Corey, I love talking to you and like other people in
00:26:32
Speaker
Yeah, like in our county, like, Hey, what worked for you? What didn't work for you? What's working now? What's not working now? Or even just like a venting session. You know, like sometimes you just need that. And I think it's really important to find people again, who are going to support you and not think of you as a competitor. Because I know like when I talk to some people, they're like, Oh, well, I know we're competitors. As soon as they say that I immediately check out. I was like, No, because we're not like there's too many people in the world that need help. And
00:27:01
Speaker
us too should not be competing with something like that. So I think it's important too to reach out to people who've been in practice for you to have some ideas. Well, and I just want to add on to what you're saying with that because I think that's really important. For grad students to hear, you need to create a community and then come up in your community and then support each other
00:27:22
Speaker
And there is no shortage of people that need help in, I don't care where you live. Like there is no shortage in your state of people that need help. And to your point of when people say to you like, Oh, I know we're competitors. No, no, no. What they're saying when they say that is that like, if someone says that to me, I'm going, Oh, you view me as a competitor, which means you have an ulterior motive in any communication that you have with me. And that's not to say I'm not going to support that person, but it certainly lets me know where they stand and how they view community connection.
00:27:52
Speaker
And yeah, it's interesting because I think it could have been really easy for you and I to kind of been pitted against each other. Not that we do the same things, but we were coming up at the same time and our Democrats aren't super different in some ways.
00:28:11
Speaker
And at one point our offices were literally directly next to each other. So I think it would have been really easy for us to like become enemies, right? But like, I don't know, I never viewed you like that. And I try not to view anybody in the community like that, because there are plenty of people that need help.
00:28:29
Speaker
What I need around me as an entrepreneur is other people who are doing what I'm doing in my area so that I know things to look out for. So I appreciate that you've kind of been definitely open to all of that too. Well, yeah, I mean, it's so important. You need the support, and especially you and I are younger females who started practice at a younger age and trying to move forward.
00:28:54
Speaker
Even that, I think in itself, like you definitely, you need that. And I was going to say to him like, yeah, we were like next door neighbors, but also that support there. Like I miss you and was like, Hey, how do you feel about, you know, being here? Is it a good location? Is it not like you could have totally been like, it's horrible. Don't do it. Like I don't get any referrals. Like you could have totally blocked me and you didn't, you were like, Hey, if you want to come over, let's go look at it. If you want to chat, like it was very warm and welcoming.
00:29:22
Speaker
instead of that shut off, where I think in grad school, at least in my grad school, I did feel like we were all competitors, where it was like, if you guys start your own private practices, you need to immediately, you know, make sure that other people in the area aren't doing what you're doing. And you can't do this, we can't do that. Make sure this person isn't doing the same thing. It's like, I understand that from a business strategy piece of it. And again, like, I knew like, Cory's these couples, I didn't see couples.
00:29:48
Speaker
So at that time, so I was like, Okay, I can work with some perinatal stuff, she can work with the families, you know, or levels or whatnot. And like, so even being able to have that good working relationship, and I think as a business owner, or as a therapist in general, you want to refer to people that you know, because you lose a credibility if you refer to somebody who isn't good.
00:30:12
Speaker
that is so important. Like, yeah, I when I give people when people connect with me or call me or need services for me, and for whatever reason, I can't provide those services. I want to send them to someone that I know and that I like and that I trust. Like I'm not trying to send them to some rando who I've never heard of or who I can't at least internet stock to find a little bit about my preferences. Yeah, like I want to send them. So yeah, so we often send because we I'm a private pay practice, we often send insurance referrals to you guys.
00:30:42
Speaker
when people are not able or can't for whatever reason pay privately. So yeah, that's a good relationship to have too because not everybody is going to pay privately. So we're like, you know, send them over. You're on our list of places that people get sent for referral email.
00:31:04
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And we're not far away from each other. We were next door and now we're not too far. So again, it's like just because you're not too far from each other doesn't mean you're competitors. That doesn't mean anything. Something I actually love about the perinatal world is every single perinatal therapist I've met, no matter if they're like right down the street or in a different state, never has it felt competitive ever.
