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00:00:01
Episode 4 - Buy Borrow Die with High Rates
11 Plays10 days ago
It has been a moment since Austin and Derek have had a moment to had a moment to chat. A couple of life events have happened to both of them that have caused them to make some money moves with regards to credit. That sparks a conversation that has been in the Bitcoin X community alot. That being should you take a fiat loan against your Bitcoin?
Listen in!
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Transcript
00:00:00
Austin
real quick and then I'll be ready.
Training and Contractual Obligations
00:00:06
Austin
Are they still upgrading for you guys or not as much?
00:00:11
Austin and Derek
Well, they are definitely still upgrading, um um they sent out an email while we were in training that said that they are giving out class dates for first officers 18 months out.
00:00:24
Austin
Yeah, I've heard of that in the Facebook forums.
00:00:28
Austin and Derek
Yeah, mean, they're still upgrading because we're on contract to upgrade. So they're kind of just in control of the flow of captains now.
00:00:38
Austin and Derek
Yeah, mean,
00:00:38
Austin
Okay, yeah, because they contractedly agreed that they can't make you wait to upgrade, pretty much.
00:00:46
Austin and Derek
they can. Uh, it's just, we are, we have, I'm sure you guys have LOA nine as well. they have to pay us captain rate LOA nine.
00:00:55
Austin
What's that?
00:00:56
Austin and Derek
It's where you're working as FO, but getting captain pay.
00:01:00
Austin
Uh, nope, that's gone. Okay.
00:01:03
Austin and Derek
Yeah. there's been rumors of them taking that away for us, but as of now, it's like, that's part of our contract to sign up for LOA nine.
00:01:07
Austin
Mm-hmm.
00:01:11
Austin and Derek
meaning that they're going to have to pay us as captain. regardless of if we're a captain or an F.O. So they might well just make us a captain, you know,
00:01:20
Austin
Yeah. What is it? Dude, did you hear about Endeavor or no? Like what happened to them recently?
00:01:29
Austin and Derek
with regards to hiring or with regards to the plane.
00:01:34
Austin
No. So like how you're talking about the whole Captain Pay and all that stuff and your bonus, you know what I'm talking about? had too. they, think... think when you get higher or when you upgrade, they give you like a hundred K bonus or something. And they do the seven 50 thing where you get captain pay.
00:01:55
Austin
They actually took that away. They actually took it away, which I didn't, I didn't think was possible because it was country.
00:02:01
Austin
Like it's like their alpha, their contractually agreed upon to give those to people. And they just straight up took it away.
00:02:09
Austin and Derek
So people who signed the contract, they said, sorry.
00:02:11
Austin
Yep.
00:02:14
Austin
Yep.
00:02:15
Austin and Derek
Really?
00:02:16
Austin
Yeah, I'm not even... my friend that's a captain there, Caleb McCord, he went to Purdue, but he told me about...
00:02:21
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:02:22
Austin
And it didn't affect him because he's already captain.
00:02:26
Austin and Derek
Took the money.
00:02:26
Austin
He already got paid pretty much. But... Yeah, I think I forgot how it worked exactly, but I think the entire, I think it was actually more than 100K. It's, I think once you upgraded, they gave you 100 or something and then they give you an additional, they give it to you in parts. Like you, once you hit 750, you obviously get the pay. And then once you upgrade, you get 40. And then a year after being captain, you get another 40. And then the second year, it's like 30 or something.
00:02:53
Austin
But yeah, they straight up took it away. So my friend that recently went there, from training in November, he's not getting that anymore.
00:03:04
Austin
So
Union and Merger Implications
00:03:06
Austin
yeah.
00:03:06
Austin and Derek
Yeah, it's gonna be interesting that, you know, this this all this union stuff, obviously, you know, your company doesn't have a union, um we're merging with Mesa, you heard that.
00:03:17
Austin
Yeah. How's that going work?
00:03:17
Austin and Derek
And they are Alpa, and we're Teamsters.
00:03:20
Austin
Yeah.
00:03:21
Austin
Yeah.
00:03:22
Austin and Derek
Alpa obviously has, it's a smaller chapter because it's Mesa, but Alpa is the big dogs, you know, Delta United American are all al from my understanding, and meaning that if they needed to, they would have potential deeper funding.
00:03:35
Austin and Derek
You know mean? don't know of any other airlines that are Teamsters. I'm sure there's some out there. I'm not a very big union guy, so don't just do all this research, you know.
00:03:43
Austin
I think it might... No, wait. I think you guys might be the only one. I want to say American has their own, and then... know Alpa is... United Alpa, right?
00:03:56
Austin and Derek
I'm pretty sure.
00:03:57
Austin
You don't know? Okay. I just know Delta has it, and then Southwest has their own in-house. Not in-house, but it's independent, if that makes sense.
00:04:04
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:04:05
Austin
But...
00:04:07
Austin and Derek
Yeah. it'll be interesting. I mean, when the mergers, so, i mean, mean, they're talking about when I was in training, the merger actually like corporate wise will be done in like six to 12 months, meaning that Mace is going to operate under the name,
00:04:20
Austin and Derek
you know, Republic, we're going to go public. We're, you know, taking their shares. then it'll be like another two years before they actually merge, you know, integration with unions, integrations with SOPs, integration with all that other stuff. So it's different world. and I think there's a voting period where we vote if we want to be Alpa or if we want to be Teamsters.
00:04:41
Austin and Derek
And I haven't really heard anything great about Alpa.
00:04:49
Austin
What do you mean?
00:04:50
Austin and Derek
like our contract rocks, like with the amount of protections we get, the amount of, you know, pay protections, whatever.
00:04:58
Austin
Are you comparing to another regional that's under Alpa?
00:05:02
Austin and Derek
Yeah. Like compared to Mesa's and obviously compared endeavor, I mean,
00:05:07
Austin
Yeah, that was true. Actually... I think, I don't know. I think you're kind of right on that. I mean, i don't really know too much, but at least from, SkyWest, they're going through their own sort of thing right now where we're trying to get Alpa on and everything. And the forums, there's people in the group saying like, you know, this isn't that great because if you think about it, all of the major air or most of the major airlines have Alpa, but So technically, yes, you have a union. And I still agree that we should have a union. But I think a a union is better than no union. But I think some people's argument is that, oh, well, the majors have alpha, right?
00:05:49
Austin
doesn't it make sense to have something of our own? Because technically if Alpa and the majors are working together for their own interest, don't you think that it's not really for the regionals interest when you're in the same union as the major, because the major is going to want, theoretically, the major is going to want to use the regional as cheaply as possible for their regional routes pretty much.
00:06:07
Austin and Derek
because this is
00:06:18
Austin
So I think, And I started to think about that and I was like, well, that kind of makes sense because now you have a conflict of interest in your union. But if you have something like a Teamsters or you have something to where it's independent, then can see that.
00:06:37
Austin and Derek
It's the same as the varsity football team during practice.
00:06:38
Austin
don't know.
00:06:41
Austin and Derek
You usually practice against the JV, right?
00:06:44
Austin
Yeah. Yeah.
00:06:45
Austin and Derek
You know?
00:06:46
Austin
Yeah.
00:06:46
Austin and Derek
It's like you're on the same team, yeah, but the varsity players are going to get the playing. They're going points.
00:06:53
Austin and Derek
They're going to get the
00:06:54
Austin
They're going to demolish you
00:06:55
Austin and Derek
Yeah. So it's the same as that.
00:06:57
Austin
you, yeah. They're using you as practice in a punching bag, pretty much.
00:06:58
Austin and Derek
Are Are freaking kidding
00:07:04
Austin
Oh, I think... ah ah Oh, shit.
00:07:09
Austin
Be back.
00:07:10
Austin and Derek
That was weird.
00:07:11
Austin and Derek
My wifi, my wifi did a hiccup.
00:07:11
Austin
Yeah.
00:07:15
Austin
Well, you're good now.
00:07:17
Austin and Derek
Can you hear me?
00:07:19
Austin
Yeah, I can hear you.
00:07:20
Austin and Derek
um perfect. But yeah, no, I mean, it's cool. I mean, it's fine. It's another, another part of the world, but like unions, it's just like, I never grew up being a union guy. So it's like all new to me, you know?
00:07:36
Austin
No, yeah. I mean, no, it's the same with me. I didn't really have any... I mean, you learn about in like history class and stuff like that with regards to like the 1800s and stuff like that. That's pretty much all I know. I mean, my parents didn't work jobs that had any union aspect to it.
00:07:56
Austin
I mean, we're in an industry where it's like very, very big thing. So I don't know, like for me, I change my opinion on it every now and then. think flying for an airline without one, it makes me more favorable towards one. But at the same time, shouldn't think it's the most perfect thing ever. And they can't do anything wrong because I've seen stories online of union leaders doing shady you things.
00:08:25
Austin
But yeah, I don't know.
00:08:28
Austin and Derek
At the end of the day, I hope Teamsters Union doesn't let what happened to Endeavor happen because I've already spent my bonus and I don't even have it
00:08:28
Austin
That's kind of me.
00:08:34
Austin
Yeah, yeah.
00:08:38
Austin
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, no, it's, yeah, that wouldn't be good at all. Yeah, ah ah yeah, heard that and I was like, dang, that's, that sucks.
00:08:50
Austin
But I mean, mm
00:08:50
Austin and Derek
I mean, especially with amount of money, people are making life decisions.
00:08:54
Austin
hmm. Yeah, yeah.
00:08:55
Austin and Derek
know mean? Like,
00:08:55
Austin
Like, yeah, like, if you're, if you know, you're gonna get amount of money, you're gonna be like, Oh, I can make a down payment for this and that get a house, get a car. Like, that's what people do.
00:09:05
Austin
That's what most people do. Not saying that they should or shouldn't. You know, you can do whatever you want with your money. But
00:09:12
Austin and Derek
My buddy um and his wife at Republic, they made plans to like blueprints, everything out. So that all they needed was the the the money to build their house.
00:09:26
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:09:27
Austin
Yeah.
00:09:28
Austin and Derek
So now imagine they made all those plans, got all excited, started packing up their house maybe a little bit, you found all the research, whatever.
00:09:28
Austin
Oh.
00:09:36
Austin and Derek
Maybe they were holding off having kids until they were in in home of their dreams, you then boom, dreams
00:09:39
Austin
Yeah.
00:09:44
Austin and Derek
Because i realistically, the the regionals can do whatever they want right now. Yeah.
00:09:49
Austin
Yeah, they can do whatever.
00:09:51
Austin
Yeah.
Regional vs. Major Airlines
00:09:52
Austin
Yeah, I don't know. I think you're right. I think with the regionals, nothing's guaranteed. I think it's more guaranteed if you're at like a major or even... Actually, i wouldn't say an LLC, but even Southwest is showing cracks at this point. But I don't know. It's more of a guarantee. I think you can make more guarantees if you're at a major because you can kind of know that they're going to make the money Their contracts are, you know, their pilot group first is way bigger for one. Their unions are probably way stronger than a regional.
00:10:27
Austin
I don't know.
00:10:28
Austin and Derek
And the majors are basically like the banks of the airlines. Like the government's not going to let them fail.
00:10:33
Austin
The central bank. Yeah. The federal reserve. Yeah. The federal reserve. They always bill them out.
00:10:41
Austin
Yeah.
00:10:41
Austin and Derek
Like seriously, like, you know, probably United's the one that's leading right now, but I can't imagine there being a world where at least Donald Trump lets Delta United American, one of them go down.
00:10:55
Austin and Derek
I mean, right now, I mean, I'm not saying for like the future, I mean, America is built competition and capitalism. Right. But also we're built on, you know, being the most innovative and Delta United and American have pockets to help innovate these jets and push things moving forward.
00:11:16
Austin and Derek
You know, mean, if there wasn't, if there wasn't a buyer of big air buses or big, big Boeings, they wouldn't make them new.
00:11:18
Austin
Yeah.
00:11:25
Austin and Derek
You know what i mean? Which is why 747 and the are getting slowly out of service because there's not a huge demand for them.
00:11:26
Austin
Yeah.
00:11:34
Austin and Derek
There's definitely not very many buyers of them anymore. you
00:11:37
Austin
Yeah. The only buyers are like the Asian airlines, Southeast Asian airlines and stuff like that. And Yeah, I mean, it's just our market. The American market is very domestic heavy, and you don't really need anything with regards to an A380. You could just use a 7.6, 7.77. You can use an 50 instead. Yeah, especially the and 50.
00:11:57
Austin and Derek
Which is why they keep making those, you know?
00:11:59
Austin
know Delta buying way more those.
00:12:02
Austin and Derek
But mean, if you look at the newest plane on the market, it's the And that's...
00:12:07
Austin
Yeah, it is is the yeah. Which is basically, the was basically a merger between Canadair or Bombardier and Airbus.
00:12:08
Austin and Derek
and
00:12:18
Austin
But then Bombardier is it it gone. Like, there was supposed to be an ACMI airplane. But now it's a mainline plane.
