We all have stories about how we first learned about sex. If asked when and how you were told about it, and by whom, what or who comes to mind? Were you given "the talk" by  a parent, or a youth group leader, or maybe your Health teacher at school? Or maybe you were surreptitiously given (or found left in your room) a book or a brochure to read, and perhaps with an invitation to "come back with any questions." Chances are, if you grew up in a Christian family or church context, there is likely some element of shame, fear, or at least discomfort with the topic.  (So kudos if you happen to still be reading.)

And if you were alive and anywhere near evangelical Christianity in the late 1990s, you may remember the iconic cultural phenomenon of "courtship." The surprising catalyst of this movement was then 21-year-old Josh Harris, author of the Christian bestseller, "I Kissed Dating Goodbye."  Harris' take on how to honor God while pursuing a suitable marriage partner practically flew off the shelves, catapulting him to "stardom" and launching him into a career as a public speaker and as a pastor.

Here's the thing, though. Like all 21 year olds, Josh grew up, and unsurprisingly encountered challenges in his professional and personal life that defied simplistic answers. The church where he pastored blew up, spectacularly, and his marriage imploded as well.  

The resulting crisis of faith led him to enroll in seminary, where another strange thing happened:.  When the subject of his book or his preaching and speaking career came up, several of his classmates had stories of how the book had impacted their lives... And, uh, not in a good way. 

People whose faith and humanity he respected told Josh that the messages in his book had conjoined with broader messages in Christian subculture about sexuality, lust, and protecting one's "purity" at all costs. And the cumulative effect had left lots of them feeling tremendous shame.  Shame for the mere fact that they had sexual thoughts. Or for the fact that they had little idea what to do with sexual desire when there was little courting opportunity to be found. And many described having found themselves,  once married, horribly ill-informed and unequipped to have a sex life at all (let alone a fulfilling one).

How Josh responded was courageous. He listened--first to these seminary peers, and then to  people he had encountered or ministered to directly, and ultimately to hundreds more people who had thoughts as well (through an online poll).  He was troubled by what he heard. 

What he did next, though, is nothing short of extraordinary.  He re-read his book and reexamined it, based on what he had learned through life and by listening to hours and hours of feedback.  

And then he retracted it--even had it unpublished.  He has since dedicated a significant portion of his time to walking back the harm his words had worked. 

He's not minimizing what he did, or making excuses based on his youth or background. And he's not cashing in on his repentance, either.  Instead he is amplifying the voices of several gifted Christian authors and speakers who are leading the way in unpacking the legacy of the evangelical church's teachings on sexuality.  

We are honored to have Josh as our guest.  On March 1, he'll be joining Charlotte's own Stephanie Stalvey, author of the forthcoming graphic memoir Everything in Color: A Love Story at Warehouse 242 for a talk on recovering from the aftereffects of purity culture. But here's a chance to get to know him beforehand, in the privacy of your own headphones.  

We hope you will listen, and maybe share this special episode with a friend or two, if nothing else just to see what kinds of honest, relationship-building  conversations it might spark.



 

Kissing "Purity Culture" Goodbye?

Here's a fun thought experiment:  Imagine you are in line at a coffee shop or helping with a newcomer's lunch at church, and you spot a person who seems really, really familiar. Once you look past the questionable fashion choices and the "what exactly were they thinking?" haircut, you realize that this person you are meeting is in fact a younger version of yourself, from 20 or so years ago.  

After the initial shock wears off, and you recognize your younger self, what would you do? Would you introduce yourself fully to yourself?  Or would you exercise restraint so as not to freak them out?  If you were to sit down for a chat, what do you imagine that conversation would be like?   What would you want to say? And how do you think the younger you would receive your thoughts?

That's where we start with this one, good people.  But there's oh so much more.  

What do we make of the suggestion that our bodies "keep the score" of the difficult circumstances, lesser "small-t" traumas, and downright harm that we have experienced throughout life?  If that notion is true, or at least a potentially helpful therapeutic concept, what do we do if we realize that "the score" sometimes was decidedly not in our favor? What does healing look like, when the harm was experienced so long ago, and yet its aftereffects linger with us (sometimes in very problematic ways)?   

What if we can't remember the details of what happened, and we aren't even sure it should be a big deal?  Or what if we can describe some events thoroughly, but only from a place of sheer emotional detachment, because "the past is in the past, and what can you do?"

And what does any of this mean for our relationship with God?  If we have befallen harm in our families of origin-- and most of us have, to at least some degree-- how do we reconcile that reality with our view of God? Where was He in those darkest moments?  And if He is "the same yesterday and today and forever," and he has the power to overcome evil with good,  why didn't He do it then?