00:31:27
Speaker
I really think most of us just know that like, there's way too many in this world are people that are unable to get pregnant or have loss or whatever the case might be, that it just can't be like you cannot, you cannot be in that type of world and think of each other as competitive. And I love talking to people about like building the practice and doing all that because they're like, yeah, I have the same thing happen to me or like, that's where that's why I'm starting it too. And that's where my passion comes from, etc, whatever, like
00:31:54
Speaker
a lot of the perinatal world didn't start just because they wanted to be a practice owner or whatever the case may be. So when I started looking into that world and all these super nice people were like, I'll help you with this and help you with that and let me know I'll refer to you, et cetera. And then I started opening the practice and then we got an office location and I started reaching out to people and some people were like, Oh no, I don't have time to talk to you or,
00:32:20
Speaker
a competitor or we accept the same insurance in this view. So I don't know how this would be a working relationship. I was like, Oh my gosh, like, this is not the perinatal world anymore. And then that I was talking to. Right.
00:32:35
Speaker
So let me ask another question for people who are listening that might be interested in doing work with the perinatal population. How could they, you know, cause a lot of programs are more general. Um, how could people interested in doing perinatal work get introduced to the mental health side of that?
Resources and Passion in Mental Health
00:32:54
Speaker
Yeah. Postpartum support international that it, I did all of my Googling and trying to figure out how I could be certified if there even was a certification back then.
00:33:04
Speaker
I found postpartum support international did my own research on like a how to help myself because I was struggling But then also be like they they were just coming out with that certification So I was like the second cohort to get the certification But they do a lot of trainings They do them virtually now, but it's about three days that you have to do it and then you have to sit for a test It's a little sleep, but you do have to sit for the test and then you can get certified Karen Klein and like we're in Pennsylvania Karen Kleinman is like
00:33:34
Speaker
an hour and a half away from us. And she does the art of holding and is hands down phenomenal. She is like the like goddess or guru goddess, whatever you want to call it. But she, she writes all the books, I read a majority of their books too. And now her prodigy is like up and coming Hillary and she's also doing more and more training. So
00:33:58
Speaker
Karen Kleinman, Postpartum Support International. I mean, there's a lot of people now who are also doing things like being a bird is a lot with like perinatal loss. So it just kind of depends because just like with everything, like substance abuse, there's like different subcategories. Just with mental health, there's like certain like severe and you know, whatever, like whatever you're looking at. So perinatal is very similar, where it's like, yeah, this is like the umbrella, but there's loss, there's infertility, there's like a whole bunch of other things you can get trained in. Yeah, that's awesome.
00:34:27
Speaker
Um, I have, I want to go to our, our kind of last two questions here. I feel like I'm going to definitely need to have you come back on to talk about having a group practice and what that looks like. So we're going to have to reschedule something. Um, but these are two questions that I really want our grad students who are listening to here. Um, and one of them is, excuse me.
00:34:51
Speaker
If you could give grad students one piece of practical advice to help them on their entrepreneurial journey, what would that be? Insight, insight, insight. So really making sure that when you decide that this is something that you want to do, that it's a decision for you and not other people influencing the decision. When I originally said that I wanted to do private practice, someone told me you should be in private practice for 10, or I'm sorry, in this field for 10 years.
00:35:20
Speaker
before you opened up a private practice. That was not the case. I didn't do that. So if you want to do something, you are able to do it. Definitely do your research. Do not just jump in to the bowl without knowing how to swim. Yeah, research, research, research. I think that's so important. OK, so then the other question would be then what would be the mindset advice that you would give someone to best help them on their entrepreneurial journey?
00:35:50
Speaker
you have to believe in yourself. You have to know that you are amazing and that you are phenomenal. And the reason why you're doing this is because there's a passion behind it. Do not ever let the passion die. If the passion dies, everyone is going to feel it and you are no longer going to be able to succeed. But if that passion keeps alive, even if you feel like it's dimming, find something. Like I know for myself, when I feel like the passion is dying a little bit, when I'm feeling a little burned out or stressed out, I'll start seeing clients again.
00:36:20
Speaker
And then I'll add a couple more clients. And then I'm like, yes, this is why, this is why I'm doing it. And then I feel energized again, like, make sure your, your cup is full, whatever that means, take breaks, breaks, go somewhere. I went on a cruise with my kids. We went to the Disney cruise and it was a whole week of no phone, no nothing. And I came back and I think my clinical director wanted to kill me, but I was like, I want to do this, this, this, this is a mess. So like, if you know, you're a very, take the time to be a visionary.
00:36:50
Speaker
So then your mindset can be positive because you want to keep it positive with your business, especially if this is your long-term goal and you're not planning on selling it and going back and support for yourself.