Innovations and Cryptocurrency in Aviation
00:12:28
Austin and Derek
It from my understanding, it was a little bit more of like bailout buyout.
00:12:34
Austin and Derek
I don't know for a fact, but that's kind of what all the captains have told me is that Bombardier made this plane and they were call it like the C 1000 or something like that.
00:12:43
Austin
Yeah, that's what it was.
00:12:44
Austin and Derek
And then they didn't have enough money to finish it, so they sold it to Airbus. um um And they changed the name to the 220. But I mean, you think about i mean, that's like the most innovative new plane that we have.
00:12:57
Austin and Derek
And it's a regional, essentially. It's a big regional. It's got like 100 seats on it.
00:13:00
Austin
Yeah, it's a slightly bigger E-175, right?
00:13:05
Austin and Derek
It's, yeah, it's slightly bigger than 190, Yeah.
00:13:09
Austin
Yeah. Yeah. And then the, what is it? Yeah. Like the airlines like breeze. I know, i i know Allegiant does three twenties, but they could, don't know if they grow anymore. They probably would use those two, honestly, but it's more for the market of majors. And then that sort of the ultra low cost carrier where they're not, where they're kind of flying,
00:13:35
Austin
mid-sized to small or mid-sized to mid-sized city, especially with Allegiant and Breeze. Yeah, they do, yeah.
00:13:42
Austin and Derek
I think JetBlue flies them too.
00:13:44
Austin
The JetBlue has that in the E190 as well.
00:13:47
Austin and Derek
i mean, you get to, i mean, mean, just speaking about the low cost carriers, right? There's going to be world where there's probably not very many of them, you know, because you can only keep costs so low, especially, you know, during the pandemic, you know, when
00:14:04
Austin
Yeah.
00:14:04
Austin and Derek
were pretty low before that. And then boom, it's like overnight things got expensive.
00:14:09
Austin
Yeah.
00:14:10
Austin and Derek
Well, it's like in order for you to even break, even if the price the same as a mainline with much more connections around the world with much more, know, not saying, yeah, not saying that they're perfect, but the network is so much bigger.
00:14:20
Austin
Yeah. Infrastructure. Yeah.
00:14:26
Austin and Derek
That's like, why would I go fly on spirit? Well, have to pay for my bag. I have to pay for, everything extra. It's not low cost anymore. can just buy one ticket and have the same amenities plus see the whole world, you know?
00:14:39
Austin
Yeah, I understand that for them or for Frontier and Spirit. I think what they could possibly do transition to more like a Breeze. They could probably compete with Breeze potentially or, well, it would be kind of hard to do that if you're going to change bases and all that stuff your pilot group. Yeah,
00:15:02
Austin
can see that. I mean, if you're paying the same ticket for sort of a a different experience because of bags and all that stuff. But what they could try and do possibly is try and figure out the breeze model or the Allegiant model. And maybe that will work. I think that can work, but, uh, cause people don't want to do, if you're, if you're trying to fly to like, ah you're from midsize city and you're trying to fly to another midsize city, like, why would you want to connect if you could just go straight to where you're trying to You know?
00:15:30
Austin and Derek
Who's going to be the first airline to accept Bitcoin?
00:15:33
Austin
Oh, the first one? Dude, watch it be spirit.
00:15:34
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:15:37
Austin
No. I don't know. That's a think of my the the first major I think into mind could be like maybe like an American or United. only reason why say American is because like they have a base in Miami and Miami is pretty Bitcoin friendly. That's the only reason. But I bet like, I don't know, like a United kind of makes sense to me because I think with their leadership in United, them you going after the sonic boom, that what it's
00:16:05
Austin
The new hypersonic boom jet.
00:16:06
Austin and Derek
The boom jet.
00:16:09
Austin
I don't know. United seems to be more forward thinking, I guess. I don't know. They might want to touch out.
00:16:14
Austin and Derek
They also they also have a really big international network.
00:16:15
Austin
Yeah.
00:16:20
Austin
Yeah, they do. Yeah. Actually, that's a good point. Yeah. If they have the biggest international network and then Bitcoin is quite obviously the best international money, why would you not accept that?
00:16:22
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:16:30
Austin and Derek
Yeah. Yeah.
00:16:31
Austin
Stamp yourself down as the international airline of the US.
00:16:35
Austin and Derek
And when I was at women in aviation, they do also have a really big cash reserve. They were saying, uh, because they have to, because whenever like someone buys a ticket for three months out,
00:16:41
Austin
Yeah.
00:16:47
Austin
They take that money and they hold it.
00:16:48
Austin and Derek
Yeah. They take that, they take that money then. Right. But i mean, it's, it's, they all have, it's all data and analytics and stuff. It was actually kind of of interesting to listen to them, they can't just spend a hundred percent of that money because what happens if somebody decides to cancel the flight, you know mean?
00:17:03
Austin
Yeah, and they give the money back.
00:17:03
Austin and Derek
Like,
00:17:04
Austin and Derek
they have to give the money back. Right. And if they don't have the money problems, you know?
00:17:04
Austin
Yeah.
00:17:09
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:17:09
Austin
Yeah.
00:17:10
Austin
Yeah, they're not a bank, so they can't pull off what banks do.
00:17:14
Austin and Derek
was just thinking about that the other day, dude.
00:17:14
Austin
Yeah.
00:17:16
Austin and Derek
I just got this new car and the interest rate was 8%. And I feel like I have a pretty good credit score. So 8% in my opinion is pretty high for a car.
00:17:26
Austin
Yeah.
00:17:27
Austin
Yeah.
00:17:28
Austin and Derek
But regardless, you know, everybody understands banks.
00:17:35
Austin and Derek
They do. It's like they understand just because of of like old stories, you know, like you had the bank runs during the Great Depression. 2008, there was a little bit of a bank run, you know, people going to get their money and it's not there and it collapsed the bank.
00:17:52
Austin and Derek
It collapsed the whole system and people know that that's happening. So if everybody right now, whatever, just wanted to go get their cash, they know that it's not there.
00:18:04
Austin
Yeah.
Bitcoin and Personal Finance
00:18:06
Austin
Yeah.
00:18:06
Austin and Derek
So, but what I'm saying like, that's not like when you explain to people, that's not, they're like, yeah, yeah, I understand that.
00:18:06
Austin
Some people learn that the hard way.
00:18:14
Austin and Derek
It's like, well, why would you give your money to the banks then?
00:18:18
Austin
Dude, I asked myself the same question.
00:18:22
Austin and Derek
I just, I don't, I don't understand that. Everybody knows the system's broken. mean, I have bank account and they're just basically for short-term savings just because I feel bad.
00:18:33
Austin
Yeah.
00:18:34
Austin and Derek
I would, I would feel bad selling my Bitcoin for like a vacation or something, you you know, ah because it's, going to be so short term. I would hate to take a taxable event or whatever, but, otherwise, yeah, I just, it doesn't make, it doesn't make sense to me, man.
00:18:51
Austin and Derek
it
00:18:51
Austin
It doesn't make sense to me. Yeah, it does. Well, I don't know. I think the most part, when it comes to people, they realize it, but then they don't take the time to, I guess, think about it.
00:19:05
Austin
I think for me, the best way to learn more about it is to hear other people about it, like on YouTube, more like you know, like watching a Jack Mallers or Michael Saylor or whatever Bitcoiner YouTuber I listened to. But I don't know. think for the most part, I think most people would realize it if they had like an external person telling them and emphasize like an emphasis sort of thing.
00:19:32
Austin
But for me personally, the I do it now, know, i for for me, personally, I hold i hold i don't have I have a bank account, of course, but i am basically trying to get that down to near zero at this point.
00:19:48
Austin
I just don't see a reason to hold the dollar. It doesn't do it purely for the principal at this point. It's I don't care if, you know, i don't care if it goes down, you know, 50% for I lose out a lot. And then I don't have enough money to pay. Well, I mean, I should have enough money. live beneath my means for the most part. So I don't think I'll ever have that problem. But if I do, then I'll do whatever it takes to get out of that situation. Yeah.
00:20:17
Austin and Derek
Well, just brings up another kind of
00:20:20
Austin and Derek
know It's like I used to give ah Dave Ramsey a lot of crap because he's always like, I don't have a FICO score.
00:20:26
Austin and Derek
I call that the I love debt score. you there's a way you can go get a mortgage on a home without having a FICO score. And I just save up for cash and everything. and don't go into debt. I was like,
00:20:35
Austin
Yeah.
00:20:36
Austin and Derek
You need to have leverage. I mean, especially when you're young, I think using debt properly.
00:20:40
Austin
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
00:20:42
Austin and Derek
recently...
00:20:42
Austin
Yeah.
00:20:44
Austin and Derek
It's like, I have a good credit score. I'm playing the game and I still got an 8% on a car.
00:20:49
Austin
Yeah.
00:20:49
Austin and Derek
Like, what's the point in even playing the game if I'm still going to get crappy rates?
00:20:52
Austin
Well, you're playing...
00:20:52
Austin and Derek
You know, I might as well just save the money and paid cash.
00:20:56
Austin
Yeah, the thing is, yeah, you're playing the game perfectly. It's just that the problem is is the person, the referees are the Federal Reserve and Jerome Powell, and they can change the rules of the game whenever they want, right?
00:21:08
Austin
We had the highest increase in the past couple years of interest rates in history, right? We went from 0.0 whatever to... to 4.5 or right? It's going down a little bit right now, but you did nothing wrong. It's just the fact that who controls the game, he's just shifting the goalposts. It's like you're playing hockey and the goalie can just pick up the goalposts and move it around. Oh, it's 1%, now I'm changing it 4%. Now, instead of your car payment on your interest being, I don't know, used to be being 5% 4%, now it's
00:21:44
Austin
the same credit score you before the rates rose, right?
00:21:48
Austin and Derek
Yeah. The other thing that I was thinking is, you know, so I've told you, obviously I took a loan out against my Bitcoin and that was, was zero credit check on that.
00:22:00
Austin
Yeah, no, yeah, that's what I've heard.
00:22:00
Austin and Derek
That was just me and a dude.
00:22:02
Austin
There's no credit check on that at all.
00:22:04
Austin and Derek
Cause it's peer to peer.
00:22:04
Austin
Yeah.
00:22:04
Austin and Derek
It was me and dude. It wasn't a bank. No third. I mean, I guess there is, know, we used a website to to link together, Debify, but he I sent him to Bitcoin.
00:22:16
Austin and Derek
He sent me a USDC. And then you now hold both essentially. And then same with the Gemini card. That also, did it in five minutes and they gave me a $10,000 credit limit.
00:22:30
Austin
Yeah.
00:22:30
Austin and Derek
And I have two credit cards, normal ones, one to discover one city.
00:22:34
Austin
Uh-huh.
00:22:35
Austin and Derek
And every like six months, I reapply for a credit limit and neither of them have over 10,000 credit limit.
00:22:41
Austin
Really? No way.
00:22:42
Austin and Derek
Yeah. And I was like,
00:22:43
Austin and Derek
This one didn't even pull my
00:22:43
Austin
That's crazy.
00:22:44
Austin
Yeah.
00:22:45
Austin and Derek
I did to do was put my income in there, which I, they didn't verify. could have lied about, you know?
00:22:53
Austin
Yeah.
00:22:54
Austin and Derek
And they gave me $10,000 and these other two reputable banks I've had for years. Nope.
00:23:01
Austin
Yeah.
00:23:02
Austin and Derek
I mean, it's like right at, like right below 10,000, but it's like, boom, right off the bat, $10,000 with Gemini and no credit check. I was like, so we're getting, we're getting to a world where what's the point, you know?
00:23:11
Austin
Yeah. Isn't that crazy? Isn't that crazy?
00:23:19
Austin
Well, yeah. What is the point when the the debt balance and consumer debt is at all-time highs? It's like, what's the beginning of the day?
00:23:27
Austin and Derek
So I actually, uh, I asked chat GPT before we started this, about, I just said, uh, can you give me some stats on debt in America? Mortgages are,
00:23:38
Austin and Derek
one sorry, 12.8 trillion. Auto are trillion. card debt is trillion. become delinquent. Student loans are 8% delinquent. So that's 90 days plus late. Credit cards and are 7%, auto loans are 3% delinquency, which means, like I said, more than 70 sorry, more than 90 days.
00:24:04
Austin and Derek
And the average Gen Z holds personal debt of 94,000 and home ownership remains only 3% of buyers, meaning that that 94,000 is probably not a mortgage.
00:24:20
Austin
Yeah, it's probably a student debt.
00:24:21
Austin and Derek
Student debt, credit card debt, auto loans,
00:24:23
Austin
Credit card. Yeah.
00:24:26
Austin and Derek
It's wild, man. I was just reading this. I'm listening to this book um um on Spotify. i don't love it. I think it's getting a little bit more political because it's talking about climate change and race activism, whatever.
00:24:40
Austin and Derek
And it's going in a direction I didn't really want it to go. I wanted to talk more about whatever, but it's talking about the...
00:24:43
Austin
Yeah.