Spoiler alert:  we don't offer answers to these questions.  We can't.  

We can, however, offer a safe place to wrestle with them, honestly.  And not just with our minds, but with every fiber of our bodies and hearts. As well as a picture of a God who we can dare to hope is with us and for us, even in the midst of our confusion, doubt, and pain.  

The Complexity of the Self (or selves) and the Perplexity of God...  

Just in time for Snowmageddon(-ish?) 2026, we are back for Season 3!   

So, it's, uh, been a minute...  There may be a few things going on--in the world at large, in our lives for sure, and likely for all you good folks as well. 

That predictable flip o' the calendar is often a time that prompts reckoning, reflection, and maybe even recon for the coming year.... Some folks seem to jump in to the new season with glad abandon,  harnessing newfound energy, racking up resolutions, and plotting plans aplenty.  

Others of us, though, may not quite be sure how we feel about another trip around the sun, the way things are going now... I mean hey, if winter is the season for hibernating, how about we just extend that idea for a bit and stay in bed a bit longer, both physically and metaphorically?  

Well, however you happen to look at the turning of the clock and the changing of the seasons, you are welcome here.  

Join us for an intimate conversation about naming the darkness, coldness, and emptiness of Winter, yet without letting it totally take us out. Could it be that  this kind of season might also be a uniquely meaningful place of preparation and formation?  What if, rather than leaving us to burrow in the covers or wander aimlessly, God is a God who might just surprise us in the most unexpected places with his playfulness and delight? 

As always, there's a little something for everyone (including a brand new original poem from Wendy!).  

And after you listen, please drop either of us an email to let us know what YOU think:  What is wintering like for you, right now in this moment?  And what are you willing to consider maybe thinking about possibly daring to hope it might become?

Wintering in the Wilderness... and the Surprising Playfulness of the God Who Meets Us There

What if poetry isn’t just for English majors and literary journals—but for anyone trying to make sense of their story?

In this episode, Wendy sits down with longtime friend, counselor, and poet Sue Cunningham to talk about the unexpected ways poetry has shown up in their lives—and how it’s helped them make sense of their stories. They talk about the moments that drew them toward writing, the wounds that made it feel out of reach, and the slow return to creative expression as a form of healing, honesty, and hope.

Sue shares how a flyer on a coffee shop bulletin board led her back to poetry, and Wendy reflects on a college experience that nearly convinced her to give it up for good. They also reflect on poetry as protest, as presence, and as a way to say things that are too complex—or too sacred—for ordinary language.

This conversation is gentle, grounding, and full of quiet encouragement. Whether you consider yourself a writer or not, it just might help you see your own story a little differently.

Connect with Us!
Follow @nurturecounselingnc [https://www.instagram.com/nurturecounselingnc/] on Instagram
Visit nurturecounseling.net [https://www.nurturecounseling.net/]

Sue Cunningham: Finding Poetry in Unexpected Places

Feedback is one of the trickiest things to get right in any relationship—especially the ones that matter most. In this episode, Wendy and Chris unpack a recent exchange that gave them a front-row seat to what helps… and what hurts. From tone and timing to defensiveness and shame, they name the subtle dynamics that shape how feedback lands—and what it takes to create space for honesty without sacrificing connection.

But this isn’t just a conversation about communication techniques. It’s about the deeper stories underneath our reactions: the expectations we bring into marriage, the ways we want to be understood, and the fear that we’re being dismissed or judged. With curiosity and vulnerability, Wendy and Chris explore how even casual feedback can stir up old wounds—and how intentional language can start to heal them.

Along the way, they offer clear, practical tools: simple shifts in phrasing, a framework for checking your own heart before speaking up, and some laugh-out-loud moments from their own learning curve. Whether you’ve been married for decades or just want to get better at saying hard things with love, this episode will leave you feeling both seen and equipped.

This conversation is real, warm, and incredibly useful. It’s about the gap between intention and impact—and the courage it takes to close that gap with kindness.

Connect with Us!
Follow @nurturecounselingnc [https://www.instagram.com/nurturecounselingnc/] on Instagram
Visit nurturecounseling.net [https://www.nurturecounseling.net/]

 The Feedback Loop: What Helps, What Hurts, What Heals

There’s a new intern at Nurture Counseling — and y’all, while Chris Osborn might be married to Wendy, that doesn’t mean he’s off the hook for the usual intern duties. In this episode, we officially welcome Chris to the team… and gently remind him that coffee runs and red carpet rollouts may still be part of the gig.