00:37:01
Speaker
Yeah. That's really interesting that you said that because I noticed that every time I go on vacation, I'm like, I'm not going to think about work. I'm not going to do anything with work. And those are the times that I think about work the most and not necessarily about my clients. I'm thinking about, Oh, I want to like host this retreat or like that's like where all of my good, um, thoughts and ideas come from for the practice. And then also for any other project that I'm kind of working on. So you're not in the day of the day. Yeah.
00:37:32
Speaker
Yeah, I think that both of those are such important pieces of advice. I'm going to ask one follow-up question to that because I'm imagining people being in grad school, hearing what you just said, and
00:37:49
Speaker
feeling like they don't deserve it yet or they aren't good enough yet or imposter syndrome or having these thoughts in their head like, oh, I have to grind for 10 years before I can have a dollar to my name. How would you say they should bridge the gap between being where they are right now and actually believing that one day they could do what you're talking about?
00:38:19
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Again, I'm just gonna go back to passion. Like I really think it's your passion because if you have a passion, so if you're sitting with a client and you're having imposter syndrome, they're talking about something that you have no idea what they're talking about. And you're like, I don't want to ask them because they're going through this trauma. I don't want them to educate me on something that if you have the passion for your client and like what they're talking about, I guarantee you, you're going to get off that call and you're going to start doing trainings and be like, I want to make sure that I'm the guru in this. This is something I love and this is what I want to do.
00:38:48
Speaker
You don't have to be good at everything. So like I said, I was a juvenile probation officer as an internship. Not me. That is not my thing. So I knew I wasn't going to be successful in criminal justice. That wasn't going to be my thing.
00:39:07
Speaker
Exactly. That wasn't where and your passion can change too. So let me like also say that too. Because like I originally was like, I want to work with kids only kids foster care and trauma sexually abused like that. I loved it. I love that kind of stuff. And then when I had my own child and went through a birth trauma and then had postpartum anxiety so bad which developed into OCD and I was like, dang, like I want to work with moms like this is what I want to do now. So it's okay for it to change.
00:39:34
Speaker
too. But once you find that fire, it's gonna be really hard to let it out or let somebody else try to like put it out for you. So you just got to keep that passion alive. Once that dies, it's hard to get it back. Yes, I love that. And I also love that you're saying that your past and can change. So
00:39:52
Speaker
something that I've noticed as I've worked with like interns and getting them to help decide who they want to work with and in what ways, they always get stuck on like, but I just don't know yet. And I'm always like, okay, but now just pick for now, right? At any point you can pivot or you can change or you can learn something new or switch directions or get a second passion. But yeah, like your passion right now is good enough to get you to the next phase of whatever that is. So thank you so much for saying that.
00:40:20
Speaker
Well, Cora, I think that's so important and exactly what you just said. Like I definitely want to emphasize it. So like we have this SEND program, so we've been interns too. And I remember the one time this one intern said, yeah, I want my passion is to work with teenagers and I want to start, but I want to start a mom and, a mom and me group. So I'm going to just do it with kids.
00:40:39
Speaker
And I was like, so why don't you just do a mom and me group with adolescents? And she was like, I can do that. And I was like, why can't you? Like, if that's your thing, people are going to want to come to you and be like, wow, that person was great at running this group because you have the passion behind it. You put the effort into it. It wasn't something like, Oh my gosh, when you're in grad school and they're like, you have to write on this topic. And you're like, Oh my God, like I don't want to do this. And you do it last minute and it's not the greatest, but maybe you still do okay with it. Cause we graduated hopefully.
00:41:06
Speaker
But no, like, especially private practice, like you get to decide that like my passion is this. And I also like this. Let's combine the two. Like you're allowed to do that.
Integrating Passions and Consulting
00:41:16
Speaker
And you might do it and be like, wow, like I loved that for a hot second, but I don't love it right now. And then switch it and then you have a new passion. Maybe something happened in your life where you overcome work on your own stuff. That's really important. Don't be like, Oh yeah, I went through this. And that means I can help you through it. That doesn't mean that. Please reframe that. That's not true.
00:41:35
Speaker
work on your own stuff first. And then if you still have the passion for it, then you can bring it in. Right. It is important to like have that passion there. Yeah, I love that. And you only need to find a handful of people that are in alignment with your passion to be able to make it successful in private practice. So if you can like shine your light,
00:41:57
Speaker
like people will see it. So yeah, this is awesome. So if people wanted to work with you or get in touch with you or how could they do that and what might people come to you for?