00:24:46
Austin and Derek
It's titled like ah the $100 trillion wealth transfer or something like that. it's basically talking about
00:24:51
Austin
Yeah.
00:24:53
Austin and Derek
the mindset of, they call it Zillennials, millennials and Gen Z and boomers and how these boomers are, were able to slurp up all of these assets, right?
00:25:07
Austin and Derek
Whether it's a home, whether it's multiple homes, whether it's, you know, stocks, whatever, over the years at low interest rates, and through quantitative easing, I've been in a forever bull market.
00:25:18
Austin and Derek
um um And so now everything is so expensive that the people... Everything is so expensive through through inflation that the people in our generation, we're fortunate, but some people can't afford groceries, can't afford rent, can't afford a home, can't afford all these things.
00:25:37
Austin and Derek
And they're starting to just give up. And they're like, well, you guys are going to all die sometime. will just inherit all of your assets. You'll pass down our houses, you it's our parents or grandparents, or there'll be an estate sale and that house will be cheap. And and that's when I will get in. There's no need for me.
00:25:54
Austin and Derek
You're paying $300 a month for this house that you bought 50 years ago, right? And if I were to buy it from you, I'd be paying $1,800 a month.
00:26:04
Austin and Derek
How does that make
00:26:06
Austin and Derek
So it's kind of an interesting mindset.
00:26:10
Austin and Derek
Especially because probably credit scores are crappy because you actually have to have debt to get a good credit score. have to manage it well. And if you can't even pay for groceries, you're probably not going to be able to pay for all these other things, you know?
00:26:26
Austin
Yeah. Yeah. said the book was about a wealth transfer. is Did it say anything about where the transition would be did it have a future projection or something like that? Okay.
00:26:39
Austin and Derek
I'm only about halfway through it. It hasn't really given out dates yet, but it did say that it's already starting.
00:26:40
Austin
Oh,
00:26:45
Austin
of course. Yeah. Yeah.
00:26:45
Austin and Derek
And and it was written by a boomer and he was a banker, I think.
00:26:52
Austin and Derek
And so he saw these new, our generation, because we're in the workforce now, you know, early Gen Zs and the late millennials are definitely the workforce and working with people.
00:27:03
Austin and Derek
And he said, it's crazy how they work different. Us, that meaning us. We're much more independent. You know, we're less materialistic. We are just very about the community. And he said that the boomers all think that the Gen Z people generation is very self-centered, very all about me, all about me. But if you really talk to somebody who's from the age of,
00:27:29
Austin and Derek
I think he said 18 to 35. they use the word we more than they use me. You know, it's a collective, what can I do to add value to the society so we all can get better?
00:27:41
Austin and Derek
Which was kind of interesting.
00:27:42
Austin and Derek
But he also mentioned cryptocurrencies. He said cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin and Ethereum and Solana. I'm like, dude, but whatever.
00:27:49
Austin
Yeah.
00:27:50
Austin and Derek
But he said it's crazy because these people are just buying these instead of homes because they can. Because you can put 50 cents an hour into Bitcoin and you can't put 50 cents an hour into real estate.
00:28:01
Austin and Derek
Correct.
00:28:01
Austin
Yeah, you can't, you can't put a dollar, you can't buy a dollar of real estate. I mean, you can get a REIT, but a REIT's nothing compared to an actual house.
00:28:09
Austin
You know, it's like, of course people are going to do that. And cause it's infinite, like least in Bitcoin's case, it's infinitely divisible and it's the greatest, you know, form of capital ever to exist.
00:28:25
Austin
It's like, why wouldn't you do that? Cause the entire point, of people our age doing that is to buy a home, right? It's a means to an end. It's a means to get to the goal of buying a home, right? Like I can talk, ah ah we can talk about all day about how great Bitcoin is and how you should never sell it. But will always, you know, be the person to advocate if you really want a house and you love it and you know, you're going to, you know, see yourself spending years and years of your life
00:28:55
Austin
you know, raising a family that house, like, dude, course, buy it with your Bitcoin, you know?
00:29:00
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:29:01
Austin
ah That's the whole point of, and this goes more into, like, the psychological or societal effect of, like, hard money is that people actually...
Bitcoin Loans and Real Estate Strategy
00:29:11
Austin
you know, have higher time preference when they use something like Bitcoin. Right.
00:29:15
Austin
And that's why, you know, I think it's important for especially people in different areas of finance and different books, what they're writing is have to understand like what hard money is because it's, it fixes a lot of problems in society, especially with regards to the housing stuff and what we see with Gen Z and all this stuff.
00:29:33
Austin
Because it, you know, you think more about your future, you save specifically in the sense of, hey, I know I'm young, I'm going to put more money into this, into this, you know, thing that rises at 50% a year.
00:29:47
Austin
And I'm going to delay gratification to get the thing that I really want in the future. And that's a house family you know, stuff like that, right? Land, whatever else that could be. And it changes society to be more of a low, you know, low time preference, long-term thinker.
00:30:07
Austin
And in turn, that makes people's minds better and better minds leads to a better society. You know, like no one just, no one just thinks by the second and does things that really hurt society in the longterm.
00:30:23
Austin
It's more so like, how can I help myself and how does me helping myself in my future help more people? Right. you know, you do a job that is productive for society. You're not a reductive or you're a net negative. Right.
00:30:38
Austin
And you really try find out what people want, you know, what do people pay you for and what they value and you get the value in Bitcoin, you save it and, you know, you use it to get what you want in future.
00:30:55
Austin
yeah. Yeah.
00:30:57
Austin and Derek
It's crazy. I mean, there's a lot of books that are out there that tie the high time preference. And always get that mixed up. is High time preference means you want it later.
00:31:11
Austin
high type preference is like short term thing. I, I, let me actually.
00:31:14
Austin and Derek
Okay. So the low time preference thinking with regards to like a monetary aspect, which is what Bitcoin is, leads into everything.
00:31:26
Austin and Derek
Like art is better. Your diet's better.
00:31:30
Austin
Yep.
00:31:30
Austin and Derek
All of these things that you're doing, like you invest better because it's like, why would I invest in this company if it's only returning 8% a year when my money is appreciating at 50% a year? You know what I mean?
00:31:40
Austin
Yeah.
00:31:40
Austin and Derek
It's like, there's, so like the the weak companies will go away. The weak artists will go away. i i mean, Michelangelo painted the Sistine Chapel. He was not paid in dollars. He was paid in gold.
00:31:51
Austin and Derek
All right.
00:31:51
Austin
Yeah.
00:31:52
Austin and Derek
And that means that somebody had to give up their gold, which was keeping up with inflation or was a store of value because they knew that the Sistine Chapel would appreciate or would be worth more than that gold.
00:32:06
Austin and Derek
Essentially, it's like, why would I give you my gold if I'm not going to get anything out of return? Right. You know, there's a donation factor in there, too, probably. Right. I want I have all this wealth. I want to make something beautiful for the whole world to see.
00:32:16
Austin and Derek
Maybe it's not monetary, but regardless, you know,
00:32:16
Austin
Yeah.
00:32:21
Austin and Derek
They actually even say, think that was in the Bitcoin standard, that there have been not very many new zero to ones under a fiat standard. The only one that I could think of is AI. And even that is, is that's just built on a a computer network. You know, that's a, that's a, you know, add on to the internet. You know what mean? But we're not, we're not making new airplanes in a sense, right?
00:32:47
Austin and Derek
All these jets that we're making are one to a thousand, right?
00:32:51
Austin and Derek
The first airplane that worked the zero to one where there was no airplane and now there is airplane, uh, was the Wright brothers, you know? And what that? i don't remember the year, but it was before 1971.
00:33:02
Austin and Derek
So it was on a gold standard. 1903.
00:33:03
Austin
1903 yeah even before the federal reserve so yeah but what were you about say
00:33:04
Austin and Derek
There you go.
00:33:10
Austin and Derek
don't know. So what, what, Go ahead. I was going to change the topic a little bit back towards debt. What are your thoughts about borrowing against you Bitcoin?
00:33:17
Austin
Yeah.
00:33:19
Austin
Oh, I, I, I'm starting to think it's the best thing ever on it. Like if, if, if I'm, I'm going through like lot of thought experiments and talking to, you know, people I know and what they do in the sense of owning a company and how that works.
00:33:38
Austin
But yeah, grown more favorable to it and I think it makes a lot of sense mathematically, especially in the Mark Moss aspect or sense of math, right? I mean, if you have something that grows on average 50% a year and if you look at the past performance of Bitcoin, Bitcoin usually in its four-year cycles, it goes up three years and then it goes down one year.
00:34:00
Austin
Three years, one year, right? I'm not saying obviously past performance is not indicative of future returns, right? But let's say, know, out of the four years, you get like two out of two or you get one out of four maybe you get four out of four for all green years, right?
00:34:21
Austin
It just makes sense to do it because if you borrow against it, you know, let's say you have enough to do like a low LTV where have like five to 10% LTV,
00:34:31
Austin
for one, Bitcoin, at least in the past... think the last drawdown that we had from 60 to I don't even think that was, that wasn't even close to 90% of a drop. That was like, I think 70 or 60%.
00:34:48
Austin
I can't do mental math like that, but you know, the last drop was only even close to a 95 or 90% drop. Right. if you borrow LTV five, 10% for one, you know,
00:35:01
Austin
you know, it has to drop 90%. And then if it does, you can add more collateral on the backend to help yourself out and not get liquidated. But if you get 10% of that money, use that money. And then let's there's two different ways of doing it. You can either use that to fund your lifestyle. And then if you have a job, then you use your income from your job to, to add onto the collateral or just add onto your stack at that point.
00:35:27
Austin
which would actually be really nice in terms of that. So you're always back in your collateral and strengthening your position on that. But you do that and then let's say it goes up 50%.
00:35:39
Austin
could even be a devil's advocate and say like, oh, over the long term, the returns will be lower, which mathematically they should, right? It'll be like 50, 40, 30, 25 or whatever.
00:35:52
Austin
And I'm sure the interest is going to go down, right? Right now, Jack Mallers just came out for the first, and obviously you have to put a shit ton, like, you know, millions.
00:35:54
Austin and Derek
It will.
00:36:01
Austin
But he, for the first time, below 10% interest on borrowing him,
00:36:04
Austin and Derek
I saw And I think he lowered the minimum now.
00:36:05
Austin
You know what that he had
00:36:08
Austin and Derek
I think in the new update, you could do 10,000, which at 50%, you have to put in 20,000.
00:36:09
Austin
Yes, it was 10,000. Yep, it's 10,000.
00:36:12
Austin and Derek
That's doable for anybody in years. You mean? you
00:36:15
Austin
Yep, yeah. yeah So...
00:36:18
Austin and Derek
that's
00:36:20
Austin
Yep.
00:36:22
Austin
Like I said, man, it's going to get a lot better. The minimums are going get lower. The interest rates are going get lower. As the demand increases and the amount of pool. like Basically, Jack Mallers, he's been saying this since day one since he started Strike.
00:36:34
Austin
He said, will make things so cheap that the people will come. That's the business. It's basically the Google Google business model, right? You do something that's so cheap and you lower it so much and people will come and you'll have a bigger market share and everyone will want to use your service all over the world. He's a worldwide business, right?
00:36:52
Austin and Derek
Mm-hmm.
00:36:53
Austin
He's not just selling to people in the US because we only have like 360 million people. He's selling to people in all of South America. You're thinking all about Africa as well. and Europe as well too, but it's, I mean, it's just the smartest way to go about it. Right. So if people realize what Bitcoin is and every people are realizing what it is, they're realizing whatever currency they're using in their country, whether it's, you know, the dollar or it's like the peso or whatever, or the Euro it, it like mathematically speaking,
00:37:26
Austin
People will gravitate towards Bitcoin because they don't have a choice, right? You're going to increase your market share by that. And then you're going it cheaper. The minimums are going to get better. The amount that they're going to loan out is going to get better because he literally straight up said like, dude, I can straight up give you like a billion dollars if I wanted to. If you have the collateral, I will give you a billion dollars.
00:37:45
Austin
That's what he said he could do.
00:37:46
Austin and Derek
thing is, and I love Jack Maller, um and I love what he's doing. And he's a Bitcoiner, you know, and he wants to help out the community.
00:37:55
Austin
Yeah.
00:37:58
Austin and Derek
But I don't foresee Bitcoin loans being a thing in 20 or 30 years because what, and excuse my French, but what chump would give you fiat dollars that's going to be appreciating that, you know, my, my loan is at like just under 14% that I took out.
00:38:23
Austin and Derek
Right. Why would somebody be like, yeah, going to make 14% on my money. was just a good return, whatever, when I'm going to make what, like, so, so why would you give out your money to make that income?
00:38:29
Austin
If you could just, yeah.
00:38:35
Austin and Derek
when you could just buy the Bitcoin and it's appreciate way more than that. Like people are going to start to realize, especially as more competition comes in, that means more money. So the interest rates are going to go down, you know, higher supply, you know, and the rates go down.
00:38:46
Austin
Yeah.