But in all seriousness, this episode opens up a much deeper story — one that’s been unfolding for decades. Chris reflects on his family of origin, growing up in the wake of a very public divorce, and learning early on that being the “good guy” could help him survive and belong. He shares how shame quietly shaped him, how his identity became entangled with performance, and how that eventually unraveled through the pressures of marriage, parenting, caregiving, and calling.

Now, as he steps into the work of therapy, Chris shares the kind of clients he hopes to sit with — especially those who feel like their answers are no longer working, who are worn out from trying to hold it all together, and who need a safe place to be fully seen. With humor, humility, and a deeply thoughtful presence, Chris is stepping into this new chapter with both feet — and a lot of heart.

This conversation is honest, funny, and full of grace. It’s about the stories we carry, the systems that shaped us, and the quiet courage to begin again — a courage that doesn’t come from within, but from the love of a God who meets us right where we are.

Connect with Us!
Follow @nurturecounselingnc [https://www.instagram.com/nurturecounselingnc/] on Instagram
Visit nurturecounseling.net [https://www.nurturecounseling.net/]

Big News! Introducing Chris the intern (Yes, THAT Chris)

Why is it so hard to stay connected when conflict shows up? For most of us, the moment tension rises, we slip into debate mode — fighting for the win instead of fighting for the relationship. In this episode, Wendy and Chris get honest about what that looks like in their own marriage, and what it takes to choose connection instead.

They share stories from their early years together — when Saturday morning chores, unspoken expectations, and clashing habits revealed something much deeper: the longing to be seen, loved, and secure. Along the way, they name how family of origin, formative wounds, and even the wiring of our brains set us up to repeat old patterns, and how easy it is to cling to being “right” when what we really want is to be close. (Ever had an argument where the real fight wasn’t about the dishes? Yeah, us too.)

At the heart of the conversation is a crucial distinction: coercion vs. connection. Coercion may look like control, persuasion, or even righteousness — but love rooted in Christ makes room for freedom. It bears with one another in humility, gentleness, patience, and forgiveness, just as Ephesians 4:2 and Colossians 3:13 call us to.

This isn’t about avoiding conflict or pretending differences don’t matter. It’s about moving from debate to dialogue, from certainty to curiosity, and from control to trust. Honest, funny, and deeply hopeful, this conversation is full of the kind of real-life wisdom y’all will recognize — the kind that just might change how you show up in your next argument.

Connect with Us!
Follow @nurturecounselingnc [https://www.instagram.com/nurturecounselingnc/] on Instagram
Visit nurturecounseling.net [https://www.nurturecounseling.net/]

Losing Is the New Winning: Choosing Love Over Being Right

We had the best time sitting down with Becky Allender — writer, grandmother, co-founder of The Allender Center, and yes, longtime partner-in-life-and-love to Dr. Dan Allender. But make no mistake: Becky is a force in her own right. Her presence is warm, steady, and disarmingly honest. And for decades, she’s been a vital voice shaping the work that has impacted thousands through Dan’s teaching, writing, and the Allender Center’s mission.

In this conversation, Becky reflects on entering what she calls the final chapter — not with resignation, but with clarity, intentionality, and grace. She shares what it means to show up fully in marriage at this stage of life, especially as Dan focuses his last major professional efforts on the topic of marriage itself. Becky names what it’s like to be drawn more visibly into that work, to keep growing in her own voice, and to embrace the joy and ache of this season with open hands.

We also talk about parenting — the beautiful and brutal reality of reckoning with the ways we’ve missed the mark, and how to best engage when our adult children bring their stories back to us. Becky's example of listening with humility, resisting the urge to defend, and offering genuine curiosity is a masterclass in becoming more like Jesus. We discuss what it means to bless our grown children even when their lives and choices look different than ours did, and to trust that God is big enough to hold what we couldn’t.

This episode is honest, tender, funny, and rich with lived wisdom. Becky doesn’t offer easy answers — but she offers something better: a deeply human picture of love, courage, and grace that keeps unfolding across decades.

We’re so grateful for her presence, and we think you will be too.

🌐 Connect with Becky [https://theallendercenter.org/about/team/becky-allender/]
Follow @nurturecounselingnc [https://www.instagram.com/nurturecounselingnc/]

Becky Allender on Marriage, Voice, and Growing Through Every Season

As our lives grow more complex, so does our faith. The black-and-white answers we once held tightly often lose their grip when we find ourselves sitting beside hospital beds, walking through grief, or holding space for the pain of others.