00:42:11
Speaker
Yeah, so you can always, anyone can email me. It's amanda at everlastingcounseling.com. And we do a Facebook group, or we have a Facebook page, sorry, and it's facebook.com slash everlasting wellness LLC. We do also have an Instagram. I'm honestly personally not on Instagram often, so I don't actually even know what it is. I think it's everlasting wellness LLC. LinkedIn, we're on LinkedIn a lot.
00:42:37
Speaker
But anyone can email me. I really don't mind it. I get emails for just like, hey, can you connect for five minutes just to talk about this one thing? What about my webpage? Can you look at it quick? And I also help with business consulting. I love it. I love talking to people about starting a business, what the pros and cons are, how to do it. I'm already doing it. There are a lot of people in our area that are going to forth with accepting insurances and which ones to accept, which ones not.
00:43:07
Speaker
We're on the majority. So please give me a call. Like if you're in Pennsylvania, like I would be happy to, or email me or whatever. Um, I'd be happy to help you with that because I've been through the wringer with insurances and which ones not to accept, which ones to accept, which ones will pay you, which ones won't pay you what their rates are and which ones give you a hard time. No, I don't know if everyone knows this, but insurances take four to six weeks, sometimes even more to pay you.
00:43:33
Speaker
So there's a lot of that I love talking about. So anything business consulting, I do still see clients here and there, but mostly business consulting and just doing the day-to-day grind of owning a medium-sized practice. So let me ask you one more question for anybody listening that might be in a grad program who is looking for an internship because I know that you have your Ascend program.
00:43:56
Speaker
Is that, are you accepting new interns? I have a couple questions that maybe could be helpful for people. The first one is, are you accepting new interns? The second is, so we're in Pennsylvania, so you'd have to be in Pennsylvania, but do you do virtual interns or do they have to be based in Berks County or whatever county, your other location? Montgomery. Montgomery County, yeah. Yeah, and if somebody wanted to apply for your internship program, when is the best time to do that and how would that work?
00:44:26
Speaker
Yeah, so to kind of go backwards, as soon as you know that you need an internship, reach out to us, because we get full very quickly. We do see a lot of like, Albernia, Kutztown, like in our area here, but we're also getting a lot of like, or a lot of interest now, Westchester University, Immaculata, those type of virtual, I feel like would be kind of hard just because a lot of schools now no longer want 100% goals. So when COVID was around, like, it's not here anymore, but like when COVID was like,
00:44:56
Speaker
They didn't care. They just wanted their students to have placement. Now they're like, well, they should at least be seeing some clients in person or whatnot. Most of ours are hybrid, so they can work on home a little bit and then they can also come into the office. We actually are growing the SEND, so we just hired another person to come over to a SEND. So right now we have a director, we have an LPC and an LCSU, and now we're bringing on another LCSW.
00:45:21
Speaker
So ASCEND not only does the internship program, but also the clinical supervision. So as you graduate from your program and say you're an LSW, you take your test, you can automatically start your hours or even going the LPC route, you can start your hours with us too. Or hope is actually that you start in ASCEND and you stay with us. So again, that negative,
00:45:50
Speaker
statement that I heard that you should be in, you know, the grind for 10 years. We don't believe here. So we actually do hire the majority of our interns. So we just had a couple people graduate and three people stayed with us. So it's, yeah, it's pretty nice. But yeah, you actually Brianne is our director. So you would want to email her. So it's Brianne at everlasting wellness counseling.com.
00:46:13
Speaker
And I'll hold this link so that people have all of the information that they need to be able to get in contact with you for the many things that you do. I will definitely be having you back on. I like have 10 topics that I feel like we need. We should probably talk to the program more about insurances because I remember I didn't know anything about insurance in grad school. Actually, I still don't. I have things that you said. I'm like, OK, there's a wealth of knowledge here that grad students definitely need to hear. So you will be coming back and I will change.
00:46:43
Speaker
Yeah. Thank you so much for being on the podcast, Amanda. I really appreciate it. Thank you for having me. I love this. I hope that you love this episode of From Intern to Entrepreneur. And if you want to learn more about what we talked about, check out the show notes.
00:47:00
Speaker
If you love this podcast and you want to support me in continuing to create content for entrepreneurs, then please share this with a friend, a grad student who you think might want their own private practice one day, and also like, subscribe, and review this podcast wherever you're listening to it. I'll catch you next time on From Intern to Entrepreneur.