00:38:49
Austin and Derek
People are going to why am I giving out my money at a 6% when Bitcoin's going up? Let's say it's in, you know, 30 years when it's only appreciating at 25 to 30% year, but still,
00:39:01
Austin and Derek
You get what I'm saying? like People are eventually going to be like, no, I'm just going to buy the Bitcoin instead with my money and sit less management. I pay taxes because it's not income.
00:39:14
Austin
but Yeah, that's a good point. I mean, I'll say right now, most people don't even realize that Bitcoin is rising at 50% a year right now.
00:39:24
Austin and Derek
No, I agree. agree.
00:39:27
Austin
For example, I don't know, all the banks right now, I'm sure... I mean, they don't have borrowing against, they don't have like a Bitcoin borrowing against service, but I bet like, if you think about it, you can get like, if you're making 14% interest rather than a key, I don't know what HELOCs go for, for interest rates, but if they're like, oh, you know, if we can, we can give out money for collateralized Bitcoin and we can make 14% instead of 8% or 7% on a HELOC, like we'll do that every day. Right. I think, I think it's just an asymmetry of information at that point because,
00:40:03
Austin
right now, Bitcoin is the most asymmetric bet in existence, right? It's the most asymmetric bet in existence. And people up in the top in the financial world don't even see it because they're so entrenched in the, like people, I think people, think the only time where it wouldn't be, where that would stop, like you think in the next 20 to 30 years, if the dollar doesn't exist or like people don't have faith in the dollar, I think I can't predict the future, but Michael, you know, and I'm not saying Michael Saylor's opinion is really the best opinion. Cause I think he has, believe he can't say things that he truly can at times because he's a CEO and you know, he has to play nice with the dollar and all that stuff. But, the, what I'm trying to get is,
00:40:50
Austin
it's either if the dollar is still you, there's, believes that the dollar was still reigned King in the United States, but Bitcoin is just capital. it's just pristine capital. He sees it more as like digital real estate, right?
00:41:03
Austin and Derek
Well,
00:41:04
Austin
which it is, I'll say that, but I'm a big, I'm a big proponent of it actually being like, he doesn't even think it's a currency. I think it's a currency cause I literally use it as my currency.
00:41:14
Austin
So therefore he's wrong, like in that aspect. But, but, uh, I,
00:41:17
Austin and Derek
I think he just thinks right now it's more important to use it as a store of value. You know,
00:41:23
Austin
Yeah, it definitely But in the sense of what you mentioned, like, oh, what's the point of giving it out? I think people in 30 years will still be using the dollar as like a medium of exchange mainly and not as a store of value, but as like an intermediary, right? Like, you know, you have, I guess it depends on what happens with the bond market and if Tether still is the biggest buyer of bonds and that stuff.
00:41:51
Austin
But as long as that's going on, I think I can see that still being the case.
00:41:55
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:41:56
Austin
But um I'm thinking is that, and it it kind of depends on if it's still a a world reserve currency and they do like another Bretton Woods or something like that. But the thing is, is as long as the dollar is still being used as the default currency, I think there, and if there's banks that don't see the asymmetry of Bitcoin, I think they'll,
00:42:18
Austin
they'll still be doing those collateralized loans. I don't know. Yeah,
00:42:21
Austin and Derek
Well, I mean, it's going to be something to think about, but I mean, and I'm not, I'm just throwing that idea out there. I do think that they're going to be around for a while. I just think it's, think I think I've mentioned it before.
00:42:32
Austin
yeah.
00:42:33
Austin and Derek
There's going to be two systems. There's going to be ah ah Bitcoin system where people are putting money into, you know, Bitcoin that's appreciating and then they're going to go buy things. Kind of like Dave Ramsey, you know, you save up money and then you go buy it, you save up money, then you go buy it.
00:42:48
Austin and Derek
And then there's going to be a credit system. where people are still taking out mortgages, taking out these things. and And I can see both sides. I mean, think of like a 30-year mortgage on a home.
00:42:59
Austin and Derek
That means you've had 30 years of appreciation on a house. You've had 30 years of deflation on the dollar, right? So that's the same thing, right? and And you're paying for a home that is still valued.
00:43:13
Austin and Derek
Like the loan doesn't change. So value of the the the loan is from
00:43:16
Austin
Yeah.
00:43:18
Austin and Derek
30 years ago. So the longer you hold the debt, first of all, the cheaper it is.
00:43:18
Austin
Yeah. 30 years ago. Yeah. Yeah.
00:43:23
Austin
The cheaper it is.
00:43:24
Austin and Derek
And second of all, the less money the bank makes because you're chipping away at principal, you know?
00:43:25
Austin
Yeah.
00:43:29
Austin
Yeah. The bank is, uh, yeah, they're only making whatever interest you got. And especially if you got in COVID really 2%, they're, they're actually losing out in that heavily because they could make a lot more interest on something else, you know, right.
00:43:42
Austin and Derek
They, someone, I don't remember where I read it, but it says that ah banks make sure like the way that their loans are structured, that they make majority of their money in the first five years
00:43:54
Austin
Oh, yeah, yeah, because, yeah, that's right. Yeah, no, you're completely right.
00:43:56
Austin and Derek
because people refinance, they, they, you know, then they'll sell off the loans, whatever it is, but they make a majority of their money in the first five years, because then it's like, it's an exponential decay.
00:43:56
Austin
Yeah.
00:44:08
Austin and Derek
of profit because the more you chip away at the interest or sorry, at the principal, the less interest is in the next payment. So it's so they try to, do that. Before, before we go on, I asked Chad GPT cause I saw this on Twitter.
00:44:22
Austin and Derek
um JP Morgan starting early June began allowing its trading and wealth management clients to use shares of IBIT. So that's the BlackRock ETF as collateral for both retail and institutional loans.
00:44:37
Austin and Derek
So it's starting. Obviously, that's not an actual Bitcoin. But I had this idea the other day, i mean probably like a month or so ago, that...
00:44:48
Austin and Derek
just because I was looking to buy this car. you I was like, wouldn't it be cool if I could go to the bank? I bought a Chevy, so the GM.
00:45:00
Austin and Derek
It's not a GM loan. It's a local bank loan. Regardless, could say, what if I post up a little bit of... I didn't do this, but i was thinking, like if I post up a little bit extra collateral in an appreciating...
00:45:14
Austin and Derek
asset, you know, you give me a lower rate? You know what mean? Like now you have the car, which is what the loan is backed off, which is a depreciating asset. And like, let's say I gave you like a 10th of a Bitcoin.
00:45:26
Austin and Derek
You know I mean?
00:45:27
Austin
Yeah.
00:45:28
Austin and Derek
And then eventually as I pay off the loan, the Bitcoin appreciates, the car appreciates, it's a cheaper interest rate. And then get my Bitcoin back. You know what saying? so was like, I was thinking of like this idea of bundling,
00:45:37
Austin
Yeah.
00:45:42
Austin and Derek
things together. Because real estate, think about it, you generally have to put a 20% down unless it's an FHA loan. So that's an 80% loan to value.
00:45:54
Austin
Yep.
00:45:55
Austin and Derek
So they're giving you 80% of the money to buy this house. So that means you don't have a lot of wiggle room.
00:46:01
Austin
No.
00:46:02
Austin and Derek
Well, what if I was to add a a little bit extra wiggle room? like What if I was going to pay 20% down maybe? or what if the was Bitcoin that I just posted as collateral.
00:46:12
Austin
Posted as collateral...
00:46:14
Austin and Derek
So now I have two, you know, appreciating assets and a fiat dollar. Maybe you give me, you know, it's less, it's less risky or maybe let's say it's, you know, it's a hundred thousand dollar house for easy numbers.
00:46:28
Austin and Derek
And I just post up 50% collateral, right?
00:46:34
Austin
So you have 50 grand in Bitcoin.
00:46:37
Austin and Derek
Yeah. 50 grand in Bitcoin. So now it's $150. I feel like they'd be more likely eventually give you more money because you have two appreciating assets. You know what i mean?
00:46:49
Austin
Wait, so that again. So you post 50%, like $100,000 house, post 50% collateral in Bitcoin. And you said 150? For what?
00:46:57
Austin and Derek
Like that's, that's what, that's what the cost would be.
00:47:00
Austin
Oh, the total value.
00:47:02
Austin and Derek
Yeah. The total value of this portfolio now. So now they're not giving you a loan for a hundred thousand. They're giving you a like against a hundred thousand. They're giving you a loan against 150,000. You know what I mean?
00:47:12
Austin
okay. All right. That makes sense. Yeah.
00:47:14
Austin and Derek
So it's like, you just add a little bit of what you have to, you know, whether that's lower interest rates or make it safer.
00:47:14
Austin
Yeah.
00:47:17
Austin
Mm-hmm.
00:47:22
Austin and Derek
Because, know,
00:47:23
Austin
Yeah, well, it would definitely be safe. Think about it because then let's say the underlying, I don't know, your 50 grand. Like while your 50 grand of Bitcoin goes down, right? Let's say the, I don't know, it starts to go down.
00:47:38
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:47:38
Austin
think Bitcoin posting as collateral, even if it goes lower, it's very easy because all you have to do is just be like, yep, here's some more Bitcoin. You know, you just put in the address, boop, I just added more collateral, you know.
00:47:49
Austin
I think it's a lot harder when it comes to house because it's infinitely divisible. So like if you have something that's infinite, like imagine if you could borrow against your dollars, that's essentially what you're able to do. Or like if you're borrowing against like the peso or whatever, whatever currency it's infinite. Like it's as if like you're borrowing against the dollars that you're putting in, like your, let's say you have $50,000. You just go in your bank account and be like, Oh, you know, the value of my dollars is going down.
00:48:15
Austin
Boop, put in, put another 5,000.
00:48:17
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:48:18
Austin
You can't do house.
00:48:18
Austin and Derek
but
00:48:19
Austin
add like can't add a tenth of a house into your collateral. That's not possible.
00:48:23
Austin and Derek
That's what I'm saying.
00:48:23
Austin
Yeah.
00:48:23
Austin and Derek
It goes into what you were saying that with the Bitcoin loans, they're generally, know, you don't put your whole stack in.
00:48:24
Austin
Yeah.
00:48:31
Austin and Derek
You put part of your stack in and it's at a 50% loan to value or whatever. doesn't matter, right? But against your whole stack, it's maybe only 20%. meaning that you can add more to it if you're in you the crypto winter bear market, whatever.
00:48:44
Austin and Derek
You can add to it. also, let's say you're at the bottom, a bottom the bear market in the four-year cycle.
00:48:52
Austin
Yeah.
00:48:52
Austin and Derek
And you take, you Mark Moss said, well, I'd feel comfortable taking 30%, 40%, 50% loan to value because I know where we're at the cycle, it should go up. You know what So you'd still have...
00:49:04
Austin
Wait, you're saying in the bottom you'd take another loan?
00:49:08
Austin and Derek
Well, he was saying he would feel comfortable taking more of a loan.
00:49:12
Austin
Oh, yeah, when it's at the bottom, because if it's already dropped by 70%, what's the chance of it going another 70?
00:49:13
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:49:18
Austin
Yeah. yeah
00:49:19
Austin and Derek
That's what I'm saying.
00:49:21
Austin and Derek
But, but it, it, I don't know. I just feel like it's, there's, there's something there that could potentially happen in the future. Like to, I don't know, like i said, lower rates or just make it safer, give you a little bit more of a margin of error.
00:49:36
Austin
I mean, yeah, I mean, think that's probably like a really good idea. I don't know. I just think in terms of you're going to, if you're trying to borrow for something and you're putting up collateral, that's, that's like Bitcoin and it's infinitely divisible, dude, literally you could, you could add on, if you get paid in Bitcoin, your entire salary, like, or a portion of your salary, whatever you want to do can just like back up the collateral.
00:50:03
Austin
Cause you're infinitely putting in more Bitcoin. Cause it's infinitely divisible. Like it doesn't matter you're making like, I don't know, ah ah hundred, You know, you're making like, you get like $1,000 from your paycheck or whatever. And then you just like, oh, here's $1,000 into this collateral.
00:50:19
Austin
Boop, put it in. Can't do that with that. You can't get paid in a house and then put a hundredth of a house your to into your collateral, you know? So it's, don't know. I think that's.
00:50:28
Austin and Derek
But imagine if there was an account that you could borrow against the Bitcoin that's in your account. You know what mean?
00:50:38
Austin and Derek
Like instead of having a credit card limit, you what mean?
00:50:39
Austin
Okay. Yeah.
00:50:42
Austin and Derek
That's just backed by the full faith of your income, essentially.
00:50:45
Austin
Yeah.
00:50:45
Austin and Derek
That's what you put in, your income, your rent, whatever it may be, credit score, like your ability to make money and pay off
00:50:49
Austin
Yeah.
00:50:51
Austin and Derek
What if you this account and just put, let's just make it easy number, full Bitcoin in there. And then every month kept adding, adding into it, adding into it, adding into it.
00:50:56
Austin
Yeah.