In this second half of our conversation with Rachel Clinton Chen, we talk about what it means to grow a faith that’s big enough to hold suffering — our own and others’.

If you’ve ever felt shaken by disillusionment, unsure how to trust again, or wondered what love really looks like when power has been misused — this episode offers story, clarity, and hope. Healing doesn’t always come through having the right answers. Sometimes, it begins with letting go of certainty and choosing to stay curious about who God really is.

Connect with Rachael:
@rachaelclintonchen [https://www.instagram.com/rachaelclintonchen/]
theallendercenter.org [https://theallendercenter.org/author/clintonr/]

Learn more about Nurture Counseling:
@nurturecounselingnc [https://www.instagram.com/nurturecounselingnc/]
nurturecounseling.net [https://www.nurturecounseling.net/#home]


Rachael Clinton Chen (Part 2): Harmers and Healers

Some people come into your life and quietly, powerfully change its trajectory. For Wendy, that person was Rachael Clinton Chen.

In this first half of a two-part conversation, we sit down with Rachael — a pastor, teacher, and co-host of the Allender Center Podcast — for a conversation that’s rich with honesty, clarity, and care. We talk about what it means to be truly seen, why minimizing suffering is so common (especially in Christian spaces), and the small but brave turns that can lead us toward freedom.

Rachael shares pieces of her own story — from growing up in a fundamentalist church, to experiencing spiritual abuse, to slowly finding her way back to a more spacious and embodied love of God. She reflects on the disorientation that comes when relationships, especially those rooted in spiritual authority, become harmful — and how reclaiming our voice and agency is part of the healing journey. Along the way, we talk about power, trust, and the kind of theology that either binds us or sets us free.

This episode is full of honesty, warmth, and fierce kindness. It’s for anyone who’s ever wondered if they were too much, too broken, or too far gone to be met by God — and needed to hear, gently but clearly: you’re not.

Content note: This conversation includes references to trauma and non-graphic mentions of suicidal thoughts. Please listen with care.

Connect with Rachael:
@rachaelclintonchen [https://www.instagram.com/rachaelclintonchen/]
theallendercenter.org [https://theallendercenter.org/author/clintonr/]



Rachael Clinton Chen (Part 1): Story, Suffering, and the God Who Meets Us

Welcome to "The Thriving Lawyers Podcast, brought to you by Chris Osborn and Michael Kahn of ReelTime Creative Learning Experiences!  Join us for candid but ultimately inspiring conversations with lawyers from around the U.S. and Canada (and maybe points beyond) who have found ways to truly thrive in the practice of law.   We may even discuss a movie or two, on our never-ending quest for inspiration, motivation, and practical solutions. (That's how Reel Time got started, after all!)

The Thriving Lawyers Podcast

Join licensed clinical mental health counselor Wendy Osborn and her husband Chris as they share intimately about their journey  through three decades of marriage, and the healing and growth God has brought them individually and as a couple in the process. From a storybook beginning right out of an 80s rom-com, though times of disappointment, heartache, seemingly unresolvable conflict, loss, and grief, their story forms the backdrop for considering how God uses struggle to draw folks closer to the real Jesus. Surviving Saturday is all about holding tenaciously on to hope in the darkest days-- in between the crucifixion on Friday, and his resurrection and ascension on Sunday.  

Brought to you by Nurture Counseling [https://www.nurturecounseling.net/], PLLC in Charlotte, NC, a counselling teaching and training center in Charlotte NC committed to helping families flourish, one story at a time. 

Special thanks to singer/songwriter extraordinaire BIll Mallonee for the licensing rights to use one of our favorite tunes about relational trainwrecks, and the road back to forgiveness, redemption, and renewal of hope.  You can find this tune and more of his music at https://www.billmalloneemusic.com/ or on the Bandcamp app.

The "Surviving Saturday" Podcast

Chris's Show

Encouragement and wisdom from licensed mental health counselor Wendy Osborn and her husband of 35 years, Chris, on how to navigate doubt, betrayal, disappointment, and other hard times in marriage and parenting.  We believe Jesus is a very present help in trouble, and is always at work to bring us closer to Him and to one another.  Our stories from our families of origin often provide important clues to how your styles of relating have been formed and ways that we have tried to make life work on our own terms.  Based on our training through Dan Allender and The Allender Center in narrative focused trauma care, we believe that God enables us to partake of his grace and reflect his glory, and that it is the kindness of the Lord that leads us to repentance and restoration.

Chris

Shows