00:50:59
Austin and Derek
And it was connected to a bank account that allowed you to just withdraw that money whenever you wanted in cash, in USD or whatever, stable coin, whatever.
00:51:01
Austin
Yes.
00:51:09
Austin
But you still own it.
00:51:10
Austin and Derek
but you still own it.
00:51:11
Austin
Yeah. Yeah.
00:51:12
Austin and Derek
You're able to go buy something like real estate or buy stocks that you think are going going to appreciate or invest in private equity or start a business that's going to create more cashflow to then pay off that loan.
00:51:22
Austin and Derek
And then you just keep on buying Bitcoin the same way you keep on buying it, keep on stacking. It keeps on appreciating. Now let's say like, you know, it's five years later and your stacks doubled. You can just do it again and again and again and again.
00:51:22
Austin
Yes.
00:51:34
Austin
Yeah.
00:51:35
Austin and Derek
as long as you keep on buying assets that are then going to pay off the debts, You know saying? Like it could be like a never ending ending cycle. Like it's like a ah big credit card that you don't have to.
00:51:46
Austin and Derek
I mean, even locks home equity line of credits. I don't know what, like I've never had one. I've never heard of anybody having one. I know that they are out there, but don't know what the permissions are. If I can just go take $5 out if i wanted to.
00:51:59
Austin
Yeah. Yeah.
00:52:00
Austin and Derek
You know what i i mean? don't think you could.
00:52:00
Austin
Yeah.
00:52:01
Austin and Derek
I think you would have to a specific amount.
00:52:03
Austin
no
00:52:04
Austin and Derek
You'd probably have to go through the same system. You'd have to call a banker. You'd have to do all these things. But what if all of your debt that you need was just tied to Bitcoin?
00:52:15
Austin and Derek
You know mean? Like wanted to swipe a credit card and buy groceries, it goes against it. La-di-dee, la-di-da, you know?
00:52:22
Austin and Derek
i don't know, man. I think there's something there eventually. i just...
00:52:25
Austin
Yeah, i I think it's the perfect thing to borrow against. I'm just thinking that.
00:52:31
Austin
I think the infinitely divisible part just makes it so that it just makes it the perfect one. Because you're to borrow against anything physical, you can't just chop it up in half or in little bits.
00:52:45
Austin
bits and pieces and add to it. Bitcoin's the only thing that can do that. The only other thing that you could do that with is with fiat currency, but fiat currency doesn't grow and no one's going to borrow against your dollars. Like, why would you do that?
00:52:56
Austin
You know? So, or I don't know, you borrow against like treasuries or
00:52:58
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:53:00
Austin
i don't know, but, or I guess I, you could do stock too in a brokerage, but I don't really, think that's the only thing, other thing I could think of, but, but yeah, Bitcoin's perfect for it.
00:53:11
Austin and Derek
Yeah. I borrow against my socks.
00:53:13
Austin
Huh?
00:53:14
Austin and Derek
I borrow against my socks.
00:53:16
Austin
Like on a brokerage?
00:53:17
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:53:18
Austin
Okay. What's the interest on that?
00:53:21
Austin and Derek
If you do it right, it's free.
00:53:24
Austin
Really? Well, how?
00:53:27
Austin and Derek
Have you ever heard of selling cash secured puts?
00:53:30
Austin
Okay, you're talking about that. Wait, i don't don't really know too much about it.
00:53:35
Austin and Derek
Okay, so you know what a put is?
00:53:37
Austin
Yeah.
00:53:37
Austin and Derek
Like if you buy a put, it's like a leveraged way of shorting company.
00:53:41
Austin
Yeah.
00:53:41
Austin and Derek
Right, so let's say the stock's at 100, you think it's gonna go down, you buy the 95 put, right? You buy it. If the stock goes down to 90, you know, you've made extrinsic value plus $500 because it's the 95 to 90 spread. Okay.
00:53:59
Austin
Yeah.
00:54:00
Austin and Derek
So that means that you are allowed to sell a hundred shares of the underlying stock at $95, even though the stock is trading at $90.
00:54:10
Austin and Derek
Okay.
00:54:11
Austin
Yeah. Yeah.
00:54:14
Austin and Derek
That's, that doesn't just happen for free. Like that's, that's not a bank doing that. That's somebody else has to go and then sell that side of it. So if I like the stock at a hundred dollars, I definitely am going to like it at $95.
00:54:28
Austin and Derek
Let's say sell a 95 cash secured Okay. a I get to collect the premium. So when the person buys the put, it goes straight into my account when I sell it, right?
00:54:39
Austin and Derek
It's like a kind of peer to peer. The brokerage is the middleman, right?
00:54:43
Austin
Yeah.
00:54:44
Austin and Derek
If the stock goes down to 90, I then have to buy hundred shares of the company at 95 because that's what the contract said.
00:54:54
Austin and Derek
So that's a cash secured put.
00:54:56
Austin
Yep.
00:54:56
Austin and Derek
It's using money that you have in your account. I'd have $95,000 in the account or sorry, $9,500 in the account.
00:55:02
Austin and Derek
There's also a way that you can do it called a naked put, where you don't have the $9,500 in your account.
00:55:10
Austin
Okay.
00:55:12
Austin and Derek
And that's free, interest free.
00:55:14
Austin
Wait, but where do you get the money from? Is it borrowing against your stock or is it just a loan?
00:55:21
Austin and Derek
Yeah, so in a margin account, each stock is kind of like, quote unquote, weighted based off their risk.
00:55:21
Austin
Yeah.
00:55:28
Austin and Derek
some of them you only need to put like, so let's say with a hundred dollars stock, right? If I buy a hundred shares of that, that's $10,000. Okay.
00:55:40
Austin
Yeah.
00:55:40
Austin and Derek
So I put $10,000 of cash into this company that I think is going to appreciate or whatever. I don't really like buying companies that go down, but people do maybe for things, but the brokerage will say, okay, this company is at X amount of risk. We're going to give you $5,000 in buying power.
00:56:02
Austin and Derek
That's what called buying power.
00:56:04
Austin
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:56:05
Austin and Derek
And so that's margin. So now if I were to go, buy a comp buy something yeah it's so so sometimes it's 50 sometimes it's uh 66 like i've seen it to where it's like one to three or one to like for every dollar i put in they give me two yeah uh sometimes it's zero like like game stop is zero cantor fitzgerald cep is zero
00:56:09
Austin
So that's 50% because you said 10,000, right? Yeah.
00:56:20
Austin
You mean two to three? Yeah.
00:56:31
Austin
Mm-hmm. Meaning you can't get margin?
00:56:34
Austin and Derek
Yeah, it's too
00:56:34
Austin
Yeah. Yeah.
00:56:35
Austin and Derek
don't want to loan against it.
00:56:36
Austin and Derek
But then you take that money and however much you have of that. So let's say you do that for 10 different stocks, right? So in this account, you have $100,000, 10 different stocks. one gives $5,000.
00:56:48
Austin and Derek
That's $50,000 in buying power that you can then naked puts against.
00:56:55
Austin and Derek
to create income. And it's tax free because you're not actually using the money. You're only using the money when you buy it.
00:57:02
Austin and Derek
So let's say a naked put.
00:57:03
Austin
When you buy the stock, so you're not buying the stock.
00:57:05
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
00:57:07
Austin and Derek
You're not buying the stock.
00:57:09
Austin
So what are you buying? put, which is a contract and a contract is not.
00:57:12
Austin and Derek
You're not buying anything. When you sell a naked put, you are saying, will use the money if this put goes against me.
00:57:18
Austin
Yes.
00:57:25
Austin and Derek
So it takes up your buying power, but it...
00:57:26
Austin
Oh, so, so it's a, but you're basically buying a contract saying if this happens, then the money will move. Is that what
00:57:35
Austin and Derek
Yeah, selling the contract. The other person would be buying it. So you're using the bank, you're using...
00:57:40
Austin
you're saying? You're selling the contract.
00:57:42
Austin and Derek
Yeah, you're selling the contract. So you're saying to, in this case, Charles Schwab...
00:57:48
Austin
Yes.
00:57:48
Austin and Derek
Hey, if, if this company that I'm selling this put at for 95 goes to 90, then I'll use, then i will use 95 of 9,500 of your dollars to buy the shares.
00:57:56
Austin
Yes.
00:58:02
Austin and Derek
And then only, and only then will, I'll pay, I'll pay you interest.
00:58:08
Austin
What? So you're not even paying interest at all in the... so it's not taxable and you're not paying interest on an that scenario at all?
00:58:16
Austin and Derek
No, it's taxable because you're getting an income. I mean, the point of like when somebody sells you the naked put or sorry, when somebody buying it, that's considered income and it's short term capital gains, essentially, unless you hold it for more than a year, then it's long term, which you can do.
00:58:24
Austin
Yeah. Buying.
00:58:34
Austin
Wait, so then why would you want to pay taxes if your interest is going to be less than your taxes?
00:58:41
Austin and Derek
Because i I still own shares.
00:58:45
Austin
Oh, because you don't sell. But wait wait. So you own it, but then you pay taxes without selling.
00:58:51
Austin and Derek
You pay taxes, but it's like you're still making money. It's extra money.
00:58:56
Austin
ah ah Okay, I see what you're saying. I mean, either way, like...
00:58:58
Austin and Derek
i mean, the interest rates on them right now are like 10 to
00:59:04
Austin and Derek
So, so you have to, you have to pick a good stock. I mean, if it averages eight to 12%, right. I mean, you're, you're barely breaking even, you know what i mean?
00:59:04
Austin
Yeah.
00:59:14
Austin
No, you're doing...
00:59:14
Austin and Derek
So it's worth it.
00:59:15
Austin
No, you're not doing anything...
00:59:15
Austin and Derek
It's worth it for me to, it's worth it for me to pay a little bit in taxes, I guess, to, to not have to pay interest.
00:59:26
Austin
No, yeah.
00:59:26
Austin and Derek
There's,
00:59:26
Austin
I mean, yeah, because, ah ah yeah, that's the thing. It's like with capital gains, people act like you do something like that's bad. It's an indication that you've won.
00:59:37
Austin and Derek
Yeah, if you pay taxes, that means you made
00:59:39
Austin
make then like trade or whatever,
00:59:43
Austin and Derek
Out of something that you didn't have before.
00:59:46
Austin
Yeah, yeah, it's, yeah. And that's, yeah and that's why I'm a big proponent on, you know, getting paid in Bitcoin and just, you know, paying, paying your expenses with it. Because even if it's a taxable event, I still have more money end of the day. Like, yeah, I don't know. But the whole borrowing against thing is interesting to me, just in general, because instead selling it to get rid of it and then paying 30%, now you keep it and you only pay interest, which is 10% or whatever.
01:00:21
Austin
What would you rather do, get rid of it and spend 30% to 40% keep it and only spend 10%?
01:00:29
Austin and Derek
The math works in our favor.
01:00:30
Austin
So, yeah, but i don't know.
01:00:30
Austin and Derek
Hey, I I got to let you go for a second. I have to go use the restroom. I'll be right back.
01:00:37
Austin
All right.
01:00:40
Austin
Might as well.
01:00:57
Austin and Derek
All right, I'm back.
01:01:00
Austin
Welcome back.
01:01:01
Austin and Derek
Find a way to edit that out.
01:01:04
Austin and Derek
So but here's what's really cool is speaking about like the leverage in a brokerage is that the loan that I took out against my Bitcoin
01:01:04
Austin
sure.
01:01:14
Austin
hmm. Mm
01:01:14
Austin and Derek
put into stock. So now I have two forms of appreciation.
01:01:21
Austin
hmm.
01:01:22
Austin and Derek
And then with the leverage that I now like the buying power of that stock, I can then sell naked puts. So that's a third form of leverage, essentially compounding.
01:01:38
Austin and Derek
And then with that income that I've been making from the naked puts and the covered calls, I've been putting it into MSTY.
01:01:48
Austin
Yeah. Yeah.
01:01:49
Austin and Derek
I have like four layers going right here of compounding.
01:01:54
Austin
Yeah.
01:01:54
Austin and Derek
I don't know if I love MSTY. got my first distribution and I guess I thought the Nav erosion was gonna be a lot less than it was.
01:01:57
Austin
Yep.
01:02:04
Austin and Derek
I mean, it literally, I it was like $1.80 per share and the stock tanked that day, $1.80.
01:02:07
Austin
Yeah.
01:02:11
Austin
Yeah.
01:02:12
Austin and Derek
And it hasn't really appreciated since.
01:02:14
Austin and Derek
So I don't, um I bought it now hoping that MicroStrategy does
01:02:21
Austin and Derek
increase because they, part of it is they do buy calls as well. So if the stock goes up, they do get a little bit of upside potential, but I don't know.
01:02:31
Austin and Derek
It's cause I, I was like telling my parents that they should buy into it, but I don't, after the first, the first distribution, I don't, I know if that's necessarily the case.
01:02:35
Austin
Yeah.
01:02:40
Austin
Yeah. Yeah. It's, uh, yeah. The erosion is pretty bad. will say,
01:02:44
Austin and Derek
Yeah. Yeah.
01:02:48
Austin
the yield is amazing though. I mean, what you got one 80 per share on a, on a quarterly payment or is it a monthly payment?
01:02:54
Austin and Derek
monthly.
01:02:55
Austin
Oh, it's monthly. Oh my goodness.
01:02:56
Austin and Derek
Yeah. It's like a hundred and it's like 130% distribution yield.
01:02:57
Austin
It's a hundred. I'm looking at it now. It's one 40. Yeah.
01:03:02
Austin and Derek
One 40.
01:03:03
Austin
Yep.
01:03:03
Austin and Derek
But I mean, if you're just, if you're just recycling the money, i that's essentially because, because what I did is then with that income, I just bought more shares of it.
01:03:11
Austin
Yeah.
01:03:11
Austin and Derek
But I mean, it's essentially just recycling the same money you have. So, I mean, if it's, if it truly is 140%,
01:03:19
Austin and Derek
you're probably only making 40% because 100% of the capital was returned to you plus then 40%. So, I mean, you're still up. I don't know. got to play around with it a little bit more. I got to learn about it. I didn't put a ton of money into it, but it's one of those those that I've seen it on Twitter.
01:03:35
Austin and Derek
People are retiring with it.
01:03:38
Austin and Derek
I don't think it's necessarily a long-term thing, but we'll see. I mean, it it basically just plays on the volatility of MicroStrategy. And as long as micro strategy stays volatile, which honestly it hasn't really been that volatile because he's just been at the money buying Bitcoin.
01:03:58
Austin
Yeah.
01:03:58
Austin and Derek
don't know.
01:03:59
Austin
Yeah.
01:04:01
Austin and Derek
We'll see what happens. Worst comes to worst. I'm 25 years old. If I lose it all, start over.
01:04:08
Austin
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
01:04:11
Austin
Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, I don't know if, I don't really know too much about MSTY in the sense of that strategy. erosion is pretty pretty bad but i i mean like you said you're really getting 40% I mean yeah I don't know it might be a short term good short term income play just to get income but don't know
01:04:27
Austin and Derek
If that,
01:04:32
Austin and Derek
that's kind of what I was hoping was that the loan against my Bitcoin would create income strategies that would then pay for the monthly payments on my car.
01:04:42
Austin
what the MSTY would be the income for the car
01:04:45
Austin and Derek
Well, so I bought Tesla as well. So I bought a hundred shares of Tesla and then selling covered calls on that for income.
01:04:53
Austin
Yeah.
01:04:53
Austin and Derek
And then I'm using now the extra buying power to sell naked puts on TSLL, which is a double lever Tesla ETF.
01:05:02
Austin
Yeah.
01:05:03
Austin and Derek
And then with the income of that, I'm then buying MSTY. And I was hoping over the year, would i be able to get it to where I'm making enough for my car payment in MSTY then be able to sell my Tesla shares and then pay off my Bitcoin loan.
01:05:22
Austin and Derek
Or roll it, you know, or pay down and enough of the principal to then take out another amount of dollars, hopefully for a smaller amount of Bitcoin. Save some of my Bitcoin, get the same amount of money back out, invest it in more stocks and just grow it that way, you know.
01:05:37
Austin
Right. Yeah.
01:05:39
Austin and Derek
I don't know. It's new, but I know I'm a hands-on learner, so I wouldn't have you know.
01:05:44
Austin
Yeah.
01:05:44
Austin and Derek
Plus the emotions are in play too. know, this game is not not the faint of heart.
01:05:50
Austin
No, it's not.
01:05:54
Austin
Not for the weak-hearted. Yeah. That's pretty smart, though. I mean, there's lot of layers into it, but don't know, it seems to be working.
01:06:07
Austin and Derek
So far, so far. So I took out enough to use the loan to pay off the first year's interest.
01:06:16
Austin and Derek
um um I have to pay $41.50.
01:06:18
Austin
For the Bitcoin loan?
01:06:20
Austin and Derek
Yeah, so I have to pay $41,055 in interest in 12 months.
01:06:26
Austin and Derek
I took out enough to where parked that money into Bitcoin. So I do have a little bit of Bitcoin leverage going on as well there. And then the rest of the money I put into the stock market.
01:06:40
Austin and Derek
And right now I'm up everything. Like this is interest including, payback included. I'm up which is, so see my car's around 30 that i just bought.
01:06:47
Austin
Okay.
01:06:52
Austin and Derek
So 30 divided by six is five. So at 20%, 20% of my car in two months,
01:07:01
Austin
You pay 20% of your car in two months?
01:07:04
Austin and Derek
I, if I were to sell every, if I were to sell everything right now and put it all towards my car, it would be 20% of my car.
01:07:05
Austin
Or you can. Yeah. Yeah.
01:07:11
Austin and Derek
That's right. 6,000 divided by
01:07:14
Austin
Yeah. Yeah, that's right.
01:07:18
Austin
Close to that.
01:07:20
Austin and Derek
Yeah. Not including taxes, you know, cause I'm, I'd be up, but
01:07:22
Austin
Hmm.
01:07:27
Austin and Derek
don't i really care about selling my, the shares in my stock, but I really kinda, now that I have that Bitcoin, I don't really wanna sell it So I'm trying to make enough to pay for the car and keep my, keep that Bitcoin that I've set aside for interest.
01:07:41
Austin
Yeah, I mean, in the plan, if as long as you don't sell, then think you're doing pretty good with that.
01:07:46
Austin and Derek
Yeah. And have a car out of the, at the end of it.
01:07:50
Austin
Yeah, yeah. Let's
01:07:53
Austin
see.
01:07:57
Austin
that be possible? I'm kind of thinking the sense of using that strategy in a house, would that kind of be, would you do the same thing with that or would it more simplified?
01:08:06
Austin and Derek
so what my plan is now. Cause I'm going to have to add another layer to it eventually. and um Like Mark Moss says this would, I mean, kind of consider all of that to be layer one or I guess layer two, layer one is just holding the Bitcoin.
01:08:18
Austin
the, oh, fifth layer?
01:08:29
Austin and Derek
I consider that all to be layer two because it's kind of all for the so purpose of the car. Layer three, I think would be to grow the stock portfolio enough to,
01:08:41
Austin
So, and also this is a brokerage account for the stock portfolio, right? Okay.
01:08:45
Austin and Derek
yeah, this is, yeah, this is not a tax deferred one.
01:08:48
Austin
Okay.
01:08:49
Austin and Derek
This is, this is brokerage. So the next, the next layer would be to grow the stock portfolio enough to where I actually do pay interest on it.
01:09:01
Austin and Derek
because you can get it to a point like that buying power is considered cash.
01:09:06
Austin and Derek
So I can just go to the transfer money, going back to the 100,000 one. So I have $100,000 in stock, $50,000 in buying power.
01:09:17
Austin and Derek
I can just pull $20,000 in cash out of that and then just pay interest on it. You know what i mean? It'd
01:09:17
Austin
yep
01:09:23
Austin
yeah well what's the interest
01:09:26
Austin and Derek
be expensive, probably 10 15%.
01:09:29
Austin
Okay, yeah.
01:09:30
Austin and Derek
But if, but if the portfolio is paying for itself, i don't really care. I mean, I don't, I mean, as long as it's breaking even.
01:09:35
Austin
Well, yeah, if it yields more than 10 15, then who cares?
01:09:39
Austin and Derek
Yeah. Plus I have the Bitcoin appreciation. Plus I have the stock appreciation. Then I think that's when I would maybe buy real estate property.
01:09:52
Austin and Derek
cause then it's a third layer. Then you'd have the house appreciating. It would have income to help pay for the brokerage account or the Bitcoin. Plus then you get into the tax benefits of depreciation and expenses and all that stuff.
01:10:09
Austin and Derek
I just don't know if it's going like longterm, if it's going to be Bitcoin, like if that's the case and i i might as well borrow against my brokers to buy more Bitcoin, you know?
01:10:19
Austin
But what do you mean long term for Yeah.
01:10:22
Austin and Derek
Like I think, I think, you know, I can't remember if it was in Fiat Foods or one of the books I read. He said there will be a day when real estate is like buying a home is the same as buying a car in a sense that you buy it.
01:10:38
Austin and Derek
And when you buy it, that's the most expensive it's ever going to be. And it's just going to depreciate over the years because, know, wear and house is going to turn it into shit, you the grass is going to come through the gravel, you all the appliances are going to be old.
01:10:53
Austin and Derek
he said, if you truly price it in Bitcoin already, that's happening, which means that Bitcoin is beating homes. So I just don't know if... It sounds like a lot of work to do for something that if I were to... Even with the tax benefits, if were to just buy Bitcoin, I still would beat it. you
01:11:11
Austin
Yeah. Compared to real estate as investment. Yeah. I mean, no, I believe it 100%.
01:11:13
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
01:11:16
Austin
I think, yeah. that's a good perspective on real estate being similar to a car. I mean, I, yeah, if you can, and I remember learning this like years ago, back in COVID, like if you priced, yeah if you, if you saved your money in rice, right?
01:11:35
Austin
Like if you just had bags of rice, The house is still the fucking same. It's the same thing. It's really just because the dollar has gone down now because you're measuring houses and dollars that only go down.
01:11:48
Austin
It's because it's really all the same price. And really the only way to increase value in a house is to remodel it. It is to fix it up. It's, you know, you add a pool in the backyard.
01:11:58
Austin
You, I don't know, you just improve it, which that makes more sense.
01:12:02
Austin and Derek
cost capital.
01:12:03
Austin
Yeah. Yeah, you invest in it to make it worth more, right? That's how it should be, but that's not how it is. You can literally have the same house and it never change and it actually becoming more dilapidated and it will be worth more.
01:12:21
Austin and Derek
Yeah. so was talking to some captains.
01:12:22
Austin
You know, it's like...
01:12:23
Austin and Derek
I was talking to some captains about this because You know, I talked to you and I'm on Twitter and all these things. So I think that there's a huge movement going on. Then you got in the real world and there's not a movement of Bitcoin yet. Like we're so early still, you know.
01:12:37
Austin
Yeah, way too early, yeah.
01:12:39
Austin and Derek
But I mean, I talked to them and they're well, not just use that money to go buy real estate? Like real estate's appreciating, you know, my house went up, you know, double in the past five years. And I have a house out of it, they say.
01:12:50
Austin and Derek
I'm like, well, let's think about this. what changed about your house?
01:12:56
Austin
nothing. Yeah.
01:12:57
Austin and Derek
And they're like, what do you mean?
01:12:59
Austin and Derek
like, well, I mean, for value to be added, value has to be added. So for the value of the property to go up, what did you do to do that?
01:13:09
Austin
to make it more valuable.
01:13:10
Austin and Derek
I just held I'm like, okay, perfect. You just held it. So there's things about that.
01:13:16
Austin and Derek
Uh, and really it's one thing, right? So supply and demand, they're always like, oh, supply and demand, you know, the, the, how there's a housing shortage and all these things. I'm yeah, okay. So there's, there's a rising demand for the same amount of houses.
01:13:27
Austin and Derek
Sure. I don't necessarily agree with that. Every time you go to, there's a new apartment complex, there's, there's new houses, there's new developments that are newer.
01:13:35
Austin and Derek
Right. So they're nicer. So whatever, we'll go with that. We'll say that there's a high demand for the rising demand for, uh, the lower supplier, remaining supply.
01:13:43
Austin
Lower supply.
01:13:46
Austin and Derek
Right. They're like, yeah, that's why my house went up. I'm like, yeah, but also you have a supply and demand of another thing, right? Which is called the dollar. Did your house double in value or did the dollar go down 50% in value?
01:13:59
Austin and Derek
Cause that would result in the same, in the same exact, in the same exact value, you know, price of your home.
01:14:01
Austin
Same thing. Yeah.
01:14:07
Austin and Derek
And they're like, uh, the, I'm like, just think about it.
01:14:08
Austin
those a bit Yeah, Yeah.
01:14:11
Austin and Derek
I mean, the groceries that you go at the store, they're more expensive. like, yeah, I'm like, Did they change?
01:14:18
Austin and Derek
Is this Apple, is this Apple still an Apple, right?
01:14:18
Austin
No, they actually get worse.
01:14:20
Austin
They actually get worse. They get worse.
01:14:23
Austin and Derek
Truly in a truly capitalist society, as we innovate technology, as we innovate efficiency, prices should go down.
01:14:29
Austin
Things should be going down. Yes. Yes, 100%. Yeah.
01:14:34
Austin and Derek
And why, why have they not?
Economic Decision-Making and Bitcoin
01:14:37
Austin and Derek
Oh, supply, it's supply and demand, man. Supply.
01:14:39
Austin
Yeah, it's supply and demand.
01:14:39
Austin and Derek
So it's,
01:14:40
Austin
Yeah, sure, buddy. Yeah.
01:14:43
Austin
Dude, we've been able to create more food than ever.
01:14:47
Austin
We have the technology to have, literally we, like we farm to the greatest capacity possible in history.
01:14:54
Austin and Derek
With the best technology, with the best.
01:14:56
Austin
Yeah, we have the best technology. We literally, you know, it's like, how is food not cheaper?
01:15:01
Austin and Derek
So, so my, my family is in ag a little bit and I worked with crop dusters for a little bit and the summer I worked with them, it was a really wet season and farmers were really struggling to get their crops in the ground.
01:15:02
Austin
You know? Mm-hmm.
01:15:11
Austin
Mm-hmm.
01:15:15
Austin and Derek
They, they planted all of the Midwest in a week.
01:15:21
Austin
What?
01:15:21
Austin and Derek
They got one week of dry enough ground. They planted the whole Midwest and one week.
01:15:28
Austin
In one week.
01:15:29
Austin and Derek
Yes.
01:15:31
Austin
and yet all the food that is based on that, it's more expensive than it's ever been. Like, come Supply and demand. Well, there's your supply and demand. The supply literally just got rejuvenated in a week.
01:15:44
Austin
And it's still more expensive. Come on, dude.
01:15:46
Austin and Derek
Yeah. So it's, it's kind of fun to see some, some of them have like a a little bit of like, Oh crap, he might be, what he might be saying. Like that might be, that might be true. Like I gotta think about that, you know?
01:15:56
Austin
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
01:15:58
Austin
Yeah,
01:15:59
Austin and Derek
I don't know.
01:16:00
Austin
yeah.
01:16:01
Austin and Derek
We're at time now, if you were to buy real estate, I'm sure you would make money, but it just, you know, you gotta out the time. Like we're flipping this house and we just got, we're just listing It'll go live on Friday.
01:16:11
Austin and Derek
It's like, that was 14 months of my life. You it's like,
01:16:13
Austin
yeah
01:16:15
Austin and Derek
yeah, I worked for it. We're probably going to make okay-ish money. like my Bitcoin stack went up way more money than I will make in that house in that same amount of time.
01:16:27
Austin
Yep.
01:16:27
Austin and Derek
And I didn't have to do anything for that.
01:16:29
Austin
Yep. No, you just held it, dude. That's the hardest part.
01:16:33
Austin and Derek
Yeah. Yeah.
01:16:34
Austin
guy making 50% on his home. He's just like, oh, I just held it and it just goes up.
01:16:41
Austin
Yeah.
01:16:41
Austin and Derek
Uh, this last captain I flew with, he was talking about it and he said, yeah, man, like we, you know, my last house had like a 2% rate or 3%, something, something cheap.
01:16:52
Austin and Derek
And he said the value went up so much, like we had a hundred K in equity.
01:16:53
Austin
Yeah. Yeah.
01:16:56
Austin and Derek
And so we sold it and bought a new house, you know, rolled that into the down payment. And then he's like, it doesn't really feel like we got a new home though, because the payments are
01:17:07
Austin
Yeah.
01:17:08
Austin and Derek
Much more expensive. It's a higher interest rate. You know, obviously we made money on that house because real estate markets at ah at high, which means that the house that we bought is also at a high.
01:17:18
Austin
Yeah.
01:17:19
Austin and Derek
So he was kind of like, holy cow, like this game might be rigged a little bit.
01:17:25
Austin
Yeah, I mean, I don't know. You probably should have kept the other one if you really, i don't know. I mean, it's 3%. It was probably cheap. and Yeah, because I mean, the next house you're going to get, it's going to be more expensive, right? Like you're really, you're thinking you're going downstream when you're really just battling upstream, you know, if everything's going up and you're trying to get the new and biggest new and bigger, shinier house, like you're going to spend more for it, you know? Wow.
01:17:55
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
01:17:55
Austin
You know,
01:17:56
Austin and Derek
But, you know, it's also like this whole like Bitcoin thing has made me realize that we are only here for such a short amount of time. It's kind of like this whole car thing too. It's like I was driving a crappy car.
01:18:11
Austin and Derek
Now I'm not.
01:18:12
Austin
Yeah.
01:18:12
Austin and Derek
I'm paying for it and it's expensive, but it's freaking nice, man. It's got adaptive cruise control.
01:18:17
Austin
Yeah.
01:18:18
Austin and Derek
I don't have to touch the brake ever anymore.
01:18:20
Austin
Yeah. 90%.
01:18:23
Austin and Derek
and you know, it's got Apple CarPlay. I've noticed a like 90% reduction in my texting and driving.
01:18:32
Austin and Derek
Yeah. Like this overnight, just by getting in new car, man.
01:18:35
Austin and Derek
So now I'm driving safer.
01:18:37
Austin
Yeah.
01:18:37
Austin and Derek
like it's, it feels good to have nice things,
01:18:41
Austin
Yeah.
01:18:43
Austin and Derek
but
01:18:43
Austin
Yeah. I mean, yeah, that goes back to the point of, what is it? Yeah. Like you buy and save in Bitcoin, but again, like at the end of the live a limited time, you have limited time. You're going to, it just brings back to the point of like,
01:18:58
Austin
okay, you're a better economic decision maker now that you have something that grows, right? And it's like, well, do I value this thing right now? Is it worth it in the long term? Does it make sense for me to do it?
01:19:10
Austin
Or am I just wasting my money? Because most people, when they buy stuff, they just waste, they end up not, they they just over consume and they don't, they, you know, they produce, or sorry, they consume more than they produce at the end of the day, right?
01:19:24
Austin
You know, you can't, live life that way or else you're just going to destroy yourself first of all financially and then to you know just like mentally you know because all you do is consume consume you don't produce right because in order to consume you have to produce you know in theory yeah but yeah but uh yeah i don't know it's you just have to be a better it just forces you to be a better economic decision maker and i'm sure
01:19:40
Austin and Derek
In theory. In a capitalist society.
01:19:55
Austin
You know, you talk like it seems like with your car, you made the right decision, even though it costs a lot of money. Right. But yeah, it's you finding whether or not that value is worth it now at that moment.
01:20:07
Austin
And if you really needed it. Right. Because at the end of the day you know, yes, Bitcoin grows at 50%, but I have to still eat. I have to still put a roof over in my head. I still have to, you know, drive my car, you know.
01:20:21
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
01:20:21
Austin
There's stuff you to do, right? You can't just like avoid not paying for things. Like you have to pay for things.
01:20:26
Austin and Derek
Yeah, you're starting to see, especially after Steak and Shake, because they accept Bitcoin now, right?
01:20:33
Austin
Yep. Mm-hmm.
01:20:34
Austin and Derek
You're starting to see a movement of pretty high up people like I think, remember if Adam Backer, if it was Samuel Mao. Those are like early Bitcoin developers.
01:20:45
Austin and Derek
they worked with Satoshi. They, one of them is saying this doesn't work if people don't spend their Bitcoin. Like, you know what mean?
01:20:52
Austin
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
01:20:54
Austin and Derek
Like the more people that use the network and see the benefits of it is going to bring more people to the network to see the benefit of it. Actually, Samuel Mao, he has a company, Jan3, which has the Aqua wallet. I don't know if you've looked into that one.
01:21:09
Austin and Derek
It's mobile only, but it's got Lightning, it's got Liquid, it's got, you know, Tether and all the different on all the different blockchains. So I actually use that use that a little bit now, but I haven't still haven't bought anything, but he's designing it to be like something that you can just go use. You know what i mean?
01:21:27
Austin and Derek
Where like Sparrow is definitely a very, you know, off the grid, you know, don't ever touch your Bitcoin. It's more for HODLers where Aqua is more for medium of exchangers, you know?
01:21:41
Austin
Yeah.
01:21:42
Austin
Yeah. Yeah. It's the same. It's the same with really any like lightning wallet or cause what with lightning wallet you can pay or wet. Sorry. With, uh, with steak and shake, you can only pay with lightning Bitcoin.
01:21:56
Austin and Derek
Right.
01:21:56
Austin
So, uh, yeah, it's just, it's just differentiating between, especially the way, you know, getting the technical aspect of holding Bitcoin, you know, you have the main net layer one and then you go to layer two,
01:22:08
Austin
Especially in the mobile platforms, it's really easy to to use, right? It's just another form of making it a better medium exchange. Lightning is amazing. I think it's so cool. I think it's so cool. I mean, I remember back when I was using Lightning on Blue Wallet, I didn't even figure out. I had a problem with getting the Bitcoin mainnet into Lightning and then trying getting it out and putting it into mainnet. That's one thing I had trouble with, and I think Strike does a good job with that because basically...
01:22:37
Austin
you know, can send you lightning Bitcoin right now through strike or really like if you use a different wallet, let's say if you use Aqua whatever and you have a lightning Bitcoin, you can send it to me and I receive it immediately and I can use it immediately to pay my bills through strike.
01:22:54
Austin
It's like, it's, it's the perfect, it's so good. It's so good. Like literally I could have a business or I just do something on the side and I just say, Hey, just pay me in lightning.
01:23:05
Austin
You know, like, I don't know, like I make like someone coffee or I don't know, I make someone like a lemonade. have like a lemonade stand or something. Pay me in Lightning, boom, put in Strike. And now that's spendable money that I can pay off my bills with from Strike.
01:23:20
Austin
And I just, and was immediate cash finality, immediate. The only thing that's immediate cash finality that I can use pay bill
01:23:26
Austin and Derek
I saw this video. I saw this video on Twitter and it was comparing gold to, in this case, it was lightning, um it was, you know, Bitcoin. And it said,
01:23:42
Austin and Derek
know, how long it takes to transfer gold versus Bitcoin. And it was a video of an armored truck going through town with police officers on both sides of it. know, there was there gold inside the armored truck and it was, you know, driving down the road pretty slowly.
01:23:52
Austin
Yeah.
01:23:57
Austin and Derek
there was a group of like 10 guys and they just lightninged one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10 to each other. Like they would
01:24:05
Austin
Yeah.
01:24:06
Austin and Derek
send it and then send it. And they got through like 10 people in the time the truck went like 30 feet.
01:24:12
Austin
Yeah.
01:24:14
Austin and Derek
And that was for one transaction in gold, you know, this was 10 different transactions on the lightning.
01:24:19
Austin and Derek
So, I mean, it's, it's, it's going to be, it's going to be interesting. You know, you think about going back to banks again, um and how people put their money in a bank, which is fine.
01:24:33
Austin and Derek
I've done it for years. My parents do it. It's fine. It's safe. But what happens when you need money on the weekend?
01:24:42
Austin
Yeah, you can't do that. Yeah.
01:24:44
Austin and Derek
You know the Cardones?
01:24:46
Austin
Yeah.
01:24:47
Austin and Derek
So Gary Cardone, which is Grant's brother. i don't know if they're twins or not. I didn't even know he existed because he doesn't really advertise.
01:24:53
Austin
Yeah. Gary, yeah. He looks exactly like him.
01:24:56
Austin and Derek
Yeah, I think they're twins.
01:24:57
Austin
He's the BitConer and Grant's obviously real estate guy. Yeah.
01:25:02
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
01:25:02
Austin
I mean, they're both in the real estate, but Gary actually like a light bulb go off and like, yeah, Bitcoin is...
01:25:07
Austin and Derek
So he made this video where he said you you should do both.
01:25:08
Austin
way better than say it.
01:25:11
Austin and Derek
You should do real estate and Bitcoin because there's benefits to both.
01:25:14
Austin
Yeah.
01:25:15
Austin and Derek
But he said the best benefit that I have found about Bitcoin is that you can – there, I guess in, in real estate deals and like the big, like he's talking like apartment complexes.
01:25:28
Austin
Millions.
01:25:29
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
01:25:29
Austin
Yeah.
01:25:29
Austin and Derek
Millions of dollars. There is a clause on a lot of these contracts that the the apartment has to be sold by, know, 5 PM on Friday or something like that.
01:25:42
Austin and Derek
Or, or maybe it's, you know, 5 PM on Saturday. I think it was actually like a Saturday thing. And if there's no buyers by 5 PM on Friday,
01:25:53
Austin and Derek
then there's not going to be any buyers on Saturday because the banks are closed.
01:25:58
Austin
Yeah.
01:25:59
Austin and Derek
So he, he goes to these people, he finds these contracts that are expiring on Saturdays and goes to them Friday night at 9 PM and says, okay, if you can find a buyer that's going to give you the money by tomorrow.
01:26:13
Austin and Derek
Okay. But if not, I'll, I'll, I'll pay you in Bitcoin. I can get it you in five minutes.
01:26:18
Austin
Yeah.
01:26:19
Austin and Derek
And they're like, well, that's awesome. And he said, awesome. Well, I'm not going to buy for full price. You're going to me a 70% discount.
01:26:23
Austin
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:26:25
Austin and Derek
So he's buying apartment complexes for 30 cents on the dollar because he can literally transact when the banks can't.
01:26:31
Austin
That's insane. Wait, wait, so he gets 70% discount?
01:26:35
Austin and Derek
Sometimes. I think in the video he was saying 70 to 50% off.
01:26:37
Austin
Dude, what? What? What?
01:26:41
Austin and Derek
He says, yeah, it's a taxable event because he had to like technically, you know, when you transfer your Bitcoin, it's still considered a selling event.
01:26:46
Austin
Transfer, ESL, yeah.
01:26:50
Austin
Yeah.
01:26:50
Austin and Derek
he says, but then it's like, you know, I just bought an apartment that's gonna depreciate.
01:26:54
Austin and Derek
I bought, know, there's so many expenses in this apartment that I can now, you know, use as expenses for the capital for gains taxes.
01:27:00
Austin
Appreciation.
01:27:01
Austin and Derek
And plus I can just go buy a jet if I need to. And that'll be a business expense because now I have an apartment in another city that I need to travel to.
01:27:10
Austin
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
01:27:14
Austin
Dude, wait, wait. So wait, so when they, oh, I see. Wait, so what happens if it expires? Is it just like a whole process where it's more costly for them for it to expire than to, it to not buy like through Bitcoin basically?
01:27:30
Austin and Derek
So that's what it sounded like. I have to rewatch the video.
01:27:31
Austin
Yeah.
01:27:32
Austin and Derek
It's been, probably a year since I've watched it, but it sounded like somebody is going to get in a lot of trouble if the apartment doesn't sell, if they don't receive the money by Saturday at 5 PM.
01:27:39
Austin
Yeah.
01:27:42
Austin and Derek
And so he waits until the banks close and says, can get you the money by Saturday at 5 PM for, for cheap.
01:27:44
Austin
Yeah.
01:27:49
Austin
Yeah. Yeah. With Bitcoin. Yeah.
01:27:52
Austin and Derek
Yeah. So I, I just once he actually, i don't know if you follow him on Twitter. He every couple of days he'll do like a ah ah Bitcoin community.
01:28:04
Austin and Derek
What are they called? Like guest note or what they called on Twitter when they have like live group versions?
01:28:10
Austin
Oh, yeah. I forgot what those are called. It's where everyone's talking live.
01:28:15
Austin and Derek
Yeah, he does those a couple times a week and they're pretty interesting to sit on and on.
01:28:16
Austin
Yeah.
01:28:22
Austin and Derek
But mean, he's obviously very, very, he was very wealthy before he found Bitcoin too.
01:28:27
Austin
Yeah, yeah.
01:28:28
Austin and Derek
So it's interesting to hear. I mean, because one one of the notes they were talking about, you know, taking debt against your Bitcoin and someone said, well, you know, it's like 15% is so expensive to take ah ah out a loan against Bitcoin.
01:28:40
Austin and Derek
And he's like, why are you taking out loans for 15%? You know, I can just go so-and-so and get like a 6% loan. It's like, well, yeah, but not everybody has access to those people because we don't have those
01:28:53
Austin and Derek
You know, like you're probably going to
01:28:54
Austin
Yeah.
01:28:55
Austin and Derek
equity lending companies. Like there's, there's things that you can do that, that we can't, you know, so 50% is what we have to do.
01:29:00
Austin
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. order to get richer, you have to be rich or on your way or have the connections for it.
01:29:12
Austin
But yeah.
01:29:12
Austin and Derek
Yeah. Someday, someday.
01:29:15
Austin
Someday. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yeah, you can get it at 6%. That's crazy. That's insane. Yeah.
01:29:27
Austin
Yeah, um what else? yeah So you talked about Lightning, what else do you think? know with the, I didn't keep up with the recent Bitcoin conference, but I watched the keynote with Saylor and Jack Mallers.
01:29:41
Austin
That's pretty much it. But what you watch a lot of it? Yeah.
01:29:43
Austin and Derek
I watched some of it and it, it definitely wasn't as interesting as it was last year.
01:29:49
Austin and Derek
mean, last year we Vivek Ramaswamy was there. we had, had, um, RFK jr. Was there, obviously Donald Trump was there and they were all, you know, presidential candidates.
01:29:57
Austin
and Donald Trump.
01:30:02
Austin and Derek
Uh, I think Vivek might've dropped out by then actually, but it was like, this is interesting. Like this could sway, but now it's JD Vance was there. I think Vivek was there as well. Cause he's running for Ohio governor.
01:30:13
Austin and Derek
Like there was interesting enough people. Peter Schiff was there and he was advocating for gold.
01:30:17
Austin
Yeah.
01:30:20
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
01:30:22
Austin
He was advocating for something else on Twitter too, but I can't say
01:30:25
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
01:30:27
Austin and Derek
I don't say that.
01:30:29
Austin
so
01:30:29
Austin and Derek
I mean, it was, it was fine. i mean, it seems like the big thing in the crypto crypto space now is stable coins. think there's a stable coin,
01:30:39
Austin and Derek
bill or act going through the the United States right now. And I don't fully understand it, but obviously Cantor Fitzgerald, Tether and Jack Mueller are getting together. And that's, you know, Tether was, was kind of the the bigger stable coin that was talked about, but I think USDC that's circle, right?
01:30:59
Austin
Yeah.
01:30:59
Austin and Derek
They just went public.
01:31:01
Austin
Oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah, I think I heard about that.
01:31:03
Austin and Derek
Like last week or the week before. So, so it was kind of more just, I mean, Don Jr. and Eric Trump were there. was, it was fine.
01:31:15
Austin and Derek
It was okay.
01:31:16
Austin and Derek
I think, I mean, i think Mark Moss, he put a tweet out that said, like, yeah, it's cool to live stream, but you don't understand. Like I'm making so many connections being here.
01:31:27
Austin and Derek
Like the the stuff that they're talking about stage is cool, but you're not going to ever get the value because you didn't meet the people that I
Bitcoin Conferences and Networking
01:31:33
Austin and Derek
met, you know? So, I think it's probably getting to a point where the keynote speakers, like, they're going to be good, but it's not going to be as groundbreaking as just being there and seeing some of these other companies and, you know, whatever.
01:31:39
Austin
are not as important.
01:31:47
Austin
Yeah, I mean, it's not like a conference about... Because really, the thing is with Bitcoin, the whole aspect and reason why it's Bitcoin and why it's special is because it doesn't change. Like...
01:32:01
Austin
So if you have a conference about something that doesn't change, then what is there to really talk about other than external factors like companies? Basically, it's a Bitcoin company conference mostly.
01:32:15
Austin
Obviously, stuff with regards to Bitcoin companies and you obviously with the financialization of Bitcoin, I think obviously that's going to have a lot of attention, but...
01:32:28
Austin
Bitcoin is something at the base layer doesn't change. It's like, what you going to talk about that hasn't changed because it it stays the same, you know?
01:32:36
Austin and Derek
Yeah, i I I think all the people who were there
01:32:36
Austin
But yeah, I'd say...
01:32:39
Austin and Derek
there was nothing crazy innovative. You what mean? Like the people who are there understand how mining helps small communities.
01:32:42
Austin
Yeah.
01:32:45
Austin and Derek
They understand how it helps the energy grid. They understand all these things. Like last year, I learned a lot about Bitcoin mining from the conference, you know, and how it actually helps smaller infrastructure, smaller, you know, little villages in Africa or whatever.
01:32:59
Austin and Derek
But I don't, I mean, they don't need to rehash that. you saying?
01:33:04
Austin
Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, I think the best thing is probably just going there to meet people. And I've, I've watched YouTube videos of people, some YouTubers that went and they, they said the same thing. It was the most important part was just meeting people that a like, you know, P fans of their YouTube channel, you know, wanted to meet them and say their, their appreciation and love for their channels and stuff like that.
01:33:31
Austin
Being able to meet, people that you talk to through the internet that you probably would have never meet if it wasn't for the conference.
01:33:39
Austin and Derek
Yeah.
01:33:39
Austin
But,
01:33:40
Austin and Derek
i I think I'd like to try to go next year. I know we talked about going this year, but then, you know, life got in the way, but I think we we should try to make it important to go next year.
01:33:43
Austin
Yeah.
01:33:47
Austin
Yeah.
01:33:50
Austin
Is it in Vegas again?
01:33:52
Austin and Derek
I don't know where it is. I don't think it is. I think they tried to rotate because it was in Nashville last year.
01:33:59
Austin
Yeah.
01:34:00
Austin and Derek
Let's ask you at GBT.
01:34:01
Austin
And I think it was in Miami the previous.
01:34:01
Austin and Derek
I was hoping it'd be Miami again.
01:34:07
Austin
Yeah, that'd be pretty cool.
01:34:16
Austin and Derek
I'm searching the web.
01:34:17
Austin
Yeah, yeah, it's in Las Vegas again.
01:34:19
Austin and Derek
Oh, really?
01:34:20
Austin
Yeah, I was wondering that because I heard someone say in a video that it's going to be Las Vegas again. And I'm like, really? But right now it's going for... GA passes are going for $200.
01:34:37
Austin and Derek
Dang.
01:34:38
Austin
So general admission is $200. And then pro $600 whale passes.
01:34:47
Austin and Derek
We probably should go to, probably should probably get the pro pass if going to
01:34:52
Austin and Derek
So chat GPT says the GA a pass pass access to main days expo hall, the pro pass, a full three day access plus lounges plus networking.
01:34:55
Austin
Nice.
01:35:04
Austin and Derek
The whale pass as VIP treatment, backstage access, multiple premium perks after hours pass is entry to official after parties only.
01:35:05
Austin
Okay.
01:35:15
Austin
Nice. They have a hotel bundle. That's fine.
01:35:19
Austin and Derek
I think the hotel bundle is in the pro pass, right?
01:35:19
Austin
I won't need that.
01:35:23
Austin
It says for all.
01:35:24
Austin and Derek
Oh,
01:35:27
Austin
It says for GA Pro, or well, and it's for a four-night state. Oh,
01:35:34
Austin and Derek
really?
01:35:36
Austin
it's at the Venetian. Yeah.
01:35:44
Austin and Derek
ah ah yeah, there's a bundle.
01:35:44
Austin
Yeah, it's a hotel state at the Venetian,
01:35:48
Austin and Derek
Hmm. Something to look into.
01:35:54
Austin
something look at too.
01:36:01
Austin
Yeah, because think it gets more expensive as time goes on, right? I'm sure.
01:36:04
Austin and Derek
It did last year, at least.
01:36:07
Austin
Yeah.
01:36:09
Austin and Derek
Because I think when we...
01:36:09
Austin
Do you remember how much they were when we were looking at them?
01:36:12
Austin and Derek
I was just about to say, I think they might've been around the six to $700. And then like the month before.
01:36:18
Austin
For the pro?
01:36:19
Austin and Derek
Yeah. For the pro. And then I think, uh, like the month before it, it was like 12, 12 50. Yeah.
01:36:26
Austin
Oh, wow. I
01:36:28
Austin and Derek
Uh,
01:36:31
Austin
i don't know. There's usually times where they have deals too. don't know.
01:36:35
Austin and Derek
I think if you, you pay for them in Bitcoin, they're usually cheaper too.
01:36:40
Austin
No way. Really?
01:36:42
Austin and Derek
Let's see.
01:36:44
Austin
me try. it Yeah, let me try paying for it right now.
01:36:48
Austin and Derek
Oof. Passes in a hotel package, starts from 1748.
01:36:57
Austin and Derek
Which means it only goes up from there.
01:37:00
Austin
Yeah, because hotel expense. Yeah, you're paying for a hotel a year in advance. Yeah. Yeah.
01:37:15
Austin
Let's see what it does. Pay with Bitcoin.
01:37:23
Austin
It doesn't say anything about it being cheaper. But, yeah.
01:37:26
Austin and Derek
OK.
01:37:28
Austin
At least give me a 3% discount if I'm not going to pay with credit card. i i don't know. Give you lightning.
01:37:34
Austin
But yeah, I don't know.
01:37:38
Austin and Derek
My Wi-Fi is doing a hiccup again.
01:37:42
Austin and Derek
Can you hear me?
01:37:43
Austin
You're back. Yeah.
01:37:44
Austin and Derek
Yeah, my wife is doing a hiccup again.
01:37:48
Austin
I think it's good now.
01:37:51
Austin and Derek
doesn't say it's good.
01:37:54
Austin and Derek
says I have no bars right now.
01:37:56
Austin and Derek
All right, well, I've got other things I got to do today, so...
01:38:01
Austin
Alright, yeah, anything closing statements on episode
01:38:06
Austin
I got nothing else for me.
01:38:11
Austin
Guess the Wi-Fi hiccuped Once again.
01:38:17
Austin
Once again.
01:38:20
Austin
Welcome back.
01:38:21
Austin and Derek
I'm back.
01:38:23
Austin
thought that's how you would end the video, just like disappearing.
01:38:24
Austin and Derek
That was weird. It literally. No,
01:38:29
Austin
Yeah.
01:38:30
Austin and Derek
we're probably going to lose it again here soon.
01:38:31
Austin
Yeah.
01:38:33
Austin and Derek
don't don't know. That's weird.
01:38:38
Austin and Derek
All right. Well, I will, uh, before I cut out again, will talk to you later.
01:38:43
Austin and Derek
Until the next episode, signing off.